boxelder charcoal for diy black powder

[farmbif]

have been reading about how to make black powder and it seems light woods like willow are the best for making the charcoal. I don't have any willow trees but lots of boxelders and they sure are no good for firewood. I've got the sulphur powder and stump remover now I just have to make the powdered charcoal. I was going to cut some and season it for charcoal cook once summer heat breaks. or do you cook it off green?

[Nobade]

Peel it first. You can cook it green, just uses more fuel.

[Dapaki]

I have posted this before but this bears reposting, here is a friends charcoal tests for different woods: http://www.wichitabuggywhip.com/fireworks/charcoal_tests.html

[indian joe]

I have posted this before but this bears reposting, here is a friends charcoal tests for different woods: http://www.wichitabuggywhip.com/fireworks/charcoal_tests.html

Good info - however for gunpowder the pyro guys miss one critical issue - clean burning - it doesnt matter to them and really the only way to test that is in a gun barrel - hybrid willow has proved better in this regard than any commercial powder I can get - I have not pursued other sources of charcoal because its readily available and it works great - velocity is good as is shot to shot variation. Have had thoughts about pawlownia and tree of heaven - could get both but much more hassle and likely not worth the extra .

[Boz330]

Good info - however for gunpowder the pyro guys miss one critical issue - clean burning - it doesnt matter to them and really the only way to test that is in a gun barrel - hybrid willow has proved better in this regard than any commercial powder I can get - I have not pursued other sources of charcoal because its readily available and it works great - velocity is good as is shot to shot variation. Have had thoughts about pawlownia and tree of heaven - could get both but much more hassle and likely not worth the extra .

I've been using TOH and it has worked well for me but I have plenty growing all over the farm. In fact I sprayed a bunch of it several weeks ago. It is an invasive tree here. I do get a little more velocity from it and it seems reasonably clean burning. But if you have willow available and the TOH is a hassle, go with the willow. For me the TOH is actually easier to get so it solves that problem. I use to have some willow tress around the farm but they have all died out. I can get willow but see no need.

Bob

[indian joe]

I've been using TOH and it has worked well for me but I have plenty growing all over the farm. In fact I sprayed a bunch of it several weeks ago. It is an invasive tree here. I do get a little more velocity from it and it seems reasonably clean burning. But if you have willow available and the TOH is a hassle, go with the willow. For me the TOH is actually easier to get so it solves that problem. I use to have some willow tress around the farm but they have all died out. I can get willow but see no need.

Bob

I am the other half of the story - know where there is some TOH but the willow is growing 200yards from my loungeroom chair on my property - plenty of it. Its been good so far - aint broke dont fix it!!!

[Boz330]

I am the other half of the story - know where there is some TOH but the willow is growing 200yards from my loungeroom chair on my property - plenty of it. Its been good so far - aint broke dont fix it!!!

Roger that, and it doesn't stink like TOH.

Bob

[John Boy]

Would like to have seen test data for Alder Buckthorn, the wood used by Swiss powders

[RogerDat]

I recall box elder is a very hard dense wood, with amazing amount of sap. But I was having to fell one at the edge of the property which may flavor my recollection. Very different than willow or cottonwood trees.

That tree reminded me of Ash except all the sap seemed to create a muffled ring from the axe head. Ash dead and standing sounded like I was hitting metal on metal.

[mooman76]

What is TOH?

[Sven205]

What is TOH?

Tree of Heaven.

It's an invasive species in a lot of areas. Some people call them Sumac.

[mooman76]

Never heard of it but have heard of Sumac. Not sure if there are Sumac but we have plenty of Willow.

[farmbif]

what are called boxelders here are a soft light wood that grows very fast, much softer and lighter than ash, I'm no tree expert but it could be there are much different types like the maples that grow here are also a light wood when dry nothing like the heavy solid wood of sugar maple that grow in the north

[Boz330]

Would like to have seen test data for Alder Buckthorn, the wood used by Swiss powders

I would guess that he didn't have access to the Buckthorn alder. He has red alder listed and that maybe Buckthorn by a different name, but that is just a guess. In addition to flight time and burn time there is how clean the powder burns, speed and height are only part of the picture.
I have had pretty good luck with the Tree of Heaven on both counts, but only use my powder for hunting and it holds minute of deer at 100yd and tree rats with a trade gun.
I have tried my home made in my 40-65 and Gibbs rifle at 300 and 500 respectively and the results at 300yd weren't too bad but the wheels fell off at 500yd. I do believe that some of the guys here have had pretty good luck with their HM, but mine serves me fine in the field which is what I was looking for.

Bob

[Winger Ed.]

In the old days, British powder was the benchmark, and most popular.
They used willow.

[indian joe]

I would guess that he didn't have access to the Buckthorn alder. He has red alder listed and that maybe Buckthorn by a different name, but that is just a guess. In addition to flight time and burn time there is how clean the powder burns, speed and height are only part of the picture.
I have had pretty good luck with the Tree of Heaven on both counts, but only use my powder for hunting and it holds minute of deer at 100yd and tree rats with a trade gun.
I have tried my home made in my 40-65 and Gibbs rifle at 300 and 500 respectively and the results at 300yd weren't too bad but the wheels fell off at 500yd. I do believe that some of the guys here have had pretty good luck with their HM, but mine serves me fine in the field which is what I was looking for.

Bob

Bob
I havent tested properly at longer ranges - but over the chrono the velocity is there and shot to shot variation is good - several 10 shot strings under 10FPS ES with only a light blow tube - I would go out confident that if something went skewey it wasnt the powder anymore .

[SeaMonkey]

Have any of you who roll your own tried varying the percentage of charcoal in
your mix? My own experience as well as of those others who have tested
various charcoals find that for some of the charcoals a 70-20-10 mix is better than
the typical 75-15-10 standard. When the percentage is adjusted, charcoals thought
to be poor performers actually turn out to be pretty good. It just takes a little more
of it in the mix.

[SeaMonkey]

Some of you may remember the Black Powder Web Pages of Ulrich Bretscher
in Switzerland some years ago. Although his Web Pages are no longer active
his Pages have been archived in the WayBack Machine.

Ulrich Bretscher's Black Powder Pages (https://web.archive.org/web/20170809203509/http://www.musketeer.ch:80/blackpowder/bp_menu.html)

Bretscher's Charcoal Page (https://web.archive.org/web/20170809203509/http://www.musketeer.ch:80/blackpowder/charcoal.html)

265280

[TheOutlawKid]

I use red alder and it burns really clean and fast and it gives me numbers a little faster than swiss. It beat my willow, both a hybrid and black willow. You can get red alder charcoal from Real Montana Charcoal or you can order red alder blocks for smoking fish on amazon. I have done both...its where i got my stash of red alder. Great stuff.

[Russel A]

I have both Box Elder and Willow. Willow, I only have about 15 ft of the main trunk left cut about 1 1/2 years ago.
Box Elder, Just fell in a storm last night. Would either work good for black powder or would one be better than the other?

[Ozark mike]

Box elder is just another type of maple latin name is Acer negundo