Poison Sumac and ground hogs

[pmer]

The other day I found a dead ground hog on the lawn next to some small Sumac that is growing on the lawn. Next to these Little Sumac are full grown Sumac shrubs.

The ground hog looked like it wasn't hurt or bit up by a critter and was just wondering if Sumac could've killed the ground hog?

I didn't get anywhere with Google on this question.

[rking22]

Interested in what you find out. I have always thought animals have enough sense not to eat things that are poison, at least the native plants.

[Neverhome]

I’d be very surprised if anything was poisonous enough to kill it on the spot unless it was also narcotic. I don’t know nuthin from nuthin but I’d imagine anything ingested and potent enough to kill would also cause enough discomfort that it would split back to its hole.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Sometimes critters (and people) just die.

[Winger Ed.]

Most of the poisonous plants taste so bad, a critter can't hardly force their self to eat it.

[pmer]

Thanks for the reply it could've been anything. One time when I was young on the farm a rooster fell over right in front of me.

[popper]

Surprisingly, white sumac berries indicate the poisonous types, red are safe.

[KYCaster]

Do you have a neighbor who's a shooter?
It's sometimes hard to find the entrance wound on a ground hog and if the boolit didn't exit it may not show any blood. With a hit like that the critter may have traveled quite a way before it expired.

Jerry

[bedbugbilly]

We had plenty of woodchucks and poison sumac on the farm but I don't ever recall finding a dead one and connecting it to the sumac. I also always thought that animals had a sense of what was and what wasn't good to eat . . . but that's just supposition on my part.

As pointed out . . . critters and humans just die of natural causes and that's something I have seen on the farm in the "animal kingdom" that lived on the land.

As far as poison sumac goes . . . I was one animal that learned to avoid it. Dad and I were cleaning out a fence row one fall . . . typical Michigan damp and misty dark day. He got a spot of the sap on his arm and I got a spot on the inside of my wrist. We doctored it but it got into our blood streams and spread all over our bodies. In those days, two to three weeks of misery . . . baking soda baths twice a day and then my mother would paint us down from head to toe with a zinc oxide solution ordered by the doctor. No fun at all!

If you figure out what killed the critter - let us know as it would be interesting to know if there was a connection with the sumac - someone bullet - or his ticker just gave up.

[popper]

As a kid, was 40 acres across the street, mostly old pasture covered in sumac. Run around in it with bare legs and you get a rash from the oil. Some of the kids were very allergic, just a sting/tingle for me. Like bamboo, hard to kill off. Finally field caught on fire (all the moms out with hose to keep it away) and sumac pretty much gone. Kids went out with brooms and shovels to help the volunteers put it out. First time I saw one of the backpack 'indians'. Town had nothing but small tanker hose truck and no hydrants around.

[Gewehr-Guy]

Well guys, it's obvious it died of Covid-19

[rking22]

Proof beyond dispute, now it jumps species yet again! :p

[big bore 99]

Animals have a sixth sense about what to eat. Squirrels can eat poisonous mushrooms that will sure kill us.

[trapper9260]

We had plenty of woodchucks and poison sumac on the farm but I don't ever recall finding a dead one and connecting it to the sumac. I also always thought that animals had a sense of what was and what wasn't good to eat . . . but that's just supposition on my part.

As pointed out . . . critters and humans just die of natural causes and that's something I have seen on the farm in the "animal kingdom" that lived on the land.

As far as poison sumac goes . . . I was one animal that learned to avoid it. Dad and I were cleaning out a fence row one fall . . . typical Michigan damp and misty dark day. He got a spot of the sap on his arm and I got a spot on the inside of my wrist. We doctored it but it got into our blood streams and spread all over our bodies. In those days, two to three weeks of misery . . . baking soda baths twice a day and then my mother would paint us down from head to toe with a zinc oxide solution ordered by the doctor. No fun at all!

If you figure out what killed the critter - let us know as it would be interesting to know if there was a connection with the sumac - someone bullet - or his ticker just gave up.

I had broke out it my self when I was a kid and it was all over me . I know how it is to have it, As for the woodchuck .like was stated might have got shot and end up died where you found it , Normal they would go in there hole to die. As for the plants they do know what plants not to eat from last I know for hunting then and trap them.

[richhodg66]

We don't have ground hogs, but more rabbits than you can shake a stick at. They always get scarcer in Summer than in Spring, but they all just dissappeard last year, never seen them just vanish like that. Before whatever die off, I found one stone dead in the yard without a mark on it or anything to indicate it was anything but healthy.

Rodent poulations seem to be very cyclical, but that one had me wondering. I missed the little guys in the yard, they seem to be back to normal now.

[MaryB]

Poison sumac is pretty rare in MN... like wet area like swamps and bogs and only found in the east central counties... you probably have common sumac that makes great wind blocks...

https://www.minnesotawildflowers.info/udata/r9ndp23q/maps/toxver.png

[Geezer in NH]

He's dead good. Want to know why spend a couple thousand dollars and you will know!

[gwpercle]

The berries are toxic to both cats and dogs , more so to cats . The berries usually make them sick but usually do not kill cats or dogs .
I could find no info on toxicity and ground hogs ... very little study seems to have been conducted.
Was the ground hog eating the berries or other parts of the plant ?
Gary

[megasupermagnum]

Poisonous Sumac is incredibly rare. I don't think that I have ever seen one. The regular kinds certainly didn't kill him. I like the deep red seeds/berries, and I essentially make tea with them. It makes a drink that tastes kind of like lemonade. I haven't checked yet, but this time of year is when they are getting to be the perfect ripeness.

[Martin Luber]

Neighbors pesticides more likely...

[pmer]

Thanks again for the info. I thought all Sumac was toxic and couldn't tell the difference between the 2. To be honest, I thought it was a gopher pile for 2 days so it was getting ripe when I threw him to of to the side. And no I can't say I saw it eating any Sumac either.

It's been pretty dry so I haven't had to mow the lawn as much this year and that's why the babies are growing on the lawn.

I was going to post some pics of the Sumac but it looks like I gave to get imgur going on this phone.

[pmer]

http://imgur.com/gallery/dWRZIRI

http://imgur.com/gallery/n5QbXhq

The small ones

[country gent]

The wood chuck may have "feasted" on some crops that had just been sprayed with herbicide or insecticide and ingested the poison there making it to your yard to die. May have been old and just expired. Or may have been lightly clipped by a car.

Woodchucks love soybeans and alpha. will eat corn and other crops.

[megasupermagnum]

Thanks again for the info. I thought all Sumac was toxic and couldn't tell the difference between the 2. To be honest, I thought it was a gopher pile for 2 days so it was getting ripe when I threw him to of to the side. And no I can't say I saw it eating any Sumac either.

It's been pretty dry so I haven't had to mow the lawn as much this year and that's why the babies are growing on the lawn.

I was going to post some pics of the Sumac but it looks like I gave to get imgur going on this phone.

There is a lot more than two. There are at least a dozen Sumac species in this country. As far as I know, only poison sumac is poisonous (duh), everything else is safe, although not all taste good. According to google, the kind I make my drinks from is called staghorn sumac.

[Alstep]

Poisonous Sumac is incredibly rare. I don't think that I have ever seen one. The regular kinds certainly didn't kill him. I like the deep red seeds/berries, and I essentially make tea with them. It makes a drink that tastes kind of like lemonade. I haven't checked yet, but this time of year is when they are getting to be the perfect ripeness.

We've got lots of the red sumac around here, harmless as far as I know. Never have seen the white variety.
How do you make your tea brew out of them?

[MaryB]

http://imgur.com/gallery/dWRZIRI

http://imgur.com/gallery/n5QbXhq

The small ones

Poison sumac leaves have smooth edges, yours looks to have serrated edges so it is another variety.

[Rick Hodges]

Trumpet flower poisoning: Introduction
"Trumpet flower poisoning: The trumpet flower is a flowering vine-like plant that bears fairly large, colorful, trumpet-shaped flowers. It is often grown in gardens as an ornamental plant. The leaves and flowers of the plant contain chemicals (solanine, solanidine) which are highly toxic. Ingestion of sufficient flowers and leaves can result in death. More detailed information about the symptoms, causes, and treatments of Trumpet flower poisoning is available below."
264978

[pmer]

http://imgur.com/a/HIXcTp9

Here is a full grown one. It has those red berries.

[Alstep]

http://imgur.com/a/HIXcTp9

Here is a full grown one. It has those red berries.

Yup. That's the stuff growing around here. Now for that tea recipe???

[megasupermagnum]

We've got lots of the red sumac around here, harmless as far as I know. Never have seen the white variety.
How do you make your tea brew out of them?

You can look up different ways to make sumac lemonade, but I keep it simple. I pick a few bundles of the berries from the trees, the most red, most ripe and sour ones I can find. I then mix them up in a pitcher of water, breaking the bundles up slightly with a spoon. I then leave it in the fridge over night. It may be faster to leave the pitcher in the sun, or even simmer on a stove, although I have never tried. The next day, I run it through cheese cloth, or a fine strainer into another pitcher. Then just add sugar to taste.

[Wayne Smith]

If you want to play with woodwork cut one of those branches about 1/2"-3/4" thick and cut very thin sections at about a 60 degree angle. Depending on your soil makeup you can get some very pretty, multicolored sections that make nice earrings. Sand very fine and spray with spray varnish. Polish varnish if you desire.