New Lee die bushing spline drive nut wrench...

[mattw]

Is anyone making a quality "metal" wrench for the new Ultimate Lock Rings? The little toy plastic wrench is a joke.

[rayh]

I sure hope someone does and with a longer handle.

[Cosmic_Charlie]

Not having any trouble just turning the bushing in by hand. Never use the plastic gizmo.

[1hole]

Is anyone making a quality "metal" wrench for the new Ultimate Lock Rings? The little toy plastic wrench is a joke.

The wrench is good, just don't break it trying to over tighten the die nut. Hand tight is plenty tight. The clue is, the nut it's used on need not be synched down like an auto motor head bolt.

[mdi]

I only used my "spline" lock nut a few times. I didn't use the special wrench. One mistake many reloaders make is they believe the Lee lock nuts need to be tight, as in a 18" box wrench tight. I've worked many, many years with nuts, bolts, etc, and have made nuts, bolts, etc. so I believe I know a bit about threaded fasteners. In my entire reloading "career" I have used Lee dies and lock rings. I have never had a lock ring work loose, or a die "change" it's setting. I do not use a wrench on Lee ring 99% of the time. The only time I have needed a tool is when a die has been in place, mostly on a turret for a long time, it needs a bit more than finger pressure to loosen it.

[Green Frog]

My impression when I read this post was, if you’re tightening it enough to break their wrench, you’re tightening it too much! Could it be that the wrench might be designed to break before something important does?

Froggie

[Valley-Shooter]

I'm sure one of those 3D printer people will make some in the future.
A longer handle would nice, less likely to loose/ misplace the little thing.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[RedlegEd]

I'm sure one of those 3D printer people will make some in the future.
A longer handle would nice, less likely to loose/ misplace the little thing.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

Hi. I'm "one of those 3D printer people" as you call us, :) and I've been working on a long handle version of the little wrench. Once I get it done, I'll post a picture. BTW, not everything needs to be metal. Look at all the Tupperware guns people are shooting nowadays. As pointed out in numerous posts above, you only need to hand tighten these (same as just snugging up the little lock collar screw.) The only time I've used the wrench is just like @mdi said in post #5 (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?403923-New-Lee-die-bushing-spline-drive-nut-wrench&p=4927362&viewfull=1#post4927362) when it was left in place a little while and needs to be "broke loose."
Ed

[1hole]

... One mistake many reloaders make is they believe the Lee lock nuts need to be tight, as in a 18" box wrench tight. I've worked many, many years with nuts, bolts, etc, and have made nuts, bolts, etc. so I believe I know a bit about threaded fasteners.

You do know about nutty things; that's a good thing to know.

Tool makers (including most reloading die makers) sometimes give users a hint that hand tight is good enough; they put nicely diamond knurled surfaces on things that need not be/should not be wrenched.

I've seen hundreds of used dies for sale with buggered up knurling that appeared to have been cinched on and off with pipe wrenches; that should not be.

[mdi]

You do know about nutty things; that's a good thing to know.

Tool makers (including most reloading die makers) sometimes give users a hint that hand tight is good enough; they put nicely diamond knurled surfaces on things that need not be/should not be wrenched.

I've seen hundreds of used dies for sale with buggered up knurling that appeared to have been cinched on and off with pipe wrenches; that should not be.
Yep, I'm a nutty kinda guy. I worked for a large city Department of Water and Power in a Heavy equipment repair facility. Vendors often offered in depth training on their products from hydraulic equipment/parts to cleaning products and yes, even nuts and bolts. Almost all the threaded fasteners were certified grade 8 nuts and bolts (certified because someone in the purchasing dept got a "deal" and bought a few thousand Chinese counterfeit "Grade 8" bolts) and our main vendor offered classes on threads, applications, and in depth info on torque and use of specific threads, and coatings. The classes were usually 4 days and I attended two. There's a whole lot more to threaded fasteners than "righty tighty, lefty loosey"...

[rayh]

Ed if you design the tool with a longer handle I hope you post it here. If you live with arthritis in your hands ( and body) gripping that little wrench is not very comfortable. I like the O-ring design, I've added them to a lot of my other dies. And yes you don't have to torgue them tight.

[Wolverine19D]

I've just had my first experience with the new Lee lock rings and overall am very happy they released them. I know that is not exactly what the OP is posting about but I also ordered one of the breech lock adaptors for a press with the breech lock nut included to install on my RCBS powder measure so I can quick release it from my bench to dump the powder from it. I just need to screw the press adapter into the wood.

But back to the new Lee die rings, I wanted some die rings that used the o-rings like Lee because it can help make rounds with less run-out. But I also wanted rings I could tighten to the die itself so I wouldn't have to keep readjusting each time it's in the press and am very happy Lee came out with the new split lock rings that can tighten to the die itself like the Hornady rings. I just wish they used a hex head screw instead of the phillips which strips easily. I may replace them all eventually with hex head screws.

And as mentioned by the OP I don't much care for the wrench that's included with all the die packs I ordered. It's not about needing the extra leverage to tighten it down but the short handle is kind of annoying. And I remember having a problem with the wrench in some other way but it's lost to me at the moment. I'd be very happy to have a new aluminum wrench with a longer handle or even a polymer one if it's all I could find.

[RedlegEd]

Hi all,
I designed and 3D printed a wrench for the Lee lock ring that's be easier to use than the cute little one they give you. I've posted the STL file on Thingiverse here. (https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4492500) As mentioned numerous times above, this isn't a pipe wrench and isn't designed to really torque down the lock rings (and new style bushings,) rather it's an aid to break loose those on a little too tight.
Ed

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[mattw]

As I am the OP... I must add some facts... no, I do not go for blistering tight... I have a fair understanding of nuts and bolts, spent many years farming (high grade and tight) and some time in the robotics industry (fine thread and torqued to spec). For me it is not to get a die tight, but to get a die consistent. I am in my mid 50's and and fairly bad arthritis and avascular necrosis in both hands. I can often put the die in and get a good finger tight, but often cannot remove the die after use without a wrench. Notice... I did not say pipe wrench or channel locks on the die body... I am not a fan of the Lee o-ring nuts, they always have felt inconsistent to me, on a good day I get them a little tighter by hand than on a bad day. I really prefer a metal to metal contact and I like to install my die against the shell holder and then go 1/8 turn further before I lock it, forcing it square against the shell holder. I do not put any crush on carbide insert dies, do not want to take a chance on crushing the little lip that holds the insert.

That longer wrench would make life much easier, my fingers do not have that much strength but my hand has more dexterity and that would just work better. I really do like the idea of the bushing and I love the fact that an allen wrench cross screw as that relieves all the tension on the die and it just backs out.

[RedlegEd]

As I am the OP... I must add some facts... no, I do not go for blistering tight... I have a fair understanding of nuts and bolts, spent many years farming (high grade and tight) and some time in the robotics industry (fine thread and torqued to spec). For me it is not to get a die tight, but to get a die consistent. I am in my mid 50's and and fairly bad arthritis and avascular necrosis in both hands. I can often put the die in and get a good finger tight, but often cannot remove the die after use without a wrench. Notice... I did not say pipe wrench or channel locks on the die body... I am not a fan of the Lee o-ring nuts, they always have felt inconsistent to me, on a good day I get them a little tighter by hand than on a bad day. I really prefer a metal to metal contact and I like to install my die against the shell holder and then go 1/8 turn further before I lock it, forcing it square against the shell holder. I do not put any crush on carbide insert dies, do not want to take a chance on crushing the little lip that holds the insert.

That longer wrench would make life much easier, my fingers do not have that much strength but my hand has more dexterity and that would just work better. I really do like the idea of the bushing and I love the fact that an allen wrench cross screw as that relieves all the tension on the die and it just backs out.

Hi Matt,
I meant no disrespect, and please don't take anything I said as directed personally toward you. My comments were in response to other comments made previously. You know as well as I there are folks who take "finger tight' as meaning how hard you grip the pliers. I am also getting up in years and find arthritis and weakened hand strength has become a little challenging. I thought I could offer a low cost/home-made solution to help break the lock nuts/bushings free as there's not much room from your fingers/hand to gain purchase on them, especially if they are in a turret. If you'd like one, shoot me a PM.
Ed

[BigAlofPa.]

So that is what that strange black thing is that came with my lee app press.

[mattw]

Hi Matt,
I meant no disrespect, and please don't take anything I said as directed personally toward you. My comments were in response to other comments made previously. You know as well as I there are folks who take "finger tight' as meaning how hard you grip the pliers. I am also getting up in years and find arthritis and weakened hand strength has become a little challenging. I thought I could offer a low cost/home-made solution to help break the lock nuts/bushings free as there's not much room from your fingers/hand to gain purchase on them, especially if they are in a turret. If you'd like one, shoot me a PM.
Ed

None taken Ed... I am jealous of all of you that can make those printers work. I have tried to learn the cad software a couple of times and just do not get it. The sad thing... I read and mark up prints at work and hand them to the guys that run autocad... :(

[1hole]

... and I like to install my die against the shell holder and then go 1/8 turn further before I lock it, forcing it square against the shell holder.

You're using a 1/8th turn "set it and forget it" sizer adjustment.

Have you ever tried "custom" resizing your bottle neck cases by using something like the RCBS' precision case gage, or Hornady's "headspace" device, so you can measure and adjust for exactly the amount of shoulder set-back you need to fit your own chambers?

[mattw]

I do for my bench guns an bottle neck levers, for pistol I use a bump set. Most of my rifles get proper bushing dies as well.

[john.k]

I believe Snap On make a range of "spline drive" tools ,wrenches, sockets ,etc .....however its quite obvious Lee doesnt intend high duty wrenches to be used to over torque and break their components.

[rayh]

Ed do you have a site where your handle can be bought?? What in the world is thingiverse????

[RedlegEd]

Ed do you have a site where your handle can be bought?? What in the world is thingiverse????
Hi Ray,
I hadn't considered selling them, but if I do, I'll post an ad in the Swappin and Selling forum (I don't want to violate forum rules by posting here.) As for "Thingiverse (https://www.thingiverse.com/)," it's a web site where people who design and make things for 3D printers can post and share their creations (think PDFs for 3D printers.) If you have a 3D printer, and really don't want to learn how to use design programs, you can go there and get a "ready made" solution. Some even offer the ability to customize. For example, I smoked some pork butts the other day and wanted to get meat claws to pull it (beats using forks.) I went on Thingiverse, searched, and sure enough, they had a meat claw to print. Printed up two of them, and they worked great.
Ed

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[onelight]

I like the wrench for turret and progressive tools where you don't have room to get ahold of the nut even using the wrench I try to not tighten more than I would if I could get a hold of the nut with my fingers. The O ring secures them well when snug.
I wonder if you could make a wrench that would slip over the top of the die out of PVC pipe.

[RedlegEd]

I like the wrench for turret and progressive tools where you don't have room to get ahold of the nut even using the wrench I try to not tighten more than I would if I could get a hold of the nut with my fingers. The O ring secures them well when snug.
I wonder if you could make a wrench that would slip over the top of the die out of PVC pipe.
Hi,
That's why the wrench is half moon/spanner looking so you can go in from the side (see the pics in the post above.) (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?403923-New-Lee-die-bushing-spline-drive-nut-wrench&p=4928966&viewfull=1#post4928966)
Ed

[rayh]

Thanks Ed, I'm really not into this computer stuff. i appreciate you taking the time to explain. I bought the Lee APP for depriming mainly and encountered the new ring. . I don't expect to change the die out to many times but your design would be handy if I do. I did ground down and shorten an open wrench for the regular Lee rings.

[RedlegEd]

Thanks Ed, I'm really not into this computer stuff. i appreciate you taking the time to explain. I bought the Lee APP for depriming mainly and encountered the new ring. . I don't expect to change the die out to many times but your design would be handy if I do. I did ground down and shorten an open wrench for the regular Lee rings.
Ray,
I sent you a PM.
Ed

[onelight]

Hi,
That's why the wrench is half moon/spanner looking so you can go in from the side (see the pics in the post above.) (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?403923-New-Lee-die-bushing-spline-drive-nut-wrench&p=4928966&viewfull=1#post4928966)
Ed
Thanks .
that's how I use it , it works fine for me so far 0 complaints.

[mattw]

Is spline drive a standard? Like, say a hex head bolt?

[RedlegEd]

Is spline drive a standard? Like, say a hex head bolt?
Hi Matt,
No, Lee recently went to those. Prior to that, it was a hex lock nut with a groove for an O-Ring. When finger tightened, the O-ring compressed and put pressure on the die body thereby keeping the whole thing secure. The problem with it was you couldn't lock it in to get repeatability when you changed dies. In the picture is an old style, new spline style, and the Locking Ring Bushing. To further confuse things, the Lock Ring bushings have three different types of set screws depending on when they were manufactured. The current version uses an Allen screw.
Ed

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[mattw]

Ed, could not agree more. I have several of the old o-ring nuts and really do not like them. Cannot set them the same way from use to use.

[Omega]

I guess I never really had an issue with any of the nuts on any make of die. I started early on with the Lee Turret press, so once I set my dies, I didn't need to touch them. I sometimes used a wrench to get them off, if I couldn't get a new turret for a new caliber I repurposed one of my seldom used ones. Now, I still use turrets, but all have their own so don't need to mess with them.

[mattw]

Omega, sounds like you are in your ideal world. I do all of my loading on an RCBS Rock Chucker 2 and 4 and prime on a Partner press with the Lee priming setup. At our shooting volume of around 700 to 800 rounds per week, I load in the winter and shoot in the summer. I have run 1050's and other progressive presses and just did not feel the attention to detail per round made the best ammo. Therefore, I do end up changing dies often. I find that I really like the old Hornaday split ring nuts, the RCBS are second for me and Lee o-rings end up last. Lyman rings are also pretty good. I do use set screw locked rings, but not without a shot ball in the hole first, hate boogered threads on dies.

[RedlegEd]

I guess I never really had an issue with any of the nuts on any make of die. I started early on with the Lee Turret press, so once I set my dies, I didn't need to touch them. I sometimes used a wrench to get them off, if I couldn't get a new turret for a new caliber I repurposed one of my seldom used ones. Now, I still use turrets, but all have their own so don't need to mess with them.
Hi,
I also use the Lee Turret press and keep most of my dies set up in turrets. Where I got started on the new style was with the Lee APP where it's easier to keep sizing/decapping dies in new Lock Ring bushings so I can swap them out. I also switched my Lee Classic Cast from a Hornady bushing insert to the Lee bushing insert. It just makes life easier if everything is set up the same.
Ed

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[mdi]

I like the wrench for turret and progressive tools where you don't have room to get ahold of the nut even using the wrench I try to not tighten more than I would if I could get a hold of the nut with my fingers. The O ring secures them well when snug.
I wonder if you could make a wrench that would slip over the top of the die out of PVC pipe.

While not PVC there already is a tool for that; deep socket. IIRC a 1 5/16 socket. https://www.mscdirect.com/industrialtools/1-sp-45-sp-5-sp-47-sp-16-inch-deep-socket.html

Unless you are using Lee's splined nuts...

[Valley-Shooter]

While not PVC there already is a tool for that; deep socket. IIRC a 1 5/16 socket. https://www.mscdirect.com/industrialtools/1-sp-45-sp-5-sp-47-sp-16-inch-deep-socket.html

Unless you are using Lee's splined nuts...That's what this thread is about, the new Lee spline wrench.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

[onelight]

Hi,
I also use the Lee Turret press and keep most of my dies set up in turrets. Where I got started on the new style was with the Lee APP where it's easier to keep sizing/decapping dies in new Lock Ring bushings so I can swap them out. I also switched my Lee Classic Cast from a Hornady bushing insert to the Lee bushing insert. It just makes life easier if everything is set up the same.
Ed

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You are way to organized :-P Nice job!

[RedlegEd]

You are way to organized :-P Nice job!
Thanks, but it's really just a coping mechanism. If I didn't force myself into this, my bench (garage, desk, tool room, office, etc.) would look like a bomb went off and I couldn't find anything. Dan at Inline Fabrication (https://inlinefabrication.com/) (a vendor sponsor of this site) has great brackets and trays that make being organized a whole lot easier.
Ed

[onelight]

264221
This is from Lees web sight
I like this version for where I want the ring locked to the die they clamp on instead of using a set screw run into the die.

[rodsvet]

I alway simply remove the O ring and use their nuts like any other. Or yet buy Dillon nuts and wrench.

[archangel2003]

I store my dies in Plano 3-18 Waterproof Stowaways and the old style nut fit in the compartments perfectly, but the new spline drives lack that thinness at the flats and bulge the compartments.
I'd love to find someone who has a bunch of old 6 sided nuts wanting to trade for the new splines ones.

[RedlegEd]

I store my dies in Plano 3-18 Waterproof Stowaways and the old style nut fit in the compartments perfectly, but the new spline drives lack that thinness at the flats and bulge the compartments.
I'd love to find someone who has a bunch of old 6 sided nuts wanting to trade for the new splines ones.

PM Sent

[Pepe Ray]

P.M. going out to archangle2003.

[archangel2003]

RedLegEd got the ones I had for now, but I expect I'll be getting more in the future.

[deces]

Is anyone making a quality "metal" wrench for the new Ultimate Lock Rings? The little toy plastic wrench is a joke.

Yeah, have a look, but ignore the price.
https://bigdogsteel.com/product/lee-ultimate-lock-ring-wrench/

[mac60]

How 'bout these?

314254

You can get 'em at Lowe's.

[curiousgeorge]

The wrench that mac60 pictured in his post is what I've been using on the new Lee rings. Dug it out of a tool box where I keep things that I don't have a need for at the time, but can't bear to get rid of. The wrench works very well.

[mdatlanta]

My impression when I read this post was, if you’re tightening it enough to break their wrench, you’re tightening it too much! Could it be that the wrench might be designed to break before something important does?

Froggie

^THIS^

With respect, in my experience the leverage available with the spline tool as designed is more than sufficient. YMMV, however.