What is wrong with this one

[pdragon]

262365
A friend is having problems. This is a Lyman 457125 alloy is 20-1
Lead is isotope containers. Thanks

[rockshooter]

mold too cold, alloy dirty (inclusions), add a little tin
Loren

[pdragon]

Thanks Loren, I thought it was too cold also.
I am not sure where he is getting the dirt from. Any idea how to clean the alloy. He fluxes with candle wax.
We bought tin and he is adding to get 20-1.
Mark

[sigep1764]

I would probably start with scrubbing the mold, it could be rusty or contaminated. When fluxing, it only takes a pea sized amount of wax and I always scrape the bottom and sides of the pot with a spoon. Then gently bring all the contaminates that are on top of the lead in the pot over to one side and scoop out.

[ascast]

don't overlook the pot sides bottom. and toss a chunk of wax in the dipper too

[MrWolf]

I would use some pine shavings in addition to the wax and really mix it well. Some batches just take more times to come clean.

[DHDeal]

Is he ladle casting or using a bottom pour? Those big heavy bullet molds cast great, but like some heat. To me it looks like dirty alloy and possibly a rusty/dirty mold. While I don't have that mold from your picture, I do have the Lyman 457132 (haven't used it in about 15+ years though). If my memory is good, the driving bands shouldn't be as round as your picture which implies a mold that's not up too temperature.

You also mention the alloy as isotope containers and adding tin to get 20/1. The 20/1 that is mentioned for BPCR's (Black Powder Cartridge Rifles which that mold is designed for) is pure lead and tin, not isotope containers and tin. I've been wrong before but isotope containers are very similar to COWW and has some antimony. The alloy you mentioned will be harder than 20/1. That doesn't mean it won't work, but the guys serioisly shooting the BPCR's are pretty particular on alloys.

What is your friend shooting that bullet out of?

[Land Owner]

20-1, lead to tin, is 95% lead to 5% tin (20 times 5 = 100). That's a lot of expensive tin, when, imo, 2% tin would do.

1.) Clean the mold with care and attention to the minute vent lines.
2.) Make certain that no wax is getting into the mold.
3.) Flux, flux, flux. Sawdust and wax are BOTH excellent.
4.) Heat the mold and especially the spru plate - really well.
5.) Try again. Let us know how that goes.

[WHITETAIL]

+1 with Land Owner!
I have been melting lead for
more years than I will admit.
(35+ years) and They are right on target.:cbpour:

[Billwnr]

one thing I do with my pots from time to time is empty all the lead out, let them cool, fill them up with water and turn them on. It boils all the crud off the sides and gets them squeaky clean. After drying I go back to casting again. The reason they'd get so much crud in them is I'd also use my pots to melt down wheelweights and they are dirty, very dirty.

[country gent]

I cast a lot of the lyman 457125. 20-1 tin makes a great bullet ( Thats my standard alloy for BPCR rounds). I cast with 2 moulds and cast at a brisk pace. Im usually in the 725*-750* range. I cast long heavy for caliber bullets 38 cal 360 grn 40 cal 425 grn 45 cal 550 grn these bullets are roughly 1 .3-1.4" long. It takes a fast pour and fairly quick cadence to get really good bullets. I ladle cast with a rcbs ladle the spout has been opened up to .205

Heres my cadence or technique

Bring lead up to molten temp of 750* and warm both moulds on warming shelf
Flux pot with sawdust wax mix stirring with a spatula, and wooden paint stick. You want to work the lead up thru the flux and the flux down thru the lead scraping the sides and bottom of the pot.
Warm ladle in the pot for a few minutes, it needs to be up to temp also.
I pick up the first mould and fill with a full ladle Most of my moulds are 2 cavity. I dont pour for a sprue, I pour the first cavity full and then the second emptying the ladle and letting the excess run back in the pot. I have vented all my sprue plates to allow for this
set this mould on warming plate and repeat on sevond mould
Now the sprue on the first mould has set well and the bullet is ready to remove and fill repeating thru the session. I flux as needed usually every 100-150 bullets.

At the end of a session I will have 400-600 bullets all with in a 1/2 grn weight. I throw out the first 10 pours of each mould automatically

Heres a another thing to remember When your casting cast when your sorting sort done try to do both its messes up your cadence and rhythm.

Your alloy is fine and a good choice. temp may need slight adjustment. flow to fill may need adjusted. Technique may need some tuning.

[country gent]

And as a side note my casting pot is gas fired and and holds 120 lbs when full. That much mass maintains a very even temp level and runs well for me. The ladle remains in the pot other than when pouring. When I fill the ladle I push it to the bottom of the pot and make a swirl agitating the alloy every pour.

[gwpercle]

For a alloy that keeps turning up inclusions I do a three step flux :
Add to pot in this order and stir with a small wooden paddle after each addition
1.) Marvelux
2.) Pencil sharpener wood shavings
3.) Beeswax

Beeswax goes in last and all is stirred well with wooden paddle , a gray ash should be left on the surface , work the fluxes in well stirr slowly and completely , skim off the ash (aka - gradeaux) . Two small fluxes work much better than one large flux and don't use too much , too much flux just makes a big mess ... I will sometimes do 3 small fluxes , stirring and skimming well.

The wooden paddle is just a scrap of thin wood...it burns up eventually .
Gary

[Conditor22]

I'd look to fluxing the alloy well first. "flux. Sawdust and wax"

As others have said preheat the mold (on a hot plate) to apr 400° really helps
IF you don't have a hot plate, pressure casting the first 10 - so pours is a way to get decent boolits from a cooler mold.

I've gone to using a denture cleaning brush to clean my molds, work better for me than a toothbrush.

I like using a potatoes masher to get flux to the bottom and a wire whisk to fully incorporate the flux

https://i.imgur.com/eYLZAtO.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/GuYWkDK.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/XnGx1hQ.jpg?1
https://i.imgur.com/iVILHTi.jpg

[rockshooter]

I like that potato masher idea! Think I'll use a glove to hold it tho!
Loren

[pdragon]

Thanks guys, my friend has been casting for years. We shoot sharps and rolling blocks in 45-70 and 45-110. He had a Lee pot that appeared to crack and allow some “insulation?”into the melt. After a few years of prodding he finally bought some tin and this problem seems to be since he added the tin. The tin is stamped “Rotometals solder” it was supposed to be 100%. It was purchased from eBay. He now has a Lyman digital pot. He is the guy that got me into the game so I try to help as much as I can. He’s not so good at internet.

[sutherpride59]

Buy a new liner from the lee site directly and also make sure when you flux and stir he stirs the bottom of the pot. A lot of oxidized crap gets stuck to the bottom of the pot and comes out as you pour.

[David2011]

A friend gave me some metal that he had already rendered to ingots. I tried to use it as provided but it had lots of inclusions. Fluxing with pine sawdust cleaned it up nicely.