Making charcoal for BP

[GregLaROCHE]

I searched for making charcoal, but didn’t come up with anything. If there are threads, please direct me to them. Otherwise, what is the best way to turn wood into charcoal? I know about the traditional ways of burying it and making a fire on top etc. But isn’t there a modern way to put it in an almost sealed metal container and heat it over a fire?
Thanks

[djohns28]

I have been looking into doing this (for BP) and in my extremely short and very limited experience, a gallon paint can seems to work well. There are numerous videos on youtube using paint cans and all seem very successful. Search "DIY charcoal" on youtube and scroll until you see folks using paint cans. Basically, you put green wood (no bark) in an unused paint can and seal it up wit the lid. Poke a small hole in the center of the lid with a nail to release pressure. Put it in a fire or build a fire around it. As it heats it will steam the water off and then the wood gasses will boil off. The wood gas will catch on fire as it escapes through the hole. Once the fire goes out, all the wood gasses have escaped and you should have straight charcoal. Remove the can from the fire once the vent-hole fire goes out to preserve the charcoal and let it cool completely. DO NOT OPEN IT! hot coals will get oxygen and catch fire burning the charcoal you just worked so hard to make. Steel paint cans are cheap too. I plan on making some next weekend with what I think is willow that I have located.

I have made charcoal like this for a forge but not for BP. Same principal applies, just using different wood.

[Oyeboten]

I think djohns28 covers it well...

And as he reminds, do not open till all the way cooled off.

I used to make Charcoal 'sticks' for Artists, and I did them in Sand, in a large size Tin Plated Steel Fruit Juice Can, and they always came out very nicely.

I'd have a few small holes in the top for fumes to get out.

New fresh Gallon Paint Can of course would hold a lot more.

[JimB..]

I use an old ammo can, remove the gasket and place it upside down, build fire around it. Burn for 2-3 hours. If you go too long the only problem is that you get a bit more ash. I use the ammo can that is the same base as the 50cal can but twice the height.

[MrWolf]

I tried the paint can in a whole house wood stove outside that does not work. I use it to burn all the cardboard and paper that I get. I guess it did not stay hot enough but I burn enough that the embers were still hot the next day.

[sharps4590]

Hmm...same way I make char cloth for catching a spark when starting a fire with flint and steel....only a LOT smaller container is used. Good to know both!!

[Themoose]

I used paint cans in fire pit, but cans burnt thru after about a dozen batches. Now I use a Dutch oven with hole drilled in lid then plug with appropriate sized bolt when I take it off. Try to use dry wood with bark removed. I made first batches with cedar shavings as Fly suggested. That man has figured the process out an describes it well in homemade BP thread

[Markopolo]

this is what I use....

262384

262385

cast iron with a lid, a tiny hole drilled into it...

[GregLaROCHE]

I like the Dutch oven idea. I don’t see any reason I can’t use the same one as I melt range scrap in. I even have an extra lid I can use to drill a hole in.

[djohns28]

I used paint cans in fire pit, but cans burnt thru after about a dozen batches. Now I use a Dutch oven with hole drilled in lid then plug with appropriate sized bolt when I take it off. Try to use dry wood with bark removed. I made first batches with cedar shavings as Fly suggested. That man has figured the process out an describes it well in homemade BP thread

Using Cedar for BP?? like western red cedar fence pickets?? I will do a search but do you happen to have a link to the thread?

[Markopolo]

Greg, you can even light the smoke on the lid with a lighter if you dont like all that smoke... it is highly combustable... just remember that when the smoke stops, you are done. and dont open the lid to take a peek... it will possibly flare up...

[John Boy]

Swiss makes their charcoal with seasoned alder buckthron in retorts and control the temperature never to exceed 608 degrees Fahrenheit

[Themoose]

The cedar shavings sold for pet bedding. Got a bag at Walmart. The thread is here on this sight. I think the title is My Homemade Black Powder.

[swamp]

I use the gallon paint can. 1/8 inch hole drilled in lid. when smoke stops I put a screw in the hole to lessen air getting in. Cut wood to length and split into sticks or saw into 1 inch cubes.
swamp

[GregLaROCHE]

Swiss makes their charcoal with seasoned alder buckthron in retorts and control the temperature never to exceed 608 degrees Fahrenheit

This is the first time I heard temperature was important. The Swiss do make good BP though. Anyone have any input on temperatures ?

[Boz330]

I think the big thing about temp is the consistency of the powder lot to lot. That would be difficult to do in a hobby setting.

Bob

[skrapyard628]

Reading this makes me a bit curious. Would using the natural hardwood lump charcoal you can buy for grilling at the hardware store work for making BP? Has anyone tried this?

[country gent]

Wondering here if the retort could be put in an oven at 500* to make the charcoal? an old electric oven with a PID on it would give a very controlled temp and then it would become a time to "cook" and wood type equation. Just curious here. another is the enclosed oven would also limit the oxygen in the process.

[swamp]

Wondering here if the retort could be put in an oven at 500* to make the charcoal? an old electric oven with a PID on it would give a very controlled temp and then it would become a time to "cook" and wood type equation. Just curious here. another is the enclosed oven would also limit the oxygen in the process.


I think that would be something to try. Outdoors for sure.

[indian joe]

This is the first time I heard temperature was important. The Swiss do make good BP though. Anyone have any input on temperatures ?

I tend to burn on the cool side - regulate the fire by how hard and fast the smoke comes out of the vent hole in the can - I never take it through to when the smoke stops - makes good powder (willow) - burns a little brownish in the gun - impatience is part of the equation - maybe more cooked would be better but I am loathe to change something that works good.

[indian joe]

I think the big thing about temp is the consistency of the powder lot to lot. That would be difficult to do in a hobby setting.

Bob

You get consistency by blending several small lots into one - whether charcoal or powder - the blend is your friend - be careful tho

[indian joe]

Reading this makes me a bit curious. Would using the natural hardwood lump charcoal you can buy for grilling at the hardware store work for making BP? Has anyone tried this?

many have tried and failed = poor quality powder is the story - dirty - inconsistent - low energy - I took their word for it .

[abunaitoo]

I've been meaning to try this.
What wood is the best???
Hard or soft wood???
We don't have much variety here, so wanting to use scrap wood.

[JimB..]

Abunaitoo, I have heard that coconut shell charcoal is good, but have never tried it.

Well these guys say no. They suggest grape vine.
https://pyrodata.com/chemicals/Charcoal

[NoZombies]

Usually the lighter the weight of the wood (lower density), the more energetic the BP made using the charcoal (like all rules, there are exceptions). Some wood species leave more ash than others. For pyro stuff the ash isn't that important, for use in firearms it make a big difference in the fouling left behind. Most hardwoods leave less ash, most softwoods more. Light pine is great for pyro BP, but leaves more fouling that's harder to clean when used in guns compared to most (popular for BP) hardwoods.

[John Boy]

The best wood is the one with the most glucose when harvested in the Spring. Goex subcontracts yellow maple and premium Swiss buys spring cut alder buckthorn from the Gypsies, stores for 3 years, peels off the bark and then makes charcoal as I previously posted

[GregLaROCHE]

When I first thought about making BP, I found the most important ingredient was the charcoal. I found some SEM pictures and the best charcoal had tiny voids in it produced by the fibers of the wood. I guess the voids were filled with the other ingredients and that’s what makes it better. These aren’t the pictures I found before related to BP, but will give an idea.

https://www.google.com/search?q=charcoal+sem&rlz=1C9BKJA_enFR735FR737&oq=charcoal+sem+&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l3.19631j0j7&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

[Boz330]

You get consistency by blending several small lots into one - whether charcoal or powder - the blend is your friend - be careful tho

I make enough at one time that I don't have to blend small batches.

Bob

[indian joe]

I make enough at one time that I don't have to blend small batches.

Bob

so not a hobby setting!:-o

[Boz330]

so not a hobby setting!:-o

They aren't that big but I shoot mid and long range competition and use store bought for that. My HM is used for hunting or close range (150yd).

Bob

[seetrout]

The best wood is the one with the most glucose when harvested in the Spring. Goex subcontracts yellow maple and premium Swiss buys spring cut alder buckthorn from the Gypsies, stores for 3 years, peels off the bark and then makes charcoal as I previously posted

Spring cut? So how about about wood that is dried standing? I have a tree of heaven or two that are just about dead standing due to the spotted lantern flies. Was thinking of trying my hand at homemade with them when they are ready to fall. The one tree should be able to make about....How many pounds of charcoal can you get out of a tree that would make two cord of firewood plus all the smaller stuff?

Anyway, question is, should I cut it before it dies or just let it stand and cut it when it's more convenient?

[Ozark mike]

Most would have willow close by id think if my memory serves black willow is what you want but i may be behind on the latest achievements

[greenjoytj]

Cooking wood in a vented container at a controlled temperature, sounds like a job for a PID controller hooked to a gas camp stove.

When Dupont was making chemicals through the destructive distillation of wood in giant retorts and waste byproduct (to DuPont) was the wood charcoal. DuPont sold the waste to GOEX.
When the retort wore out they quit that area of business. GOEX had to to find a new source of charcoal.

“Activated charcoal” you see that label applied to many products, particularly if the product is a filter.
I see a trendy trend now is to have charcoal as an ingredient in shampoos and body washes.

What does Jack Daniel’s do with the charcoal in their filtering vats? Might make good BP once the booze dries out of it. Maybe it all ready earmarked for GOEX.

How about all that Texas mesquite wood. Cook it to charcoal. make it into BP. Every shot fired would smell like a BBQ in hell. Maybe a mesquite and Jack Daniel’s charcoal blend, it might cause a resurgence in popularity in BP shooting.

Pipe tobacco manufacturers put all sorts of weird flavouring in their deadly product, so why not some dried apple peel in you BP to counter the sulphur stench.

:bigsmyl2:

[heelerau]

I have always understood that the type of wood, eg willow, buckthorn, alder is most important, and the charcoal is the most important ingredient. I did make a small batch of powder by hand using charcoal made from cherrywood. I found it had about 1/3 the strength of factory Goex. It did go off ok in a Navy colt and my flintlock rifle, but no real guts. I did not compress it into a puck when damp, so that may well have made a huge difference.
A Pid controller on a gas barbecue might well be a good way of making a consistent product. I did try some powder for priming that a mate made out of palm fronds, that went off fine. It was pretty much dust so I did not try it as a main charge.

[GregLaROCHE]

Greg, you can even light the smoke on the lid with a lighter if you dont like all that smoke... it is highly combustable... just remember that when the smoke stops, you are done. and dont open the lid to take a peek... it will possibly flare up...

Do you know they once used that smoke to run engines?

[Tracy]

Here's the black powder making super thread. There's an incredible amount of info therein. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?103852-My-homemade-black-powder

[indian joe]

Do you know they once used that smoke to run engines?

yep WW2 - seen pictures of them old 1920's cars with the "Gas Producer" on the back - my Dad told me a well fed horse was a better bet but those old contraptions spluttered along and got there - my Grandad and the boys buried a 44 gal of good petrol in the middle of the chookshed floor to avoid handing it in when rationing came in early in the war - dug it up about 1953 (after the rationing ended)

[Huvius]

Spring cut? So how about about wood that is dried standing? I have a tree of heaven or two that are just about dead standing due to the spotted lantern flies. Was thinking of trying my hand at homemade with them when they are ready to fall. The one tree should be able to make about....How many pounds of charcoal can you get out of a tree that would make two cord of firewood plus all the smaller stuff?

Anyway, question is, should I cut it before it dies or just let it stand and cut it when it's more convenient?


I'd cut it while its green and let it dry.
You will find that for such a stinky tree, ToH makes about the nicest smelling smoke imaginable, but very strong.

[Huvius]

I made my retort out of two square cake pans clamped together ($1 store) and a hollow bolt stuck in the center of the top one for a chimney.
Not sure that a chimney is necessarily better than just a hole but it seems to me that air would have a harder time getting down a chimney than just through a hole.
The hollow bolt is a lamp part which is nice because once the smoke stops, you can simply plug it with a sharp dowel or something similar.
The big BP making thread has all of the answers one could seek on the subject.

[BombDoc]

The Royal Gunpowder Factory at Waltham Abbey in UK used only Alder Buckthorn (Frangula alnus) for making rifle gunpowder. Willow was used as well, but for making artillery grade powder. They considered that the charcoal, and what it was made from, was the main factor in the eventual quality of the gunpowder.

The wood was cut in the spring and debarked. It was then stacked for over a year to let the sap and moisture dry out. The wood was then packed into metal tubes which were then loaded into a retort and heated to form the charcoal. One of their main concerns was ensuring that grit did not get into the milling process from the charcoal, and were extremely careful in how they stored and processed the wood once it had been de-barked.

[EMC45]

I cut down and debarked som TOH and rendered it into charcoal. I used a metal coffee can with a double thickness of tinfoil on top wired closed. I poked a small hole in the foil and it gassed off for quite a while. I lit the gas coming out and it burned vigorously.

I simply put the can in the fire pit and stacked "fat lighter" around it and it burned until it stopped gassing off. I retrieved it the next day and the charcoal was perfect.

[Claypipe]

I think the big thing about temp is the consistency of the powder lot to lot. That would be difficult to do in a hobby setting. Bob

Maybe if one used a ceramics kiln?

[GhostHawk]

Skrapyard768 it is my understanding that most of that charcoal for grilling is hardwood.

For black powder you want the lightest wood you can find. Willow, tree of heaven. I've even heard of bundles of oatgrass.

I wonder about bundles of pigweed or horseweed stems an inch in diameter. Cut, dried, bundled, and charcoaled. Might be a little time spent experimenting would give you something that works really really well.