I want another .45 Colt

[Rick R]

I had a 4” Ruger Redhawk in .45 Colt, it was accurate off the bench but not from my paws just standing there shooting, I just couldn’t learn to love it. It went away in a trade and I don’t miss it. But I do have an MP mold for the 270SAA, an NOE for a 350gr FP, a six cavity Lee 200gr LRN mold and a stack of Starline brass out in the shed.

I’m thinking it is time for a “Pack’n Pistol”, something you can carry in a holster and forget it’s there but something that’s fun to knock a few cans off of a fence rail with. I have a 4 5/8” SBH that I shoot pretty well so a .45 in about the same size format. I don’t shoot SASS, I don’t live where big bears gnaw on people, this is a fun gun.

Are the various Italian clones worthy? I was looking at Uberti’s in the local fun store and Taylor & Co has a “Devil Anse” model that looks interesting. Or is a Ruger NMBH or Vaquero the “Easy Button” if you just recognize that it’s going to need the throats opened up to be accurate?

[LUCKYDAWG13]

Id go Ruger if I was looking

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I've got an abundance of .45 Colts, but none of them are "something you can carry in a holster and forget it's there...". Just by the very size of the cartridge compact gun design is a rare thing. As for the quality of the Italian clones, I give them an A+. I've got both Uberti and Pietta models and have no complaints. Both companies make "Sheriff" models that are short, some with and some without the ejector rod housing. But, they're still a significant piece of iron and you'll know that they're there. I also have a NM Vaquero. Truthfully, it's my least favorite and doesn't shoot to point of aim, but groups o.k. I just can't think of a lightweight .45 Colt. You'd probably do better in the .44 Spec. area (like Charter Arms Bulldog) or .357 Mag., but I do understand the allure of the .45 Colt which is why I have several.

DG

[littlejack]

Rick:
About 7 years ago, I bought a Uberti "Evil Roy"
model SAA in 45 Colt. It is a fine revolver, in every way. Fit and finish is very good. The piece is very accurate, and feels great in the hand. Mine has the 5.5" barrel. Don't know what loads you intend to shoot, or even if you plan on reloading for it. If you're into heavy fodder, better stick with the Ruger. My go to load is 9 grains of Herco, with anything from 255 to 265 grain cast. Clocking those slugs at 900 +/- fps is very satisfying. I have in the past owned a Ruger BH in .41 magnum. Yes, they are built like a tank, but it comes at a price, (weight). So, if you're ok with standard pressure 45 Colt loads, in my opinion, you would not be handicapped in any way with the Uberti revolver. Different models, come in different barrell lengths, i.e. 3.5" or 4.75". The shorter barrel versions may be better for your packing purposes. I have no experience with the other Italian copies, so I will not comment.
Regards

[Walks]

The RCBS #45-270-SAA drops a bullet that when crimped in the groove is too long to fit in My Italian clones.

Don't know about the N.O.E. bullet.

[sundog]

The Uberti El Patron is good right from the box.

[Rick R]

Forgot to add that I routinely carry a full size 1911 or a 3” GP100 (using a good belt and holster) so the two Italian clones I fondled yesterday were svelte to my paws. I’m not one of those dudes rocking a Airweight J frame in his shorts pocket.

I really want the gun to work well with the 270SAA just under 1,000fps, hearing that the RCBS version doesn’t work in the Italian guns is disheartening. My Mihec mold drops beautiful boolits.
The 350gr NOE was purchased on a whim and probably needs to go to someone with a Casull. Or maybe I need a Casull...

Thanks for the input guys,

[Rick R]

The Uberti El Patron is good right from the box.

One of the guns I looked at yesterday was an El Patron. If it had been a 4 5/8” it would have probably come home with me.

[littlejack]

Just to add, I cast with the RCBS 45-255 SWC. Drops a great slug. Article by Glen Frixell, doing comparisons of different bullets in that weight range, states that, that RCBS mould drops as close to the original Keith 454424 slug as any. That's not including the propritory mould makers turning out the 454424 clones.
Regards

[sac]

I have a Pietta Great Western ii https://www.emf-company.com/store/pc/Dlx-Californian-c68.htm and it handles RCBS 45-270saa bullet just fine, I don't think I would shoot a 350 gr. in a SAA colt or a clone. The Pietta is a mirror image of a 2nd gen Colt.

[Scrounge]

I had a 4” Ruger Redhawk in .45 Colt, it was accurate off the bench but not from my paws just standing there shooting, I just couldn’t learn to love it. It went away in a trade and I don’t miss it. But I do have an MP mold for the 270SAA, an NOE for a 350gr FP, a six cavity Lee 200gr LRN mold and a stack of Starline brass out in the shed.

I’m thinking it is time for a “Pack’n Pistol”, something you can carry in a holster and forget it’s there but something that’s fun to knock a few cans off of a fence rail with. I have a 4 5/8” SBH that I shoot pretty well so a .45 in about the same size format. I don’t shoot SASS, I don’t live where big bears gnaw on people, this is a fun gun.

Are the various Italian clones worthy? I was looking at Uberti’s in the local fun store and Taylor & Co has a “Devil Anse” model that looks interesting. Or is a Ruger NMBH or Vaquero the “Easy Button” if you just recognize that it’s going to need the throats opened up to be accurate?

I don't want to hear your crying! I haven't gotten to shoot anything in .45 Long since I was a kid! Well, except for that funky derringer-thing. .45LC & .410 shot, and the gap between the chamber and rifling was something like 1" or more. From about card-table distance to the target, got one shot right near the edge of the target and laying on it's side. It keyholed and barely penetrated the paper target and a bit of wood backing. Nah! I know the cartridge is better than that!

Yeah, you're right. Pure jealousy. My eyes are green right now, just thinking about it. ;) A couple of the gun shops here will rent a gun, so you might be able to find someplace there where you could try some of them. If you know people local to you who own something you're interested in, you might be able to talk them into letting you try theirs out. Really, nothing beats holding in your own hands and shooting it. Which is how I know I don't want one of those derringer-things. It is bad to find out such things AFTER you've paid for the weapon.

[sac]

The RCBS #45-270-SAA drops a bullet that when crimped in the groove is too long to fit in My Italian clones.

Don't know about the N.O.E. bullet.

Thats odd, that is what it was designed for was Colt saa and clones,

[Beagle333]

My favorites out of all of mine are my four Uberti El Patrons and my Cimarron Thunderstorm.

[Baltimoreed]

262121262122
I also like .45s [.45acp/auto-rim, LC, .455/.450 Webley] My first SA’s were old s/s Rugers, and a uberti Thunderer that I won but I've recently bought a Schofield and an open top 1860 mason richards conversion. My DA .45s are N frame Smiths, New Service Colts and Webleys. If I needed a 100% reliable .45 it would be my 625 with full moon clips. This is a Thunder Ranch that I put stags on, needed to go back to smith to straiten the bbl but now it does fine.

[USSR]

The RCBS #45-270-SAA drops a bullet that when crimped in the groove is too long to fit in My Italian clones.

Don't know about the N.O.E. bullet.

My RCBS #45-270-SAA bullets also fit my Pietta.

Don

[Der Gebirgsjager]

262121262122 This is a Thunder Ranch that I put stags on, needed to go back to smith to straiten the bbl but now it does fine.

See..that's what happens when you tighten the grip screw too tight! ;-) Seriously, that's a really nice looking 625.

[DougGuy]

Either a flattop new model blackhawk or a new model vaquero would work from ruger, these are current production medium frame guns and imho they are about as good of fit and finish as anything Ruger has ever made.

Throats opened up, 30oz. Wolff trigger return spring and take a tad off the hammer pad to lessen or rid the trigger of creep and they are very fine specimens of 45 Colt, good to 23,000psi which is tier 2 level, basically a 250gr boolit at just shy of 1200fps you can hunt deer, bear, or pig with that velocity, and they are fun to shoot.

That is, if you are not yearning for the color case frame and 4 clicks to full cock like a Colt or Italian clone. If you want the cowboy style colt, look into the clones, if you want durability and low cost, I'd suggest the Ruger.

[Drm50]

I wouldn’t buy a gun without adjustable sights. The Ruger Blackhawk is what got me interested in
45Colt. I bought one in 60s when first out. I quit Rugers when New Model came out. Now I have 3 S&W m25s and shoot them more than any of the magnums. The Ruger BH and M25 both do well with the old 250RnFp cast at factory duplication velocities. I also have a Colt New Service that shoots well with this load but someone filed front sight way before my time. Two of my 25s are tuned for 242gr WCs. they shoot better than me.

[9.3X62AL]

Finding and buying a S&W Model 625 x 4" last summer has slaked my '45 Thirst' a bit, DANG that is a NICE REVOLVER.

But the 45 Colt is an AWESOME cartridge, and while I love my Bisley Blackhawk in that caliber, it is a bit of a chunk to haul around. Prior to snagging the BisHawk--which DID require throating, I had a Uberti Cattleman x 45 Colt x 4-3/4". GREAT revolver. I miss it something awful. It shot both #454190 and #454424 right where the sights looked at 25 yards over 8.5 grains of Unique or 9.5 grains of Herco. Velocities ran in the 825-850 FPS ballpark. A more recent (2012-made) Cattleman in 44/40 WCF has similar quality and places SAECO #446 right where the sights look also. I would purchase either the Uberti or the Ruger offerings without much hesitation--size and weight considerations come foremost, as well as load strength expectations. A 255 grain casting of .452" diameter approaching at 800-900 FPS is no slouch as a venison-maker or as a goblin-repeller. I used to deeply envy Anaheim PD's authorization of S&W Model 25-5 revolvers in 45 Colt for duty use.

[sonoransixgun]

Based on your original post and reason for wanting one, I'd go with the Ruger Vaquero.... That's the gun I eventually want to get... Little lighter than the Blackhawk but still the strength of a Ruger... Right now I have a NMBH in .45 and it is my most accurate revolver. Last group I shot with it had every hole touching. That was at 15 yds. At 25 yds. I almost had the same. I absolutely love that gun... Good luck with your decision. No doubt you'll be happy. It's a good day in history to buy a .45....

[contender1]

Ok, I own several Rugers in 45 Colt,, as well as a FA in 454, & an El Dorado in 45 Colt. I also own other .45 Colts.
To get to the meat of things.
DougGuy has put forth some excellent info.
Ruger first put out the Old Model .45 in 1971. It was a Blackhawk. (Sorry Drm50,, it wasn't in the 1960's.) The OM's stopped in 1973,, and the New Models were introduced. It wasn't until 1993,, that the Vaquero's came along,, and they were FIRST out using the same frame size as the Blackhawk. The New Vaquero came along in 2005,,, and it's frame size was scaled down, (as noted by DougGuy.) It along with the later Flattop 45's,, use the "mid sized" frame,, and can handle hotter loads than the older Colts & other guns made many years ago. (Again, good reference DougGuy.)
There have been several variations in barrel length & grip frames to go along with the .45 Colt made by Ruger. You have several options,, including the ability to swap grip frames to your liking. All of Ruger SA handguns use the exact same screw hole pattern. Some of the NM's no longer have the cut out in the mainframe that mates to the g/f,, so there may be a need to modify the grips, etc,, but it's easy.

The point to all this is the fact that there are variations within the Ruger line that can fill most desires. Many of the Colt Clones out there,, often fail to be as versatile.
And as noted,, a Vaquero has fixed sights,, and can sometimes need tweaking to get a load to shoot to POA. I once swapped into a nice Original Vaquero that the owner knew it shot low & left. (He failed to tell me, until I confronted him later.) But,, I was able to tweak it by opening the rear sight channel a little, and regulating the ammo.
And if you wish to know the difference in frame size,, the Original Vaquero's (on the Blackhawk frame,) will have a 2-digit prefix in the serial number. The New Vaquero's will have a 3-digit prefix.

I have shot many of the Colt clones & many felt & shot good. But the long term wear & tear, as well as re-sale is not as good as a Ruger.

[boatswainsmate]

I don't know how you feel about smith & wesson but this is a nice 45 colt packer and will handle the 270 SAA at 1000 FPS. Happy Shooting! Boats
https://i.ibb.co/N27LW9j/DSCN3920.jpg (https://ibb.co/whYKpSW)

[Rick R]

Boats,
That’s a good looking 625! I have a 629 Mountain Gun and if I find (big “if” around here) a 4” S&W I’d buy it if the price is even close to reasonable.

DougGuy,
I hadn’t thought of the Flat top BH, it’s probably an excellent idea, again “if” I can find one around here.

Gentlemen,
Thanks for the ideas and opinions.

[Dale53]

I second DougGuy's recommendation of the Ruger Flattop in .45 Colt. Medium frame, adjustable sights (with the great sight picture that provides), and that great "Pawl" that is a pleasure to load. Most of all, if you get the convertible, you will have one of the best, most useful, single actions of all times. I already had a Bisley SS Convertible that (after cylinder reaming) shoots "lights out". Having a .45 ACP cylinder to shoot target loads and woods carrying, with the advantage of a .45 Colt cylinder for the Tier II hunting loads, is almost beyond satisfaction! The Ruger will work perfectly with the RCBS 270 SAA bullet, too. My Bisley shoots it quite well and it is a premier bullet for big game.

I have two Ruger Flattops in .44 Special, which along with the, Bisley convertible, I have that covered or I would get one of the .45 Colt Flattops, myself. They are that good!

FWIW
Dale53

[yeahbub]

I played around with a friend's New Vaquero in .45 Colt, 5.5". When I examined it and took measurements, I pin-gaged the throats and they were .452, IIRC. It shot to the point of aim with the Lee 255gr RNFP at 800-900fps and didn't do badly with the Lee 200gr RNFP either, but if driven fast, they would hit low. The one thing I didn't like about the RNV in .45 Colt was the scary-thin chamber walls between chambers. Definitely meant for standard pressure ammo. I liked the action, the trigger and thought it would be sweet in .44 Special or .41 Spl or Mag, where the chamber walls would have a reassuring thickness to them. This is one reason Elmer Keith went to the .44 Spl - more steel for those high pressure loads he was experimenting with. Another good thing is the transfer bar mechanism for safe carry with 6 loaded chambers. A guy at the range I once belonged to had an Italian Colt clone with the firing pin on the hammer and was limited to 5 loaded and hammer down on an empty chamber only. One of the clone makers (Beretta is it?), maybe more use a transfer bar now, but I can't remember which. No matter what, though, it's not a small package

[DougGuy]

The one thing I didn't like about the RNV in .45 Colt was the scary-thin chamber walls between chambers.

Webs are the same thickness as the outer cylinder walls but the weakest part of any sixgun is the bolt cuppets which are cut right in the center of the chambers so that the thinnest part of the cylinder is under the deepest part of the notch. 5 shot cylinders do not suffer this design weakness.

The Ruger New Vaquero and Ruger New Model Flattop Blackhawk is rated to 45 ACP+P which is 23,000psi, as are many of the modern Italian clones, check with the mfgr before assuming any 45 ACP cylinder is safe with +P loads.

In agreement with Elmer, I would rate the Ruger New Model Flattop Blackhawk in 44 Special to 25,000psi, because of the smaller chambers = slightly thicker cylinder walls and webs. That is my personal estimate of the pressure ceiling for the flattop 44, it's neither documented nor recommended.

My Avatar is a Uberti Old Model made only in 2006, it has a hammer pin safety which is a transfer rod inside the hammer which the trigger pushes up on when firing so the firing pin will engage the primer. It also has a safety notch which is not the same as a half cock notch of the old Colt, the Uberti can be carried with 6 loaded chambers even though I don't carry this way because it could cause me or someone else to accidentally carry a different single action with 6 loaded chambers, old habits are hard to break so why create them in the first place? Complacency can get a fella killed if he isn't careful.

For those John Wayne fans, did you catch the scene in "The Shootist" where he is getting ready to leave his rented room to go down to the Metropol, you will see him remove one of his engraved USFA revolvers and drop in the 6th cartridge, it's the last thing he does before strapping his gunbelt on.

[Wayne Smith]

How much of a romantic are you. If you have an engineering personality and very functional get the Ruger. If you like the romance of the original Colt get the Uberti. I'm enough of a romantic that my Uberti's are in 44WCF and 41Colt! And I shoot my 44WCF with BP and a Big Lube boolit.

[gunther]

Something not covered in these replies is your hand size. If you wear xl or xxl gloves, a Colt grip frame will be way to small. A bisley frame will do, but weighs an extra 4 or 5 ounces. A no win situation. Ooh, for an after-market aluminum bisley grip frame for Rugers.