Lets Talk 40-65......

[jackley]

Found a C-Sharps in 40-65 today, right here in town. But I have no info on this cartridge. What kind of range can you get out of it? With what boolit? Are they competitive in long range shoots? Or would waiting for a 45-70 be a better choice? Any other info or comments on it would be appreciated.
Thanks
Jerry

[wills]

Fine for silhouette. Look at the equipment lists from competition. Light for Creedmoore.

Brass is not as common, and you’ll use a little less powder and lead. I think there was an article in Handloader on the .40-65 recently.

[Don McDowell]

If you use a 400 gr bullet (lyman snover or RCBS 400 gr CSA)going 1000 yds really isn't much of a problem, infact a 40-65 will hold its own against the best of em at the long ranges. Recoil isn't much of an issue even with the heavy bullets, and going with light weight bullets is just a bunch of fun for piddlin around or for shooting the offhand matches.
Cases can be a drag, depending on the chamber. If they used a variation of the Ron Long chamber then simply running a 45-70 case up the size die and go on about your business. If they kept with something closer to original demensions, then you can still simply size 45-70 cases but then have to trim back a tenth. OR the other option is to go with Starline brass, and that's a pain in itself, as the 40-65 stuff we have from them is about the closest thing to scrap metal I've seen.
2 powders have worked really well for my wifes rifle, Goex Cartridge and 3f Express. 60 grs of either one is about all you can get in a Starline case, but that keeps the recoil down, and accuracy can be stellar.
If you get the rifle don't try and go cheap with the dies. Lyman or RCBS's dies work fine, Lee's are just junk.

[Buckshot]

http://www.fototime.com/02838B89D2984DB/standard.jpg

..............I have a Pedersoli RB in 40-65. I use both converted 45-70 and Starline 40-65. I believe the Starline brass may have begun as 45-70 but before it dropped into the hopper at the end of the line it became 40-65 :-). It just looks that way.

I converted the 45-70 via a Lyman FL size die and used Imperial sizing lube. Lube the case and run each case up about an inch worth into the die. After their all done, screw the die down some more and hit'em all a lick again. Repeat until the shellholder kisses the base of the die or they chamber in your rifle, whichever comes first.

I don't know if it was the rifle or the die, but at that point the FL sized case STILL wouldn't fully chamber, and the issue was just above the rim. I chucked up the die and peeled off a tenth inch and threaded it back into the press to touch the shellholder. Relubed a case and ran it back into the die. The last few thousandths were definately reluctant, but it went. After that one case a try in chambering was easy, but you could feel the faintest little drag before the rim touched the breechface. Just about perfection.

http://www.fototime.com/E3932A18D38C8CD/standard.jpg

I've never shot it with BP, but here's a pretty good 5 shot 100 yard group. They all aren't always this good, but usually not too much worse, but considering unscaled slugs and thrown charges there'll be the occasional leaker. The rifle does like this particular load though. One day I'll get around to loading some BP in it.

...............Buckshot

[Boz330]

Jerry,
Do you know how old it is? CSA started out using Douglas barrels, I beleive, and then switched to Badger barrels. Most are 18 twist barrels unless something else was requested, that is their standard.
Mine is a 91 vintage Hi-wall with the Douglas barrel and it shoots the RCBS 350gr CSA boolit very well but I was never able to get what I thought was acceptable groups from the 400gr boolit. John Shofstol said thaqt he never had any problem so it might have just been my rifle and a buddy has a 75, same time period that shoots the 390gr Lyman really well. I have since rebarreled the rifle with a Badger 16 twist barrel. The 350gr shoots well out to 600yrd but I beleive that it might be a problem beyond that, but all I shoot is silly wets anyway.
I have a set of RCBS form dies to make the brass from 45-70s. If you decide to get it and have problems forming the brass with the above methods I could lend it to you.

Bob

[billsr]

I have the Pedersoli 1874 Sharps in 40-65. I bought the RCBS cowboy .40-65 dies and had to grind off the bottom of the FL sizing die too so I could get the .45-70 cases, resized to .40-65, to chamber in the gun. I trim all my cases to the length of the chamber and have no problems. I do not shoot black powder in the gun, but I use IMR4759 with 400 grain bullets and really like the way it shoots. I also shoot paper patched bullets and am in the process of making a breech seater, with the help of my cousin, who owns a machine shop. He made the mould for our paper paper patch bullets too, as he also shoots a Pedersoli .40-65.

[montana_charlie]

You should see if Rambunctious can get Mrs. Rambunctious to post.
Linda shoots a 40-65 Pedersoli, and scored well above him (and his 45/70 Shiloh) at the last Quigley.

CM

[EDG]

As far as loads go I have about the same results as Buckshot:

I use the same powder charge -- 23 grn of SR 4759
Bullet is a NEI 320 grain gas check bullet designed for the 405 Win. It casts at .410 and it is lubed in a .410 die. I use Lyman gas checks and am lucky to have a lifetime supply.

I get best accuracy with cases formed from Remingtons that have been annealed after sizing.
I also use the Imperial wax. I have used a both a Lyman sizer of recent manufacture and a RCBS Cowboy die set with excellent results. I do not have the problem with the case head fit but my rifle is a Browning 1885 BPCR and it's chamber is straight at the head for about .250 inch.
I would not recommend the Redding or CH sizers since they are set up to size the necks down for .406 dia bullets.
The sized cases are expanded with a .410 expander plug.
Bullets have been seated in Lyman, RCBS Cowboy and Redding Competition seaters.
All 3 seaters work well but I really like the Redding die the best.
Bullets are seated to produce one rim width interference. Takes heavy thumb pressure to get the loaded round in the chamber far enough to close the breech block.

I have also shot quite a few of the ~400 grain Lyman Snover bullets and the ~400 grain Reddings with somewhat lighter powder charges of the same SR4759 but they have never been as accurate as the gas check bullet.

[NickSS]

I have a couple of 40-65 rifles that I shoot regularly. My silhouette rifle is an 1885 high wall by C Sharps in that caliber and it is one of my most fired single shots since I bought it. Acuracy is fine out to 600 yards which is as far as I have fired it. I have an acquaintance who tired to use a similar rifle out to 800 to 1000 yards. The bullets got there but his scores were uniformly lower than he could get firing a 45-70 or 45-90 rifle. A careful review of his shooters book showed that he lost more points on average due to sudden condition changes than he did with the 45 caliber rifles. He quit using the 40-65 for long range shooting for that reason. The 400 gr bullets in the 40-65 work really well out to the 500 meter rams (550 yards) and recoil less and burn a bit less powder doing it than the 45-70. All of this make it my prefered silhouette rifle.

[jackley]

I want to thank everyone for all there help..

Boz- it is a C sharps 75.

Don- it comes with forming dies 45-70 to 40-65

As soon as I can sell a bench gun I think I will add it to my gun room.

Thanks again, any other help will be appriecited.

Jerry

[Don McDowell]

Jerry you'll like that 75. I have one in 45-70.
Hopefully we'll get to see you put it into action at one of the shoots this next summer.
I'm in the north end of Goshen County.

[Boz330]

I want to thank everyone for all there help..

Boz- it is a C sharps 75.

Don- it comes with forming dies 45-70 to 40-65

As soon as I can sell a bench gun I think I will add it to my gun room.

Thanks again, any other help will be appriecited.

Jerry


You won't regret it, Have fun.

Bob