COAL for 9mm

[josie wales]

I have been a long time caster but new to casting for 9mm. I purchased a Lee 2 Cavity Bullet Mold 358-125-RF and made up 300 of these boolits. When reloading I was surprised to see the overall length came out to 1.06" and no where near the 1.125" I am used to. Now the case is just below the crimp groove so I probably should seat even deeper? I am using 4.4 grains of Bullseye,the lead is 7# of 7.8 BNH with 3# of Linotype. Seating the boolit so deep has me scratching my head as to a safety issue. I am hoping people with experience with this mold could clear up this issue. All boolits were sized to .356.

[Hickory]

COAL is the maximum length for proper fit in the magazine.
Lead without the copper jacket will be more compact then similar weight bullets, so, it will be shorter.
Don't over think it, load and shoot.

[Dusty Bannister]

Please note that the bullet in use is the Lee 358-125-RF and not the usual bullet for the 9MM. The ogive contacts the lands sooner than the more tapered 9MM round. So yes, a shorter COAL is noted, and it does suggest that you should start low and work up to reach safe and reliable feeding and extraction.

A lot of folks use the Lee 356-120-TC as a standard bullet for the 9MM. I am also going to question the data for your 4.4 grains of Bullseye. It seems to be excessive for your caliber.

It would be to your advantage to read the sticky "setting up for a new 9MM".

[onelight]

Start long and seat deeper until it will plunk test in you barrel if that fits in your magazine work up the load with that OAL . Unless there is some other issue that is how I work up a load for auto pistols.

[mdi]

I use that same bullet in my 9mm pistols (and 38 Special and 357 Magnum). My notes are out in my shop so I don't have my complete notes about how I arrived at the length, but I seated the bullet to 1.060" (don't forget that third digit from the decimal point) and ignore the crimp groove. Plunked fine in 3 different guns.I have fired this bullet seated this way in 3, 9mm pistols, all fed, shot, ejected fine...

[gwpercle]

Adjust bullet seating depth by trial and error . You are loading a round- flat revolver boolit , chances are no COAL will be found . It will differ from a round nose .
Make up a few dummy rounds , no powder no primer , seat boolit untill they pass the plunk test .
Load some in the magazine , stand over the bed and manually cycle the slide ...if they feed from magazine , into chamber and eject easily...you good to go .
Now you work out powder charge ...start low and slowly work your way up .
When you and your pistol both like the load ...write it down ...may want to use it again .
Load safe,
Gary

[fredj338]

COAL is the maximum length for proper fit in the magazine.
Lead without the copper jacket will be more compact then similar weight bullets, so, it will be shorter.
Don't over think it, load and shoot.
Sort of. OAL is the most misunderstood part of reloading. It must fit your barrel, every barrel is diff, ever bullet type for that bullet will be diff. bullet profile affects OAl more than anything else. So barrel first, then magazine.
Seating deeper isn't an automatic over pressure event but bullets are seldom plug & play. IF you switch bullets & seat deeper, it is prudent to drop your powder charge 1-2/10gr & work it back up. A choron here helps a lot as there are no free lunches with pressure vs velocity.

[1006]

I think 3.5 to 4.0 Bullseye, out to be a good start point for the 125grain cast 9mm.

Some of mine go as short as 1.05 COAL.

[tazman]

Look at the sides of you boolit. You should be able to see where the sizing stops near the nose of the boolit. This is the spot you want to have at the mouth of the case. If you have a barrel with a little freebore, you may be able to seat longer. It will depend on your particular barrel
On mine, that spot is just above the crimp groove. I seat that boolit so the crimp groove is just inside the case mouth.
4.4 of Bullseye should be quite safe.

[higgins]

I went to that bullet because of my 9mm's .358 groove barrel. My best accuracy is with the bullet crimped on the lower edge of the crimping groove for a COAL of about 1.087". My best accuracy is at around 950 fps chronographed from a 4" barrel. Make sure a bullet so seated will plunk in your barrel.

[TjB101]

4.4gr of BE at 1.06 is gonna be stout for the Lee 125.

[JMax]

Every bullet will have a slightly different OAL, check references like Lyman Cast Bullet handbook

[1hole]

COAL is the maximum length for proper fit in the magazine.
Lead without the copper jacket will be more compact then similar weight bullets, so, it will be shorter.
Don't over think it, load and shoot.

Exactly.

Many seem to think OAL is a law for loaders but it's only the length used by those who developed the load data in their own firearms. In some 55 years of reloading I've never even looked at a book OAL because it's no more a law than the powder charges they suggest. Make your ammo fit and feed and be done with it.

[joebaja]

I typically load that one to 1.03. Haven't tried it with Bullseye, so no comment on the charge. Like others mentioned, starting low is the way to go.

[rintinglen]

4.4 grains of Bullseye is right at the very top end--and maybe over--of allowable pressure for a short, 125 grain boolit.

I'd recommend starting at 3.7 grains and working up to no more than 4.2 grains. In Lymans No. 4 Cast Bullet Handbook, they recommend 3.7- 4.1 grns. for the RCBS 124 Grn. boolit with a max pressure of 30,000 cup. This has a COAL of 1.050 inches as loaded by the Lyman Techs.

[Jal5]

I’m using 4.1 Bullseye with that boolit. In my Shield it’s seated with just a sliver of the lube groove showing. 1.045 IIRC
I would be hesitant to go much higher on that charge.

[gwpercle]

Exactly.

Many seem to think OAL is a law for loaders but it's only the length used by those who developed the load data in their own firearms. In some 55 years of reloading I've never even looked at a book OAL because it's no more a law than the powder charges they suggest. Make your ammo fit and feed and be done with it.
LIKE !!!
Truer words were never spoken ... Well said 1hole !
Newbe's need to pay attention to this...write it down for future reference !
Gary

[1hole]

Thanks Gary.

Back in my salad days most reloading sources didn't even mention OAL. We did our reloading work with a measure of common sense; we each set OAL (and case "trim-to" lengths) as needed and then developed our powder charges up towards book max unless we had symptoms of too much pressure and backed off no matter what a book said!

And overload signs did occur from time to time. When over pressure happened, we fixed it, so we and our fire arms are still alive.

It seems common sense is an uncommon virtue in these "enlighten times." I've read web posts effectively saying he always "works up slow" but indicates he doesn't stop until he reaches book max, meaning he/they "carefully" ignored any over pressure warning signs because "if it's in a book it must be safe!" And then quite a few "thinkers" have said they get several loading books and average their max charges to find a "safe max"! Arrrrghhh :(

I'm an old guy, been reloading for all kinds of firearms for more than five decades. Not only have I never had a KABOOM!, I've never seen or heard of one from my obsolete old 60s era shooting buddies who started reloading with far less detailed load data than today.

Bottom line, there is only ONE Book that has the gospel truth and it ain't a reloading manual. Any loading manual is quite enough for any of us IF its used with common sense, no loading manual(s) are safe without common sense.

[fredj338]

exactly.

Many seem to think oal is a law for loaders but it's only the length used by those who developed the load data in their own firearms. In some 55 years of reloading i've never even looked at a book oal because it's no more a law than the powder charges they suggest. Make your ammo fit and feed and be done with it.
^^^this^^^

[mozeppa]

also be aware that even though you are seating all the bullets on THE SAME PRESS... your over all lengths will be all over the map in their lengths..

in other words ...if your target length is 1.050" ........... you will measure lengths that vary 10 thousandths over or under your target....live with it.


now some one will ding in and say "mine are ALWAYS + or - half a thousandth!"..... yeah Pinocchio .....your nose is getting in the way of your press.

[gpidaho]

As others have said. Use your barrel as your "Plunk gauge" and make the round fit YOUR barrel first. Then start low and work up. A LOT of the new striker fired nines and even single-double action nines have no throat as shooting lead bullets wasn't in their design. (Doug Guy can fix that) I got lucky with my latest nine, a Beretta APX in that it accepts lead bullets out to the Sammi COL max. The Lee 120 TCs and RCBS 124 TCs are a good choice for the nines that require a short COL. Gp

[reddog81]

I use 1.06 to 1.08 depending on the gun. 4.0 Bullseye would probably be a better place to start than 4.4 as others have suggested.

OAL is very dependent on the exact bullet, gun, magazine combination.