Gustav 1871 Roling Block stock re-finish

[pcmacd]

It's been 25 years or more since I have refinished a gun stock.

Attached are a couple of images of the wood for the Gustaf 8x58RD Rolling Block I own.

I stripped the stock wood, ran coarse steel wool over and about it, then used 100 grit C paper to take out what I saw to be the remainders of the finish.

I put some Birchwood-Casey walnut water based stain upon the stock, slightly deluded.

I was surprised to see these splotches turn up.

Bottom line?

I don't understand why, when the stock looked so clean, that when I applied water based stain, this kind of nonsense showed up?

Your thoughts? Should I start over, or just put on the Tru-Oil?

I remain, verklempt.

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[Misery-Whip]

You need to apply a wood sealer before you apply stain. I was told the wood has areas that are more porus than others and hold more stain. This came from a cabinet builder.

[Bad Ass Wallace]

It should look OK once a finish is applied. I work with a finish called "Wipe On Poly" which gives a nice deep finish to my Martini Henry(4 coats).

Sanding sealer only
https://i.imgur.com/NHlaNbUh.jpg

Finished stock
https://i.imgur.com/irOVKtrl.jpg

[roadie]

If you stopped at 100 grit, the water based stain is raising the grain of the wood and softer areas will take more stain. It'll also make for a rough finish. The wood should be sanded to a finer grit, and the grain raised and cut back before staining. I usually go to at least 400 grit, quite often 600.

[303Guy]

The wood must be dampened with a wet cloth after each sanding to raise the would. After a few such treatments it will look polished. And yes, use ever finer grit.

[RustyReel]

Yep, you have a lot more sanding to do if you started with 100 grit. I never use sandpaper when stripping a stock to refinish. Always use stripper (multiple applications if necessary) and steel wool.

Don't be too concerned about the blotches until you get a look at it finished. Those often give an otherwise bland looking piece of wood a little character. This one is from a piece of the same period and region, it is a Husky RB shotgun. Probably not typical. I think it looks kinda nice. YMMV

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[pcmacd]

Yep, you have a lot more sanding to do if you started with 100 grit. I never use sandpaper when stripping a stock to refinish. Always use stripper (multiple applications if necessary) and steel wool.

Don't be too concerned about the blotches until you get a look at it finished. Those often give an otherwise bland looking piece of wood a little character. This one is from a piece of the same period and region, it is a Husky RB shotgun. Probably not typical. I think it looks kinda nice. YMMV

260312

How did you blue the metal?

[pcmacd]

Thank you all for your insights.


Well, now that I have a coat of stain on the stock, and Birchwood sealer/filler on the way, the next steps would be????

[RustyReel]

How did you blue the metal?

I didn't, metal finish is as I received it. I have done rust blue on several other pieces. Pretty easy to do at home, just takes a bit of time.

[pcmacd]

I didn't, metal finish is as I received it. I have done rust blue on several other pieces. Pretty easy to do at home, just takes a bit of time.

Can you tell us the products and procedures you used for rust blue?

[marlinman93]

I would highly second ****** Wallace's suggestion to use Wipe On Poly to finish the stocks. It will not only give it a beautiful hand rubbed oil appearance, but it can also be touched up if needed, like an oil finish.
You're on the right track so far, but I apply the WOP very wet, and then wet sand it with 400 grit. There's no reason to go finer than 400 grit when wet sanding. I pour the WOP in a pie pan and dip my sandpaper in it to wet sand. Once I've wet sanded the whole stock I wait a few minutes, and then wipe the excess off by wiping against the grain. This forces the sanded wet dust into the pores, and leaves the wood smoother.
Once I've applied several wet sanded coats I simply apply the WOP without sanding until the finish is what I like. Always wipe the excess off after each coat so it dries faster, and more even.
Once finished I let the finish breath for about 3 weeks. Then if I want a really nice piano finish for high luster, I rub the wood with rottenstone powder on a damp rag. Then buff it with Minn Wax paste to a gorgeous luster.

[RustyReel]

Can you tell us the products and procedures you used for rust blue?

I've been using Brownells Classic Rust Blue. Other guys prefer different products. The directions, I think, are on Brownells website. In addition you need lots of disposable gloves, 4/0 steel wool, blue stripper (Birchwood Casey works OK for me), 320 and finer sandpaper, acetone, brake cleaner, clean patch or some other way to apply the solution, and a container large enough to hold the piece you are blueing under water. Don't think I missed anything.

Everyting needs to be clean and oil free throughout the process, thus the many gloves. Brake cleaner is used to degrease the parts and the acetone is used to degrease the steel wool. Down here the rusting process is not a problem. Don't get hung up on the boiling. Get your container (PVC) is fine and pour boiling water over the rusted pieces. Lots on detailed instructions elsewhere on this forum.

For stock finishing I do what MarlinMan says only I use TruOil. Poly always sounded to "high tech" for me but after his post I've watched a few videos and I may have to try that after my current bottle of TruOil is gone.

Enjoy your project! And don't worry if it doesn't come out as you like it you can always do it over as you should have some finish and blueing acid left over!

[pcmacd]

The wood must be dampened with a wet cloth after each sanding to raise the would. After a few such treatments it will look polished. And yes, use ever finer grit.

Yeppers. Done that before. I've only done a walnut stocked 30 carbine and an M1 Garand a long time ago. I used something similar to Tru Oil.

I found that the lack of essential smoothness of the wood when I began (I din't SEAL either) din't matter much after multiple coats of finish with likely 400+ wet sand paper.

These days I don't care for a full gloss finish. But that 30 M1 carbine is likely purtier now than when it left the factory.

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[Dan Cash]

Birch stock. Won't stain for beans. That is why cheap guns look like the stock is painted because it is. Get the wood clean and well sanded and finish it. Just live with the blond stock. You can always tell someone that it was a custom maple job.

[sharps4590]

What Dan said. You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. I have the same rifle and after stripping, not sanding except to remove the whiskers, all I did was a light, walnut stain then a few coats of semi-gloss spar varnish, sanded between coats. I think those stocks were varnished originally. No matter what you do it ain't gonna look like BAW's Martini.

[marlinman93]

These stocks were all done with Wipe On Poly.

https://i.imgur.com/UYYq3B7l.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Edsq9dzl.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/4OJ3CYil.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9gtUTuJl.jpg

I haven't used anything but WOP in two decades. Once I tried it, I was convinced. I was skeptical about a poly finish on stocks just because Browning and Remington rifle stocks had those heavy and glossy poly finishes I disliked. But WOP is surely not the same.

[pcmacd]

These stocks were all done with Wipe On Poly.

I haven't used anything but WOP in two decades. Once I tried it, I was convinced. I was skeptical about a poly finish on stocks just because Browning and Remington rifle stocks had those heavy and glossy poly finishes I disliked. But WOP is surely not the same.

Wow. Those surely do look nice.

[Baltimoreed]

260553260554
Birchwood caseys red walnut water based stain always looked terrible until multiple coats were applied on my 1903 Springfield redo’s. I don’t know if it’s the same stain that you’re using though. Here’s a before and after.

[pcmacd]

260553260554
Birchwood caseys red walnut water based stain always looked terrible until multiple coats were applied on my 1903 Springfield redo’s. I don’t know if it’s the same stain that you’re using though. Here’s a before and after.

If this were a re-finishing contest, you guys would blow me out of the water.

[pcmacd]

Birch stock. Won't stain for beans. That is why cheap guns look like the stock is painted because it is. Get the wood clean and well sanded and finish it. Just live with the blond stock. You can always tell someone that it was a custom maple job.

I am horribly confused here.

Got the Birchwood "Sealer and Filler."

Direction says, and dudes? I quote here? ,

"Stain wood if desired BEFORE applying SEALER & FILLER."

This seems to contradict the advice given here?

I remain, clueless?

[roadie]

I am horribly confused here.

Got the Birchwood "Sealer and Filler."

Direction says, and dudes? I quote here? ,

"Stain wood if desired BEFORE applying SEALER & FILLER."

This seems to contradict the advice given here?

I remain, clueless?


If the wood is sealed first, stain isn't going to penetrate into the grain.

[marlinman93]

I am horribly confused here.

Got the Birchwood "Sealer and Filler."

Direction says, and dudes? I quote here? ,

"Stain wood if desired BEFORE applying SEALER & FILLER."

This seems to contradict the advice given here?

I remain, clueless?

If you seal the wood first the stain wont take. You have to stain prior to sealer if you want it darker.
Stain is tough to get to soak in on a stock refinish though, unless you're sure you got every bit of old finish out of the wood. Any old finish tends to penetrate deeper than you could ever sand, so need to chemically strip it to suck it all out.
I used acetone and whiting powder to ensure all the oils are sucked out of the old wood. Whiting powder can be purchased online, or from craft stores, or stores that cater to people doing leaded glass work. It's used to suck oils out, and mixed with acetone into a wet slurry it can be brushed on the wood and it will turn brown from the oils it draws out. Once dry, it can be rubbed off with a cloth, and then the wood rinsed under hot water. I usually rinse the wood with hot water prior to using the acetone/whiting slurry so it opens up the pores and helps the slurry work even better.
Once the stocks dry in a warm area for 72 hrs. you can apply stain, sealer, and finish.

[MOA]

marlinman93, what brand of "wipe on poly" have you been using?

[marlinman93]

marlinman93, what brand of "wipe on poly" have you been using?

There's only one brand that I know of? Wipe On Poly is the brand name, and it's a Minn Wax product. It comes in satin or gloss, and either works the same. I prefer the gloss personally as it's easy to knock it down if it's too shiny, but no way to bring up satin if it's not enough sheen.
All the home improvement stores carry it.

https://www.minwax.com/wood-products/clear-protective-finishes/wipe-ons/minwax-wipe-on-poly

[Shawlerbrook]

Another fan of the MinWax Wipe on Poly.

[MOA]

Thanks bunches marlinman93. I always like to have a few new finishes on the shelf to try on my refinished stocks. I got a few double's I am planning to redo in the future. Again, thanks a lot for the quick response. Stay safe.

[samari46]

For a British #4 MKII forend I'm working on there is a product that minwax puts out that conditions the wood to take stain better. I've used it on one or two gun stocks and I get a deeper fuller application of stain. Currently been doing another British #4 forend and an upper hand guard. Had some old bottles of gun style that comes in the little two ounce bottles. Those stains Colonial Walnut and their walnut stains didn't do much for making the wood darker. Went in the garage and found a small can of minwax Special Walnut. Stirred it up for awhile to get all the sediments off the bottom then shook the can. 1" chip brush and slowley started applying the stain to the forend. Almost immediatly the stock darkened to a reddish walnut color. Forend has the Ishapore screw so who knows if its a local wood or something else. Next was the rear hand guard. This was more of a blonde wood. It too started getting darker. let both pieces sit and dry. Rubbed with an old towel. The forend has highlights of brown and red and the hand guard is a much darker brownish blonde. I scraped both pieces of wood repeatedly to even out the woods surface and get rid of some gouges and a few dents. Then sanded to 400 grit prior to using the wood conditioner then the Special Walnut stain. Won't be no technicolor rifles in this house. Frank

[ogre]

This is a long read with a huge pile of useful information if you are interested. https://thecmp.org/wood-cleaning-article/

[pcmacd]

this is a long read with a huge pile of useful information if you are interested. https://thecmp.org/wood-cleaning-article/

all good stuff!!!!!

That CMP post is 48 pages long!

I saved it to PDF.

It's good stuff.