Heat sink for cooling ingots

[Bantou]

Has anybody tried using some form of heat sink under their ingot molds to cool them faster? I saw a video of a guy using a big chunk of I-beam but I couldn’t tell if it really did much for him. I have been considering buying a chunk of I-beam but getting one big enough to put my molds on would be kind of pricey.

Thanks,
B


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[Misery-Whip]

Aluminum will do what you want. Large chunks like to suck up heat. But you need some way to cool it off. Or its benifits will deminish.

I cast ingots on sunny days around with a high of 40 or colder. Gives me a reason to stay near the fire. Ingots solidify faster too.

Probably cheaper to buy more ingot molds and give them time to cool.

[Winger Ed.]

As said, Alum. will suck away heat fast, so will Stainless Steel.

I wouldn't bother, I'd a second ingot mold, use cup cake tins, etc.
Ingots solidify pretty fast.
Unless you're doing some mass production, you shouldn't need much in that reguard.

[BK7saum]

I pour ingots (5-8 lbs) from a bottom pour melter that I made. Since the ingot has to cool before I can pour the next one, a heat sink is very important for efficiency. I use a folded towel that is dampened and placed under the ingot molds.

Now.. before yall go off about water and molten lead, The ingot molds are preheated to drive off moisture. No water is introduced into the molds, and even if it were. the molds are well above 212, so any moisture cannot be below the molten lead. Ingots cool in a matter if seconds instead of taking a couple of minutes. The transfer of water to steam is very efficient in transfering heat.

Without the heat sink of the damp towel, it would take me a long time to pour ingots and would no longer be practical.

[rondog]

I just use a folded wet towel or a cold concrete garage floor.

[winelover]

+1 on the concrete.

Winelover

[BNE]

I use paper towels that have to be re-wetted after each pour. A cloth towel would be better.

Like a lot of parts of this hobby, carelessness or neglect will get you into trouble.

BNE.

[Bantou]

As said, Alum. will suck away heat fast, so will Stainless Steel.

I wouldn't bother, I'd a second ingot mold, use cup cake tins, etc.
Ingots solidify pretty fast.
Unless you're doing some mass production, you shouldn't need much in that reguard.

I’m actually trying to ramp up to make it a side gig. Money is tight right now and if I want to fund my shooting habits I need a second source of cash flow. I have 4 molds inbound from Lackehouse2012 but at 10lbs per mold I’m worried about the cool down time in the Texas heat. I’m currently using a cast aluminum muffin tin for a mold and after the first fill my cool down times get pretty long.


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[gunarea]

This concern has been addressed before and I can give some advice. For my rendering situation, which generally involves several hundred pounds, getting everything up to counter top level is first. My back, just like yours, doesn't need repetitive bending with weight. You are correct in having many moulds to receive the molten alloy. I use a four foot livestock gate, leveled up on cinder blocks. It is of lightweight tube construction. Not sure how much they are these days but were fairly inexpensive some forty years ago. A partial sheet of Diamond plate aluminum with the diamonds down hold a lot of weight and cool the ingots quickly. Check out this post for pictures.

Forum
Casting & Reloading
Cast Boolits
First Time Melting - Observations and a Question. Post was made 5-13-2018 Hope this works and helps.
Roy

[lightman]

I smelt using 8 different Lyman type molds made from cast iron. My heat sinc is a piece of 1/2 in by 6 in flat steel bar stock, about 6 ft long. It does help cool the molds. It eventually gets hot but by then its time to refill the pot. My 8 molds would be 32 pounds per cycle and between 10 and 12 cycles will empty my pot. Depending on outside temps, I only have to wait for a few seconds on the last 2 or 3 cycles. A piece of I-beam would work and channel probably would. I use what I do because it was free.

[RydForLyf]

Wet concrete is the ticket.

[725]

I'm not into big production, but I use the concrete floor of the shop. Suck heat away reasonably fast. I usually do 20 to 60 Lyman ingot molds at a time.

[lightman]

Concrete works great but my ole back appreciates things being saw horse high! It didn't used to bother me but now I'm a lot more conscious.

[Bantou]

Concrete works great but my ole back appreciates things being saw horse high! I didn't used to bother me but now I'm a lot more conscious.

I’m in the same boat. My back hasn’t been the same since I got hurt at work a few years ago.


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[rcslotcar]

I use left over bricks from when the back yard wall was put up.

[Bantou]

I use left over bricks from when the back yard wall was put up.

I tried left over tiles from redoing the shower but I think they do more harm than good


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[Bantou]

I just use a folded wet towel or a cold concrete garage floor.

Does the towel not warp the mold? I’ve used a damp rag to cool my boolit molds when they get too hot but that is a lot thicker aluminum than my ingot molds.


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[Petrol & Powder]

Bantou - You wrote, "........I’m actually trying to ramp up to make it a side gig. Money is tight right now .....". So if I understand you correctly, your goal is to increase your production rate but still turn a profit for your labor.
Any capital outlay will eliminate profit until you can pay off that investment in equipment. So spending a lot of money on equipment (more ingot molds, some type of heat sink, etc.) may speed up your production rate but it will reduce your profit until that capital outlay is paid for.
Some method to cool the molds quicker will only make economic sense if the method is inexpensive AND significantly decreases the amount of time needed to cool the ingot.
Assuming the cost of the ingot molds is relatively low, acquiring more molds will probably result in the greatest increase in production with the lowest capital outlay.

A heat sink may help cool ingot molds quicker but to be useful it needs to cool the mold fast enough that it outweighs the advantage of simply having another mold.

There are efficiencies to be found in many places. Can you do something profitable while the lead is melting? Can you do something useful while the ingots are cooling? Can you match the number of ingots to the amount of molten lead in one batch? How much does your fuel cost? How much does your lead cost?

[Bantou]

Bantou - You wrote, "........I’m actually trying to ramp up to make it a side gig. Money is tight right now .....". So if I understand you correctly, your goal is to increase your production rate but still turn a profit for your labor.
Any capital outlay will eliminate profit until you can pay off that investment in equipment. So spending a lot of money on equipment (more ingot molds, some type of heat sink, etc.) may speed up your production rate but it will reduce your profit until that capital outlay is paid for.
Some method to cool the molds quicker will only make economic sense if the method is inexpensive AND significantly decreases the amount of time needed to cool the ingot.
Assuming the cost of the ingot molds is relatively low, acquiring more molds will probably result in the greatest increase in production with the lowest capital outlay.

A heat sink may help cool ingot molds quicker but to be useful it needs to cool the mold fast enough that it outweighs the advantage of simply having another mold.

There are efficiencies to be found in many places. Can you do something profitable while the lead is melting? Can you do something useful while the ingots are cooling? Can you match the number of ingots to the amount of molten lead in one batch? How much does your fuel cost? How much does your lead cost?

Most of my set up I got for free or dirt cheap. My biggest expense so far has been the molds that I just ordered from Lakehouse2012 but those were paid for with previous profits. Lead runs me about $.25/lb for the final product. Fuel cost isn’t much because I get a discount on propane. My biggest inefficiencies are weight sorting and ingot cooling time. I could quit sorting the weights and just let the fire do the work but I don’t trust that method for a product I am trying to sell. Right now I only have one muffin tin for ingots and after my third pour my cooling time runs 5+ minutes for the center ingots to fully harden. More molds and fewer ingots per mold will help significantly. I just wanted to explore other options to expedite the process.

Thank you for your reply. It made me stop and double check my numbers which is always a good thing in business.

Regards,
B


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[djryan13]

I hear you about Texas heat. I smelt on the back patio on a stainless steel table. Table gets hot under Texas sun so not really a heat sink.

Cooling fan might help. Attach copper pipes to stainless steel table and flow water through? Or maybe junk yard radiators...

Good luck! When you are off and running, hit me up and I will buy some lead.

[JSnover]

Got scrap lumber? A couple of sawhorses (store-bought or homemade) under a sheet of plywood will keep the ingots off the floor. Maybe throw an old wet blanket on top

[Bantou]

I have a table that I put the molds on


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[rbuck351]

I don't do large ingots as I want them to fit in my Lee 20lb pot for casting boolits so my method may not work for you. I use the small muffin tins set in a cookie sheet with about 1/4" of water in it. They cool off real fast. Just have to be careful pouring the lead.

[lightman]

Just a thought. I think you mentioned being a Lineman in another post? May one of mine about pole top pins? If so, there has to be a piece of channel laying around from a regulator platform or a platform mounted transformer bank!!! Maybe a junk air break switch?

[Bantou]

Just a thought. I think you mentioned being a Lineman in another post? May one of mine about pole top pins? If so, there has to be a piece of channel laying around from a regulator platform or a platform mounted transformer bank!!! Maybe a junk air break switch?

We use timbers or aluminum racks for our banks and regulators. I’ll look around for an old air switch though, that isn’t a half bad idea lol


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[Idz]

I use a wet cotton towel in a shallow pan of water. Since we smelt about 300 lbs of ingots at once using 4 sets of Lee ingot molds we can't wait around for things to cool enough to dump. The Lee aluminum molds show no worse for wear after 5000 lbs of ingots, except for loosening handles. It steams a lot and you have to be careful not to get water drops into the mold cavity but it works well for us. I cool just enough for the ingot surface to solidify and frost over so it can be dumped without warping.

[skeettx]

I use LOTS of ingot molds
A pot is usually good for two pours
This clears most of the pot of alloy.
Then turn off the burner, let cool just a bit
and add more alloy, when pot alloy is solid
Then do it over again
Lyman, RCBS, and Ohaus ingot molds, four one pound ingots
14 molds x 4 = 56 pounds for 1/2 a pot
Mold cooling is not an issue at this rate.

Mike

[slim1836]

Once I dump my ingots I place the mold on a dampened towel, use a new mold and repeat. I use 4-6 molds at a time (small time renderer) and repeat starting with the first mold. I dampen the towel as needed.

Slim

[Rizzo]

I use a muffin pan from Walmart for my mold. It can make 12 ingots.
I put the muffin pan on top of two pieces of 1-1/2" steel angle iron (point up) which is on the table that my smelter is on.

I ladle the alloy and fill the muffin pan.
The air space under the muffin pan works well to cool down the alloy.

After the alloy hardens, I turn it upside down at the garage floor level and dump them out and let them cool while I pour another batch.

[Springfield]

I like to save up my lead and then do a big batch. I have enough ingot moulds to do 75 lbs at a time. While they are cooling the next batch is melting, so little wasted time. I use an old Work-mate with a piece of plywood that is covered with an oil drip pan. The plywood is strong while the lead doesn't stick to the drip pan, making for easy cleanup. And I melt with a turkey fryer and a heavy duty stainless steel pot. I can do about 150 lbs/hr with this setup, if all the lead is ready to go. Picking clips out of the pot will slow things down a bit, but not too much.

[jsizemore]

I got enough muffin tins to do 150lbs. 4'x4' piece of plywood on the tailgate and bed of my pickup. Smelting pot is slightly higher then the tailgate and the sheetmetal windscreen keeps the heat away from the tailgate 12" away. I reload the pot and start dumping ingots to finish cooling and mark for alloy. Ingots weigh about 2lbs each. So that's 6 tins of 12 and 1 tin of 6 or 13 tins of 6 or any combination. I got about 30 used muffin tins that I paid $1 each. No bent back or complicated setup that you'll end up trying to store or move around. Best thing is my setup is mobile. I sort while the pot is melting. Don't stand over the pot so your sweat drops in the pot. I use the sheetmetal from a 30gal lowboy HW heater for a windbreak and the top for a lid.

[kevin c]

I have several of Lakehouse's molds. There's a lot of metal in the drafted side walls and dividers that I think would make the mold pretty stiff, but, even if there is a tiny degree of warping, this is an ingot, not a boolit mold. They'll probably still fit in a SFR Priority Mail Box no problem.

I think that a damp towel, wicking up more water from a pie tin as it dries, is a good bet. For me and my aluminum boolit molds, I got lots of rust on the ferrous parts of the molds, but that's not an issue with your ingot molds.

[reddog81]

Wet rag on top and concrete works for me

[Lloyd Smale]

me too
+1 on the concrete.

Winelover

[brassrat]

I put the tins in a metal tray and pour water carefully around them. Its exciting but often leaves craters on the bottoms. Its usually pewter melts

[country gent]

For true production A piece of aluminum I beam and weld some fins in side. Like on an engine cylinder. A fan blowing over the sides will pull a lot of heat off. The more surface area the better the draw.

Another way would be to line the underside of the I beam with several runs of copper tubing in a loop cap one end and 1/8 tygon tube to a bucket. A small water pump into other end with 1/4" or 3/8 inlet when using pump water thru the loop using a 5 gallon bucket for the water supply. During breaks the water can be poured out and replaced with cold again. Even better would be to make the loop to sit on top of the beam and sit the ingot moulds directly on top of the loop. The water flowing thru the loop will pull a lot of heat out fast You could make a square coil the ingot mouls set in but that might be awkward to get them in and out of. THe water flow all arounf would really pull heat. ANother option would be to add antifreeze to the water to pull even more heat

[William Yanda]

I just use a folded wet towel or a cold concrete garage floor.

+1,,,,,

[Misery-Whip]

Hmmm...production huh?

Get an aluminum radiator from a car or truck and run the garden hose to it and from it. Mayb get a plate of aluminum to set on top spread out the weight. Probably need some creative plumbing techniques like I see on the Red and Green show.

Test it for LEAKS!

Country gent set me onto this idea.

[Valley-Shooter]

I think the next time I'm making ingots I'm going to try the wet towel inside a cookie sheet. Pour my lead into my ingots moulds, let them get solid a little bit, and then move them to the wet towel to sizzle.
I don't want to be pouring molten lead over any water. No matter how much I try, I will mess it up and drop some molten lead into a puddle of water.

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[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Does the towel not warp the mold? I’ve used a damp rag to cool my boolit molds when they get too hot but that is a lot thicker aluminum than my ingot molds.

I have two aluminum ingot molds that are the same size as what Lakehouse offers (made by Beone, years earlier).
I use a folded wet terrycloth towel on a wood stump to cool the filled ingot molds...no warpage.

But, just to be clear about my process. I have two ingot molds, while the first mold is sitting on the towel and cooling, I have the second mold on a brick next to my smelting setup. I fill it with molten alloy. Then I dump the cooled ingots from the first mold that was on the towel, then I freshen the moisture on the towel with a half cup of water. This all happens in about a minute. In that time, the second mold, the ingots have crystalized/froze over, then I place it on the towel. Even though it's crystalized/froze, it's still too hot to dump, the ingots will break into pieces.

Then I repeat..

Since the ingot mold that was just dumped isn't blazing hot, when I pour new molten alloy into it, it freezes fairly quickly...like I said, it's about a minute, which is that same amount of time that it takes to dump ingots, and pour some new ones. So, I found there isn't any waiting around, even on a warm day. and have found the two ingot molds is all I need.
Good Luck.

259608

[redhawk0]

I use an old truck brake rotor to cover my pot while it heats up. After it's heated, I put the rotor on a plywood table upside down and set my ingot mold on top of it. It pulls the heat out of the mold.

redhawk

[Springfield]

I can't imagine going back to pouring ingots with just one mould. I did that the first time, with one LEE mould and a Coleman stove. Took me about 4 hours to do 150 lbs of WW. Never again. I can now do 150 lbs and hour. Sorry, but I got better things to do than stand around and watch lead cool. More ingot moulds and cooling is no longer a problem. The OP did say production, so he really shouldn't be messing around with wet towels and such. IMHO

[lightman]

I can't imagine going back to pouring ingots with just one mould. I did that the first time, with one LEE mould and a Coleman stove. Took me about 4 hours to do 150 lbs of WW. Never again. I can now do 150 lbs and hour. Sorry, but I got better things to do than stand around and watch lead cool. More ingot moulds and cooling is no longer a problem. The OP did say production, so he really shouldn't be messing around with wet towels and such. IMHO

Thats about the way we started. A 10# cast iron Lyman pot on a Coleman stove with 1 ingot mold and a soup ladle. Now I use a 400# capacity pot on a 500,000 BTU Jet burner with 8 ingot molds, a nice Rowell Ladle and a nice skimmer. I can process 400# with a helper in about 2 hours from lighting the burner to empty. I'm still looking at faster and easier! Go Figure!!!

[country gent]

The aluminum radiator should work but be careful the cores in them arnt as strong and a few 10 lb ingots might crush them. The other thing will be getting the inlet and out let down to sizes needed

[bangerjim]

I just sit the mold on a sopping wet towel. Works great. use as many towels as you need for the number of molds your are running. Keep them dripping wet.

Just watch for any steam escaping around the bottoms!!!!!

banger

[Lionel Allen]

I am going to suggest more molds. I bought myself a tonne of lead a few years ago and my biggest bottleneck was waiting for the ingots to cool. I used both angle iron and channel iron molds, all dumping the right sized ingot to fit into a 50 cal ammo can.
Being a farmboy, I welded my own molds from scrapyard finds. Bedframe angle iron for the triangular molds, because it was less mass and would cool down quickly, and 2x3" channel iron because I could pour more lead into them and store larger chunks.
I know I have 3 large 2x3" channel iron molds.
And maybe half a dozen angle iron molds. Some are ganged together with 2 or three molds.
I pick up the molds with vice grips so any handles dont get too hot.
Make friends with a welder and have a good supply of consistent ingots.

I'll also suggest stamping the ingots with either a maker's mark, or at minimum what kind of alloy it is. Customers will appreciate not playing guessing games with their lead down the road.
Good luck!

[lightman]

I'll 2nd the permanent marking idea. I just started this and wish all of mine were stamped. Before my next big smelt I'm going to buy a couple of cheap sets of stamps and tack weld a couple together. WW, PB, ISO, LINO, ect.

[Bantou]

I'll 2nd the permanent marking idea. I just started this and wish all of mine were stamped. Before my next big smelt I'm going to buy a couple of cheap sets of stamps and tack weld a couple together. WW, PB, ISO, LINO, ect.

I use a copper crimpit to mark my clip on ingots. It makes a perfect “C” in the middle of the ingot. I haven’t marked any of my stick on ingots yet because I can readily tell the difference by sight. I am struggling to get them clean enough to sell so I’m not worried about customers getting them confused yet. The glue and tape don’t seem to flux out of the lead very well and leave a coating on the bottom and sides of my pot that has to be scrubbed out with steel wool.


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[Youngtimer]

I built exactly what you are talking about. I used a 6' long piece of 2"x 10" aluminum tubing and capped both ends. In the middle of the length of tubing I welded a aluminum pipe fitting so that I could thread a brass garden hose fitting into it (I could not find a aluminum threaded garden hose fitting). On each end of the aluminum tubing on the top side where the ingot molds will sit I drilled and threaded a small hole to screw in a threaded hose barb and attached a length of small diameter plastic tubing. To use it, I just attach the garden hose and turn it on to a slow trickle. This fills the tubing with cold water and the water will exit through the top side end hose barbs and away from the melting and pouring operation. On the top of the tubing I also lay a length of high temp fire resistant cloth and I dampen it well with water and then sit my ingot molds on top of the dampened cloth. This helps transfer the heat out of the ingot mold and to the aluminum tubing/heat sink. I used aluminum to reduce the weight, but steel should work just as well. I can sit 10 or so ingot molds on it and they cool very quickly. I can keep pouring until my arms can no longer pick up the ladle!!!

[Conditor22]

I solved that problem by making 8 5-cavity molds that have a built-in rise so air can get underneath. They keep me busy pouring and dumping

https://i.imgur.com/ZxFNWTl.jpg

I remember seeing a video about a person processing large quantities of lead. He'd get several ingot molds filled then mist them with a hose. I'd probably put the lid on your smelting pot when doing this for added insurance but --- water is only dangerous when it gets UNDER molten lead.
Old-time plumbers used to smelt in the rain when they were sealing pipes.

[dragon813gt]

I just sit the pans on the carport slab. A large mass of concrete works well as a heat sink. Once solidified I dump them, and they cool quickly. Once cooled off completely they get stamped w/ composition, like 96-2-2 or 96-3-1.

https://live.staticflickr.com/4420/36458633732_86b2436eda_c.jpg

[kevin c]

What kind of mold are you using there, dragon? Do the ingots fit a twenty pound pot?

[dragon813gt]

It’s a mini loaf pan that you can pick up in the household section of Walmart/Target. Not heavy duty like iron angle molds. They won’t fit under a production pot. But they do stack tightly w/ no wasted space. This is around 325#.

https://live.staticflickr.com/4693/27601665719_e5b34f8a07_k.jpg

[Slugster]

I use two of lakehouses molds and 6 - 12 place muffin pans sitting on my welding table. That takes care of the piddling amount of lead that I can still source. It sure ain't like the old days when I could make the springs on a 3/4 ton pickup beg for mercy with just one days collection.

[kevin c]

It’s a mini loaf pan that you can pick up in the household section of Walmart/Target. Not heavy duty like iron angle molds. They won’t fit under a production pot. But they do stack tightly w/ no wasted space. This is around 325#.

Ah, I realize I actually have those mini loaf pans! I didn't get the right sense is scale in the first pic.

I have gone to the next size up for storage ingots of about 9-10#, and the smaller bar ingots by Lakehouse for casting alloy. My mini loaf ingots were 3+#, and were a bit hard for me to fit in my Lee, and a bit hard to preheat on the rim or handle with pliers.

[Gunslinger1911]

I use the square muffin pans from WalMart, large cookie sheets under them with about a 1/2 inch water in them. All on wood held up on saw horses - yea, my back aint what it used to be either !
Steams like heck as you pour the alloy. I pour one pan, then the other, by the time I'm done with the second, the first is ready to dump out.
Yes, I know water and molten lead dont mix; so dont mix em !!
My smelting pot holds about 200 lbs - I can really run through it with this setup - just have to be careful.
500 lbs in an afternoon is no sweat.

[papayumyum]

Why not water quench for quick cooling? After a min or so, just dunk mold with ingots into a bucket full of water.

[Walks]

Almost all my ingot molds are factory style. I've collected them for 40+yrs.
I use the different brands to separate the different alloys. Have 3-5 of each.

I use a turkey fryer with a 10" cast iron Dutch oven. I have a 4+lb ladle and rest the ingot molds on a pair of clay bricks spaced 2" apart. By the time I fill the 4th mold the 1st has "set" enough to move to the cool concrete. By the time the 4th is set down on the concrete the 1st is ready to dump.

But It's becoming a moot point. There's no longer any free lead or even range lead.

I just use the molds to make one pound ingot for easier storage.

And I squat on a very short swivel stool. It's pretty easy when your entire setup is only 2ft off the patio floor.

When casting ingots from WW's as a kid My Dad used 3-4 Sons & Nephews and 5lb ingot molds. All He had to do was sit in a Lawn chair, drink coffee and smoke His Pipe.

[Bantou]

Why not water quench for quick cooling? After a min or so, just dunk mold with ingots into a bucket full of water.

Because I don’t feel like getting a steam burn from flash boiling the water. Even with long sleeves and a decent set of tongs, I feel like that would be pretty risky. Water quenching boolits is fine because they cool so quickly. They don’t have enough mass to maintain their temperature very well. My ingots molds weigh about 10lbs when full. It takes a lot longer to cool that much lead and will produce a significant amount of steam.


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