Two novice Gas Check Questions!

[Rob Carney]

For you experienced guys, I’m sorry about these two novice questions. My neighbor passed and his wife sold me a few hundred 125 & 130 Gr. 9-MM cast lead bullets. Also a hundred or so 154 Gr. - .308 cast lead bullets. I shoot both 9-MM and .308 regularly but have never used cast bullets — maybe this experience will make me a believer.
The 9-MM bullets do not have gas checks; instead they have a flat base and either a slender green or red ring encircling the bullet about 1/16th of an inch above the base. Question #1 — Does this ring take the place of a gas check?
The .308 bullets all have a flat base with a rebated edge. The stock included five bullets with a copper gas check installed on the rebated edge and something that looked like white putty in the bullet grooves. Question #2 — do I need a special tool or die to install a gas check or can I just push or hammer it on; also what is the white putty — lube?

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Cast bullets can generally be fired very successfully without gas checks if the velocity is kept below a certain level. What that level is depends on the bullet. The green and red rings you see are probably bullet lube that was pressed into the lube grooves when the bullets were sized. The white putty is likely also lube, but a different kind. There are many kinds and formulas of bullet lube, as you will discover by reading some of the past threads. As for installing the gas checks on the bullets, used to be that Lyman made some that you just pressed on. I used to lie them flat on a table surface and put the base of the bullet into the gas check and push downward. Now days almost all are installed by the sizing/lube machine when the bullet is run through the machine for sizing. The machine also crimps them on, so if you can see a slight crimp at the top rim of the gas check, then they are of the latter type and were put on as described.

[Bazoo]

The thirty caliber bullets you describe have a gas check shank. It's generally advisable to use a GC when the bullet in question is made for one. Using a GC design without the GC is a little more advanced. At rifle velocities GCs are generally needed.

The 9mm bullets are not made for GCs because they will see less pressure and velocity than a rifle bullet. GCs help the bullet grip the rifling better and give a better seal from the expanding gas in higher pressure loadings.

The colored rings will be some variety of lube. It usually is some combination of wax and grease. Gas checks bullets still require lube. The lube under pressure not only lubricates the bullet to barrel interface but it also contributes to sealing the pressure of the expanding gas behind the bullet.

Generally bullets will need to be sized to an appropriate diameter as they come from the mould a few thousands oversized. For example the 30 rifle bullets will likely be .310-.311 in diameter and you'll want to size them slightly to .309-.310, or even size them minimally to .311. Sizing them is swaging them, and makes them perfectly round and also crimps the gas check.

A lubesizer tool such as Lyman's 4500 will size the bullets and put lube in the grooves at the same time. Lees push through sizing dies will only size the bullet. With lees tool you'll need to either pan lube or tumble lube the bullets. Pan lubing is where you set the bullets in a pan and pour melted lube around them so that when it solidifies it fills the grooves in the bullets. Tumble lubing is a liquid coating you squirt on the bullets and it coats them with a thin layer all over.

[Walks]

Just to add more confusion.
Getting the Gas Checks on straight is Extremly Important for accuracy.

Lyman makes a gas check seater that fits on both their Lube-Sizer & the RCBS. And Saeco makes a built in one for their Lube-Sizer.

These are used before sizing & lubing to ensure the gas checks are seated squarely.

Buy a Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook #4. It will explain Casting & Loading Lead Alloy Bullets.

Good Luck

[Rob Carney]

Thanks for all the good information -- it looks like I have a lot more learning ahead of me. Keep it coming if you think of something else important.

[Castaway]

Another, and cheaper option to install gas checks is the Lee Sizing die.

[DukeInFlorida]

Give this a good read, it should explain a lot for you:
From Ingot To Target: A Cast Bullet Guide for Handgunners (http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_textonly2.pdf)

[robg]

i use a lee sizing die too.works well

[leadhead]

Go back to your neighbor and see if she still has the lube sizer
and see if she will sell it to you.
Denny

[slide]

NOE sells a gas check seater. It is outstanding! It puts on the checks good and straight. Just another option.

[Shamus]

I really like the NOE gas check seater, it solved my .50SR gas check issues. Makes getting them on straight much easier.

[NMBill]

On my .429" bullets, to crimp / seat all of my gas checks on straight using my RCBS sizer, I found that I first had to run the bullet into the die upside down. (Gas Check up) Once all the gas checks were seated, the bullets were ran through again with the check down and the bullet then lubricated. A pain in the butt but it saved buying the NOE seater.

Seating the bullets check down cost me around 10 % of the bullets. I still haven't figured out why.

For you newbies: If there is any question of whether the gas check is crimped on straight, simply put the bullet in your caliper and hold it up to the light. That will tell you in a hurry if it is straight.

Billy