JSB heavy jumbo 18.13 grain old grey label VS new red label differences?

[Tripplebeards]

I have a tin of 250 that I tested in my rifle a few weeks ago with about 15 or more different types of pellets. At 23 yards my 10 year old grey labeled 18.1 grain heavy jumbos shoot almost hole for hole. The old labeled can of 10 year old 500 RS was a little larger groupings. Well I ordered a couple of tins of the new red labeled pellets and the cones had a lot uneven finning on them first of all. I never retested groups with the new red labeled pellets till today. I found that the new red labeled pellets shoot about an 1.5” or larger group at 10 yards VS shooting all in the same hole with the old grey label jumbo heavies...Very disappointing. I called pyramidAir, Airgun depot, Airguns of Arizona and of course nobody had the old school grey labeled ammo left in stock. Dose anyone know where I can get some of the old Grey labeled .22 cal JSB heavy jumbos? Here are some comparison pic of the old VS the new. I’m guessing they must have changed alloys? Also the newer ones have more of a rounded Diabolo head VS a football shaped head on the old pellets. I also noticed different shapes inside the cones. I’m guessing the dies, alloys, and quality control changed along with the owner ship of JSB? I’d really like to find some old grey label pellets to purchase if anyone knows of any for sale. I also can trade for other pellets. I have a lot of alloy and PBA style pellets laying around to swap if needed. You definitely can see the inside of the cones have a different style Between the two pellets.


https://i.imgur.com/m9zkvPd.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/qntUj7R.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/JxLN0OQ.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/oyc1XlK.jpg


I came across this post doing some research a few minutes ago and figured I’d add it to my post...

https://www.airgunnation.com/topic/jsb-18-13gr-pellets-differences-old-vs-new/

According to the above post the ones that shoot good in my rifle are from die #47 in my gun. The other one posted as die #15 looks like my newer pellets that group poor. You can see my newer pellets look pretty ruff as well. I’m guessing some of it was shipping damage?

[NSB]

I just got my first air rifle a couple of weeks ago. Yesterday I shot two groups of ten pellets, one each from two different makers. One of the groups were with the JSB's you're shooting. I didn't notice any oddities to the rims and they seemed to shoot well. I think it might just by like a rimfire rifles.....each one has its own preference.
258117

[Tripplebeards]

Is yours a springer, piston, or PCP? My piston gun I tried these out seems to be finicky apparently. But yes I do agree every airgun is different just like center fires and rimfires.

[NSB]

Is yours a springer, piston, or PCP? My piston gun I tried these out seems to be finicky apparently. But yes I do agree every airgun is different just like center fires and rimfires.

It's a PCP.

[Tripplebeards]

That makes sense since every PCP I’ve watched on YouTube shoots nice tight groups with a lot of pellets compared to spring and piston guns. The problem is my piston gun does not like the new pellets that obviously has been redesigned. If I knew they did this I would have stocked up.

[rking22]

Nice grouped with that Daystate, mind putting up a picture. I have an older single shot Huntsman, well made. I believe Daystate was a pioneer in the modern PCP world, back in the day. Springers, especially strong gas ram guns, hit the pellet really hard making them sensitive to skirt parameters. At least that’s been my experience. Really nice thing about the old 1250 piece box of Premiers, they had the die number on the box and only that die put pellets in that box. Some other makers did not segregate by die and dies wear, in addition to being slightly different even new. Call it personality:) When I heard they were stopping the 5mm premier, I stocked up, a lot! Treat them like 22s, when you find what they like lay in a supply. Sadly, prices are not what they were.

[NSB]

Not a great picture, it looks a lot nicer in better light. The stock is fantastic.
258145

[Tripplebeards]

Well since no one has any of the old grey labeled pellets left in stock I will have to switch over to the 10 year tin of JBS RS of 500 I have that shoot almost as tight. Im sure jsb changed them by now as well. I ordered a tin of 500 hades to try today. Hopefully they won’t group poorly like the new heavy jumbos.

[Tripplebeards]

This was the answer from JSB so they are aware they make different shape pellets in the 18.13 heavy jumbos....



Regarding the shape differences. I always try to explain to our customers the following… The dies (manufacturing tools) are produced in batches. There are production tolerances on all dimensions and angles of these tools. There are several components which make a set of tools producing the pellets inside our machines. Each set is specific and may differ slightly one to another (because each of the parts has its production tolerances). Our goal is to create such a sets which will produce the most accurate pellets not as much uniform as possible. If we keep the pellets totally uniform we may not reach the best possible accuracy of the pellets which we definitely want. We prefer some differences between batches but with best possible accuracy. For identification purposes we mark them on the bottom of the tins with batch numbers and never mix it together.

Each gun is specific and may get better results with one batch then other. So the TOP shooters usually test more batches and then buy larger amount of the one which is the best for their gun.

Despite that all batches should meet our quality standard (which is mentioned on our websites) from any gun…

I hope this explanation help you understand a little more of our philosophy.

Best regards,

Pavel Kolebac
JSB Match Diabolo



I wrote them back and asked them if they could at least tell me what machine number lot number they used on my shallower skirt pellet on the left so I can have pyramidAir see if they have any. There was no lot number on my amazon pellets for some reason.

[NSB]

I checked my tin and there are numbers on the bottom of the tin. Seems odd that Amazon would remove them. My tin has a label on the bottom with some info printed on the label. AoA sells pellets where you can buy either three or four (can't remember which) and get an additional tin for free. Maybe you can find someone to split an order with if you can't use that many. Yesterday I found out how accurate my Daystate was. I shot some more groups and finally realized that shooting one ragged hole by aiming at the same target actually increased my group size. I adjusted the scope to change my POA from my POI so that I wasn't distorting the aiming point. My last ten shot group was .24" c-c at a measured twenty-five yards. This air gun challenges my Anschutz and CZ for accuracy at this distance. I never realized how accurate air guns were.
258312

[Tripplebeards]

After shooting a few of the heavy jumbo 18.1 grainers on fins and feathers the last couple of days I ordered some hades to try. I’m hoping they will put varmints down quicker. The heavy jumbos don’t seem to have any stock value. Most run or fly in not hit directly in the head but they finally end up expiring. I’m definitely not impressed with the lack of on game performance of the heavy jumbos. I’d rather shoot larger groups with my predator pellets. At least if i connect with them they drop what ever I hit DRT almost every time.

With the all the bad reviews of damaged JSB HJ pellet reviews I read on amazon I’m guessing these were probably damaged returns and re sold as new...and they probably removed the stickers. I have pyramidAir air pellets I ordered that have tags on the bottom.

[NSB]

With the all the bad reviews of damaged JSB HJ pellet reviews I read on amazon I’m guessing these were probably damaged returns and re sold as new...and they probably removed the stickers. I have pyramidAir air pellets I ordered that have tags on the bottom.
You're probably correct about taking the stickers off damaged tins that were returned. It doesn't seem feasible to return them to the Czech Republic for credit or sorting. The shipping would be prohibitive. I'm betting that the tins you received were Amazon stock being resold. I think I'll just keep buying from one of the domestic sellers of these tins. AoA, Pyramid Air, etc are good reputable sellers.

[bosterr]

I've bought pellets from different sources and Pyramyd Air is the only seller that packs multiple tins correctly. They pack with a piece of styrofoam with a hole in the middle so they don't bang together and get damaged in the box. The last ones I bought from Amazon and they shipped 3 tins loose in a padded envelope and tins were beat to hell.

[Tripplebeards]

I've bought pellets from different sources and Pyramyd Air is the only seller that packs multiple tins correctly. They pack with a piece of styrofoam with a hole in the middle so they don't bang together and get damaged in the box. The last ones I bought from Amazon and they shipped 3 tins loose in a padded envelope and tins were beat to hell.

Same experience from both. I cry when I pay shipping from pyramidAir but I don’t have to worry about damage.

[Tripplebeards]

You're probably correct about taking the stickers off damaged tins that were returned. It doesn't seem feasible to return them to the Czech Republic for credit or sorting. The shipping would be prohibitive. I'm betting that the tins you received were Amazon stock being resold. I think I'll just keep buying from one of the domestic sellers of these tins. AoA, Pyramid Air, etc are good reputable sellers.


Amazon sells a lot of used items as well. I’m sure they probably combined pellets from damaged returns and threw them all in a tin that was not. If you look at my pics I tried to re shape the skirts and they still look crappy. I’m sure between the imperfect repairs and new style pellet design it’s a double negative in my gun.

[Tripplebeards]

I received my hades pellets today. They had finning on the base of every skirt. I think JBS quality has gone down the toilet. I talked with pyramidAir who I bought the pellets from and they said they have been getting a lot of complaints and poor quality pellets from them lately. They didn’t shoot very well on my gun needless to say. About an inch group on average in my piston gun at 20 yards. I’ll be switching pellet manufacturers. For now I’ll use the terminators which were shooting about a half inch group or a little less.

[ebner glocken]

Same experience from both. I cry when I pay shipping from pyramidAir but I don’t have to worry about damage.

They do seem to encourage you taking advantage of the 3 tins for the price of 4 and free shipping on orders over 150 bucks. When I buy pellets it's enough to last me awhile.

Ebner

[Tripplebeards]

UPS also took some time special time to go out of their way to poke three holes in the shipping box and somehow what ever they stabbed it with went through the foam denting pyramidAir’s bulletproof packaging. I remember the days when every ups box/package came perfect and undamaged. The 70s and 80s Are long gone and millennial’s are obviously doing the deliveries now.

https://i.imgur.com/CMg61AM.jpg

[NSB]

You seem to be having some bad luck with JSB pellets. Oddly enough, on the on-line web sites they seem to be a favorite brand of pellet. So far, the ones I ordered have arrived and are shooting better than anything else I've tried out of my Daystate. I just ordered four more tins from AoA based on them shooting so well. Part of the problem you're having may be your gun, or the fact that your gun has a brand/wt. preference. That seems to be common to both pellet rifles and rimfires....they just like one thing better than another. Are you aware that you can buy a box of selected and sorted pellets from several manufacturers and in different weights to try in your gun? You might find what you're looking for by giving this a try. Here's the link: http://www.straightshooters.com/straight-shooters-full-pellet-sampler-.22.html

[Tripplebeards]

My guess is my rifle just doesn't like them...the resigned styles that is.

[wordsmith]

I realize I’m resurrecting a zombie thread here, but in case the OP reads this I may be able to help. I have a MM barreled custom Marauder in .22 that used to love 18.1 JSB’s, until I got some new ones recently. Groups almost tripled in size. Turns out my pellet gage showed head sizes went from an ideal 5.52-5.53mm in the old batch to all over the place, from as high as 5.54 to below 5.47mm (off the pelletgage scale). Groups sucked. Decided to try Air Arms 18.1’s. Amazing. Head sizes across 8 tins we’re about 2/3 5.52mm with the rest 5.53mm. Groups shank back to tiny or smaller. Hope JSB gets their quality back under control, until then I’m only buying AA pellets.

[Tripplebeards]

Well I sent a picture of the old and new pallets to JSB back when I started this thread and ask them if they still had the old style pellets because the new ones now don’t group worth a darn. JSP was good enough to say the asked me if I wanted a sample pack sent to me I said sure why not! I wasn’t expecting that at all I just wanted to buy the old pellets. Well after months and months time I got a box yesterday in the mail with 10, 250 count packs of Diablo 5.52” 18.13 grains!!! To bad the6 don’t group worth the squat in my gun. When they said they would send a sample pack I figured they were going to send me one of those packs that had five different pellets in it to try. Thanks JSB!!! I just have to figure out what I’m gonna do a 10 packs of pellets I don’t shoot worth a darn in my gun.lol A lot of fun plinking I guess! Beggars can’t be choosers but I would’ve traded them all for one Or two 500 packs of the old style.

[W.R.Buchanan]

3B: you'd bitch if they hung you with Bubba's Garage Door Rope![smilie=w:

They were free, just shoot them and smile. First Rule of Business: Don't look a Gift Horse in the Mouth!

You could come over and sand on my Jeep doors? That's almost fun. :mrgreen:

Bring your gun maybe you can get that fricking Mocking Bird that has been harassing me![smilie=b:[smilie=b:[smilie=b:

Randy

[Tripplebeards]

Lol...I would. I like doing body work! Yep I’ll be doing a lot of plinking with them. I drilled a nuisance squirrel the other day with the H&N terminators behind the front shoulder. It put a dime size entry hole and the pellet exited through the neck on the other side. I can’t believe I got a pass through.Approx 20 yards shot. The squirrel dropped where it stood! I get less carnage with 22lr. I’ll practice all summer with the JSB’s and order up some more terminators for fall hunting.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Hey wasn't that Squirrel protected by the Migratory Furby Treaty with the Fukowie Tribe? Or something else not fun!

I'm sanding on doors soon so you better leave quick.

Randy