Double action trigger

[bigted]

Ruger to be specific. GP-100 model. 3 inch, 4 inch and 6 inch. 357 mag and 44 special.

Recently began utilizing the double action portion of my revolvers. Having three that I use mostly and all three being the Ruger GP platform. Having began this late in life with the double action portion of my revolvers, I begin seeing a vast difference in the action of my three revolvers mentioned.

My first revolver, built in 1990, being a model 01705 4 inch 357 mag. Wonderful double action squeeze. Smooth throughout the squeeze with no tick's or bobbles. Smooth through the entire squeeze.

Second revolver, built in 2016, being a model 01759, 6 inch barrel in 357 mag. Smooth pull till the cylinder stop engages the cylinder then after the felt cyl stop, another 1/8th inch in hammer travel is required before the hammer fall's.

Third revolver, built in 2018, being a model 01761, 3 inch barrel in 44 special. Same action as the second revolver.

So question is ... on the second and third revolvers ... is this referred to as "stacking" ? Not disappointed in either action and with the stoppage in the action seems to be nice for shooting more precise shots but just curious as to what this difference is referred to. Being new for the most part to double action shooting ... I am searching for the proper reference term wise to this action and if there is a "fix" to the stoppage that the second and third revolvers. Mostly desiring a smoother transition for the same "feel" as the first revolver in a self defense mode.

Thanks for your invaluable input and info as well as the suggestions I feel certain will follow.

[Hick]

I cannot answer your question specifically-- but I have a S&W that acts the same as the second two revolvers. I actually like it that way. When I qualified for my CCW the instructor insisted that I qualify double action. The little hesitation in the trigger warns me that I am close to discharge-- so I can steady out my aim just before the hammer falls. Made qualification easier.

[megasupermagnum]

That is what stacking feels like. I'm sure every revolver does it to some degree, but the GP100 should not be perceptible, or at least very minimally. To me it sounds like you have some kind of mechanical binding going on. It shouldn't be detrimental or anything, but not ideal. My 2018 GP100 does not do it.

It may not fix it, but something easy to try is a detailed cleaning up. Take the trigger apart, clean it, inspect it. Take the trigger return apart, run a drill bit through it BY HAND just to nock any burr off. The plunger should move freely. Put it all back together with oil. I've often saw where a slightly too large hammer dog can bind slightly. Dry fire the gun plenty, it might just smooth out.

[onelight]

It's kinda hard to interpret and express the way a trigger feels , but one thing that can be felt that seems similar to what you describe , is when beginning a da pull quickly and the slowing down to stage the trigger , the momentum of the cylinder will spin the the cylinder around to lock , ahead of the trigger position so you feel the cylinder lock before the end of the trigger stroke. Could this be what you describe ?

[bigted]

I can try to describe what the 2 newer revolvers do.

Upon disassembly, I have done all the smoothing and deep cleaning/deburring of all parts and holes. I even took my trigger return spring and spun it in my drill motor and with 220 grit paper ... ensured that all the coils were nice n smooth with no hint of binding.

Upon comparing parts with the revolver that is oldest and has no hesitation of any kind ... and smooth till letoff ... I find something that gives me an idea ... in the double action pull, the cylinder goes into complete battery well before the hammer falls off the final trigger lever/sear.

The older trigger area which has a shorter second stage, has hammer fall exactly the same time the cylinder becomes locked in battery. The newer GP's have a higher trigger secondary sear ledge ... resulting in the hammer being lifted or "cocked" further after the cylinder has locked into battery.

Now for fix's that occur to me is,
1... shorten the secondary sear on the double action section of the trigger.
2... get another cylinder hand with hopes that I can shorten the current one to delay the cylinder stop until the hammer is way closer to tripping at the end of the trigger squeeze.

Be so much easier if we were dealing with the simple Colt style of mechanical mechanic's.

[Bigslug]

My process for smoothing out Ruger DA revolvers has been very simply and effective:

1. Strip it down per factory instructions.

2. Hose it with crud cutter to flush off any leftover factory machining residue

3. EXCESSIVELY oil anything that moves & reassemble.

4. Dry fire the beejeezus out of the gun - to the tune of a couple thousand reps.

5. Disassemble again, blast out again, lube more sensibly, and enjoy a gun that isn't ashamed it's not a Python.

[onelight]

Sounds like you have some options , I am no gunsmith but I do tinker and do basic parts replacing and clean up on rough parts. I think it may be luck of the draw but my 3" gp100 44 special is nice and smooth much nicer trigger than my sp101s .
Let us know if you find a satisfactory solution.

[Dale53]

My comments will NOT address the particular revolver smoothness. However, almost NEVER in these discussions does anyone mention the operator and what the operator can do to improve his or her part in using a double action. The operator MUST improve the strength of their grip and trigger finger, etc. That is done by dry firing (think of weight lifting and how it can improve your lifting abilities). It is imperative to use snap caps to eliminate damage to the firing pin, etc. of the revolver.

Years ago, I was quite active in PPC. The double action stages benefit from a good action job but it is MOST important to get your hand strength up to speed. That is where dry firing many, many times at a session will start to improve your performance after a couple of weeks. Coincidentally, it will also tend to smooth your revolver action. If no one is around when you are watching TV, that is an excellent time to do so (I practically drove my wife nuts dry firing) but I seriously improved my performance.

I also found that regular use of a hand grip strengthener such as this helped a good deal:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MXHXSNP?tag=sa-sym-new-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1


FWIW
Dale53

[bigted]

Sounds like some great ideas ... thanks.

They are clean and debured so guess that ballistol soaking and copious dry firing is in order. Also snapcaps are in order.

My finger muscles and grip strength could stand to be strengthened as well.

No snivels on the smoothness on either. Actually the hesitation would work out if more accuracy is needed in the double action sequence. Guess that working through the "new" feel would be easy to accomplish. Before doing anything mechanical or changing anything ... I will be working my grip and finger strength as well as giving them a good dry firing for some time.

[bigted]

Well found the "fix". Kept foolin with the GP and made the discovery of what it takes to make the cylinder lockup at the same time the trigger lets go and the hammer falls.

The secondary hammer cocking lip on the trigger ... the one that continues the hammer cocking after the little arm in the hammer is lifted to its max needs to be shortened a very small amount at a time until it lets the hammer fall at or just after the cylinder locks up.

After using a file to get it close ... this takes filing a few careful strokes then cleaning it all up and reassembly to try ... I used a scrap of 220 sand paper on the file to begin polishing followed by a piece of 600 grit for a final polish.

I have a lighted magnifying glass lamp that I peer through to be certain of keeping this surface at the same angle. This is labor intensive but oh my ... what a splendid difference. After smoothing and polishing all bearing surfaces and shortening the trigger cocking lip, my 44 special is every bit as smooth and light as Dads old no dash Smith 586. It now rivals my GP 357 4 inch built in 1990.

What a fun project! I have a 6 inch GP that needs this done to it as well ... when I do it I will take pictures and post for a follow along for folks that have the desire to tackle this endeavor.

[onelight]

Great to hear you found a fix .