New 1874 sharps?

[sac]

So this weekend I was at the local gunshow and there was a gentleman with a 74 in 45-27/8 16lb. original. So that kinda got me to thinking to get another 74, but I have been out of the loop on them for awhile and started resurching Shilo which I heared is for sale and aren't making rifles anymore, and C.Sharps which I have been reading that they buy all their parts and finish and assemble them.

My question is if anything in the first paragraph is true, and the quality of both manufactures are now?

Thanks Scott

[Gray Fox]

Another to consider is the Pedersoli. I have their Quigley Gun in .45-110 and it is as nicely done as the two C-Sharps I used to have. GF

[Gunlaker]

Shiloh is still making rifles. There is no change in production, Kirk is just looking to retire and has started looking for someone to take over.

I've own a number of rifles from C. Sharps and Shiloh. For a 1874 I'd pick Shiloh each and every time, nobody makes a better rifle other than a very few custom gun builders.

Chris.

[sac]

Another to consider is the Pedersoli. I have their Quigley Gun in .45-110 and it is as nicely done as the two C-Sharps I used to have. GF

I have a Pedersoli Billy Dixon in 45-90 great rifle. Just wanted to have a special order one.

[country gent]

The last I new C Sharp's was machining their actions and most parts. I have 2 C sharps rifles currently a Hepburn in 45-90 and a High Wall in 38-55. Both are very good as to wood quality fit and finish. The case hardening is very well done. Both are very accurate with BP loads though the 45-90 is a handful ( shoulder ) with heavy bullets. I have the pedersoli Long range Sharps that is good ( not as nice fit and finish as the C Sharps.) Its the 34" barrel half octagon version. A great shooter in 45-70 but it wont make weight for a lot of matches. My last was a DZ arms Hepburn in 38-55 I believe DZ machines their parts also but are sent out for finish ( case harden and blueing).

What you can do is call or e-mail with your questions, ask at the source.

[RedlegEd]

and C.Sharps which I have been reading that they buy all their parts and finish and assemble them.

My question is if anything in the first paragraph is true, and the quality of both manufactures are now?

Thanks Scott

Hi Scott,
Where have you read that? Here's a link to C.Sharps manufacturing process. (http://csharpsarms.com/pages/14/Manufacturing-Process.html) According to them, they machine their own parts except for the barrels, which they buy from Badger or Green Mountain. In their words,
"Beyond the receiver, the key to a rifle's accuracy is its barrel. At C. Sharps Arms in the past we exclusively used Badger Barrels for all our rifles. Badger Barrels are match grade, cut-rifled, and hand-lapped. They are produced from 4150 gun-certified chromemoly steel, double stress relieved at the steel mill, and cryogenically treated. We are now offering, in certain calibers Green mountain barrels which are Match Grade, button rifled, stress relieved, air gauged, and produced from 4140 chrome moly steel. These barrels are safe for both smokeless and black powder and are available in lengths up to 34 inches. The reason we use Badger and Green Mountain barrels is simple, they enjoy a reputation as the best available on the market today. Like other manufactures, we could produce rifle barrels and probably do so at a fraction of the cost , but it would be a fraction of the quality. We regularly re-barrel original rifles as well as rifles produced by our competitors with our Badger and Green Mountain Barrels because the word is out, they are the best."

I own '74 Sharps from both C.Sharps and Cabela's (Pedersoli,) and I'm very happy with both of them.
Ed

[sac]

Hi Scott,
Where have you read that? Here's a link to C.Sharps manufacturing process. (http://csharpsarms.com/pages/14/Manufacturing-Process.html) According to them, they machine their own parts except for the barrels, which they buy from Badger or Green Mountain. In their words,
"Beyond the receiver, the key to a rifle's accuracy is its barrel. At C. Sharps Arms in the past we exclusively used Badger Barrels for all our rifles. Badger Barrels are match grade, cut-rifled, and hand-lapped. They are produced from 4150 gun-certified chromemoly steel, double stress relieved at the steel mill, and cryogenically treated. We are now offering, in certain calibers Green mountain barrels which are Match Grade, button rifled, stress relieved, air gauged, and produced from 4140 chrome moly steel. These barrels are safe for both smokeless and black powder and are available in lengths up to 34 inches. The reason we use Badger and Green Mountain barrels is simple, they enjoy a reputation as the best available on the market today. Like other manufactures, we could produce rifle barrels and probably do so at a fraction of the cost , but it would be a fraction of the quality. We regularly re-barrel original rifles as well as rifles produced by our competitors with our Badger and Green Mountain Barrels because the word is out, they are the best."

I own '74 Sharps from both C.Sharps and Cabela's (Pedersoli,) and I'm very happy with both of them.
Ed

I got this from BPCR.net. The guy says he worked there, but I know how that goes also.Post by Sidewinder » Mon Nov 06, 2006 10:41 pm

The Shiloh Sharps are made at and by Shiloh, C Sharps are made from componets bought and then finished partly by them ie, Badger barrels, actions blanked out by other companys and such. I don't know were there case is done but I dought they do it. Shiloh stands behind their rifles and the parts will interchange with original Sharps. I have handled some imports and some are pretty fair, one couldn't be made to hit my hat but the same ammo in the Shiloh that replaced it grouped very well. You can some times find an import used at a reduced price but most used Shilohs will cost as much as a new one. That, I think says it all!

[Don McDowell]

So this weekend I was at the local gunshow and there was a gentleman with a 74 in 45-27/8 16lb. original. So that kinda got me to thinking to get another 74, but I have been out of the loop on them for awhile and started resurching Shilo which I heared is for sale and aren't making rifles anymore, and C.Sharps which I have been reading that they buy all their parts and finish and assemble them.

My question is if anything in the first paragraph is true, and the quality of both manufactures are now?

Thanks Scott

Shiloh has indeed listed the business for sale in order to find qualified persons to carry on the business and the high standards of quality. But are still taking and filling orders. I have one rifle that I expect to get the call it's ready to ship any day now, and have another on order that will likely be shipped about a year from now if not sooner.
C Sharps has been for sale since at least 2015, and do indeed buy most of the castings for their actions from other places. They use Green Mountain barrels for the most part and an occasional McGowen.

If it's a 16 lb barrel you want, would be best to contact Shiloh and see when they are expecting to make their next run of bull barrels. I would also suggest to research brass availability of the 2 7/8 cases, as the Norma's are a very limited run now and extremely hard to find. Jamison/Captec has gone out of business, so about the only reliable source for that brass is when Buffalo Arms makes a run of the stretched starling 2.6 brass.

[sac]

Shiloh has indeed listed the business for sale in order to find qualified persons to carry on the business and the high standards of quality. But are still taking and filling orders. I have one rifle that I expect to get the call it's ready to ship any day now, and have another on order that will likely be shipped about a year from now if not sooner.
C Sharps has been for sale since at least 2015, and do indeed buy most of the castings for their actions from other places. They use Green Mountain barrels for the most part and an occasional McGowen.

If it's a 16 lb barrel you want, would be best to contact Shiloh and see when they are expecting to make their next run of bull barrels. I would also suggest to research brass availability of the 2 7/8 cases, as the Norma's are a very limited run now and extremely hard to find. Jamison/Captec has gone out of business, so about the only reliable source for that brass is when Buffalo Arms makes a run of the stretched starling 2.6 brass.

Thanks Don,

I was thinking of going with 40-90bn but I only see 40-90ss. Thats what was making me going c sharps, but will go with Shilo but change chambering.

Thanks again.

[Don McDowell]

The 40-90 would be good in a 16 lb barrel. The one I have comes in just a touch over 10 lbs, and it looses a lot of it's fun factor after a few rounds.

[beshears]

I am putting a 40-90 Sharps necked together and am annealing Starline 45-100 brass and running it through a full length size die. Brass grows to 2.625 length.

[WBH]

So this weekend I was at the local gunshow and there was a gentleman with a 74 in 45-27/8 16lb. original. So that kinda got me to thinking to get another 74, but I have been out of the loop on them for awhile and started resurching Shilo which I heared is for sale and aren't making rifles anymore, and C.Sharps which I have been reading that they buy all their parts and finish and assemble them.

My question is if anything in the first paragraph is true, and the quality of both manufactures are now?

Thanks Scott

For the price of a fine condition "original" 1874 Sharps rifle in the configuration you mention you could buy several custom fancy grade Shilo Sharps.

Ive seen only 2 in all my years that were true buffalo guns. Each was north of $30k.

[Lead pot]

WBH.
Here is a true Buffalo rifle that has downed two. Can I get that much money for this Shiloh .44-77 ? :bigsmyl2:

255027

[country gent]

Lead Pot I think it takes hundreds or thousands of buffaloes taken with the rifle to qualify for those prices LOL

[Tom Herman]

I looked at both the Shiloh and C Sharps sites, and found out that Shiloh uses casts receivers, while C. Sharps machines them.
For roughly the same price, that's not even a choice. Game over. I'll go with a machined receiver over cast any day.

-Tom

[Gunlaker]

I looked at both the Shiloh and C Sharps sites, and found out that Shiloh uses casts receivers, while C. Sharps machines them.
For roughly the same price, that's not even a choice. Game over. I'll go with a machined receiver over cast any day.

-Tom

There is a lot more to these rifles than investment castings vs. machined receivers. From what I have read, the Ruger #1 action is an investment casting. That action seems plenty strong. The one thing I can say, having owned quite a few C. Sharps rifles, Shiloh rifles, CPA's, Browning/Winchesters is that Shiloh's are built with greater care and attention to machine work than anyone else out there. The only exception are a few of the expensive custom rifle builders.

Chris.

[sac]

Thanks for all the advice.

I don't know what the hangup on investment casting is, Ruger Blackhawks, VAQUERO, Springfield m1a's are and they dont seem to have a problem.

[country gent]

Add in the ruger 77s 10 22s mini 14 The last I new the only ruger firearm that wasn't an investment casting was the ruger semi auto 22 pistol. A Lot of forearms are cast by investment casting now. Usually the same steel alloy as the forged and machined actions.

I have seen shot and handled rifles from C Sharps, Shiloh, CPA, Pedersoli, DZ arms, BRC. All are fine examples of the firearms and very well made. The big plus to the Custom semi custom makers ( all above but pedersoli) is you can order just exactly what you want. The draw back is the usual 8-10 week wait time or longer. I currently have 1 CPA Stevens 44 1/2 1 DZ hepburn 2 C sharps High wall and Hepburn and 1 Pedersoli 1874 long range and 1 BRC brochardt all are fine rifles all are very accurate all perform as expected. Calibers are 38-55, 40-65, 45-70, and 45-90.

What I would recommend is to do your research, Talk to the companies, see what is available in options and upgrades from each. Then decide the use for this rifle what you want don't want and order. Keep in mind some options really up the price a lot, presentation grade woods, checkering, high polish ect ect

[Gunlaker]

Sac, is it a bull barreled Sharps that you are after? I've had one on order since 2017 ( the bull barreled rifles are only made occasionally, and I think the 1877 development put those off a little in time ). When I placed the order with Lucinda she said "you know that we aren't likely to make this rifle for a very long time". I told here I was OK with that :-). Mine is going to be a 16 lb Long Range Express in .45-2.6".

Interestingly enough, the fastest Shiloh I've ever ordered was a bull barreled rifle. Shiloh announced that they were doing a bull barrel run and that if anyone wanted one to get their orders in quickly. I put mine in and got my Shiloh #3 with a 14lb barrel in .45-2-7/8 maybe 16 months later if I remember. Actual weight is 15lbs. It's a great shooter and the felt recoil is no more than my .45-70's.

Chris.

[Lead pot]

Lead Pot I think it takes hundreds or thousands of buffaloes taken with the rifle to qualify for those prices LOL

Hey CG I still have time to bring up the count :)

As far as quality with the Shiloh's, it's tops as well as their warranty.
I stoped four times to place an order with C-Sharps and four times I walked out of the door shaking my head and drove 200 yards down the street and placed the order with Shiloh. Once they would not even turn on the lights by their display and they seemed annoyed when I asked questions.
The last time I stopped I had a brand new heavy round .44 Krieger barrel and asked if they would use this barrel and John's reply was, I would not put that S....t junk on my actions. That was the last stop there.

Shiloh used it and I got my 22# 35" barreled Tollofson rifle.

[sac]

Sac, is it a bull barreled Sharps that you are after? I've had one on order since 2017 ( the bull barreled rifles are only made occasionally, and I think the 1877 development put those off a little in time ). When I placed the order with Lucinda she said "you know that we aren't likely to make this rifle for a very long time". I told here I was OK with that :-). Mine is going to be a 16 lb Long Range Express in .45-2.6".

Interestingly enough, the fastest Shiloh I've ever ordered was a bull barreled rifle. Shiloh announced that they were doing a bull barrel run and that if anyone wanted one to get their orders in quickly. I put mine in and got my Shiloh #3 with a 14lb barrel in .45-2-7/8 maybe 16 months later if I remember. Actual weight is 15lbs. It's a great shooter and the felt recoil is no more than my .45-70's.

Chris.

I called Shiloh last week as Don suggested, and she said they where thinking ov doing a run of them this year. Now I need to make up my mind if I want a bull barrel and what caliber for sure. I have a Pedersoli in 45-90 and three other rifles in 45-70, so I'm thinking something in 44-77 or 40-90.

[WBH]

WBH.
Here is a true Buffalo rifle that has downed two. Can I get that much money for this Shiloh .44-77 ? :bigsmyl2:

255027

I think "Original" was the key word on the ones I saw at those prices

[Don McDowell]

Sac, the best use of a heavy barrel I think is to stick with one of those cartridges that is burning something north of 90 grains of powder.

[Tom Herman]

Good points on investment castings and customer service.
I'm not dead set against investment castings: While I do have forged S&W revolvers, I have many more investment cast Rugers!
Guns of both processes do their job well.
Price being the same, and both guns being high quality, I'd go with a forged gun over a cast one.
Customer service is super important... I've heard of the C. Sharps attitude driving people down the road, and can't say I'd blame them.
I once went to the LGS around opening time one day, went in, and the owner started screaming at me! He asked me how in the %&^$#@! I got in, as they weren't open yet. I calmly explained that the door was unlocked, and it was only a few minutes before the posted opening time. I then tongue in cheek asked if I could stay, promising not to ask any questions, and stay out of the way until they officially opened (again, in something like two minutes!).
The owner grudgingly said "OK"... I looked around for a bit, then left and went about three miles down the road to the biggest gun store in the area and bought something from them instead.
The first shop didn't last long... It's not lamented.
Had a similar experience at a multi vendor flea market about a month ago. Spent my money with someone else as well.
I won't spend money with people that antagonize their potential customers.

-Tom