265 Yards Marlin 1894CB and 200 Yards Uberti Winchester 73'

[Savvy Jack]

12-16-2019
Pretty good morning at the range. After messing around with the scopes on both rifles, I took this day to re-zero them in.

Temp was a mild 50 degrees but the winds picked up to 7 gusts to 10mph so I now have an excuse for the poor groups!!!! The Marlin 1894CB at 200 yards then 265 yards and the Winchester 73' to 200 yards. Why? Because I can ;-)!

The same load of 25.8gr of Reloder 7 is safe for all firearms and in a 24" barrel, gets 1,350fps @ less than 11,000psi

These Groups will make most folks laugh but they are good for this caliber at these velocities...not great, but typical.

For the 265 yard targets, the Marlin 1894CB averaged a 7 3/4" slow fire 8 shot group, while a more rapid fire 8 shot averaged 11". Most hits were in the kill zone....so note to self....aim good and shoot slow, and shoot with no wind!!!

The 200 yard Winchester 73' 14 shot group averaged 6 1/2"

Listen I know these are nothing to brag about but I had fun and that's all that matters right?

253086 253087 253088


253089 253090

253091 253092 253093

253094

[DaveM]

Good shooting.

[longbow]

Looks good to me!

Many years ago I was having trouble with my new then 1894 in .44 mag. Took me a while to figure out that my Lyman 429421 mould was casting "undersize" using ACWW. Accuracy was mediocre at best and I got constant light leading.

Boolits were casting at 0.429"/0.430" and the groove diameter of my gun runs to SAAMI spec for rifle at 0.431"+. I didn't know at the time. Once I figured that out I made a mould to cast at 0.432"+ and accuracy improved considerably and leading about disappeared. Mould was an RNFP design that cast a 265 gr. PB boolit.

I can't recall my 100 yard group size but shot to 200 yards and got 10" groups or a bit better. I was happy with that from a short light lever carbine. I haven't shot that far with that gun since but should to check accuracy with boolits cast from my Mihec and Accurate moulds (all cast 0.433" or larger). Maybe they'll do better... if I can.

For me, your groups are good at that range. Good shooting!

Longbow

[Jniedbalski]

That is very good shooting. What caliber?

[Larry Gibson]

Good shooting. My 44-40 is a Chiappa M92 and currently am using a 240 gr bullet at 1150 fps. I still use the iron on it and with the slide I plink at a ram hanging at 300 yards on our range. I hit it more often than miss it which amazes the AR zombie shooters. My Uberti M73 is a 45 Colt and I load it with 200 FPs or 230 TCs (becoming my favorite bullet for the 45 Colt) to 1150 fps in the M73. I also plink at 300 yards on the ram but it only has a buckhorn style rear sight which at max elevation with the elevator slide gives a 200 yard zero with normal sight picture. With a bit of Tennessee elevation holding the front post up into the buckhorn I can hit the ram about 1/3 of the time and come real close with the misses.....good enough to keep a "hostile" hopping around...….

I enjoy reading your tests and the results of your long range shooting with the 44-40 lever guns.

[Savvy Jack]

Thanks guys!

It is a 44-40

[Tripplebeards]

I want to see the gun!

[Savvy Jack]

I want to see the gun!


LOL


scroll down to the bottom of the page at this link

https://sites.google.com/view/44winchester/handloading/accuracy-at-265-yards

[Savvy Jack]

Actually, this link is better

https://sites.google.com/view/44winchester/the-rifles

[T-Bird]

Good shooting. You would have been killing deer at these ranges and not knowing you shouldn't be! ( according to energy charts etc and modern "knowledge") Just like the old guys.

[LtFrankDrebbin]

Mate I am impressed you can even see those targets at 200 yards plus :awesome:

[Hickok]

Great post! I really enjoyed the info and the pictures of the targets.

This is "real world" shooting!:D

[wdr2]

Savvy Jack - nice shooting with the Marlin CB at 265yds. I see you are using the Accurate 43-214A which has no crimp groove. I am using the 43-220C in my 44-40s with a light roll crimp using an RCBS die. Can you describe how you are “crimping” your loads? Or, do you have other posts that describe your reloading technique?

[Savvy Jack]

Savvy Jack - nice shooting with the Marlin CB at 265yds. I see you are using the Accurate 43-214A which has no crimp groove. I am using the 43-220C in my 44-40s with a light roll crimp using an RCBS die. Can you describe how you are “crimping” your loads? Or, do you have other posts that describe your reloading technique?


Absolutely. The 43-220C and 43-215C are great bullets that can not be improved!!! However, I have to "go there" and be difficult by wanting a bullet with no crimp groove like the 427098 but wanted more O'give area which increased the weight to 220gr with the right mix. 217gr with basic wheel weights.

Using the softer lead, the Redding Profile Crimp does a great job. I put some information here: https://sites.google.com/view/44winchester/handloading/redding-profile-crimp-die

[wdr2]

Thanks - very useful info.

[If1Hitu]

That is good shooting.:lovebooli

[Kev18]

Good shooting! People need to remember that these rifles and cartridges were made to kill. They are accurate for sure, up until a certain point.
I feel like modern culture changed the way shooting or groupind is viewed. For example, you even stated that people might laugh at the group.
These days if you aren't shooting in a dime at 2000 yards and 4000fps, it isn't fun or important. Wrong! All shooting is good shooting. Have fun :)

[dverna]

Shooting beyond the "normal" range of a caliber is always fun. It shows what can be done in a pinch...but it is not the best way to harvest game.

I certainly will not laugh at those groups...fine shooting IMHO.

My 1894 Marlins are a couple of my favorite rifles. One is chambered in .38 Spl and the other in .38/.357. I plan on extending my range to 200 yards this year and will play with them like you have. Again, nice shooting.

[osteodoc08]

Crossing over into the subsonic territory can cause some major accuracy issues. I wonder what you velocity is out that far. Looks like a good day of shooting to me.

[Savvy Jack]

Crossing over into the subsonic territory can cause some major accuracy issues. I wonder what you velocity is out that far. Looks like a good day of shooting to me.

According to Winchester's ballistics website, the Super-X JSP at a puking 1,190fps slows to 900fps @ 360ft lbs of energy at 200 yards and 756fps at 400 yards. My hard cast bullets show 1,350fps at the muzzle so for kicks, lets guestimate 750fps at 400 yards.

https://winchester.com/Products/Ammunition/Rifle/Super-X/X4440

At 750fps, my hard cast loads penetrate over 32" of water jugs and bounced off of a split (flat front) pine log. Although I shot again through the water jugs after the water drained out, without the water jugs, another round penetrated 3/4" into the pine log. Have yet to dig out the bullet.

Shot these yesterday.

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Just to be clear, first bullet went through water only. Bullet in pine log, no water used.

[Hootmix]

At 400 yds. ( 3/4" in pine ) that slug would put some pain in the " belly " of a dancing buffalo hunter !!! ( saw it for my- own self ) " Gus Did It ".

Thanks Jack , always a pleasure .

more coffee ,, Hootmix.

[Savvy Jack]

At 400 yds. ( 3/4" in pine ) that slug would put some pain in the " belly " of a dancing buffalo hunter !!! ( saw it for my- own self ) " Gus Did It ".

Thanks Jack , always a pleasure .

more coffee ,, Hootmix.

LOL, that make me chuckle!!!!
Thanks

[Savvy Jack]

I guess one of the most controversial topics with the 44-40 is the killing power and accuracy at distances greater than 150 yards.
Quite understandable but lets not focus too much on accuracy as much as the actual killing powder.
Yes, you have to have both to be "effective" but the following is only informative and does not come to any conclusion...just data collecting.

https://sites.google.com/view/44winchester/contributors/bryan-austin/43-214a-pine-board-test

12-23-2019

43-214A Ballistics Test

If properly tested in 1/2" pine boards, I do think it would have penetrated 2 1/2 boards, or more, @ 750fps.
If shot from a rifle (1,350fps), it is calculated that the bullet will travel to 400 yards as the velocity drops to 750fps.
According to Winchester's 1875 catalog, the bullet was reported to penetrate 8 each, 1/2" pine boards at 1,000 yards.

253488Lined up about 32" worth of water jugs, not photoed is the pine long at the end.

253489Retrieved after shooting through ruffly 32" of water jugs and hitting a pine log (split with flat surface) @ 750fps impact velocity.

253490Another bullet, no water....entered from right to left, turned slightly before stopping at about 3/4" penetration. The 220gr bullet retained 218.5gr with nearly 3/4" expansion.

253491 Bullet retained 218.5gr

The following video link shows the proper way to test pine board penetration when testing ballistics per Army specs. back in the day.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiM6XILmfQg

[35 Whelen]

Excellent shooting and thanks for posting stuff like this!

35W