Light 20 gauge slug for 13 year old daughter??

[Vettepilot]

So in order to get into a setup a little more destructive/FUN than her .22 rifle, I bought my daughter a cheap break action 20 gauge and selected a low recoil load to load up for her. (She is 13 and of slight (slim) build.)

We have been using 12.5 grains of Hodgdon's International under an 11/16 ounce wax slug made with #9 shot, and of course, wax. These loads MURDER gallon jugs of water and full cans of shaving cream, and put a HUGE smile on her face! Recoil and blast are just right and don't bother her. (I did have her try some standard 2 3/4" 20 gauge field loads and she didn't like those one bit; too loud and too much recoil, even with hearing protection and a very good recoil pad.)

The only problem is she goes through these wax slug loads pretty fast, and they are a bit cumbersome to make with the wax and all. So something easier to load on the Lee Load-all would be cool, and has me considering a more conventional slug load for her.

I am thinking maybe a discarding sabot round ball or something similar to keep the payload weight and thus recoil down. I could modify the gun for a screw in rifled choke for other load types, but I'd rather not...

What do you guys recommend that would be accurate enough to hit a shaving cream can at under 50 yards, and destructive enough to put that huge smile on her face even with a reduced recoil loading??

BTW, those wax slugs ARE hard to beat for destructive fun; just a bit of a pain to make...

Thanks in advance,
Vettepilot

[longbow]

If the barrel is choked then whatever slug you pick has to fit through the choke or be designed to collapse to suit the choke (like a typical Foster slug). Round ball in a shotcup should work as long as it fits through the choke if there is one. Round balls are quick and easy to cast and properly loaded should give adequate accuracy for hitting gallon jugs at least to 50 yards. Cans of shaving cream are a little small for that range. Good loads should give about 4" groups at 50 yards. Use a nitro card wad under the ball to keep the wad from trying to wrap itself around the ball. Ajay (SuperBlazingSabots) has posted lots of info on slug and round ball fits in wads for both 12 and 20 ga. so do a search and you will find his info. Just remember to make sure the round ball/wad combo will fit through a choke if there is one. If choked and tight (like full choke) then an undersize ball and donut wad might be required.

Alternately there is the Lyman Sabot slug which uses standard trap wads and there are Russian slugs available in 20 ga. through Svarog or AS Company. Mihec lists a 20 ga. clone of the Lyman Sabot Slug as well but not sure if he has any in stock. Doesn't seem like many domestic options for 20 ga. slug moulds.

It is always good when kids are interested. My son had to have a 12 ga. when he was 13. As with your daughter, he found recoil too much so I downloaded and patterned so he could hunt with the 12 ga. that worked out well.

Longbow

[pipehand]

Vettepilot, I just started experimenting with .562 cast balls in the 20 gauge. I use 14 grains of International and a claybusters waa 3/4 ounce clone with enough card wads to get it up to crimp height. This in a Remington sts type hull. The card wads are punched using a 1/2" arch punch. It could be a fun father/daughter reloading project. At 13 I bet she would enjoy making her own ammo with Dad's supervision. I imagine the 13 year old boys would find it interesting also.
I'm using both Lyman and Rcbs .562 molds because I got a deal on them. Had I not, Lee sells a very reasonable mold. A dipper and a ball mold are about the easiest gear to start casting with. There's not as much info on this site for 20.gauge as there is for 12, i just used what I learned in loading .680 roundball in 12gauge.

[Vettepilot]

Thanks for the answers guys. Yes, I am aware of the choke "problem" with slugs.

At this point for various reasons, including payload weight, I am considering going with a round ball load for her. I've also got my mind pondering faster/easier ways to load the wax slugs we like so much. Those things are a riot!! Too much fun!

One thing for anyone making them... a common method for doing it has one just cutting off the crimp of a birdshot load, and then just pouring the wax/shot mixture into the wad and that's it; no slug retention. I do not agree with this method at all as the wax slug and or wax slug/wad combo may slide out of the shell and down the bore, becoming an obstruction. This is especially worrisome in hot weather or in a hot gun. We ALWAYS make ours with a roll crimp to avoid this potential problem. It has happened before, and the results are very dangerous.

Thanks again,
Vettepilot

[W.R.Buchanan]

If you are reloading once fired hulls with wax slugs the hot tip is to take them up to "wad in place," then drop in the correct amount of molten wax and then the shot on top. The shot will drop down into the wax and the wax will fill up to the top of the shot. The kicker is figuring out how much wax to pour in, which may take a few tries to get right. It also helps to warm the shot, like in a Toaster Oven.

Randy

[dverna]

Making a rifle out of shotgun is not easy. If you have the funds, get a .38/.357 rifle. I have one I cut down to fit a small lady and she loved it. Plenty of load data, and super easy to load. Even if you do not want to cast, lead bullets are $60/1000.

Shooting full cans of shaving cream seems like a costly way to have fun, but I understand the attraction of reactive targets. I have my fiancé shoot at a 6" steel plate and she loves it. No targets to set up, portable and not costly.

BTW, good for you in getting your girl involved and keeping it fun for her!!

Edit to add:
I get canned vegetables for $.25 on sale. I wonder how they would react to a wadcutter or blunt faced .38 bullet at 1000 fps? Not something I would do too many times as the mess and stink would be awful. But at least the birds/critters would clean up later...LOL.

[gumbo333]

Really cheapo off brand soda pop, a pretty impressive target.

[Vettepilot]

If you are reloading once fired hulls with wax slugs the hot tip is to take them up to "wad in place," then drop in the correct amount of molten wax and then the shot on top. The shot will drop down into the wax and the wax will fill up to the top of the shot. The kicker is figuring out how much wax to pour in, which may take a few tries to get right. It also helps to warm the shot, like in a Toaster Oven.

Randy

Actually I am thinking about doing the reverse of what you suggest. That is, loading up as normal on the Load All, up to the pre-crimp. Then drop in a pre-measured amount of melted wax, then either fold or roll crimp. When I get time, I will check to see if the wax will fully permeate a load of shot. As you say, the shot may have to be warmed.

Regarding those targets. We just take a few of the shaving cream cans from the dollar store when we go to shoot, along with a cheap, on sale watermelon or two. For the rest, it is saved up milk jugs and soda bottles full of water. Lots of fun. I am excited to introduce her to Tannerite. She'll LOVE that, but even here in the desert it is getting more and more restrictive where you can shoot the stuff...

Dam idiots shooting off large amounts of it and then showing it off on social media and youtube ruining the fun for everyone! I mean, I get it... it would be a kick to shoot off a large amount of it if you were safe about it. But showing it to ALL THE law in the land is just plain STOOPID!

Thanks,
Vettepilot

[Vettepilot]

By the way... I didn't get her a 20 gauge. I got her a break action 12 gauge. I figured in the long run, the 12 gauge would be more versatile, and she could "grow into it." Then I bought a 12 to 20 gauge adapter from Short Lane Adapters, and one of their 8" rifled 9mm adapters too, so those are what she shoots. We're very happy with the setup.

After my first post, I got to thinking I better wait until she graduates into reduced recoil 12 gauge before considering regular slugs instead of wax slugs. The accuracy of a 20 gauge slug rattle banging it's way down a 12 gauge bore couldn't be very good...

Vettepilot

[Vettepilot]

Yeah, it is Short Lane Gunadapters.com. We have their 12 to 20 gauge adapter, their 12 gauge to muzzle loader adapter, and their 8" long rifled 12 gauge to 9mm adapter. They work quite well and we are happy with them, though I feel the 8" rifled adapters are a bit overpriced at 100 bucks...

I don't know why, but I have been "itching" to get into a 45-70. I don't know if I will get a 45-70 shotgun adapter, or start the (quite long) process of saving up for an actual 45-70 gun.

Vettepilot