Black and the 50 Alaskan

[MOA]

What kind of pressure is this cartridge going to develop? Has anyone played with this cartridge by using black instead of smokeless? Cast boolits only.

My inquiring mind wants to know.

[Edward]

Not enough to consider, you can"t stuff enough BP in that case .

[MOA]

I'm contemplating taking one of my 1876 Swede rollers currently chambered in 12.7x44Rmm ie. (Remington 12mm, Swede 50-70) and having the original chamber reamed to the specs of the 50 Alaskan but only using black powder. Pressure could be more than action or block, barrel could handle. Guess I need to check closest capacity of other BP cartridges of 50 Alaskan size for their pressure figures.

[RichardB]

I built a 50-2.1 (50 AK) on a Peabody receiver. All I shoot in it is BP. Its about midway between the 50-70 and 50-90.

[MOA]

I built a 50-2.1 (50 AK) on a Peabody receiver. All I shoot in it is BP. Its about midway between the 50-70 and 50-90.

Your opinion on the possibility of this Husquvarna roller handling an added 25 grains of black powder?

[Keith]

As long as you stick to black its not a problem. They are a very strong action anyway.
I have one in 45-70 and another in 45-120 and an original 12 mm like yours I shoot as a 50-70.

[RichardB]

shooting BP its not an issue.

[MOA]

Well I just hate to have new starline 50 Alaskan brass and have to cut them down to 44mm when I could just have the chamber reamed for the 50 Alaskan and have a unique cartridge and a cleaned up chamber plus use the 50 Alaskan case full of bp, wax card, lube disc, wax card, cast boolit with beeswax n crisco lube using a 30:1 lead-tin mix.

[MOA]

As long as you stick to black its not a problem. They are a very strong action anyway.
I have one in 45-70 and another in 45-120 and an original 12 mm like yours I shoot as a 50-70.

Keith, did you rebarrel a 12.7 Swede roller to 45-120? If so what barrel, length and twist.

[missionary5155]

Good morning
We shoot our 86 (jap) in 50 Alaskan with 3F Goex and a 350 -450 grainers cast of 40/1. I have no doubt it would harvest any critter that would be on the receiving end. In the 26 inch barreled model 86 is very mild to shoot. Our BP brass have annealed necks so there is no blowback into the chamber. We do not resize the brass. The cast are crimped. Normally I load three in the mag.

We do not have bears in east ILLinois to contend with. If we did I would carry 5 - 500 grainers at 1850 fps.

Off cross sticks it will shoot 2 inch groups at 100 yards.
This rifle is a JES rebore also.
Mike in LLama Land

[Keith]

Keith, did you rebarrel a 12.7 Swede roller to 45-120? If so what barrel, length and twist.

My mistake I wanted it in 45-120 but my gunsmith said it was too long to fit past the hammer, so we did it in 45-110. This was 20 years ago. Just a Green Mountain 18 twist 34 inches long. Even that was too much for me to handle so its now a 45-90.

I am just building a Norwegian Roller in 40-72. in the Black Powder section

[Huvius]

Just dumped some BP into a 50AK case and it looks like it will hold 75gr with a little room for compression wads, etc.
Would be fun but not a high performer I'd think.

[MOA]

Just dumped some BP into a 50AK case and it looks like it will hold 75gr with a little room for compression wads, etc.
Would be fun but not a high performer I'd think.



I guess that could be true, might depend on what your criteria is of a high performer.
Stuffing it with a 500-600 grain boolit and punching holes in paper might be a high score getter, and then again, punching holes clean through animals the size of the American Bison with no problem, might be considered a non-performer. Guess it just comes down to what the elements one is looking for that make a cartridge a performer. The Alaskan is just short of what you would find in power of a 50-90. It's a great performer for many.

[Huvius]

True enough MOA.
I guess I'm used to thinking of fiftys in the 100+ gr powder charge realm.
In your roller, it would work fine but is it much of a step up from the original chambering to be worthwhile?
Have you sourced brass and dies for this project yet? I have both I would sell you.

[MOA]

True enough MOA.
I guess I'm used to thinking of fiftys in the 100+ gr powder charge realm.
In your roller, it would work fine but is it much of a step up from the original chambering to be worthwhile?
Have you sourced brass and dies for this project yet? I have both I would sell you.




Huvius,
I've got 100 pcs of Starline Alaskan brass, about fifty are cut to the 44mm lgn, the other fifty are uncut. I've been using some 50-70 dies to size the current caliber. If I ream the chamber I most likely will first try just neck sizing the full length Alaskan case with the same dies and if I need to crimp I might try running the completed shell back up into the sizer die without the decapping pin in it to see how that works, and if that does not work I'll put together a dummy round and send it off to Lee for a FCD, which is what I did on the 44mm cases. These are the cartridges I used the new FCD on and I must say it did a sweet job on crimping them. If I ream the chamber I might also still be able to shoot the shorter round in it still, it will be something that I will try just to see if I can utilize the shorter cartridge. Either way, not having to spend the time cutting down expensive Alaskan brass will be worth paying the extra money for the caliber reaming on the rifle.

https://i.postimg.cc/7hqNHDks/20190922_114906.jpg (https://postimg.cc/ftgdCGkm)

[indian joe]

Just dumped some BP into a 50AK case and it looks like it will hold 75gr with a little room for compression wads, etc.
Would be fun but not a high performer I'd think.

I been wondering what it is that a 350 grain 50 cal slug cruising along at 1450-1500fps wont kill ????? Should be a quite adequate performer within its range - the 50 alaskan should hold at least as much BP as the old 50/95 load for the 1876 ?

[MOA]

I been wondering what it is that a 350 grain 50 cal slug cruising along at 1450-1500fps wont kill ????? Should be a quite adequate performer within its range - the 50 alaskan should hold at least as much BP as the old 50/95 load for the 1876 ?





Hi Joe, that's my thinking exactly.

[singleshotcajun]

Interesting thread. What projectiles are those ? In my particular Swede I trim the Starline 50 Alaskan cases to 1.690, dump 70 gr FF Goex then seat Buffalo Arms .513" 350 gr Flat nose soft cast lead on the powder no card. Shoots great in mine. I do use a home made .513 expander die to both form the inner neck and to seat the boolit.

[MOA]

Interesting thread. What projectiles are those ? In my particular Swede I trim the Starline 50 Alaskan cases to 1.690, dump 70 gr FF Goex then seat Buffalo Arms .513 300 gr cast lead on the powder no card. Shoots great in mine. I do use a home made .512 expander die to both form the inner neck and to seat the boolit.


The cast projectiles are for the s&w 500 revolver. But it was the perfect size and weight for the 12.7x44R roller. I'm using 30:1 alloy so I get upsetting from boolits.

[gunluvver]

I have an 1875 dated Norwegian Rolling block in excellent original condition that is stamped ".50-.348 LUGNET" on top of the chamber. I researched the caliber and did a chamber cast, and discovered it had been rechambered to .50 Alaskan. Lugnet is a sports complex in Sweden, and I'm not sure why the chamber is stamped as such. I ordered some Starline cases, and am planning on making up some loads using Trail Boss and 385 gr. hollow base .50 cal Minie Balls to take advantage of the deep grooves of the rifling. Original charge in the 12.7 was 75 grs. of BP, and I'm planning on 70 grs. of TB. The previous owner tried shooting .50/70 out of it but it was wildly inaccurate. I have a .50/70 die set and a Minie Ball bullet mold in .385 grs. as well as some pure lead. It will be my first attempt at casting boolits.

[BillyCanuk]

Interesting thread indeed. I wanted to go this route with my 43 Spanish roller. Fairly costly endeavour here in Canada. Greenmountain barrel =600.00 imported. Reamer=250.00 imported. Gunsmithing labour=?
Already have 50-70 and 50-90 but it would be so cool to have the three amigos. Any updates from you fellers?

[MOA]

Billy, not much in news here. Covid has kept me pretty grounded for last 2 months. We're also in the process of moving so much is now packed. The wife and I had looked at moving to the UP years ago before we got sidetracked here to the coast so we could assist our ageing parents. Now we're too old and unable to voluntarily subject ourselves to those low temps for 8 months a year. We like to be in the outdoors.

[BillyCanuk]

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Yes winters can be a challenge here. Hasn't warmed up yet. I actually lived in Huntsville Alabama from 58 to 61. My Dad was Canadian Army on loan to U.S. army at the Redstone Arsenal. I did grade 1,2 and 3 there. Can still remember the red dirt and getting heat rash and those yellow jackets. Learned to play baseball and football at an early age. Hope you keep safe and we'll see better days ahead.

[MOA]

.
Yes winters can be a challenge here. Hasn't warmed up yet. I actually lived in Huntsville Alabama from 58 to 61. My Dad was Canadian Army on loan to U.S. army at the Redstone Arsenal. I did grade 1,2 and 3 there. Can still remember the red dirt and getting heat rash and those yellow jackets. Learned to play baseball and football at an early age. Hope you keep safe and we'll see better days ahead.

When we get re-settled I'll be doing lots more with the Alaskan and Black so stay tuned on this subject.