Buck with 44 mag. rifle

[Yooper003]

Today was opening day here in Michigan, about 3:00 this afternoon nice buck came through behind a doe. I was shooting my 44 mag, cva hunter with 240 gr. cast & pc,ed. Pushed with moderate load of H110. Boolit went through both shoulders & is still going I guess. He went about 100 yd. & piled up dead. But not 1 drop of blood, we have over a foot of snow on the ground so would have seen blood if there was any. Sure did not think I was casting too hard a boolit but maybe so.

[megasupermagnum]

You guys have seasons that open on a Friday?

[Yooper003]

Nov 15 they tried sat. opener a couple years but people wanted to go back to Nov 15 th opener.

[richhodg66]

Congrats!

Got a picture of the buck? It's been my experience that cast bullets generally don't leave much blood on the ground, but jacketed ones don't really either. Usually, mine have dropped fast, never had one go 100 yards, most times I see them fall down.

I bet hunting those north woods with a rifle like that is a great experience. Kind of envious here.

[bmortell]

nice work, could you mention the bullet design and lead alloy

[Yooper003]

I did take pic's but could not get them to post with my I-pad. It was a nice 8 point with 14" spread. Boolit was Lee 240 round nose. Alloy was just adding some Roto metals hig antimony & tin nuggets to some plumbers lead I had to where I thought I was getting 14-17 hardness. Boolit exit hole was hardly larger than enterance.

[CastingFool]

Congrats, Yooper! I, too, went out yesterday morning, at a friend's farm. Looking for a doe, saw 8 but all too far away for my Henry 45 colt. Be going out shortly, behind my house.

[bmortell]

oh that makes sense then. a round nose around 15-16 hardness probably acts like a FMJ. obviously you can still take something with it, but you would get better damage and bleeding with flatpoints soft or hard. for expansion with flatpoints id go roughly 10 hardness or a pretty wide flatpoint still gives people good results if hard.

[Screwbolts]

What bmortell said! I agree completely. You could file a flat nose on them RNs and that would help a great deal IMHO!

[dnepr]

Congrats on the deer . Going to a flat point and/or a softer alloy would help , I am wondering around the woods of northwestern Ontario with the same rifle loaded with a lee 310 gr flatpoint , if Lady Luck smiles on me I will let you know how it performs.

[Tripplebeards]

Sounds like me last year! I shot three in a group and two ran over 100 yards before dropping with little to no blood...

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?373867-First-deer(s)-with-cast-boolits!-Used-my-devastators!!!



I am going to shoot an extremely soft 7.5 BH at about 1600 ft./s this year in the same hollow point to see if I get different results during our antlerless only season. A 100 yards will put my deer on someone else’s property and I’ll lose my deer to someone else. If soft alloy doesn’t work i’ll still cast and use my boolits for practice and plinking but I won’t hunt with cast anymore unless I go out west so I can watch my shot animal run across the open plains until it drops. I’d rather blow a deer in half and lose all the meat than watch it run out of sight after the shot and be able to eat in the hole once I find the animal with no blood trail any day of the week. At least with the softer alloy I’m using I’m hoping I at least put a very large exit hole on my animal so I have a blood trail(if needed) this year.

[kycrawler]

The Lee 310 cast soft anchors them

[Tripplebeards]

The Lee 310 cast soft anchors them

How soft and at what muzzle velocities?

[murf205]

How soft, what speeds?

clip on wheel weight or there abouts and 1500 to 1600 fps in a rifle is plenty. The 310 Lee or a Keith SWC kills quicker than any RN. That is pretty tough to have a property that close. Set up on the property line with your back to the other property.

[Tripplebeards]

clip on wheel weight or there abouts and 1500 to 1600 fps in a rifle is plenty. The 310 Lee or a Keith SWC kills quicker than any RN. That is pretty tough to have a property that close. Set up on the property line with your back to the other property.


That’s what new my neighbor did after they bought the property next to me a few years back. They are about 15 yards off of it and have their tree stand sideways and stare down into my woods. I finally had enough of it and posted my land. My new neighbors saw the signs and called and yelled at me for posting my land! Lol... and I know why is because they’re shooting deer on my property. They told me they didn’t like the signs and I should turn them around towards my way because they found them offensive,OMG! I have found blood trails and huge blood spots 100 yards into my woods the last couple of years and know they’ve been launching shots into my woods. On the conversation we had I explained to them at least we know where the lines are now and it will make us both honest. I said I wouldn’t expect to shoot a deer on their property as I expect them not to shoot one on mine. But if they do shoot a deer on their property and it runs onto mine they know as long as they call me they have permission to come on and track it as I do theirs. And they’re pretty bad shots because every year they call me at least 2 times and never find their deer. I realize you got to keep the peace with your neighbors so I can’t Jerry Springer them too bad. The first year they shot a couple deer and one ran down and stood right in front of me for 20 minutes. One of the owners walked down to my tree stand it ran away and asked me if I saw the deer! I said yes there’s nothing wrong with it politely. He then saw the deer 30 yards in back of me walk away and said yup it’s fine. He then walked back up to his property line got in the truck drove it up To the deer about 40 yards above the property line loaded it and drove away. As they were driving away a 20 inch 10 pointer walked within 10 yards of my stand staring at them driving across the field! Nice beautiful easy shot I wish it would happen like that every year! Dropped it right off it’s feet. I sit about 80 yards off my property line watching up to it. I’ve use my 30 out six and 180 grain core locks since the 80s and most deer drop where they stand. I have had some go 20 or 30 yards with a heart shot. I’m using my 35 Whelen with super performance ammo this year. I hear lifts deer up and off the ground most the time.lol I own 33 acres and of course where the deer run is on the ridge of my property line. That’s why I try and get in there early for Bow hunting and try and get a monster every year so gun season seems less relevant to me. I finally think I’ve got the neighbor thing taken care of the other neighbors decided they were going to go coon hunting on my land and finally got caught on trail camera along with the other neighbors dogs twice which I called the cops on because they were chasing deer on camera but the cops won’t give them tickets for their dogs. Last Sunday at two new dogs come right underneath my stand! There is dog poop all over in my woods. I have no issues with shooting a cat but a dog is only as smart as his owner. I can’t blame the dogs but the idiots that let their dogs run loose in the country. I did get a kick out of the neighbor who yelled at me about posting my land. When they bought the property there was an overlap between mine and there’s We went back-and-forth for over a year and all met a half a dozen times out in the woods with the surveyor. We both came to an agreement where our properties met and the surveyor put stakes in the ground. That’s where I put my signs if not a couple feet down onto my land so I wouldn’t be marking their property as trees don’t grow perfectly parallel with each other. I was told by the neighbor that they didn’t think that was right and they might have to get it surveyed again.lol i’m sure if they called the surveyor or the County record deeds they laughed at them as it’s all been written, signed. a note or a doctrine stamped...and we both received copies of what we did with our agreement. They did text me a few weeks later very nice and asked me if I shot a deer because they found a huge buck on the other neighbors property bordering both of ours so I think they realized they were in the wrong calling and yelling at me for posting MY property. I really couldn’t care less during muzzleloader, antlerless only! or archery season, during gun season they’re out there in full force. Archery they’ll sit in front of me every once in a while but I don’t think they are diehards when it comes to that. I know they do hunt early youth season so in respect for the kids I stay out of the woods that weekend hoping they can do their best.

[bmortell]

my deer season is in about 15 days, I got a 44 lever action set up with 300gr .360" flatpoint at 1500fps, I need hard bullets for accuracy so I got the front 100gr's 20-1 lead and the rear 200gr heat treated 50-50 WW. there also PC'd so its quite a bit of work per bullet but I got it shooting accurate and it should hammer deer pretty good and lots of penetration.

[catkiller45]

so would a 255 grain hollow point have been a better choice? Asking because I have some I might use in my revolver 44 mag..

[444ttd]

although i use 444 marlin(tc encore, 23" barrel) i use a 300gr fn gc(saeco) going at 1624fps. its 10 lead : 1 tin or 12ish bhn. i had one run about 25-30 yards and the other two were drt or close to it.

63+/-(or was 53?) yards to the spike, ran
25ish yards to two doe, drt

they all were behind the shoulder shots. they also were thru n thru. the boolits did expand but not by much. the spike had a blood trail, but the spike didn't go far.

i used a 275gr ranch dog, 280gr wfn and lfn gc that were around 12ish bhn(10 coww: about .25 tin) going roughly 2000fps and did it ever expand!!! bloodshot meat was the rule. i don't like bloodshot meat, so i downloaded the 300gr boolit.

[jaydub in wi]

The Lee 310 cast soft anchors them

The one deer I killed with cast was with a 44 280 LBT WFN. I was shooting them in a ruger super blackhawk over 21 grains of H110 IIRC. Anyway, the deer was at 25 or 30 yds. I shot him through the top of the heart..right through the plumbing. He managed a weak 25 yard trot. Those boolits were cast by beartooth. I have bought that mold from Veral. There was a good size exit and lots of blood to trail. I didn't need it as I saw him fall. Good luck everyone...I'm going hunting in Michigan's UP now

[gunseller]

I have no idea how many deer I have shot and killed with my 44. Bullet is a 240 SWC cast of WW over 18 grains of 2400. They usually only move about 30 inches. Straight down. Big flat on the front is, to me, as good as a hollow point.
Steve

[murf205]

Big flat on the front is better than a jacketed bullet too. I have some experience with Nosler Partitions and they are really good but they are REALLY expensive too. The old Keith boolit and Veral Smith's long and wide flat nose boolits are about as good as it gets IMHO. I have a friend who is a feral hog killing machine and he shoots my cast boolits. He tells me that he has not lost one since he started using them and they were running off and dying somewhere he could not find when using jacketed stuff.

[Yooper003]

I just finished butchering that buck, looking at the wound channel I can't fault the boolit . I was upset at the lack of blood from the hit, but it was mostly from where I hit him.if I had been shooting my 6.5 creedmoor & gotten perfect expansion ,exit would have been no larger than from my 44 boolit. I have some purchased 240 swc boolits but theare harder than mine so probably won't make much difference.

[Kylongrifle32]

Congrats on your harvest. I'm shot my first deer with a cast boolit this year. Pretty much had the same result as you. I used a 14" Contender in 44 mag. Pushed a NOE 430-265 deep hollow point with 18 grs of 2400. The alloy I'm using is hard for a hollow point 95% lead 5% antimony.

I shot a buck (170 lbs ) at 75 yards. Standing briars side the boolits struck the right front leg Midway between the knee and shoulder breaking the leg and passing thru the other side just behind the left leg. After the shot I watched the buck run over 40 yards until it vanished into the brush. I waited an hour and then walked to the spot where he was standing. Upon inspection I found no blood no hair so I started walking the route I thought he use looking for blood along the way. I found him 65 yards from the spot of the shot. Laying there on the ground was a blood spot that had only 2 ounces of blood. A finger size hole in and out the other side. Field dressing revealed the chest cavity full of blood and a finger size hole dead center they the heart . Totally different that the results from my 14" barrel 7-30 Waters with jacketed bullets.

[Tripplebeards]

Well after two different posts here in the last week and my experience last year of deer getting shot with good shots and running away like they’re not hit and zero blood it sounds pretty much the norm for the 44 mag and cast if you don’t hit them in the head, back bone, or neck to paralyze them. I still plan on using my super soft alloy this year to see if I get different results. I always figured the 44 mag would put them on the ground where they dropped or within 20 or 30 yards 99.9% of the time especially at the faster rifle velocities I’m pushing them. I’m hoping a super soft hollow point cast bullet will be a game changer for me. If I’m lucky maybe my bullet will completely come apart and stop in the deer and transfer all that energy into it which I highly doubt. I’m sure My boolit will still be tough enough to still go right through it even with the softer alloy.

[waksupi]

I doubt the bullet was too hard. A high hit, and they will many times bleed out internally without loosing blood. Flat noses will definitely help.

[Tripplebeards]

I did some googling on pure, soft cast lead bullets and 44 mag. Not a lot info ran into yet but there was a poster that powder coated and gas check them and ran them at 1300 ft./s with no leading. He claimed shooting them through 4 x 4 posts would blow the whole backside of the posts away when exiting VS just poking a bullet size exit hole out the back with his hard cast. I kind of had a similar experience shooting through 55 gallon oil drums with my 7.5 BH versus 15.4 BH alloy. The softer Alloy made some good size exit holes peeling the metal back on the exit holes vs The harder alloy never expanded and poked a boolit sized exit hole right through it. I definitely will be trying pure lead next year(my stuff I have here is lead flooring at 5BH so close enough) for an experiment and a hollow point out of my 7744 on a deer to see how big of an exit hole and blood trail it gives me. If I still get hundred yard runners with no blood I will be switching to a faster caliber.

Imo I also think a bullet traveling under a 2500 ft./s isn’t going to transfer a lot of energy to instantly kill an animal most the time so most will travel if not hit in the CNS. I’m hoping To prove myself wrong with soft boolits this year. I plan on taking the same heart and lung shots and not aiming for the head,neck,or shoulder and see what kind of reaction I get versus last year.

[WinchesterM1]

I sent my lee 310 6cavity off to get Flat based and I powder coat and cast to about 9-10bhn over 21.5 grn of w296 it’s a HOT load but I have killed a bunch of deer with it in my 20” Rossi lever gun

This buck woke me up out of a dead sleep in my blind how rude! So I had to shoot him in self defense

251567

He ran maybe 15 yards and dropped, my flat base 310 just hammers anything it comes across, and it cycles and shoots great in my Rossi and shoots great out of my Ruger SBH

[Tripplebeards]

I sent my lee 310 6cavity off to get Flat based and I powder coat and cast to about 9-10bhn over 21.5 grn of w296 it’s a HOT load but I have killed a bunch of deer with it in my 20” Rossi lever gun

This buck woke me up out of a dead sleep in my blind how rude! So I had to shoot him in self defense

251567

He ran maybe 15 yards and dropped, my flat base 310 just hammers anything it comes across, and it cycles and shoots great in my Rossi and shoots great out of my Ruger SBH

Curious where your shot placement was on the deer. The more I read it seems if it’s a head on shot in the chest it seems like deer either drop or don’t go far but on a broadside heart and lung shot the bets are off.

Seems like the majority of the deer that get shot with 44 mags whether a rifle or pistol from what I’ve read don’t bleed and run after the shot making a challenging recovery.

[WinchesterM1]

I stopped shooting deer in the head, I think they stink to much. I shoot just below the head on the neck or in the vitals just above the shoulders under the back strap. This deer was shot behind the shoulders. I put another round in him because he was thrashing around and I hate seeing deer suffer like that I would rather waste a little meat then to watch them suffer

[bmortell]

I cant believe theres something about 44 mag rifle that makes it not good for deer. every deer me and my dad shot with flintlocks went down very fast and weight and speed specs are close. this year ill likely get my first with my 44 rifle using 300gr wfn at 1500 with 20-1 nose and hard base. im just thinking we should go heavy soft and wide with our 44s and all should go well but ill see in about 10 days

[444ttd]

Curious where your shot placement was on the deer. The more I read it seems if it’s a head on shot in the chest it seems like deer either drop or don’t go far but on a broadside heart and lung shot the bets are off.

Seems like the majority of the deer that get shot with 44 mags whether a rifle or pistol from what I’ve read don’t bleed and run after the shot making a challenging recovery.

the 44 spl(ruger sbh with 4 5/8" barrel) and 250gr penta hp(8 bhn) and unique failed to penetrate deer. i shot 3 or 4 of them about 20-35 yards and they run about 40-50 yards and there was no blood. i then go to a 255gr keith(12 bhn or 10 lead .5 tin) and unique and penetration is complete. they were also 20-35 yards away and they run about 40-50 yards and there WAS blood. all deer were shot in the CHEST, a double lunger.

i have a 44 mag load with 280gr wfn gc(MBW claims 22bhn) and unique, but i haven't shot a deer.

to date, while using my 444 marlin i have killed deer with(12 bhn)....

275gr ranch dog 2000-2300fps
280gr lfn gc 2000fps
280gr wfn gc 2000fps
they all did penetrate thru-n-thru but the meat was bloodshot. except for 1 doe, it was head on and i did destroy the backstraps, it was a spine shot:(

300gr fn gc 1624fps
it penetrates thru-n-thru and i can eat up to the hole

all of deer HAD a bloodtrail and they didn't go far(drt most of them).

[kycrawler]

12 bhn range. Just mixed scrap lead and range scrap. Lubed with bullshop lotak they run 1150 out of my 7.5 inch Redhawk. And they shoot well out of a 20 inch stainless r92 Rossi but I haven't chronoed them out of the rifle . I've had good results out of the Lee 240 swc also ,shot out of a handi rifle

[chaos]

I doubt the bullet was too hard. A high hit, and they will many times bleed out internally without loosing blood. Flat noses will definitely help.



^^^^^ This. I have taken boat loads of game with RCBS 44-240-SWC. Its a gas checked slug with a smaller mwplat than most would like. WDWW. You hit em high and they will drown in blood before it runs out the hole.
I took to shooting them on the shoulder as 44man suggested to me years back and they leave blood that Ray Charles could follow. You MUST hit some bone

I originally loaded this boolit for a marlin 94, but ended up as my go to slug for the Super Blackhawks as its darn accurate.

[RU shooter]

Not with what you shootem but where . Hit in the lungs behind the shoulder their gonna run some don't matter if it's a cast bullet name your caliber or a 300 mag with jacketed at 3500 fps wanna drop em break the shoulder and the do the bulldozer or high shoulder or neck and clip the spine

[Tripplebeards]

Well if that’s the case I’m gonna start breaking shoulders with my 77/44 and see what happens. Last year I had a bunch of blood shot meat if you check out my old post and I never hit the shoulder. I’m sure it’s even going to be messier but if it puts it down on the spot or within sight I’m all for it.

[murf205]

Well if that’s the case I’m gonna start breaking shoulders with my 77/44 and see what happens. Last year I had a bunch of blood shot meat if you check out my old post and I never hit the shoulder. I’m sure it’s even going to be messier but if it puts it down on the spot or within sight I’m all for it.

That's better than your "neighbor" claiming it!

[murf205]

I sent my lee 310 6cavity off to get Flat based and I powder coat and cast to about 9-10bhn over 21.5 grn of w296 it’s a HOT load but I have killed a bunch of deer with it in my 20” Rossi lever gun

This buck woke me up out of a dead sleep in my blind how rude! So I had to shoot him in self defense

251567

He ran maybe 15 yards and dropped, my flat base 310 just hammers anything it comes across, and it cycles and shoots great in my Rossi and shoots great out of my Ruger SBH

Where did you send that Lee mold to get it flat based? I want one of those. I would like to buy another 310 mold anyway. Mine has about the most shallow crimp groove I've seen. Do you have a pic of your boolits cast from that mold?

[Tripplebeards]

That's better than your "neighbor" claiming it!


I was all excited this weekend for opening deer season as I didn’t see my neighbors or hear them shoot at all. The only wooded land that they have on their property is border in mine and it’s about a 75 yd. quare. They must’ve got the hint after I posted my property... Along with The deer as I saw zero During legal shooting hour on opening day. Very weird this is never happened to me. I had one right under neath me at 6:10a.m. And bumped one coming out 10 minutes after closing that was standing out in the open field by my hunting shack which is on the opposite side of my property. I figured I’d sit the shack Sunday afternoon since it forecasted rain. But first I Sat from pitch dark until noon today on the other end of my property again in my tree stand first and saw nothing again. I then took a nap & went out to sat in my shack at 2:30pm. I had three doe that we’re bedding right in the open 90 yards away from me get up at 3 o’clock. I waited to see if there was a buck for five minutes before I shot and took the biggest doe around a 110 yards After procrastinating to the last second to see if there was a buck while it was trotting with a 35 Rem J word 180 grain hot-core I loaded a little “hot”. I did lead enough and hit it a little far back on trail end of its lungs and blew apart the liver. The doe ran 20 yards did a U-turn and came back directly where I hit it but 20 yards farther up the hill and fell over. Three minutes later the other two does came back with a good size buck following it. He was a good 130 yards away on a slow walk nose down going up the hill following the does. I fired a Hail Mary through the brush and dumped it! The buck maybe took about three steps and turned around and fell over. Took out both of his lungs. Never shot a deer with a 35 Remington before... I think it’s time to try cast in it now.

[nagantguy]

Great buck Yooper- I didn’t get up to Iron Mountain to hunt at all this year or last; but I’ve been hearing about good buck numbers and it’s actually been colder downstate where I’m at now than over the bridge. Good shooting .

[Ramjet-SS]

WFN and push them hard and fast. Exit holes are huge and the internal damage is fantastic. LBT molds are what I a, going back too his design has proven itself time and time again. Run the speed up on this WFN or LFN get the “splash” effect up to its max.

[Yooper003]

Great buck Yooper- I didn’t get up to Iron Mountain to hunt at all this year or last; but I’ve been hearing about good buck numbers and it’s actually been colder downstate where I’m at now than over the bridge. Good shooting .

Thanks Guy, it really was a pretty good buck, I later put the tape on him & he measured 15 1/2 inside. I also killed another 8 pet. This last fri. Not guide as good, little over 12" inside. Shot this last with 357 mag. Henry SS. Not happy with that gun. Did not make the best shot & needed a finisher. Probably should have tried the 45/70. Funny thing, the 15 1/2 was just a 2 1/2, the 12 was 3 1/2.

[Yooper003]

Great buck Yooper- I didn’t get up to Iron Mountain to hunt at all this year or last; but I’ve been hearing about good buck numbers and it’s actually been colder downstate where I’m at now than over the bridge. Good shooting .
Thanks Guy, I later measured that buck & he was 15 1/5 inside, I killed a second 8 other. This last fri. he was a little over 12"" inside.shot the last with 357 mag. Henry SS. Not real happy with that cal. Needed a finisher. Probably should have used the 45/70. Funny thing the 15 1/2 was just 2 1/2 yr. the smaller rack was a 3 1/2.