What do I use to flair rifle cases for cast?

[Tripplebeards]

Yeah I know it’s a dumb question but I’ve been casting for two years now only in straight wall pistol ammo and my pistol dies have always comes with a flair die. Well I want to load up some 35 Whelan and 35 Remington and was just about to start reloading them and thought how am I going to expand my .358 case necks? I would assume I can’t use my 44 caliber of 45 caliber expander dies. I do on a Lee factory crimp Collett die to squeeze it back down after my boolit is seated..

[brewer12345]

You can get Lyman M dies in your caliber or Lee sells and inexpensive universal flare die.

[RKJ]

Lee makes a "Universal expanding die" which I use. I see it on Amazon for $14.98. It works pretty well and simple.

[txbirdman]

Needle nose plyers

[Tripplebeards]

Thanks I just ordered a lee off of eBay for $16.91 shipped. Amazon will jam me for shipping if I don’t spend 25 bucks. Guess I’m dead in the water till it shows up ... Or try the needle nose pliers trick.lol

[Wheelgun]

I use the Lee universal expander and/or the NOE expander plugs.

[Tripplebeards]

I was going to ask if I have to crimp as well... I knew the answer since the case was being flared and it has to pushed back flush. I have a 35 Remington factory crimp Collett die. I’m guessing it will work for the Whelen as well?

[GregLaROCHE]

You may want to look into NOE’s expanders in the future. They aren’t expensive and will fit in the Lee expander tool. They give you more options on how the case is expanded.

[Tom W.]

I bought one by RCBS from Midway years ago that I use to flare my 30/30 and 30-06....

[Tripplebeards]

35 rem Collett die will not work. I stuck a load of 35 whelen case in it and the neck goes way above the collet.

[Pablo 5959]

The NOE expander plug in the Lee universal die is the ticket for me.

[megasupermagnum]

You can't use the 35 Remington collet crimp die on the 35 whelen. If you had someone make you just the right length spacer ring you could, but it's much easier to just get the right crimp die. I've never personally tried, but if you are looking for a quick and dirty solution, try a 9mm taper crimp die.

As for the expanders, the NOE expander do work. They are anything but the holy grail, but there is no other solution currently out there if you want to fine tune down to the .001. In rifles you have other options as well like bushing sizing dies, and different mandrels for the Lee neck sizing die. In 308 Winchester I use the Lee neck sizing die with a mandrel that sizes the neck ID to around .309", then just put a tiny bit of flare with the Lee universal expander die. If it wasn't for having to full size once in a while, I would say it's easier than a straight wall cartridge.

[GhostHawk]

I started with a center punch and a light tap with a small hammer. Voila, flared neck. Did not take me long to get the universal flaring tool from Lee.

I wish it was an option with every set of dies to get a powder through expanding die. Some I'd pay for it, some I would not. But I love them in my pistol calibers which have them.

[quilbilly]

I use the tip of an old knife sharpening steel acquired at a garage sale for 50 cents. It is perfectly round and flares anything from 7mm to 40 caliber plus nicely cleans the brass. The large wood handle makes it easy and comfortable on arthritic hands. I use an old Navy boatswain mate's marlin spike for 22 through 7mm caliber but the sharp point means you have to pay attention or you will put holes in your finger.

[wills]

Lyman M dies

https://www.lymanproducts.com/rifle-neck-expanding-m-dies

"(Three-Die Sets, Neck-Expanding “M” Die—See other side forMulti-Expand/Powder Charge Die; Used in Four-Die Sets)The Lyman Neck-Expanding “M”die expands and flares case mouths to facilitate bullet seating. It is included in all three-die sets and maybe purchased separately for most cartridges. Cast bullet reloaders should use this die to prevent “shaving” of bullet metal during the seating operation"

https://www.lymanproducts.com/media/catalog/product/a/l/all_rifle_2_die_sets.pdf

[smoked turkey]

I really like Lyman M dies for flaring brass to allow seating a cast boolit prior to sending it home in the sizer die. However the expander ball in most die sets is set for j-words bullets and not cast. This is especially true when using say a sized .311 cast boolit for your 308 Winchester. the expander ball is now way undersized for seating that .311 boolit. The Lyman M die also expands the case neck just before it makes the small funnel shaped flair for cast boolit seating without shaving the boolit in a too small case neck. Unfortunately the Lyman products are very limited in what is offered for seating the great variety of cast boolits we use. I highly recommend the NOE expander plugs for use in the Lee neck sizing die. Al offers a large array of different sizing plugs and I can't satisfactorily seat cast boolits without them. I highly recommend them to anyone seating cast boolits.

[JM7.7x58]

Just another vote for the NOE expander plugs. Works great for me. They make odd sizes, and I needed an odd size to seat my .318” sized pills.

JM

[Texas by God]

I just chamfer the inside of the neck. But PM me, I've got an old Lee flaring tool in 35 cal. if you want it.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[phantom22]

So I've run into this issue loading for my 45-70 and 30 caliber rifles. However I had a solution in my shop already. I have the lee die sets for 45acp and 30 carbine. I can use the 45acp expand through powder die to flare my 45-70. I take the expander insert out of the carbine expand through powder die and put it in the 45acp die to use on my 30-06. Just don't rush it and make sure the neck goes into the expander or it can crush the case mouth if misaligned.

[Screwbolts]

another vote for the NOE type expanded for the LEE universal Die.

[RU shooter]

If you already have a 38/357 die set you can use the belling die if you can adjust it up high enough

[waksupi]

I use my Toolman needle nose to stick in a case mouth and give it a twist.

[calm seas]

What RU Shooter said...I had a spare set of .357 dies, set the expander to do my 35-338 brass

[cwlongshot]

I agree the Lyman M-DIE is THE CAST BULLET shooters best friend!!

Proper and consistent neck tension is THE MOST IMPORTANT part of your reload.

CW

[Muddydogs]

Both the Lee universal and a caliber specific M die are nice to have around. I keep the Lee die around for stuff I don't load much of or if I want to try something new but once I get into casting for a caliber the M die is nice to have so it can be set up and left for the right amount of flair. I've used the Lee die on the progressive press to get a little flair on a case mouth to help set flat base bullets when using a bullet feeder as well.

[Aunegl]

Lyman M dies works for me.

[EMC45]

I too used a pair of needle-nose pliers (press in and turn) and a self-centering Starret punch (used the tapered portion bumped into the case mouth).

I learned quickly that the Lee Universal expander die was the way to go. I know there are others on the market, but the Lee has done everything I have needed.

[joe leadslinger]

Can't go wrong with the Lee Universal expanding die along with NOE Expanders.

[Wild Bill 7]

I used a tapered punch also before I bought the Lee flair die.

[dondiego]

I have used a .50 BMG bullet to good effect. The core of an armor piercing BMG bullet is also a good prick punch.

[osteodoc08]

I’ve always used Lyman M dies when needed.

[Ed_Shot]

I agree the Lyman M-DIE is THE CAST BULLET shooters best friend!!

Proper and consistent neck tension is THE MOST IMPORTANT part of your reload.

CW

+1 for Lyman M Dies.

[Alferd Packer]

Use a 223 case
Maybe a steel one if you like, but a brass one should work for 35 cal.A 243 or 6mm case will work too. A round center punch.

[Conditor22]

I also use the Lee universal expander with the NOE expander plugs. You can tailor the case necks to get just the right tension without downsizing the boolit.

[44magLeo]

The Lee Universal Expander opens the mouth to a funnel shape. You need to adjust carefully so as not to over expand. If you over do it the case mouth gets to big to fit up into the seating die and can crumple the case mouth.
The Lyman M dies has a long expander section that has a step in it. The smaller diameter should be about .001 smaller than the bullet, After the step it should be about .001 over bullet diameter.
When you expand with the M die You adjust the expander to enter the case far enough so the step enters the case mouth about 1/32 in. This lets you set the base of the bullet down into the case.
The 1/32 in of the neck is larger than the bullet so it can't shave lead off the bullet.
You don't really need to use a crimp die to remove this .001 expanded area unless you want to or need to.
The NOE expander plugs are set up like the Lyman M expander but fit in the Lee Universal expander die.
You can use one body then have expanders to fit all your cartridges.
I have the Lee UE die with NOE plugs. The NOE plugs aren't expensive so having a selection of sizes for caliber gives you options.
Like If you have several 30 cals but they need different dia. cast.
I also like the M style expanders for doing jacketed bullets too. The step help start the bullets straighter.
I also like the Lee collet Factory Crimp dies. You can get a good heavy crimp with out risking crushed cases.
The 44 Mag lee dies I have came with the carbide FCD. I found it ok for jacketed bullets. In my Marlin 1894 44 Mag cast bullets need to be .432-.433 for best accuracy. The carbide FCD has the carbide ring that sizes the case after the bullet is seated. This squeezes the case enough to size the cast bullet down to small the shoot well.
I bought the Collect crimp die for the 44 and it don't squeeze the cast bullets down.
I like the Collet FCD's because if I don't seat a bullet to the crimp groove it has enough power to crimp into even a jacketed bullet where there is no crimp groove.
Leo

[robg]

Lee expander is a good tool ,cheap enough for me.

[Murphy]

The NOE expander plug in the Lee universal die is the ticket for me.


I have to agree with Pablo. Order the LEE Universal Expander and go with NOE's expanders later if the need arises. But that's just my 2¢ worth.

Murphy

[Petander]

To flare is one thing,to expand is another. Everything else being the same,expanding necks can make or break a load.

Lyman M-die is a solid & simple solution as long as it's large enough for your particular bullet. A large,soft bullet likes more expansion than a smaller dia hard cast.

It's possible to flare too much,sometimes a seater die size/plug shape start seating crooked and you get shaving even with a well visible "trumpet" flare. With M die you can easily adjust flare just right,expansion staying the same. Otherwise excellent Hornady seaters can be tight and the sleeve interferes with the flare. Ease up on the M flare part just a tad.

NOE plugs (with Lee die) work the same plus you have many size options. Buy a few adjacent sizes. Practical when testing different bullet diameters.

Amongst other mistakes,I overlooked proper expansion when I started out. Proper neck tension without swaging or shaving the bullet just makes life so good

[Mr Peabody]

I used a center punch out of my tool box for quite awhile, the taper on the shank flared the case just right. And I didn't have to spend any money!

[s mac]

Haven't used the NOE tools, I have used Lyman's M dies, I got started using RCBS expander dies, seem you can buy any size I've looked for, pretty reasonable, have a nice variety.

[lightman]

I use a Lyman "M" die for the few rifle cases that I shoot cast bullets in.

[toallmy]

I have switched over from Lyman m dies to noe expander dies because - I had to have custom plugs made for the m dies to load slightly larger cast boolits .

[trapper9260]

For just about all my reloading I use the Lyman M die.the Lyman 30 cal M die they have 2 a short and long one .I got the long one many years ago and use it on 30-06,308 win ,30-30 It all works for me .The 32 cals I use the one that Hornady had in the die set .

[charlie b]

I cheated :)

I load on a Lee Loadmaster progressive. When loading for my .308 I ran out of die stations to size, prime, expand, charge, seat and crimp. Lee makes a charge die that works well, but, does not expand. But, they do make powder through expansion dies for pistol cartridges. Just an expansion die that is hollow. I happened to have loading dies for the .30 Mauser.

So, I took the normal insert out of the rifle size charge die and substituted the hollow expander from the Mauser. It works great and now I expand the neck and charge the case at one station.

FWIW, I neck size with the Lee collet die and I 'crimp' with the Lee factory crimp die (also a collet type). Only enough crimp to remove the flare.

I guess you could write to Lee and see if they sell the expander separately.

[rintinglen]

The NOE expander plug in the Lee universal die is the ticket for me.

What he said!

[kavemankel]

I use a lee universal expander, no issues and cheap...

[Jruby38]

Put the cases in a loading block and go up and down the rows with large prick punch. I can expand 50 in about a minute.

[fcvan]

Wow, when I started loading cast for rifle, I chamfered the inside of the case mouth and simply seat the boolit. It prevents the case mouth from shaving the boolit. The chamfer works with GC and PB PC boolits. The expander ball seemed to do it's job nicely and the neck tension is firm. I started by seating, the pulling to make sure I wasn't swaging the boolit during the seating process. So far I have loaded , .223, 30-30, .308, and 30-06 just by putting that little bevel in the case mouth opening.

When I load pistol cartridges, I only flare enough for the boolit to center in the case mouth. It works for me, YMMV

[KCSO]

I've used a dummy 50 calibre cartridge since about 1970 and it still works.