Colt 1903 hammer 38 acp

[Battis]

I saw an interesting gun at the store last night, a Colt 1903 38 acp (with hammer). Beautiful finish - at first, I wondered if it had been refinished but it has that great Colt blue. It has a barrel wedge near the muzzle, no safety, no slide lock.
Anyone have any experience with this gun?

[charlie b]

Kinda rare.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_Model_1903_Pocket_Hammer

[rintinglen]

These were one of the first "compact" pistols, being a reduced length version of the Colt 1900 and 1902 pistols. It was the most popular of the early colt hammer semi-autos, with just over--or just under-- 31,000 made (depending on which source you care to believe.) As you note, there is no safety, and they were chambered in the 38 ACP round. As a safety note, they will chamber 38 Super ammunition, but to fire one could be very dangerous. the 38 ACP was designed for a pressure of ~20,000 PSI and the 38 super SAAMI MAP runs 36,000 PSI. Reloading data is available in some of the older Lyman manuals, IIRC the 39th and 40th both have data for Bullseye and Unique powders.

I have handled several, but never fired one. I did shoot a 1902 some years ago, but other than the fact it went bang, and did not stutter through one magazine of 7 rounds, I can't say much about it. A more awkward feeling pistol I can not recall handling.

[Battis]

I gotta stop going to that store. That 1903 Colt jumped out at me. The finish is amazing. They have a case where they keep the vintage guns, and most of them are usually C&R eligible, or antiques. I put it on hold for a week to research it.

[Petrol & Powder]

The Colt 1903 Hammer is squarely in the collectors realm. An unmolested 1903 that is mechanically sound probably belongs in a museum.

If the finish is too good to be true, be wary; that could be a re-finish. The original Colt bluing was amazing but an approximately 100 year old pistol with its original finish would be rare.

Also, that wedge near the muzzle is the only thing that retains the slide. If that part breaks the slide will come off the rear of the frame (and generally into the shooter's face). So, I would never shoot one of those pistols until I was certain that it was mechanically sound and assembled correctly. In fact, if it was a near mint condition real 1903,.........I probably wouldn't shoot it at all.

[Battis]

I'm going to check it out again. The finish is really good but it doesn't look like a refinish. I have other handguns that were refinished and they look great, but not original. I'd have no problem not shooting it, though it'd be tempting.

[Petrol & Powder]

Caveat Emptor

[fatelk]

I had one of these many years ago, one gun I wish I hadn't let get away from me.

25+ years ago, I bought it from an old-timer in town. I was young and dumb. It came with a box of the correct ammo, but after just a few rounds it broke. A leg broke off the flat spring. I couldn't find a replacement and didn't know how to make one back then. I ended up selling it way too cheap.

It's a neat old gun. I remember being fascinated by the one I had, for the short time I had it.

[Battis]

They are great old guns. I can get this one for $600. If it is mechanically sound and had a reblue done at some time, that's cool - it'll be a good shooter. If it's worth more, then I'll probably baby it and not shoot it. I'll check it out more tomorrow. There's a few on GB and some of them have quite a few bids with several days left.

[Battis]

I went back for another look at the Colt, armed with more knowledge, especially concerning refinishing. It's definitely been reblued but it was a good job. The gun is clean, tight, well cared for, but I walked away.

[reddog81]

For a good refinish a price of $600 is probably about right. They are relatively rare guns but nothing too special other than being a really old Colt. I've got one in good condition with hints of the old fire blueing on the screws and trigger. If they are something that interests you $600 is probably as good a deal you'll find without lots of searching. There are quite a few examples out there with minimal wear if you want to spend twice that much. I'm guessing the fact that the round never really took off helped keep them from being shot a lot.

Mine has a real heavy trigger and the few times I've shot it the accuracy was disappointing for a gun that cost me $1,200...

[Petrol & Powder]

I went back for another look at the Colt, armed with more knowledge, especially concerning refinishing. It's definitely been reblued but it was a good job. The gun is clean, tight, well cared for, but I walked away.

I think you made a wise choice.

[Battis]

It's a nice gun but it has some quirks (wedge, no safety, no slide lock). If I was looking for one specifically, I'd get it. I have the dies and brass for my Astra 9mm Largo, but that's a lot of money to tie up.
Anyways, thanks for the tips and info.

[smkummer]

I have one. Correct data will shoot a 130 bullet at 1050-1100 FPS. About the same power as a standard 9mm. Very sweet shooting old colt and a wonderful example Browning’s work.

[Drm50]

I had one back in 80s and never shot it because it was broke and missing parts. I did get 3 boxes of Win 38acp with it which I still have. Ammo looks to be from 1960s. I sold gun to a guy that wanted it for parts. I'm sure 3 boxes of ammo is worth more than I had in the whole deal at the time. I think the 38acp Colts take a beating from people shooting 38Super in them. I have shot 38Super in a Spanish Destroyer carbine with no signs of excessive pressure. I didn't fire 38Super in Star or Astra pistols for two reasons. Didn't think they would handle the recoil without going metal to metal and rims on 38Super is thicker than 9mm Largo and would stress the extractors. I did turn 38Super brass to thin rims and reload to Largo specs.

[Battis]

I went back to the store with a gift certificate and a 10% store coupon, which lowered the price quite a bit. And, in a moment of weakness, I bought the gun. I'll get some pics of it.

[Battis]

A calculated impulse buy

[onelight]

Very nice.

[reddog81]

If you're looking for load data, I used the 38 Super starting loads in my Lyman manuals as a good reference point. The vast majority of their starting loads are within the 38 ACP pressure range.

[Battis]

I had planned on using 9mm Largo brass but it's rimless, so I ordered some 38 Super from Midway (they didn't have any 38 ACP). I'm thinking 3 grs of Bullseye for a 125 - 130 gr bullet to start.

[reddog81]

3 grs of Bullseye will be a light load and might not cycle the slide but it'll be enough to get the bullet out of the barrel. Probably a good load to test out the gun.

[fatelk]

I have some old .38 Auto brass around somewhere, and a bunch of 38 Super. I've been planning on putting it up for sale but just haven't gotten around to it yet.

[Battis]

I was going to do a Want To Buy on this forum, but I ordered some 38 Super from Midway. Graf has the 38 ACP but they won't ship to my state. The Midway brass was around $.20 per case. I think the Graf 38 ACP is around the same.

[Drm50]

I don't have any 38acp empty brass to compare but isn't 38Super the same brass?

[Battis]

From what I read, the 38 Super is a lot stronger but dimensionally they're the same.

[fatelk]

My understanding is the same. I don't see any problem with using Super brass and just loading it light.

[leadeye]

Good guns, I shoot mine off and on.

[Baltimoreed]

I have handled several, but never fired one. I did shoot a 1902 some years ago, but other than the fact it went bang, and did not stutter through one magazine of 7 rounds, I can't say much about it. A more awkward feeling pistol I can not recall handling.[/QUOTE]

Try a 9mm Astra 400 for awkward.

[rintinglen]

I have handled several, but never fired one. I did shoot a 1902 some years ago, but other than the fact it went bang, and did not stutter through one magazine of 7 rounds, I can't say much about it. A more awkward feeling pistol I can not recall handling.

Try a 9mm Astra 400 for awkward.[/QUOTE]
Add a couple inches of barrel and keep the same awkward 90 degree grip, and voila, you have the Colt 1902, though my recollection of the Astra was that it kicked harder. The shooting was conducted years apart, so I don’t trust my memory.

[Big Ben]

Nice Collection Leadeye!