Progressive presses

[Mousehouse]

1hole got me thinking about progressive presses again when I was looking at going to a turret press for a third press.

I use to have a Dillon 650 years ago but sold it because it was collecting dust and I got burned out on shooting and everything related to it.

I am wanting to look at all of my options and would love some feedback on what people of this board are using. Pros and cons on the progressive reloaders you are using and why you decided on that brand.

Dillon
Hornady
Lee
RCBS
etc.

I am liking the Hornady at the moment. But Dillon has the 750.

Comments, thoughts?

[XDROB]

I like the Hornady. Because that w ad d the only press available. It was one week after Sandy Hook and the reloading section looked like the bread aisle before a winter storm. Luckily I grabed it before another guy who stopped to talk to his wife. I do not have any experience with any other presses. But I'm totally satisfied with the LnL progressive Hornady. It has done well for me. I load for pistol only. Any problems I have had and most of them were my fault. Hornady has taken care of me. Even when I told them it was my fault. There was no hesitation to send me what I needed.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

[Winger Ed.]

Nobody makes a bad one that I know of.
There's good reason why Dillon has almost a cult following.

I recently got a Hornady after being out of shooting much in the last several years and replaced a Hornady ProJector I'd had.

I really really like the new AP. The LNL feature is the solution for a problem I don't have,
and is their competition for removable shell plates.

There's a guide rod thing for the primer station that was a little goofy, and slips out at the top,
but a drop of JB weld settled it right down.
The new powder station, a 5th die hole, and being able to take cases in & out at any station makes up for it.
For quality and price, it's hard to beat. I'd buy it again, or recommend it.

[JeepHammer]

Since you owned a 650 you know the difference between manual index and auto index.

I think the question for me would be who had issues with what.

I still own a Lee 'Turret' (tool head) which allow for ultra fast caliber changes, and seriously speed up loading.
I still partner these in manual mode with my self indexing progressive presses to bend brass back into shape, tear down rounds that aren't quite right, no 'Mystery Rounds' on the bench... Ever.

I also had two Lee Loadmasters, one of which I beat off the bench with a hammer, the other is in the recycle bin, no amount of tinkering & tuning would make them run for very long, and the amount of quality culls they produced made them somewhere between useless and dangerous.

I don't care much about brand or 'color', what works simply works.
Dillion works out of the box. (Or they make it right)
With some tuning they work quite well.
Something better comes along I'd be glad to recommend it.

[Mousehouse]

I still have a use the first press my father and I bought when I was 10. 42 years and thousands of rounds of ammo loaded on a single stage Pacific. Still works great and I still use it from time to time. I am leaning towards trying the Hornady AP setup this time.

I noticed Dillon doesn't sell a 650 anymore. What did they change or add to the 750?

[rbt5050]

I like Dillon first and Hornady second. I had all most all these press in my life time, and it is in how much you want to spend
the Dillon 750 looks like they changed the prime system , I sold my 650 because of the priming system. I was all set to buy the 750 then some one offered be a good price on a 1050 so that is what I have now.
I also have a lock a load that I like. the only problem I had was with the primer rod falling out. once I got it adjusted right It works find.
so I would go with Dillon first ,Hornady second.

[dverna]

Three important questions:

How much will you reload.
How many calibers will you want to load in quantity
How much time do you want to spend reloading.

IMHO, there is only one choice - Dillon - you just need to answer the three questions above to pick the machine(s) that suits you.

Cost is a secondary consideration. A cheap press that is slow and/or troublesome is no bargain if you are not interested in tinkering.

I have downsized and down to four metallic progressives. Two of each 550's and 1050's. I reload to shoot not the other way around. Speed and quality are my criteria YMMV. I do not get my jollies doing it. It is a chore to be completed as efficiently as possible.

You will get both the right and wrong advice/answers with the question you asked. Do you want advice from someone who shoots 3000 rounds a year in 8 calibers or 20,000 rounds a year in 4 calibers? Someone who loves reloading for 20 hours a week, or hates it and reloads 10 hours a month? The right answer for one is the wrong answer for another.

[Budzilla 19]

Dillon, still got my Dad’s old 450, one 550B, 2- SDB’s, but still have my RockChucker!!! Other than single stage, bench is all blue!!! Just my opinion cause it may not work for you in your situation. Good luck.



Oh, I forgot, I just added a new MEC single stage press. So far, so good.

[Petrol & Powder]

DILLON

I actually prefer the Dillon 550 because I like the manual index. I've used the 650 and the 1050 and despite the added features of those fine presses, the 550 is my choice. I keep threatening to get another 550 so that I can have one press set up for small primer and the other set for large, but I seldom have to load large primer cases and just load them in batches when I do load them.

Not only is the Dillon an outstanding machine but their service is second to none. The service alone is more than enough reason to go with the Dillon.

A friend had a Lee progressive that he used for years, it was total JUNK. Lee may have improve things but it doesn't matter, I wouldn't even consider a Lee progressive.
The Hornady has a little more open distribution network than the Dillon and frankly, that's their claim to fame.

The Dillon 1050 is essentially a commercial reloading machine and is suited for competition shooters that require massive amounts of ammo. It's overkill for most users.
The 650 (and now 750) adds auto index, more stations and a lot of bells and whistles but it costs a lot. It also requires that you dedicate to the toolhead for that press.

The 550 is the middle ground between the SDB with its proprietary dies and the 650 with all the bells and whistles.

There are some fine turret presses out there and they have their place but I don't consider a standard turret press to be a true progressive press.

[Kevin Rohrer]

This is the most-asked question on this site. A Search will yield lots and lots of answers.

[Green Frog]

Or you could just get a Star Universal... the new owner of the company is assembling and restoring them and there is no more well made progressive press in the world! Just sayin'...

Froggie

[M-Tecs]

Personally I am a Dillon fan. I love my 1050's, really like my 650's and I sold my 550's when the 650's came out. I never really liked the 550's due to the manual indexing. Three friends went with the Hornady AP and two have since sold them and went with the Dillon 650's. I do not know of anyone that owns a current RCBS progressive. Some of the past RCBS offerings lost them future customers.

[oldhenry]

I have a Dillon 550B & a 550C: one setup for small primers & the other for Large. I prefer manual advance (about 10 years ago I finally ceased having nightmares about auto advance...…. those nightmares were brought about by a Green Machine).
I have a Redding Ultra Mag that I now use only for de-priming since I'm now a handgun shooter only. I have a Lyman AA that I acquired for sentimental reasons: can't remember using it last.

Everyone likes something different. I have friends that have Dillon 650s & love them. I don't know anyone that has a Hornady progressive so I can't comment there

If I decide to add another progressive, it'd be another 550.

[Walter Laich]

as a cowboy shooter I shoot pistols loads
the SDB is fine for me. I have dedicated tool heads for each caliber and can change out shell plates in less than a minute--I actually timed myself since I have no life to speak of

I grew up with single stage presses but when it was time to buy my own press the SDB was the one I went with--now have 4 so I must be happy

[Dale53]

The best all around progressive press is the Dillon 550B. I have loaded well over 100,000 rounds of both match pistol and match rifle on mine. Dillon's NBS warranty is JUST THAT. I can recommend this without reservation! I have no personal connection with Dillon. Just a VERY satisfied customer!

Dale53

[Rcmaveric]

I am using the Lee Loadmaster and it works pretty well for me.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[375supermag]

Hi...
My son and I currently run two Hornady LnLs, one set up with small primer and the other set up for large primer. We have been cranking out ammunition by the thousands of rounds with no real problems. We also have a Dillon 550 that I am in the process of acquiring die sets so we can transition our large primer revolver loading over to the Dillon.
We still each have a RockChucker that we use at least weekly for load development and small batch loading.

At this point, I believe that Hornady makes a very good quality progressive press that functions very well.
I will need to run the Dillon for a while before I am ready to pronounce it the superior machine.

I did not buy it because I was displeased with the LnLs. I just got a good deal at an auction and I wanted to try a Dillon progressive press.

[tinsnips]

I have a Dillion 550 and a Hornaday LNL for pistols. I like both of them they work just fine unless I to something wrong. I use a coax for my rifle loads it works great also.

[Zingger]

I have owned my Dillon 550B for 2 years and they have been happy ones. I bought it via an online classified and was skeptical about the blue machine. It has since proved itself and loads a majority of the pistol rounds shot around here. I like the manual index, the auto would spook me a bit. If I had it to do again, I would do exactly the same. Dillon has been awesome to work with as well!

[DocSavage]

I load everything on my 650s except 45/70 and 40/65 any and all problems were corrected by Dillon with a phone call.

[sigep1764]

I loved my Dillon SDB until I wanted to reload bottleneck rifle rounds. I got a single stage for Christmas. I liked it and still use it, but sold the SDB and bought a Dillon 550C. OOH BABY, I have been I love since!

[retread]

I agree the Dillon 550 is a great machine. I have two of them. If you run across a Lee Pro 1000 at a good price, consider it for decapping pistol brass prior the wet tumbling. With a collator you can decap a lot of brass in a hurry. It will function as a loading tool but is finicky. If you are mechanically inclined and on a limited budget it will load ammo.

[jmorris]

Pros and cons on the progressive reloaders you are using and why you decided on that brand.

Dillon
Hornady
Lee
RCBS

I have or have had progressives from all of the above. I currently have at least one of all of the Dillon’s on my bench right now, except the 750. The 650 has the most reliable primer feed system out of any progressive and that’s the biggest change they made with the new 750 press, it has the primer system like the one used on the 550.

The Lee’s will be the cheapest but will require more from the user. The Hornady’s come with “free” bullets but are not as friendly when it comes to case feed. RCBS has their own case feed issues on the new ones. Dillon’s will set you back the most but there is a reason for that and they only go up in value, the longer you have them.

[HeavyMetal]

This is pretty loaded question with lots of answers!
I have a few progressive Press's: Two Dillion's, Two CH Auto Champions ( MK 4 & MK 5) Four PW 600's One Lee Pro 1000 and a Lee Breech Lock Pro.

Interestingly the Breech lock is the only press that I've bought new in about 35 or so years!

The reason was simple: Lee's Breech Lock Pro was, dollar for dollar, simple the best buy on the market.

Dillion's are very nice of course but they've gotten pricey in the last 15 years but with a very good warranty. Auto Champ's, like many other good press's, simply aren't made any more, the Lee Pro 1000 got regulated to a decapping press, seems to me they should have made this a Four station press ( which they did with the Breech lock Pro) and I consider the Loadmaster a dog that's way to complicated for what it does.

Dillion, Hornady, and RCBS make very nice Press's but in today's tight dollar tight budget world the Lee press is a unit that really should be given serious thought before hard earned money is parted with.

the same with out of "print" press's, if there the right price buy but those press's are some times not worth the asking price, at least not in a practical situation, to have one to just say you have one is a different matter all together!

So I post this not as a Pro Lee buyer ( yes they've had a lemon or two over the years) but more to point out, especially to new reloader's, that you can make excellent reloads without breaking the bank!

So this is written as food for thought, but remember: no matter what you buy,or spend, enjoy our hobby!

HM

[Walks]

I bought a Dillon 450 when they came out 35+yrs ago. Customer Service left a lot to be desired. Sold it to my Buddy. He blew up a Uberti SA and a 1866.
Sold him my old Mec 650. Blew up a Stoeger Rds 12ga. I loaded up to 5-6,000rds a year for about 25yrs on that Mec. Only bloopers were my little brother's jokes.

Ended up with Hornady Pro-Jector. 5 positions and I could load .30-06 without contorting my wrist/fingers.
And the cast iron/steel drum powder measure was A LOT BETTER then a cheap sliding aluminum bar.

Bought a Dillon SDB in .38Spl to load my Kids Cowboy Ammo. Used to dump/leak powder. Sent the whole thing back to Dillon. Got a new one. Seemed to lock up halfway through turning the shell plate. Gave up on Dillon.

Bought RCBS Piggyback 2, works great use it for all .32S&W to .32H&R and .32ACP, 9mm too.

The Hornady L-N-L is Fantastic. Works smooth .38Spl to .45Colt. And .223, .308 and .30-06 for the semi-auto's.

Have Zero interest in Auto case-feed, bullet feeders. Or any auto feature. Except the auto-index on my 2 presses. Neither has ever failed.

One thing about My using A Progressive Press.
I don't resize or prime on a Progressive. I can't prime because it exacerbates my tennis elbow. Only way to fix that is split my forearm open and strap the muscle down to the bone. And I figure if I have to decap, I might as well resize too. It adds in final case inspection.
Just the way I do it.

[dikman]

Might as well put in my 2c worth. I started off with a Lee Value Turret, it works well and I still use it for loading .44-40 (I've learned through experience that progressive presses can chew up the thin-walled cases in nothing flat!).
Next was a Pro1000, it worked fairly well but needed tweaking a fair bit. I bought a second one which I used for priming only, using the other one for powder/boolit seating. Priming was its weak point. I eventually sold one and use one purely for decapping/resizing .38sp.
Then came a Lee Loadmaster. When it's working it works well, but the priming system was unreliable and nothing I did would make it absolutely reliable.
Finally I bought a Dillon 650. I've modified it a bit but it's proven to be reliable and consistent (except when I get a primer in sideways, but that's my fault, not the machine's). Engineering-wise it's a very nice piece of equipment.

[Mike Kerr]

I enjoy reading replies on this thread topic. It must be the most asked question on the reloading forum. I have owned and/or still own Dillon presses, Lee presses, and RCBS presses. From old models to new models Dillon makes the best for the money when all things are considered. From top to bottom and old to new models Dillon presses are the best but Lee and RCBS have much to offer and I think they are also money well spent. Hornady presses (progressive only comment) almost caught me several times but they never won me over after personal review and experimentation with other reloader's equipment.

Since you had a Dillon 650 in the past you are familiar with the model and the company. Seems like your new interest in progressives will lead you to obvious conclusions. Lee now as before specializes in machinery which requires intense owner involvement the more complex their model is. They work but not without owner effort of a high order. RCBS progressives have a continuing history of problems that mystify me considering the overall excellence of their product line. Dillon machines are superior but Lee and RCBS product lines, down the line are, really quite competitive or superior
in many instances. My reloading choices are Dillon for progressive presses but what ever works best for every other item.


.

[drac0nic]

Used a 550 and a LNL AP in the progressive space. I thought the priming on the 550 was more robust than the LNL AP which seems finicky to me at least IME. The sliding up primer tube thing is annoying as all get out. I like the extra station but watch out for the powder measure popping up as it spins some times. They supposedly make a lock washer for it you can ask for. I need to. Didn't mind manual indexing as much as one would think and in some ways auto indexing is a headache.

My buddy has a 1050 set up as a Mark 7. Obviously that's a pretty hard core setup. He had problems with the primers that didn't seem to be insignificant. I think a setup like that has a very steep learning curve however. If you wanna crank ammo that's the way to do it though if you've got the wallet.

In terms of the Lee Pro 1Ks they are cheap and the people I've known with them seem to buy a few and set them up (and keep them set up for) one caliber combination. Just food for thought there as I've seen that more than once.

No experience on Lee Progressives, however I did like their Classic Turret save the indexing which kind of sucked IMO. I liked the press way better manually indexed.

Something else I would buy if you get the LNL AP is more of the adjusters for the powder measure. I have 3 I think for pistol caliber, it makes it where you can just slam in another caliber. I've been meaning to take a piece of delrin and see if I can do a fixed grain setup but haven't done it yet. I certainly should I could make em super cheap and just keep em with the dies as I need em.

[onelight]

1hole got me thinking about progressive presses again when I was looking at going to a turret press for a third press.

I use to have a Dillon 650 years ago but sold it because it was collecting dust and I got burned out on shooting and everything related to it.

I am wanting to look at all of my options and would love some feedback on what people of this board are using. Pros and cons on the progressive reloaders you are using and why you decided on that brand.

Dillon
Hornady
Lee
RCBS
etc.

I am liking the Hornady at the moment. But Dillon has the 750.

Comments, thoughts?
There are so many things to consider when recommending equipment it's hard to make a recommendation without more information .
If you shoot in competitions , rifle , pistol or both if you do is it bullseye or do you need 1000 rounds a week of 1 or 2 calibers ?
Or do you want to load for 15 or 20 or more calibers in more modest quantities for basically fun shooting ?
Do you want to invest hundreds or thousands in the equipment .
We have a great selection of equipment to choose from and different combinations work well for different people . We have so many choices because we have different priorities .

[lotech]

Being a slow learner, it took four progressive machines over many years to realize that my 1960s Texan Turret press was adequate for my handgun cartridge loading needs. I probably shoot no more than 6 - 8 thousand rounds a year in 9mm, .38 Special , .44 Special, .45 ACP/ Auto Rim, and .45 Colt. If I shot a lot more than that, I'd probably use a progressive. A turret press may not be as fast, but the versatility for those that like to experiment with load development and load in small test batches and the cost, speed, and simplicity of changeover is unmatched by a progressive.

[onelight]

Being a slow learner, it took four progressive machines over many years to realize that my 1960s Texan Turret press was adequate for my handgun cartridge loading needs. I probably shoot no more than 6 - 8 thousand rounds a year in 9mm, .38 Special , .44 Special, .45 ACP/ Auto Rim, and .45 Colt. If I shot a lot more than that, I'd probably use a progressive. A turret press may not be as fast, but the versatility for those that like to experiment with load development and load in small test batches and the cost, speed, and simplicity of changeover is unmatched by a progressive.

We have similar appetites for ammunition I enjoy loading on my turret press much more than any of the progressives I have had , I load for a lot of different calibers and over all the turret is probably faster because set up takes seconds , I find it much more enjoyable .
I do still use a progressive but for calibers that I load 500 or more rounds at a time but watching 4 or more stations at a time is more like work than fun for me.

[Kenstone]

I have found that de-priming before running cases thru any progressives I own is what makes them run almost trouble free.
Doing this, before tumbling or not, keeps all the primer debris off the press and identifies the crimped primer cases to be dealt with before the progressive operation.
Many also prime cases before starting to load on progressives as a way to limit problems while loading.
Some purists consider this method as not true progressive loading and a short coming of the press in use, but I would modify the operation/sequence of any progressive to get better results, regardless of the brand.
That's the beauty of reloading, so many endless possibilities to do it your way...
:grin:
edit: checkout my new sig line :coffeecom

[dikman]

I have found that de-priming before running cases thru any progressives I own is what makes them run almost trouble free.
Doing this, before tumbling or not, keeps all the primer debris off the press

Exactly my thinking.:-) It's amazing how much crud builds up on the de-priming press.

[onelight]

Quote Originally Posted by Kenstone View Post
I have found that de-priming before running cases thru any progressives I own is what makes them run almost trouble free.
Doing this, before tumbling or not, keeps all the primer debris off the press

Exactly my thinking.:-) It's amazing how much crud builds up on the de-priming press.
Me to :wink: when I get 5 or 6 coffee cans of brass I have a depriming and brass cleaning session bag um up until ready to load them again. I do prefer to prime on the press for handgun ammo the two presses I use the most are the Lee classic turret and the auto breech lock pro they use the same system which after my learning curve works great and trouble free for me.
The LCT is also the cleanest press I have for the depriming job it captures 99% of the mess.

[abunaitoo]

I have a RCBS, Hollywood, Star, Dillon, and Lee.
I always seem to go back to the Lee Pro 1000.
Load 30 Carbine, .223, 45acp, 38spl, 9mm, on it.

[Muddydogs]

I just loaded a few 100 rounds last night on my Hornady AP after not using it for 8 or so months and I have to say it was quite boring. Been loading rifle rounds on the single stage press and was a little excited that I needed some .40 cal round so I could mess around with the AP press again. Took a few minutes to get the powder measure set for 4.5 grains of Unique, filled the 3D printed case feeder, loaded some Lee tumble lubed bullets in the bullet tube feeding the Mr Bullet Feeder die and dropped 100 primers in the feed tube. Sat down ready to get started, pulled the handle a couple times and before I knew it I was out of primers. Filled the primer tube, case and bullet feeder again and had another 100 rounds loaded. Guess its good that everything just runs smooth on the AP press but dang just setting there pulling the handle was kind of boring, got all excited when the bullet feeder die failed to feed a couple bullets but the next case into the die came out with a bullet so the only excitement I got was actually having to set a bullet on a couple cases.

[Ranger 7]

Started with Hornady 5 station progressive in 1982.
Up graded to the Lock & Load with the Great priming system and great E-Ject system.
No problems at all!
Would not consider changing!
Hornady has fantastic service/help line and stands behind their products 100%.

[kmw1954]

They have been mentioned but I guess I will honestly state that I load on a Lee Pro1000. This was the simplest press on the market until the ABLP was released. Use to be that pistol dies were sold in 3 die sets which would fill a Pro1000, and that is just the way I use it. Yes I prime on this press, yes I have a second shell plate carrier and have shell plates for 380, 9mm, 45acp and 38/357. With these shell plates I could also load 223 and 40S&W if I had one and bought dies. With the case feeder this is all the press I need to make more than I can use in a short amount of time.

[Mousehouse]

All great comments and thanks to everyone that has shared.

I don't know what I am going to do yet. I started on a Pacific single stage press (which I still have) 42 years ago when I was 10 years old. Lee and Dillons were next. Stopped reloaded 10 years ago after owning a gun shop and got burned out and didn't want to look at guns or reloading. Got everything moved into our new house a year of so ago and setup all of my loading stuff. Which got me thinking about loading and casting bullets again. I miss shooting, reloading and everything that comes along with it. Except the cleaning of all of the guns that were just shot. I have always hated that part.

So the big questions for me are as follows.
How much shooting am I planning on doing?
How much loading do I was to do and how fast?
How much time do I have to load?
Do I want to load in stages (deprime, prime then load at a later time)?
and the list goes on and on.

I guess if I can't figure out what I want to do I will have to buy a couple of presses. :)

[lightman]

I'm a loyal Dillon customer. Their presses work well without having to be tinkered with and you have that famous Dillon support if you ever need it. I kind of always wanted a Star, just because, but I doubt that I will ever get one.

[Wheelguns 1961]

Does anyone use the newer rcbs progressives? I am talking the 5 and 7 station ones

[pjh421]

I'd like to try out a 7 station RCBS. Maybe they've worked out the problems plaguing their early progressives. In my experience though, you simply can not go wrong with a Dillon. I wouldn't try to operate an ammo business with one but for home use I don't know of anything better.

[dverna]

Does anyone use the newer rcbs progressives? I am talking the 5 and 7 station ones

RCBS has a poor history on progressives. If you already had a Dillon, it might be worth a roll of the dice. I would not invest in one as my only progressive. I got burned so have little faith in them.

[tazman]

Sounds like the problems with progressive presses comes down to the priming system more than anything else.
I currently load on a Lee classic cast turret press and use the safety prime for priming on the press.
I don't have any need for a fully automated press. As long as it allows for all the functions needed to reload with each pull of the handle, I can place the cases and brass on it and index by hand if needed.
In that regard, my question is, which progressive press has the most bullet proof priming system?

[gruntbull]

I have owned a few different presses, currently have a 1050 - the only thing I dont like is the PRICE. But it is a solid contender. Coming from an Hornady LNL I am thankful for the primer system in the Dillon. I miss the inexpensive and small amount of time to swap to different cartridges, but the Dillon just makes great ammo in spec ALL THE TIME. Half my time on the hornady was trying to get the primer system to work - using plastic as an anchor for the cam was a serious disservice on the otherwise good machine. I retuned my cam to work better - changing the speed when the primer "puck" presented the primer to be pressed into the pocket helped a bit, but was still not 100% reliable. The hornady system is less expensive, makes good ammo, but I found I was tweaking it more than loading - kinda defeating the point.

TAZMAN - the price of the 1050 is a huge pill - but the priming system on it is NEAR BULLET PROOF. There is a pin that aligns the primer to be pressed before the ram inserts the primer ensuring the case and primer are in alignment before insertion. And it is adjustable for depth with ease - I like its system compared to Lee and Hornady process - only thing more bullet proof is doing it by hand.

[onelight]

Sounds like the problems with progressive presses comes down to the priming system more than anything else.
I currently load on a Lee classic cast turret press and use the safety prime for priming on the press.
I don't have any need for a fully automated press. As long as it allows for all the functions needed to reload with each pull of the handle, I can place the cases and brass on it and index by hand if needed.
In that regard, my question is, which progressive press has the most bullet proof priming system?
On the inexpensive end of the progressive scale is the Lee auto breech lock pro.
It uses the same priming system as the LCT which I like, very simple to set up and works just as designed , will run manual or auto index your choice. It will easily be 50 to 100% faster than the LCT even with no case feeder .
The only change I would like would be if it used the 4 hole turrets instead of the bushings.
It is the slowest of the Lee progressives but for me and I have had all the Lees and loaded a lot on them ,the ABLP is the simplest and my favorite of the Lees for the way I like to load. They are a bargain in my opinion . The LCT is still my favorite but it is nice to get a loaded round every pull of the handle when you want 500 or a thousand at a session . :-)

[Rockzilla]

Or you could just get a Star Universal... the new owner of the company is assembling and restoring them and there is no more well made progressive press in the world! Just sayin'...

Froggie

Yes sir on the Star, found one in 45acp great condition, auto-index, case feeder, and maybe one in 38 spl.

Have the whole gambit of progressives old Hornady Pro's, Projector's, LNL-AP's, Dillon 550, 650. Still looking
for a CH 444 -45acp setup. Started on old Rock Chuckers, that was my form of progressive one size, one seat,
prime off press, Old Lee autoprimes (round trays) everything in batches, still do with the prep part. Dillon 1050's,
Ammo bots would be nice but that's the difference between "wants", "needs". All presses have "quirks" no matter
what, all have fans, pro's and con's, what works for them and what doesn't. It can be just a preference, if you need
a rack of Ammo bots, Mark VII's, to support your amount of shooting is great.....

-Rock

[Kenstone]

Does anyone use the newer rcbs progressives? I am talking the 5 and 7 station ones

Why not start a new thread with this question...
Instead of hijacking this one :sad:
just askin'
:mrgreen:

[Valornor]

I have messed with a few progressive presses and I have been impressed with Dillion. I currently own a Dillion 550 which I load all of my pistol rounds on. I personally couldn’t be happier. I spend far less time trouble shooting problems and more time loading good Ammo.

I would love to get a second Dillion 550 to set up for rifle loading. I don’t shoot or load in high enough volumes to justify the more expensive or larger presses.

My experience with Dillion Progressive presses has spoiled me to the point where I really don’t entertain the idea of any other brand of progressive press.


Check out my website www.theballisticassistant.com

[pmer]

Sounds like the problems with progressive presses comes down to the priming system more than anything else.
I currently load on a Lee classic cast turret press and use the safety prime for priming on the press.
I don't have any need for a fully automated press. As long as it allows for all the functions needed to reload with each pull of the handle, I can place the cases and brass on it and index by hand if needed.
In that regard, my question is, which progressive press has the most bullet proof priming system?

I have a Hornaday LNL AP and it always functioned great. Standard dies, good control of cartridge OAL, nice normal powder measure(no sliding bar).

But had trouble with primer seating depth with primers not seating deep enough. It almost always picks up and presents primers as it should but I almost gave up on seating depth.
There is a spring around the tube for spent primers that is used as a bumper if you let go of the handle. It's supposed to ease the shock if the ram from hitting bottom. That spring was bottoming out and stopping the ram from lowering enough to seat the primer. Priming seems to go alot better now. Adjustable primer depth on the Dillion sounds like a good idea though.

Another good thing about the LNL AP is that priming and powder charging are case activated.

[drac0nic]

Sounds like the problems with progressive presses comes down to the priming system more than anything else.
I currently load on a Lee classic cast turret press and use the safety prime for priming on the press.
I don't have any need for a fully automated press. As long as it allows for all the functions needed to reload with each pull of the handle, I can place the cases and brass on it and index by hand if needed.
In that regard, my question is, which progressive press has the most bullet proof priming system?

If I was not going to own a proggy and had my choice in presses this would be very high on the list. The one I used was great they're well put together and super hard to beat for the money.

Also something I didn't mention was I thought both the Dillon and Hornady powder measures were excellent.

I agree with priming on the LNL being its weakness. There's a guy selling an alignment tool on ebay for the primer feed. Anyone tried it? I was thinking about making one on the lathe.

[drac0nic]

Sounds like the problems with progressive presses comes down to the priming system more than anything else.
I currently load on a Lee classic cast turret press and use the safety prime for priming on the press.
I don't have any need for a fully automated press. As long as it allows for all the functions needed to reload with each pull of the handle, I can place the cases and brass on it and index by hand if needed.
In that regard, my question is, which progressive press has the most bullet proof priming system?

If I was not going to own a proggy and had my choice in presses this would be very high on the list. The one I used was great they're well put together and super hard to beat for the money.

Also something I didn't mention was I thought both the Dillon and Hornady powder measures were both excellent based on my use of them.

[jmorris]

In that regard, my question is, which progressive press has the most bullet proof priming system?

The 650 has the most reliable primer feed system there is, the Pro 2000 is a close 2nd with new APS strips.

As far as over all priming systems go that would be the 1050. Unlike the others, there is a swage station that gets every primer pocket ready for a primer before hand, then the primer is set to the depth the operator adjusted with an Allen wrench. If they had the rotary feed system of the 650, they would be perfect.

To get that you would have to go with the Mark 7 Revolution but they are new enough to not yet have the test of time.

[curiousgeorge]

Dillon first. I have 3 550B machines. Simplicity, service, and durability. Also would never part with a Lee 3 hole turret. Can quickly load a few rounds of pistol or rifle with the fastest set up. Took the automatic turning rod off and just turn the head by hand. And I also have a Stsr Universal with 2 tool heads- one in 45 acp and the other in 38 special wadcutter. The 38 wadcutter head stays on the machine. And an RCBS piggyback which has never had anything but 44 mag run through it. Had the RCBS progressive when it first came out but did not care for the priming strips.
Back to the original question- Dillon 550B.
Steve

[onelight]

All great comments and thanks to everyone that has shared.

I don't know what I am going to do yet. I started on a Pacific single stage press (which I still have) 42 years ago when I was 10 years old. Lee and Dillons were next. Stopped reloaded 10 years ago after owning a gun shop and got burned out and didn't want to look at guns or reloading. Got everything moved into our new house a year of so ago and setup all of my loading stuff. Which got me thinking about loading and casting bullets again. I miss shooting, reloading and everything that comes along with it. Except the cleaning of all of the guns that were just shot. I have always hated that part.

So the big questions for me are as follows.
How much shooting am I planning on doing?
How much loading do I was to do and how fast?
How much time do I have to load?
Do I want to load in stages (deprime, prime then load at a later time)?
and the list goes on and on.

I guess if I can't figure out what I want to do I will have to buy a couple of presses. :)
[smilie=l: you have it figured out.
A suggestion that was not part of the question. Many here have a Lee Classic Turret in addition to a one hole single stage , they are so versatile for so many uses on the bench from case processing to loading small batches of multiple calibers , once set you have the turrets for calibers you use the most , you can change from one to the other in seconds including changing primer size and with out to big a rush give you 50 rounds in 20 minutes.
For progressives for me it would be the ABLP if I wasn't so cheap (I'd rather spend on guns and bullets ) I would go with a Dillon , a 550 would cost me $1000.00 to $1200 set up they way I would want ( new equipment ) with the service Dillon has , if I was not in a hurry I would look for used.

[drac0nic]

I agree on the "couple presses" in the long term. I at least one want one for small primer and one for large primer. I'd probably be happy doing another LNL AP if only because I could change parts between them.

[GWS]

The 650 has the most reliable primer feed system there is, the Pro 2000 is a close 2nd with new APS strips........

On the slight chance someone owning or finding a Pro2000 these days is looking on....."new" APS strips can stay new indefinitely....if you store them flat. Storing them vertically will warp them, then their incredible reliability falls. I love the system....beats hell out of the new Pro Chucker's tube system.

251091

[GWS]

I'd like to try out a 7 station RCBS. Maybe they've worked out the problems plaguing their early progressives. In my experience though, you simply can not go wrong with a Dillon. I wouldn't try to operate an ammo business with one but for home use I don't know of anything better.


I have a PC7, and like it, but it isn't ready for the masses. It's incedibly smooth....no powder jumping out of cases on rotation on this one. But it doesn't tolerate abuse in any form...don't force anything.....and the case feeder isn't reliable out of the box....you need to be a little "handy" for fixing their oversights with it. The basic design is great...it's just not finished and RBS doesn't seem to be in a hurry to perfect it.

The following video show how smooth it is.....at the end the ejection wire stopped it.....had to be adjusted just so....so I made a longer one by 1/8" and it suddenly became reliable.....typical. Not that hard to make it reliable...but you shouldn't have to.
https://vimeo.com/264698887
Next video shows the difference on 1/8" makes
https://vimeo.com/265311844

[shrapnel]

Take it from someone that doesn't reload because it is fun, but necessary. I don't like to reload, but I do like to shoot. I have 2 Dillon 650's a Dillon 550 and a RCBS Rockchucker and I can load anything but 22 LR. The Dillon 650 is without peer in it's price, diversity and dependability. If there was a better press, I would get it. It works and has worked for years and 10's of thousands of rounds.

Forget all the nuances of depriming first, flasholes, trimming and a host of other time wasting measures, get the Dillon and start cranking out good ammo fast...


http://i.imgur.com/UMfxxT8.jpg (https://imgur.com/UMfxxT8)

http://i.imgur.com/JtxKUuj.jpg (https://imgur.com/JtxKUuj)

http://i.imgur.com/w0aYMg4.jpg (https://imgur.com/w0aYMg4)

http://i.imgur.com/t6Lu98E.jpg (https://imgur.com/t6Lu98E)

[drac0nic]

That's a lot of Dillon progressives. You've only got 2 arms! :mrgreen:

Seriously though if I had that kind of shooting habit I'd be thinking about a Mark 7 or similar. There comes a point where it pays to "press up" although if I had a bridgeport I'd probably already be scheming on how to build my own reloading system. Just not there yet.

[hotshot357]

I chose Dillon on the recommendation of my LGS owner. I started reloading pistol and decided to buy a SDB. Later I purchased a .30-30 rifle. Wanting to load for everything I shoot. I traded in the SDB on a 550B. I noticed my LGS still had my trade in. I thought it would be nice to have one set up for large primers and one for small. So I bought the SDB again. I am a "happy-camper" now.251106

[dikman]

Shrapnel, mate, that is one cluttered area!:lol:
I like it.

[Petander]

I agree with priming on the LNL being its weakness.

Even when/if priming works,I don't like it because you won't see when a primer tube gets empty. Then you spill powder through the hole and have to dissassemble everything. Repeat.

Otherwise I like LNLAP, a solid system with a good case activated measure. But I size and prime separately nowadays. Watch a movie,prime 1000 cases with RCBS hand primer.

For serious semiauto round production it would be a Dillon. But where I live,loading 9mm costs more than factory ammo,even with free bullets, so...

[drac0nic]

Even when/if priming works,I don't like it because you won't see when a primer tube gets empty. Then you spill powder through the hole and have to dissassemble everything. Repeat.

Otherwise I like LNLAP, a solid system with a good case activated measure. But I size and prime separately nowadays. Watch a movie,prime 1000 cases with RCBS hand primer.

For serious semiauto round production it would be a Dillon. But where I live,loading 9mm costs more than factory ammo,even with free bullets, so...

I put a piece of clothes hanger in my primer tube. I put it to the bottom and marked it with a sharpie. It holds the shuttle back on the last primer and has a line to tell you where you are in your tube. Works well.

How are you getting 9mm that cheap? I can't really get 22lr for that kinda spend. I've got some 3 cent primers, free bullets (lead was given to me) and under 2.5 cents of powder. 1 or less if I use Titegroup. All ears. I mean I'm talking sub 3 bucks a box here.

[Petander]

How are you getting 9mm that cheap?

It's the other way round,primers and powder in Finland are expensive, making 9 mm 15 cents a pop to load, that excludes bullet price. Factory 9 mm ammo can be found cheaper or about the same.

Only larger calibers make economical sense to load for. Or specials like subsonic.

Back to presses,yes I have tried simular idea like your coathanger but I forget to watch and follow it. :) I make about 500 pistol rounds a week these days,"semi progressive" is just fine. And I like to inspect my brass anyway.

[drac0nic]

I want to make something like the Dillon's have with a micro switch and a buzzer. Just haven't yet. Maybe I will get a rod from McMaster next order.

Aah cool hat makes sense. .15 is a pretty steep investment.

[Kenstone]

Even when/if priming works,I don't like it because you won't see when a primer tube gets empty. Then you spill powder through the hole and have to dissassemble everything. Repeat.

Otherwise I like LNLAP, a solid system with a good case activated measure. But I size and prime separately nowadays. Watch a movie,prime 1000 cases with RCBS hand primer.

For serious semiauto round production it would be a Dillon. But where I live,loading 9mm costs more than factory ammo,even with free bullets, so...

I'm not understanding the "not seeing when a primer tube is empty".

Priming happens when the lever is push forward, the only thing going on with that motion, and the primer seating can be felt via the resistance of the lever verses no resistance.
The differing pressure applied is noticeable when no primer is present.
Operation could be stopped at this time to add more primers/swap tubes and the un-primed case removed, a pre-sized/primed case inserted/swapped out, no spilled powder...
the way I do it...
My sig line is relevant here,
:-)
Note: I use a wooden skewer as a primer follower rather than a metal wire/coat hanger, less chance to detonate.;)

[Petander]

Yeah,most probably it's a user error but I removed the priming system after so many spills.

There should be a 1000 primer tube station. 100 is not worth the whole setup time/effort in my opinion. Heck I make subsonic 9 mm with a Lee turret w/ four case tubes,feeling "progressive" enough. :)

This thread is making me want a Dillon of my own.

[dikman]

If you like, and appreciate, well made machinery then you will like Dillon.:smile:
I considered that my Loadmaster was quite well made (excluding the plastic bits) but Dillon is on another level.

[onelight]

If you like, and appreciate, well made machinery then you will like Dillon.:smile:
I considered that my Loadmaster was quite well made (excluding the plastic bits) but Dillon is on another level.
I totally agree my loadmaster was the most difficult of my Lee progressives to keep running smooth , Dillons are a class act.

[Petander]

I typed wrong about Lee "turret",which I have and have used but I meant an old Lee 1000 for my 9 mm sub loads. One can call that Lee progressive,right?

I almost prefer that Lee to my LNLAP,I like to SEE things. With Lee I don't pre-size and pre-prime. Filling primer tray is easy,as are the brass tubes.

But yeah,Dillon is another world.

[onelight]

I typed wrong about Lee "turret",which I have and have used but I meant an old Lee 1000 for my 9 mm sub loads. One can call that Lee progressive,right?

I almost prefer that Lee to my LNLAP,I like to SEE things. With Lee I don't pre-size and pre-prime. Filling primer tray is easy,as are the brass tubes.

But yeah,Dillon is another world.
Yup the 1000 is a progressive I used one for about 15 years if it had four stations I would probably still have it.
I have a buddy with a LNL and it to is a fine press .

[dogdoc]

Dillon, the only one you do not have to make excuses for. They work with the minimum of tinkering. No homemade fixes needed.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[pmer]

Even when/if priming works,I don't like it because you won't see when a primer tube gets empty. Then you spill powder through the hole and have to dissassemble everything. Repeat.

Otherwise I like LNLAP, a solid system with a good case activated measure. But I size and prime separately nowadays. Watch a movie,prime 1000 cases with RCBS hand primer.

For serious semiauto round production it would be a Dillon. But where I live,loading 9mm costs more than factory ammo,even with free bullets, so...

MY LNL AP came with a rod that sits on top of the primers that can I watch drop as the press operates.

I shortened that spring lifts the shell plate after priming. In my case the primer may or may not fully seat because that spring wouldn't compress enough. Shortening that spring allows the shell plate to go lower thus seating the primer more positively.

Has anyone else tried this trick for the LNL AP?

[Mousehouse]

Getting my loading bench setup again. Have my old and trusted Pacific single stage. Next to it the Hornady AP with case feeder will set. I am seriously thinking about putting a Dillon XL650 next to the Hornady. Several dealers around here are selling them off for $500 since the new 750 came out.

[drac0nic]

My LNL AP munched the primer feed yesterday. The slide jammed up for some reason and the wire bent. It apepars that they've made a significant change in it and it's got some sort of spring loaded detent I presume to keep it from bending like mine did. I also asked about my shuttle placement as it seems like the shuttle doesn't go back far enough to align in a centered way with the hole even at the limit of adjustment. I filed the hole in the top plastic piece but I dunno apparently it can be finicky to set up at times. I'm going to make a piece like that one guy had on ebay to align the primer slide properly and see how that works out. A chunk of aluminum rod isn't too expensive and that's like a 15 minute lathe project.

[AR-Bossman]

MY LNL AP came with a rod that sits on top of the primers that can I watch drop as the press operates.

I shortened that spring lifts the shell plate after priming. In my case the primer may or may not fully seat because that spring wouldn't compress enough. Shortening that spring allows the shell plate to go lower thus seating the primer more positively.

Has anyone else tried this trick for the LNL AP?

I'd have had to see it to believe it.

[AR-Bossman]

My LNL AP munched the primer feed yesterday. The slide jammed up for some reason and the wire bent. It apepars that they've made a significant change in it and it's got some sort of spring loaded detent I presume to keep it from bending like mine did. I also asked about my shuttle placement as it seems like the shuttle doesn't go back far enough to align in a centered way with the hole even at the limit of adjustment. I filed the hole in the top plastic piece but I dunno apparently it can be finicky to set up at times. I'm going to make a piece like that one guy had on ebay to align the primer slide properly and see how that works out. A chunk of aluminum rod isn't too expensive and that's like a 15 minute lathe project.


You musta been after it pretty good. Even the old system was designed so the the plastic top would break long before bending a steel rod. All the factory plastic rod holders i've seen at the top have a slot for adjustment. I changed them out to the one's from ebay, or if you have a 3d printer you can download the file. I also upgraded to the spring insert for the rod as well. I can pull it out to disengage the primer slide super easy now.

[AR-Bossman]

The only thing about that is now you need two sets of parts and know-how to deal with two different styles of presses. Although, if you totally dedicated a Dillon to one caliber that would make things alot easier.

[AR-Bossman]

Dillon, the only one you do not have to make excuses for. They work with the minimum of tinkering. No homemade fixes needed.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Yeah that's why ebay's loaded with fixit up Dillon parts and why Dillon just changed their whole press to a different primer system.

[drac0nic]

You musta been after it pretty good. Even the old system was designed so the the plastic top would break long before bending a steel rod. All the factory plastic rod holders i've seen at the top have a slot for adjustment. I changed them out to the one's from ebay, or if you have a 3d printer you can download the file. I also upgraded to the spring insert for the rod as well. I can pull it out to disengage the primer slide super easy now.

I filed mine to make a bigger slot and thought I had it set right. Yeah, I was going at it pretty hard having an off weekend and before I realized it the part was done. If the top piece is sacrificial it sure could have fooled me. Mine seems to be not brittle at all really. Now that I've said it I'll probably munch that too.


I was playing around with .45 ACP and I didn't have this issue using large primers. Just seems to be the small stuff. Even then I had it set up great in .38 Special.

Yeah if you're going to have 2 general purpose presses (say large/small primers) then the same press is the way to go if possible. Parts interchange is a good thing. Obviously dedicated caliber is another story. I've heard enough thing about the Pro 1K I've been tempted to get one for say 9mm and/or .38/.357.

[pjh421]

GWS - I'll have to wait on the pro chucker. I just bought an old RCBS 4X4. I know, I know.

Shrapnel - I think I saw a space in there where you could maybe force another press into, lol.

Paul

[XDROB]

So now that we're talking about progressive press's. There was a guy who talked about shiming the shell plate on his Hornady LnL. I have been looking for that thread and can't find it. Can anyone help?

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[AR-Bossman]

So now that we're talking about progressive press's. There was a guy who talked about shiming the shell plate on his Hornady LnL. I have been looking for that thread and can't find it. Can anyone help?

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

There's a big thread about that and more on another site. Don't know policies on cross forum talk.

[tazman]

There's a big thread about that and more on another site. Don't know policies on cross forum talk.

Send him a PM with the info. As long as stuff isn't posted on the main site, they don't really care.

[XDROB]

Send him a PM with the info. As long as stuff isn't posted on the main site, they don't really care.Who is him?

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[Kenstone]

There's a big thread about that and more on another site. Don't know policies on cross forum talk.

Post a link
no harm/no foul
:mrgreen:

[AR-Bossman]

Post a link
no harm/no foul
:mrgreen:

I think this is the one...

https://www.ar15.com/forums/armory/How-to-tune-the-Hornady-Lock-N-Load-AP-progressive-press/42-414607/

[XDROB]

I think this is the one...

https://www.ar15.com/forums/armory/How-to-tune-the-Hornady-Lock-N-Load-AP-progressive-press/42-414607/Thank you that is spot on.

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[drac0nic]

I'm kind of looking at that and I don't have a ton of slop in my shell plate far as I can tell. I'll have to grab the feeler guages I guess and see where I stand.

[XDROB]

I was having a problem with the shell plate no quite settling into the right spot. You have to manually push it into place. There is a tube video that shows exactly what is happening with the shell plate not going into place correctly. Have not been loading much because of some medical issues. Not shooting much either. But am starting to get back to sort of normal or a new normal for me. And thinking of getting out of the house and at least putting some holes in paper.

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[pmer]

I'd have had to see it to believe it.

I just ran 70 45 acp mixed brass with dirty primer pockets. All the primers seated good except for one CBC only seated flush even my RCBS hand priming tool couldn't make it go deeper.
I tried a couple things but only shortening that spring worked for me.

If you click on that other forum link you'll see the spring in the first pic. More importantly to the right of that spring is the dimple in the casting made by the primer punch. That dimple gets deeper from primer seating, it negatively affects tolerance stacking and you end up with primer troubles IMO.

Since that is a ruff cast surface there could be .015 hieght variation and that might be why some presses don't have any troubles and others do.

The press in that pic doesn't have that many rounds through it by the size of that dimple.

[Kenstone]

I just ran 70 45 acp mixed brass with dirty primer pockets. All the primers seated good except for one CBC only seated flush even my RCBS hand priming tool couldn't make it go deeper.
I tried a couple things but only shortening that spring worked for me.

If you click on that other forum link you'll see the spring in the first pic. More importantly to the right of that spring is the dimple in the casting made by the primer punch. That dimple gets deeper from primer seating, it negatively affects tolerance stacking and you end up with primer troubles IMO.

Since that is a ruff cast surface there could be .015 hieght variation and that might be why some presses don't have any troubles and others do.

The press in that pic doesn't have that many rounds through it by the size of that dimple.

Yes, that dimple is a common thing on many presses regardless of color, as is that primer pin spring or stop spring coil binding.

I found Wolf small pistol primers to be shorter and needed to be pushed deeper into the primer pocket on most cases.
My press(es) have a stop bolt under the shell plate opposite the primer seating so rather than mess with that I simply taped the thin part of a single edge razor blade(0.010") over that dimple in the casting to seat those shorter primers as a fix.
And I eventually added another blade to get consistent seating, a temporary fix that has become permanent.
:mrgreen:

[pmer]

I just have a Rockchucker and the LNL AP and have been doing more small batch reloading lately. Mostly use the Lnl for pistol and 223. So I'm glad I didn't spend big for Big Blue.

I'm not saying one is horrible and the other is the best but if Hornaday improved their primer seating right away the Dillion 750 would've came out quicker.

[Petander]

I also see powder granules collecting on/under the LNLAP shellplate. I'm loading test batches now, 50-100 rds a day. I cleaned on and under the plate a week ago,now there's powder again.

Don't know when/where they fall/fly/drop from? But they will find their way to the priming system causing trouble, another reason to prime beforehand.

Can this be a user / adjustment error? My 357 case is really full of slow powder, it looks like the shellplate is doing a tiny "shake" when the ram goes up and plate goes down,clicking to the next stop. Could it throw some granules overboard then? Adjustment?

Or something wrong with the -otherwise excellent- powder measure system?

https://i.postimg.cc/7ZYftDCh/IMG-20191127-172021-874.jpg

This thread is making me want a Dillon of my own. I don't enjoy changing calibers anyway.

[XDROB]

I also have the same thing. But have not done much shooting due to health problems. Am better now. And going to do the shim update to my press. I believe it helps reduce the shaking of the shell plate as we are pulling the handle. Makes it smoother. I believe this is the link to explain.


https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar...P-progressive-press/42-414607/

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[kmw1954]

Don't know about the Hornady press but on my Lee Pro1000 I have started placing the bullet after the bullet comes out of the die after the powder drop and before it advances to the last position. Yes it makes it a bit harder to see the powder charge in the case but it also eliminates any powder splash.

[XDROB]

I have the Hornady Powder Cop die after my powder drop. I also have Inline Fabrication led lighting on my press so it makes much easier to see what's going on.

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[drac0nic]

The wire setup looks cool. Is there a thread on that? I can kind of see where it goes but not totally. I do notice that ejection is kind of not great with .38 Specials.

[Phlier]

[smilie=l: you have it figured out.
A suggestion that was not part of the question. Many here have a Lee Classic Turret in addition to a one hole single stage , they are so versatile for so many uses on the bench from case processing to loading small batches of multiple calibers , once set you have the turrets for calibers you use the most , you can change from one to the other in seconds including changing primer size and with out to big a rush give you 50 rounds in 20 minutes.
For progressives for me it would be the ABLP if I wasn't so cheap (I'd rather spend on guns and bullets ) I would go with a Dillon , a 550 would cost me $1000.00 to $1200 set up they way I would want ( new equipment ) with the service Dillon has , if I was not in a hurry I would look for used.

I found my reloading Nirvana with a Rockchucker, a Lee Classic Turret, a Dillon 550, and a Dillon 1050. The 1050 is relegated to 9mm and 5.56 only, the 550 handles the other calibers that we shoot a lot of, and the Lee Classic Turret fills in the gaps, and does so with great aplomb. Honestly, I've enjoyed that little LCT a lot more than I ever thought I would, and for exactly the reasons you stated. The turrets themselves are so cheap, that you can just fill a turret with dies for one caliber, throw an insert for a Lee Auto Drum powder measure on it, and be up and running in a new caliber in less than two minutes. There's never a reason to take a set of dies out; just leave them in and properly adjusted. The fact that it's a turret gives you a decent return on the time/ammo loaded ratio. I can easily load four rounds per minute, so about 200 rounds per hour, as you will have to stop and refill the primer system.

A "caliber conversion kit" for the LCT consists of a turret, a set of dies, and a shell holder, and the shell holder is included with the dies. And if you stick with Lee dies (and for calibers that you don't load in bulk, I honestly don't see a reason not to stick with Lee dies), you can get a complete "caliber conversion kit" for the LCT for not much more than the price of one 550 shell plate.

IMO, there's no substitute for the 1050 if you're shooting thousands of rounds per week in one or two calibers... it's fast, reliable and consistent. Same can be said for the 550 and 650. Definitely worth the investment for the calibers you shoot a lot of.

But for everything else, the little LCT is a very elegant solution, at an amazing price.

[kmw1954]

Phlier, very well put! Mixed press benches can live happily together.

I have a JR3 press, a Lee 3 hole turret and a Lee Pro1000 and like you they all get used differently and yes they do get used. I wish I shot enough to warrant a 650/750 or 1050 press but I don't and don't see it anytime in the future..

[drac0nic]

Honady charged me for the parts to get my LNL AP priming system functional again even though they were revised parts to (obviously) remediate a design flaw. Gonna have to ding points for that. RCBS sent me parts without even asking for my Uniflow. Big contrast in service there IMO. Yeah I got it used but RCBS never made an excuse for that.

Re:Classic Turret

If I didn't have the LNL AP I would have a Classic Turret. It's a great press and even better when you factor in the price honestly and if I see one for a good deal I'm going to take it home. The disadvantage to the LNL AP is minimal IMO especially when I factor in the time spent dealing with the stupid primer feed.

[Petander]

Phlier, very well put! Mixed press benches can live happily together.

I have a JR3 press, a Lee 3 hole turret and a Lee Pro1000 and like you they all get used differently and yes they do get used. I wish I shot enough to warrant a 650/750 or 1050 press but I don't and don't see it anytime in the future..

I still use Lee turret every now and then. And the 1000. And Rockchucker and an old CH single and a portable RCBS small single (bolted on a chair with a case trimmer for garden use). :)

[AR-Bossman]

The wire setup looks cool. Is there a thread on that? I can kind of see where it goes but not totally. I do notice that ejection is kind of not great with .38 Specials.

That's the old setup for LnL AP's. They make a upgrade kit to change it all out to the new style, but the shell plate isn't machined for it so you would have to get all new ones. Hornady may still offer a machining service to modify them.

[dogdoc]

Yeah that's why ebay's loaded with fixit up Dillon parts and why Dillon just changed their whole press to a different primer system.

The difference is the Dillon does not need any of the fix it up parts to work well. They work well without any additions. They are the overwhelming choice of competitors (like USPSA ) who load and shoot massive quantities of ammunition for a good reason : they just work well. I have 2 650s for twenty years and the primer mechanism works great. I suspect they changed it for another reason (ease or cheaper to make.). If not a Dillon, I would look at the Hornady .


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[Three44s]

I also see powder granules collecting on/under the LNLAP shellplate. I'm loading test batches now, 50-100 rds a day. I cleaned on and under the plate a week ago,now there's powder again.

Don't know when/where they fall/fly/drop from? But they will find their way to the priming system causing trouble, another reason to prime beforehand.

Can this be a user / adjustment error? My 357 case is really full of slow powder, it looks like the shellplate is doing a tiny "shake" when the ram goes up and plate goes down,clicking to the next stop. Could it throw some granules overboard then? Adjustment?

Or something wrong with the -otherwise excellent- powder measure system?

https://i.postimg.cc/7ZYftDCh/IMG-20191127-172021-874.jpg

This thread is making me want a Dillon of my own. I don't enjoy changing calibers anyway.

You may be having powder jump from your cases even with the longer revolver brass.

The other and greater possibility is powder bridging in the measure and falling out as the case is being withdrawn from the case activated charge die. I notice you are using a relatively coarse powder.

If you are getting delayed powder drops you may want to revisit Hornady’s recommendation on prepping your measure (getting all the oil residue off the measure’s internals. Hornady uses some pretty sticky stuff to protect these from rusting. As I recall they urge new owners of the LNL AP’s to use their One Shot case lube which also dry lubes for even better powder transfer.

I did the One Shot procedure with my measure but had powder bridging with my 223 ammo. My thought was to add a small vibrator motor to keep the powder from hanging up. I have not gone back to rifle on that press though.

I did a batch of 380 Auto with red dot powder and had the cases twitching powder out after that.

Never a dull moment.

Three44s

[Kenstone]

I also see powder granules collecting on/under the LNLAP shellplate. I'm loading test batches now, 50-100 rds a day. I cleaned on and under the plate a week ago,now there's powder again.

Don't know when/where they fall/fly/drop from? But they will find their way to the priming system causing trouble, another reason to prime beforehand.

Can this be a user / adjustment error? My 357 case is really full of slow powder, it looks like the shellplate is doing a tiny "shake" when the ram goes up and plate goes down,clicking to the next stop. Could it throw some granules overboard then? Adjustment?

Or something wrong with the -otherwise excellent- powder measure system?

https://i.postimg.cc/7ZYftDCh/IMG-20191127-172021-874.jpg

This thread is making me want a Dillon of my own. I don't enjoy changing calibers anyway.

Here's some vids that relate to powder spillage:
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=hornady+lnl+ap+powder+spillag e
:mrgreen:

[Petander]

Thank you - I paid more attention to the spill,powder really is jumping from cases when they stop after being filled. That's when a strange little shake happens,the shellplate goes back and forth.

Vihtavuori N110 tends to fill cases,causing more powder jump.

It's possible to put a finger on top of case just before the stop/shake happens,then seat the bullet.

[derek45]

I LOVE my XL650 and 550b

I use the XL650 for processing rifle brass, and bulk 1000 round loading.

I use the 550b for smaller batch stuff like 41 magnum

I've heard a lot of guys over the years at USPSA/IPSC matches say stuff like

" I finally sold my brandX press and got a Dillon, what a wonderful machine"

I've NEVER heard anyone say anything like

"I sold my dillon and got a brandX and like it so much better"

.

[onelight]

I LOVE my XL650 and 550b

I use the XL650 for processing rifle brass, and bulk 1000 round loading.

I use the 550b for smaller batch stuff like 41 magnum

I've heard a lot of guys over the years at USPSA/IPSC matches say stuff like

" I finally sold my brandX press and got a Dillon, what a wonderful machine"

I've NEVER heard anyone say anything like

"I sold my dillon and got a brandX and like it so much better"

.
Dillon makes excellent reloading equipment no question about that if it did not have advantages it would be foolish to pay one cent more for it than something that cost less .
If you don't need those advantages it's Kinda like buying a 1 ton dually truck to drive to the grocery store .
For my 100 to 200 rounds a week it would be a little silly to spend 3 or 4 times as much . If I bought Dillon equipment it would only be to have Dillon equipment I am not a collector so I buy what serves my need.
Oh and I got rid of my heavy truck when I sold my heavy equipment . I drive a 1/2 ton
We all have different needs I buy what I need but nothing wrong with buying what you like if your are an equipment junkie. I am a gun junkie no reasonable excuse for most of the guns I buy.:razz:

[Petander]

I've been googling around for a Dillon.

550 is manual index? Why is that being advertised as such a great feature?

[rbuck351]

Because you can stop and fix an oops at any station without it automaticly moving more cases into the mess and you can back it up if needed. Also, once you are used to the manual advance, it becomes automatic to the point it doesn't slow things much if any. Any round can be pulled at any station or replaced at any time without having to clear the whole batch on the press and start over. I have a Star progressive that is a royal pita when anything goes wrong. I really like the Dillon 550. It will easily load 400/500 rounds per hour which is more speed than I need.

[drac0nic]

Because you can stop and fix an oops at any station without it automaticly moving more cases into the mess and you can back it up if needed. Also, once you are used to the manual advance, it becomes automatic to the point it doesn't slow things much if any. Any round can be pulled at any station or replaced at any time without having to clear the whole batch on the press and start over. I have a Star progressive that is a royal pita when anything goes wrong. I really like the Dillon 550. It will easily load 400/500 rounds per hour which is more speed than I need.

Yeah, I didn't notice the manual advance slowing me down on the 550. I would say its biggest flaw is probably that it only holds 4 dies which is a limitation a lot of people are fine with. As said before even Lee Classic Turret compared to a wasn't a huge downgrade in my mind.

[onelight]

It's also handy when setting up and adjusting dies and powder measure.

[Dale53]

The 550B also is considerably less expensive per caliber change than the 650/750/ and 1050. I regularly loaded for 11 different cartridges and that could really add up. The 550B's (I have two) will load match quality ammo for rifles and pistols.

FWIW
Dale53

[Petander]

Yeah,I guess it's just my many years with Hornady LNLAP and auto index,never had a problem. Never missed manual index.

I also have a Lee 1000 and a Lee turret, used them for a while but they are collecting dust & rust now.

This thread really is whetting my appetite for a Dillon. Most probably 750 set for 357 mag.

[Taterhead]

Never missed manual index.



I certainly wouldn't classify manual index as superior!

[Petander]

I like the accessories.

252913

[onelight]

For the most part the more complex the press is the more you have to adjust trouble shoot and maintain
when you have primer feeders bullet feeders case feeders 3 to 7 stations and auto indexing you can put out piles of ammo in a short time but totally inefficient if you want to run small batches of several cartridges . And if you have a problem you have a lot of things going on at the same time that can lead to dangerous or defective ammunition. This is not a cut to them but more a reason the 550 appeals to a lot of people it's not superior , it's simpler but still fast enough for what many need . Simple and fast both have compromises we pick what we think works for our needs and budget and not unimportant enjoyment in using the equipment.

[Petander]

Yep,it's just me being used to auto index.

I don't trust myself to learn new kind of attention needed. I see myself loading double charges...

[rbuck351]

In order to double charge a case in a 550 you would have to try to put a bullet in a case that already has a bullet in it, try to put a new case in the first station that still has a case in it and ignore these and not turn the shellplate. I have had my 550b for about 25 years and haven't done this yet. Turning the shellplate with your left hand as it moves to grab another bullet becomes automatic after pulling the ram lever. While doing this your right hand grabs and installs another case. Going slowly at first, maybe 200 rds per hr, and it soon becomes automatic. I still do not reload while distracted by anything even a radio. I'm not saying the 550b is the best press for everyone but it's the best I have used for me. The only thing it has ever done wrong is to not feed a primer maybe once or twice per thousand. Not dangerous but makes the need for occasionally pulling a bullet.

[Rcmaveric]

It's not that bad on the Loadmaster. I have cheap webcam I have had forever mounted in the second die hole. I can see everything taking place on the shell plate and powder level, even if a primer didn't seat. So no chance of a double charge. Check the laptop screen for powder charge and primer then place a bullet and the pull the handle. Repeat until there are enough bullets for a small army.

I did have an occasional casing not primed. Like 1 out of 100. But now I can see if a peimer is seated through the case.

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[Phlier]

I like the accessories.

252913

Man, have I been ordering my Dillon stuff from the wrong place... I've never even seen that as an option (although I don't think I could afford it, anyway). ;)

[baragasam]

I have a Lee Loadmaster somewhat modified to my likings. If I had the money I'd get a Dillon with the X Drive. Doing only several calibers also help slim down the process.

[Petander]

I guess it's like switching between automatic and manual tranny cars.

We load differently. Like now I have loaded 357 mag (LNLAP) every day for a couple of months, changing only bullets. I might load 15 min or one hour, cat may break in my reloading room every now and then... (Does anybody know what makes cats to vigorously break in rooms with closed doors...?)

I like how I can leave the press so that everything is in sync when I come back. No extra thinking required.


Square Deal would be good but the proprietary dies... expander problem for sure. The four die limitation is sort of strange with both.

[Baltimoreed]

252987252988252989
I was gifted two Dillon 550s from two different friends. One was set up for .45 acp already, I bought a .45 auto rim plate for it. The other has become my 300blkout and eventually a 7.62x39 press. I also use two Lyman T2 turrets and a Bair Kodiak for my ‘06 and .30-40. I have an old Pacific auto index 12 ga press and didn’t like it, way too complicated imo, I need to sell the dumb thing. I prefer manual operation, you’ve got your hand right there to place a case or bullet in the press, how hard is it to turn it 1/4 turn?

[onelight]

In order to double charge a case in a 550 you would have to try to put a bullet in a case that already has a bullet in it, try to put a new case in the first station that still has a case in it and ignore these and not turn the shellplate. I have had my 550b for about 25 years and haven't done this yet. Turning the shellplate with your left hand as it moves to grab another bullet becomes automatic after pulling the ram lever. While doing this your right hand grabs and installs another case. Going slowly at first, maybe 200 rds per hr, and it soon becomes automatic. I still do not reload while distracted by anything even a radio. I'm not saying the 550b is the best press for everyone but it's the best I have used for me. The only thing it has ever done wrong is to not feed a primer maybe once or twice per thousand. Not dangerous but makes the need for occasionally pulling a bullet.
I have watched a friend double charge on a 550 when adjusting his bullet seating die.
It was caught and not a problem but in the right circumstances it can happen on any progressive I have experience with, in a moment of distraction . Progressives demand my undivided attention and any interruption requires every station checked before proceeding ( I say this based on my own errors I have caught ) , this should be SOP . I like them and use them , but they are more like work for me than an enjoyable hobby like a single stage or turret.
The reward is at the end of a session when filling all the box's with 5 or 10 X the ammo I could have loaded on my single stage in the same amount of time. If you don't need the quantity they are a waste of money unless you just like to collect equipment that is a different hobby.

[Phlier]

I have watched a friend double charge on a 550 when adjusting his bullet seating die.
It was caught and not a problem but in the right circumstances it can happen on any progressive I have experience with, in a moment of distraction . Progressives demand my undivided attention and any interruption requires every station checked before proceeding ( I say this based on my own errors I have caught ) , this should be SOP . I like them and use them , but they are more like work for me than an enjoyable hobby like a single stage or turret.
The reward is at the end of a session when filling all the box's with 5 or 10 X the ammo I could have loaded on my single stage in the same amount of time. If you don't need the quantity they are a waste of money unless you just like to collect equipment that is a different hobby.
Yup. If you're going to use a progressive press, you absolutely MUST get in the habit of looking at the powder charge in the case you're about to put a boolit in, and pay attention to the level of powder in the case.

[Petander]

After using autoindex machines for many years,even thinking manual just feels strange. I didn't know Dillon 550 is manual until a week ago.

There was an ancient 550 on Ebay, I was going to bid but it already got sold "buy it now" for nearly a new press price. I think I have a Dillon fever.

I don't want another LNLAP mostly because of those O-ring bushings.

[Baltimoreed]

I’ve gotten into the very deliberate habit of pulling my handle and holding it down until I actually pick up a bullet from my bullet box, then I raise the handle, rotate the shell plate or turret and place the bullet in the charged case. Then depending on the press do the next step. I peek into the charged case occasionally and of course watch my powder level, topping off when it gets to 1/4 full.

[Kenstone]

I have watched a friend double charge on a 550 when adjusting his bullet seating die.
It was caught and not a problem but in the right circumstances it can happen on any progressive I have experience with, in a moment of distraction.

Sounds like you have never used a progressive with auto indexing, as it's near impossible (for me) to double charge on any of the auto index presses I reload on.
You might double charge if you short stroke but that would be an obvious lapse of concentration.
That and having some extra "sized/pre-primed" cases on hand to plug in when priming goes south, makes it way easier to continue on without removing every case in every station.
I use a bullet feeder, stand to load, and have a mirror for powder check.
253005
:-)

[XDROB]

I also have a Hornady Powder cop die on my press. And have installed Inline Fabrications led light system. Lights up the whole inside of my press. Makes it hard to double or short charge a case.

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[doulos]

Im sure Im a green horn too many here with progressive presses. But my one and only is a Dillon 550B. Once I decided on Dillon after my research. I bought the 550 just because i didnt want to spend the money on a 650. The caliber changes are cheaper also. I thought its simplicity would be beneficial to me since it was my first progressive. I was concerned at first about the lack of a powder cop station. But paying attention with any reloading is a good idea. You can make mistakes on a single stage press too. The manual index actually helps in keeping your focus on the shell plate where it belongs. I load sitting down. So I position my stool to the side where I can easily look into the case before bullet placement. With the powders I use its pretty hard to double charge without seeing it immediately.
The 550 is plenty fast for me. I actually don't use it much any more because Im shooting other stuff I dont reload on that. But it's a pretty solid machine. Easy to set up. Easy to change calibers, even when changing primer size. And Dillon CS is great. I had one issue with a priming bar and they walked me through the problem on the phone and made sure it was running right before ending the call.

[XDROB]

The only reason I bought a Hornady LnL is when I decided to start reloading it was the week after Sandy Hook. When I got to Cabelas. The gun dept and especially the reloading area looked like the bread shelves before a big storm. It literally was the only press on the shelf. I almost missed getting it. Because another guy was headed for it and got delayed by his wife. Got some really bad looks from him as I passed him with it in my carridge. First press and first time reloading. Steep learning curve. I had a what I belive was a double charged round go off in my Beretta 92F. As my son was shooting it. Locked the slide back so hard I had to take it to the clubs gun smith to get it apart. He checked it out and said it put a few rounds through it one at a time. Then progress to using a magazine. I realize that it could have been much worse. That was before I started reloading. I always keep that day in mind when I'm running the press.

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[onelight]

Sounds like you have never used a progressive with auto indexing, as it's near impossible (for me) to double charge on any of the auto index presses I reload on.
You might double charge if you short stroke but that would be obvious lapse of concentration.
That and having some extra "sized/pre-primed" cases on hand to plug in when priming goes south, makes it way easier to continue on without removing every case in every station.
I use a bullet feeder, stand to load, and have a mirror for powder check.
253005
:-)
I have loaded on auto index progressives for at least 30 years .
For me the problem shows up most , not when it's working like it should be , but after a stoppage of some kind what ever it might be , to make adjustment or run out of primers or a primer misfeed a crushed case or whatever it might be that is when a charging error none or double is most likely to occur . It is not a common occurrence most other errors on a progressive are a slow down and irritating , powder errors are dangerous .
Every one that uses progressives hopefully have integrated ways in the process to guard against errors .
But progressives demand my undivided attention I may not be as good a multitasker as some but some mistakes can have serious consequences .

[kmw1954]

Have followed this thread for 7 pages and many have expressed the same thoughts in many different ways.

I will repeat my sentiments and advice that I espouse to new reloaders or those just starting with a new type press. Always take the time to build a repeatable process, one that becomes ingrained in your mind and muscle memory. This way if and when something feels out of sync or not quite right you will automatically stop to investigate. In my case this is why I sort brass by head stamp to run thru my progressive. Because I also become accustom to a feel and again if something doesn't feel right I stop. I don't get into such a hurry that I look like a drunk at a slot machine on a Friday night.

As to powder charges, unless you are weighing every charge a mistake can happen and even with that it still can. Especially when using a mechanical powder dispenser/powder measure. It doesn't just happen on progressive presses either. Even when using a loading block it can happen which is why I look into EVERY case as a quality control check, and is also why I do not use high density fast burning powders like Titegroup. Even with a medium fast powder like HP-38 I have tested and I cannot visually tell the difference in cases that are off by just .3gr or powder. Yes I have taken cases and loaded 10 to my target weight then taken3 or 4 and over and under filled them by .1gr until I was over and under .3gr and then mixed them all together on the bench. So that was a combined 34 charged cases on the bench. I could not pick out which 4 were .3gr over or .3gr under. Try it and see if you can pick them out.

In my mind reloading is all about consistency/repeatability, process. It makes no difference to me what equipment you are using or if you are a single stage, turret or progressive press user. It doesn't even matter what components you are using as long as you are using it correctly and safely and can determine when there is the sense of a problem.

[Three44s]

kmw1954,

Great advice that fits any handloading style wether it be single stage or progressive or with a turret.

Three44s

[onelight]

kmw1954,

Great advice that fits any handloading style wether it be single stage or progressive or with a turret.

Three44s
I agree totally . You can often feel or hear a problem before you see it.

[drac0nic]

Yep, I agree too. The HUGE advantage of single stage loading is you can easily bake a lot of QA into it. Otherwise you have to make up for that in a lot of ways. If I was loading ammo I wanted my life to depend on I'd never do it on a progressive.

In other news it seems like I'll be picking up my buddy's 550B tomorrow. Looking forward to that honestly. If it acts better than the LNL I may end up offloading it or relegating it to specific calibers. Then again, I got the retrofit stuff for the priming system. It seems as if the timing of the primer slide is a lot different (as to not bend the engagement point on the shuttle) and it also seems like there's a lot more adjustment to it. Even more than the one I modified slightly by ovaling the hole more with a file. Will it work out well? Don't know truthfully but we'll have to crank a few boxes out and find out.

[toallmy]

I load 9mm , 45acp , 38s , 357s , + cast for 30-30s , + 7x57s on a lee loadmaster and love it , rifle brass is sized off press on a single stage but primed on the loadmaster . It's bolted down right beside a Dillon 550 that I use to load 223 ammo on . I like the auto index feature but I don't think it's faster because I take the time to watch the operation while it's happening all the way around the shellplate plus the primer drop before sitting a boolit in the charged case .
I have never actually saw a 650 in operation but I have helped a buddy pull down a bucket full of 9 mm ammo his friend loading on a 650 . It was not the 650 that loaded the bad rounds it was the operator - the machine loaded every round the same . I can honestly say the 550 is a much sturdier and we'll built machine them the loadmaster but a perfect round is a perfect round .
If I only wanted one press on my bench beside the single stage , it would be a 550 with separate tool heads & powder measure .
Later today I'm going to load a 50 round box of 7.65 Argentina ammo on a single stage weighing the powder charge by hand on a scale and enjoy doing it .

[Kenstone]

I agree totally . You can often feel or hear a problem before you see it.

Yes, all day long...
I cannot understand how anyone can crush a case, I can feel when a case bumps into the end of the sizing die, stop pushing the lever, reach in and nudge the case so it enters the die.
The same goes for priming, it's all in the feel...
:smile:

[rickys2]

I'm a Dillon user for over 30 year. I have 2 550b one setup for small primer and the other for Larger primer. Dillon no BS warranty sold me. I call them and they send me the part. Hard to beat.

[Phlier]

The same goes for priming, it's all in the feel...
:smile:
That's one of my few complaints with the 1050... you can't "feel" the primer going in. On all of my other presses, you can "feel" the primer going in, but not on the 1050. It's also the only press I've ever popped a primer on while loading; had I been able to feel the problem, it never would've popped.

[Petander]

Proper priming is of utmost importance.

I have a friend who sometimes left a random fired case in a revolver cylinder,to check his possible flinch with a 475 SA revolver. The good old surprise-technique.

Once he went shooting, the "click" came right away at the first shot so he thought it was the empty case. He fired the second time, bang, the loading gate entered his right shoulder and came out from his lower back making a 10" wound. He lost half a gallon of blood but survived.

For whatever reason the first round didn't ignite properly until the next round was fired. You never know when a "dud" goes off.

Whenever I hear a "click"... well lets's just say I don't want to hear a click. Ever. The good old RCBS hand primer with the right shellholder has a " feel".