Anyone ever tried a different style of crimp groove that matches the Lee FCD better?

[CamoWhamo]

Tonight i was at my bench and made up a batch of stout .44-40 +P ammo with Hornady XTP jacketed bullets for use on bigger critters in my Miroku 1992.

I normally use a roll crimp on my cast loads but for these jacketed loads i gave the Lee collet style FCD a go and i really liked how well the crimp fit into the cannelure on the XTP's.

That got me thinking, if a cast bullet had a wider but shallower crimp groove that better matched how the Lee FCD crimps would it be any better or worse than the traditional crimp groove?

I've tried the Lee FCD (collet style) on my cast loads and never liked the way it "swaged" some bullets down but if the bullet was designed with the FCD in mind would that problem be eliminated?

[Burnt Fingers]

My favorite crimp is the Redding profile crimp.

[mdi]

I modified my 44 Mag collet crimp. I wanted a narrower crimp ring so I removed a bit fro the inside, bottom of the crimp ring in the collet. The top of the crimp ring was located just where I wanted it, so I removed metal from the bottom of the ring. Worked great, now my 429421 and my RD RNFPs get a crimp that starts at the top of the groove without swaging any of the bullet body...

[Tom Myers]

How did you go about removing the metal
?

[megasupermagnum]

How did you go about removing the metal
?

They collets are hard, but they do cut on a lathe. I've modified two now. I have not tried to cut the finger end of the collet, I've only cut the base. The only reason you would want to cut the fingers is if you wanted to shorten the band such that it is level with the top of the brass, or slightly below. As it is, the band extends well above the brass. For my purposes this is no problem. I get the crimp I want before the collet begins to touch the bullet.

You are not the first to want a long crimp groove. Even Elmer Keith was a proponent of a crimp groove that was not just big, it had a flat bottom. Myself, I doubt it matters. Even a standard roll crimp swages the bullet. It's as easy to see as simply crimping, then pulling that bullet. You will see that the crimp groove is now rounded, it mostly conforms to the crimp. The collet crimp is no different, except far less sensitive to brass length variations.

If by swaging bullets down, you are talking about the collet actually squishing the forward band before a proper crimp is applied, then look up the FCD modification post by Doug Guy. He shows how to stop this by modifying the die on a lathe.

[CamoWhamo]

I decided to try my idea so had Tom add a new design to the catalog.

It's based on the 43-215C and 43-220C which give me great accuracy in both my .44-40's

I'll see how it works in about a months time.

http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=43-219M-D.png

249115

[bishopgrandpa]

I second Burnt Fingers Redding Profile Crimp comment. You can taper and/or roll crimp at the same time. Great for the 45-70

[CamoWhamo]

I have a Redding Profile crimp die in .44-40.

In my case it does not work. My rifles are modern reproductions with bores way over spec at .430 and .431.

This necessitates the use of larger bullets than most dies are designed for.
The profile crimp die in .44-40 is just a hair too small for my rounds loafed with larger bullets and starts to swage the whole neck before it starts the crimp.

[Bookworm]

I decided to try my idea so had Tom add a new design to the catalog.

It's based on the 43-215C and 43-220C which give me great accuracy in both my .44-40's

I'll see how it works in about a months time.

http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=43-219M-D.png

249115

I sure wish Tom would put notes in his mould drawings. It would help folks differentiate between moulds in what is becoming a cumbersome portfolio.

For instance, on this drawing, a note that states "crimp groove designed for Lee FCD" would certainly help.

[CamoWhamo]

I sure wish Tom would put notes in his mould drawings. It would help folks differentiate between moulds in what is becoming a cumbersome portfolio.

For instance, on this drawing, a note that states "crimp groove designed for Lee FCD" would certainly help.

I wholeheartedly agree with you there.
Have often thought the exact same thing.

[Victor N TN]

They collets are hard, but they do cut on a lathe. Or soft (Emergency Collets) are available that can be machined.

[lar45]

If you pop the collet out, you can take a tapered grinding stone and reshape the crimp to be more of a > < instead of a long crimp ] [

[Bookworm]

If you pop the collet out, you can take a tapered grinding stone and reshape the crimp to be more of a > < instead of a long crimp ] [

I've got a 44 Mag collet I'm going to try this on.

Thanks for the idea !

[Petander]

I have a Redding Profile crimp die in .44-40.

In my case it does not work. My rifles are modern reproductions with bores way over spec at .430 and .431.

This necessitates the use of larger bullets than most dies are designed for.
The profile crimp die in .44-40 is just a hair too small for my rounds loafed with larger bullets and starts to swage the whole neck before it starts the crimp.

My experience with Redding profile crimp and 500 S&W is the same.

Redding 500 S&W dies are very tight and good for j-bullets. Oversize cast (501) is difficult,seater dies are shaving bullet coatings etc. So I use mostly RCBS dies for cast 500.

I absolutely love Lee collet crimper in 500, I use bullets with no crimp groove and force crimp them (swage) with the collet die real hard. Excellent function and accuracy. No need for a separate crimp groove at all.

[CamoWhamo]

Just 14 days after i asked Tom to add my design to his catalog and i have my new mold, and that includes international shipping to Australia.

I got a 2-cav iron mold and its the usual high quality i've come to expect from him.

I wasted no time scrubbing the mold down and then getting it hot while my pot got up to temp.

I cast about 100. They came out looking great and are exactly what i was hoping.

I Lube sized a few and they weighed an average of 225gn.
I loaded up a couple of test rounds. The Lee Factory crimp fits the wide shallow crimp groove perfectly. The mouth of the case is just flush with the nose and they pass the fingernail test.

So, overall i'm pleased my idea and design has worked for the reloading part at least.
Time to load up a batch and get to the range later in the week to see how they shoot.

249760

[Petander]

Just 14 days after i asked Tom to add my design to his catalog and i have my new mold, and that includes international shipping to Australia.

I got a 2-cav iron mold and its the usual high quality i've come to expect from him.

I wasted no time scrubbing the mold down and then getting it hot while my pot got up to temp.

I cast about 100. They came out looking great and are exactly what i was hoping.

I Lube sized a few and they weighed an average of 225gn.
I loaded up a couple of test rounds. The Lee Factory crimp fits the wide shallow crimp groove perfectly. The mouth of the case is just flush with the nose and they pass the fingernail test.

So, overall i'm pleased my idea and design has worked for the reloading part at least.
Time to load up a batch and get to the range later in the week to see how they shoot.

249760

Now that sure is looking good. Congrats!

What exactly did you ask Tom to do? I might like a similar mold from him but for a heavy 357 mag silhouette boolit. No lube groove either.

[CamoWhamo]

Now that sure is looking good. Congrats!

What exactly did you ask Tom to do? I might like a similar mold from him but for a heavy 357 mag silhouette boolit. No lube groove either.

Tom's instructions are here. http://www.accuratemolds.com/submitNewDesign.php

What i usually do is send in a detailed drawing of the design. I make the drawings using MSPaint and the windows Snipping tool.

Most of the drawings on his site are to the same scale, so 2 drawings of the same caliber will be the same relative size.
I find bullets with the design features i want and use the Windows Snipping tool to snip that section. Paste each section into MSPaint and then drag them until they all line up into the final design.

Then use the text box and line tools in MSPaint to add the dimensions.

If you see a bullet which is mostly what you want just without lube groove you can just explain what you want and Tom will be able to do it.
Some simple changes like that could probably also be done just using the notes section of the order form.

[CamoWhamo]

I got to shoot few groups with the new bullet a couple of days ago and I'm very pleased with the accuracy of this design. My load was 7.0gn of Unique which i chronographed at 1080fps. It was getting very tight groups off the bench at 55yds.

I also loaded a few more and tried a taper crimp using my Hornady Cowboy die. I reckon the Hornady's crimp looks as good as, maybe even better than the Lee FCD's crimp.
I'm happy with both so will keep using the FCD as a 4th step, rather than have to adjust the Hornady die for separate seating and crimping operations.

[tankgunner59]

Try backing the adjustment off on your Lee FCD and you should be able to crimp your cast pills without deforming them. I use the Lee FCD on all of my cast bullets with no problems.