Varget in 45/70

[Traffer]

I have a 45/70 Handi rifle that I have not shot yet. I have also 415 grain powder coated swaged bullets at about 12 bhn. I am not in great health and don't want to beat myself up. Looking at Quickloads, a load of 32 grains of Varget COULD be loaded. I know that it is not recommended because of the very poor burn. But I only have Varget to work with. I don't plan on shooting this gun more than 10 times and don't want to buy a can of powder for that. What do you folks think?

[Conditor22]

What other powders do you have?
I put 12 gr trail boss under that boolit with good results.

this should help Lyman 4th CB (I'd back off a little since this is a lighter boolit, the starting load should be fine)

https://i.imgur.com/55ZXB1g.jpg

[Traffer]

The only other powder I have is HS -6.

[Traffer]

What other powders do you have?
I put 12 gr trail boss under that boolit with good results.

this should help Lyman 4th CB (I'd back off a little since this is a lighter boolit, the starting load should be fine)

https://i.imgur.com/55ZXB1g.jpg

This is what quickload says: I wonder why the discrepancy?:
246022

[lotech]

I tried Varget some years ago in a Marlin .45-70 using the Lyman #457122 330 grain HP bullet. Accuracy was good, but recoil was up considerably in comparison with other powders like 4759 and 5744, probably because I had to use a lot more Varget to get the same velocity as the faster-burning powders.

[15meter]

Unless I misunderstand Quickload, that is a computer program estimating load data based on the cartridge/bullet data input into the program.

The load data from that manual was some guy sitting down and loading multiple rounds in a ballistics lab and testing the loads to get real world honest pressure and velocity tested data.

But I've been wrong before, as I've said before, for verification of how wrong I can be, just ask my mother-in-law.

[EMC45]

I too used Varget in 45-70 in a Handi and the recoil was unpleasant. It blurred my vision and gave me a headache.

[country gent]

Does quick load give loads at trapdoor, marlin and number 1 levels or is it all together? From what I have seen varget seems to be upper end loads velocity wise. In a Handy rifle with shorter barrel and lighter weight these could be interesting to say the least.

I load Black Powder in 45-70 and get very good results. Varget may not give complete burns and possibly even hang fires do to low density and lower pressures not allowing for food ignition and burn.

For awhile Accurate arms offered powders in 1/4lb containers to test and work up with. I liked this as I didn't end up with a bunch on the shelf if it didn't work out. In your case a 1/4 lb can would five what you want and be more reasonable. If you were closer to me Id give you a 1/2lb unique to work with.

[oldred]

I am surprised at the recoil comments concerning Varget, not disagreeing at all but it's just that I hadn't noticed that with Varget 45/70 loads for my Marlin 1895(s). Probably has to do with what I have to compare them to but Varget produces relatively low pressures compared to a lot of other published lever action level data and provides good case fill too, I really like the stuff in both the 45/70 and the longer '90 case.

[15meter]

For awhile Accurate arms offered powders in 1/4lb containers to test and work up with. I liked this as I didn't end up with a bunch on the shelf if it didn't work out. In your case a 1/4 lb can would five what you want and be more reasonable. If you were closer to me Id give you a 1/2lb unique to work with.

Only time I saw those 1/4 lb. powder cans was as free samples at either Camp Perry or Vandalia for the ATA shoot, too bad the powder companies don't offer 4 packs of 1/4 lb. samples of grouped powders -- 4 pistol powders, 4 medium rifle powders, 4 magnum powders. When you are fooling with a new to you caliber/type it would make it easier to come up with a workable load. Speaking as a guy that went from a 308 Winchester loaded with a Lee whack-a-mole to a 50-70 to a 22 Hornet as my first 3 centerfires I loaded, having a selection to work with would have made life easier for a noobie.

[Michael J. Spangler]

I agree on varget. It can be done but the loads are hot and kick way more than other powders loaded to the same velocity.


HS-6 is doable.

http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

[Traffer]

I agree on varget. It can be done but the loads are hot and kick way more than other powders loaded to the same velocity.


HS-6 is doable.

http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

Wow! read "the Use of Pistol Powders in Rifle Cartridges" that was linked to that page. A EUREKA moment. Thanks very much for the link. Some great info explained very very well.

[Michael J. Spangler]

Wow! read "the Use of Pistol Powders in Rifle Cartridges" that was linked to that page. A EUREKA moment. Thanks very much for the link. Some great info explained very very well.


You’re welcome.
I remember reading somewhere that most of this load data hovered around the transonic area. So some of the loads group horribly at the tested 50 yard distance and some tested great. The further research suggested that some bullets we’re going transonic around the target distance and settled down to give better groups at 100.
Now that was heresay and I’m not completely sure but the lack of accuracy at 50 due to trans sonic does make sense.
So it was suggested to stay well above or just below that danger zone.

[Zingger]

I have used IMR 4064 with a lot of success in my 1895 cb. It is very close in burn rate to Varget. I would encourage you to load 5 and try it. Pay attention to your crimp for a more complete burn and watch for kernels left over in the barrel.
Good luck and have fun!

[Conditor22]

This is what quickload says: I wonder why the discrepancy?:
246022

There are 3 different sets of load data for the 45-70 (for 1873 Springfield)=Mild (for 1886 Win & 1895 Marlin)=Medium (for Ruger No 1 & No 3)=Heavy

I load off the first one for my H&R. I shoot for accuracy and fun. I'm not hunting elephants, dinosaurs or tanks and value what's left of my shoulder:)

[EMC45]

I settled on 15-16gr. Unique and killed 3 deer with that load under a Lee 405gr. RNFP.

[wallacem]

15 gr of Unique is a good load. . Wallacem in Ga