Double Charge of Unique

[cbennett]

Gentlemen, I was at the range with my Brother in law yesterday. John is a fairly new handloader and he was shooting a Model 94 Winchester with 7.5 grains Unique and a 165 coated lead bullet. We were shooting steel plates and one of his rounds was much louder than his others. He really struggled getting the lever opened and when his case ejected I grabbed it. The primer was intact but very flat! I told him to put the rifle up until we could determine the cause. I took his rounds home and weighed them. I had 2 that were heavier and I broke them down with my collet puller. I found 15 grains of Unique in them (double charge). Question is them rifle seems fine and when I told him what I found he was curious about the condition of the rifle. Any thing to check as far as the action? Lock seems tight and he called me and said that he fired a few factory loads afterward and it seemed fine.
Any ideas on the pressure of that load? I am assuming that he was very lucky that he did not have a grenade in his face.
I have talked him into 4198 for his cast loads now!

[Tracy]

Sounds like the rifle is ok.
A bulkier powder like 4198 or 2400 will help protect him from the real problem, but he needs to examine his loading technique and deal with that.

[Kev18]

What caliber? 4198 or 3031 maybe. Tell him to take his time and not post pone anything... Sometimes I want to do that. Im adding powder, then run outside to get the mail, then I get distracted and go do something else before actually going back to reloading. Its easy to lose track! :)

[cbennett]

Kev, it was a 30-30. He said my sister called for him and I guess that was enough of a distraction. Our main concern now is the rifle it was a sweet pre 64. Any way to figure pressures?

[17nut]

It is borderline!
But any 94 after 1895 (change to nickel steel recievers) should be ok.

244510

[RED BEAR]

You really need to double check your charges. I consider myself to be careful when i load and every now and then i will miss a case ( no charge ) or double the charge. It surprises me every time but it happens.

[NSB]

Another danger is that when you get a double charge in one, you may get no powder in the one next to it. Putting a squib in the barrel followed by another (and possibly a double charged one) will damage the gun...and possibly the shooter.

[popper]

Indeed borderline but shouldn't hurt anything. IIRC 12 is pretty much book max, 10 is the LOAD. I'd scrap that fired case! Also clean the lead from the barrel! For Unique I drop powder (watch it drop through the tube) and immediately seat the boolit! Don't trust a loading block!

[robg]

tac is a good powder for the 3030,cant double charge

[cbennett]

Gentlemen, Thank You. John (Brother in Law) is going to the charge the case -load the bullet route in the future if he uses Unique again. I really appreciate the quick load pressures.

[redhawk0]

I assume he charges all cases in a single step....to avoid this I got into the habit about 30 years ago of charging a case the seating a bullet all in one step. For me this eliminated the possibility of a double charge. And...of course a bulkier powder would help.

redhawk

[dverna]

Tell him to ALWAYS seat the bullet as soon as the case is charged. That will prevent a double charge.

There is no good reason to charge all the cases first and then seat the bullets...that is the main cause of double charges when using a single stage reloader.

And I do not buy into the procedure of having a loading block of charged cases and to visually check the cases before seating bullets. I know one person who loaded this way and missed one. And it only takes one mistake.

Charging powder and then immediately seating the bullet is safer and also faster.

[JBinMN]

I am glad no one was hurt.

You did not say if he was "batch loading" on a single stage or using another system, but if he is batch loading & still wants to use Unique, or even the other powders, the "dowel method" of using a dowel smaller than the neck on the cartridge, stuck into the cartridge gently, then marked with the correct load amount at the neck with a black marker/pen should help prevent over charges.

One can check the whole tray at once & then place the boolit on the cases afterwards, or do it one at a time by checking each load once charged, then set the boolit on the case. Even doing it one at a time & seating the boolit on the press works.

One can write the caliber & load amount on the side of the dowel where the fingers would hold it to ID it for future loads, and to keep it from being mistaken for other loads/powder/calibers. One can get more than a few of them out of a 36" dowel for use with other powders. To get fancy, one can mark the part of the dowel that goes into the case with a red marker/pen to indicate "danger" when red is showing above the case mouth for where the MAX load would be to prevent going over MAX..

Anyway, whatever is done to try to stop the issue, I hope it works well for him.
G'Luck!
:)

[pietro]

.

There are two other damages, beside excessive headspace, that a Winchester 94 can receive from an overload:

1) The receiver sidewalls can be stretched lengthwise.

2) The bottom of the barrel near the chamber can bulge, or blow out - due to the thinness there.


I would respectfully suggest having a qualified gunsmith (not some AR parts-changer) thoroughly check out the gun before shooting it again.


.

[PAndy]

cbennett thanks for sharing the story. Like others here, I don't completely trust myself charging cases. It is a boring task and my mind can wander. I hold a light up beside my eyes and look down every one before seating bullets. with some loads, it could be possible to miss a double charge even if you looked right at it. Some ball powders are not very shiny, and you have to look hard to make sure that powder is even in there. I try to fill half the case volume, such as 1.3 cc in a 30-30 case, but that doesn't work in all situations with mild loads. 4895 reduced loads work well also, if the power level fits the situation. My last two bottles of h4198 were pretty dense, over 14 gr per cc. IMR is bulkier but I wish they could cut the kernels a bit shorter

[snowwolfe]

Brass lays on its side. It gets picked up and charged and goes into the loading block. Once the block is full a flashlight is flashed over the cases to make sure all the powder level is at the same height. Been reloading for 54 years and have never double charged a case.
Glad your friend endured his error with no loss of limb or rifle.

[GregLaROCHE]

I seat the boolit after charging the case, most of the time. If not I am really careful! And do it less and less. Surprised how many others seat the boolit after charging. It’s definitely the safest way.

Maybe I’m getting old, but I agree it would be a good idea to have it checked by a qualified gunsmith, if you can find one. A double charge is a lot. Not like increasing by small increments, checking for signs of over pressure each time.

[Froogal]

Unique is bulky enough that a double charge would be obvious, IF he visually inspected each case after charging with powder.

[country gent]

I would recommend having the headspace checked if possible. As a check to make sure. Ive seen lugs set back from borderline loads. Im not trying to worry but rather have you be on the safe side

[Texas by God]

Brass lays on its side. It gets picked up and charged and goes into the loading block. Once the block is full a flashlight is flashed over the cases to make sure all the powder level is at the same height. Been reloading for 54 years and have never double charged a case.
Glad your friend endured his error with no loss of limb or rifle.Exactly this. With good reading glasses.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[Tracy]

I assume he charges all cases in a single step....to avoid this I got into the habit about 30 years ago of charging a case the seating a bullet all in one step. For me this eliminated the possibility of a double charge. And...of course a bulkier powder would help.

redhawk

I always batch charge. The "charge and immediately seat" technique doesn't prevent mishaps; it only quickly hides the mishap if it occurs. Did that last one get a charge? Did the powder bridge? Did I double charge while my mind was wandering, and then hide the fact by seating a bullet over it?

I batch charge, then shine a light into every case to make sure the powder level is the same in all of them, before starting the bullet seating process. That is the most foolproof way to load, in my experience. The inspection only takes a few seconds, and as long as you always do it it's pretty hard to mess it up.

[Wally]

I do the same....it works as you add a step to inspect the powder depth. The charge and seat each bullet works, but is a bit tedious IMHO.



Brass lays on its side. It gets picked up and charged and goes into the loading block. Once the block is full a flashlight is flashed over the cases to make sure all the powder level is at the same height. Been reloading for 54 years and have never double charged a case.
Glad your friend endured his error with no loss of limb or rifle.

[RogerDat]

Tell him to ALWAYS seat the bullet as soon as the case is charged. That will prevent a double charge.

There is no good reason to charge all the cases first and then seat the bullets...that is the main cause of double charges when using a single stage reloader.

And I do not buy into the procedure of having a loading block of charged cases and to visually check the cases before seating bullets. I know one person who loaded this way and missed one. And it only takes one mistake.

Charging powder and then immediately seating the bullet is safer and also faster. I'm one of those that if not using a turret press with index rod I will complete a single step on all cases. I use a small LED flashlight to check that all powder levels are visually the same. I do know others that go with the charge and seat bullet route. I think that the consistency of the practice is more important than which one you choose. You need to be able to be consistent with what you do. Whatever works to support that is good.

[alamogunr]

I'm another on that uses a small flashlight to check powder level. Before last Christmas, I bought several of these:
http://tinyurl.com/yypd4va5

to use as gifts. That was enough to leave me with 2 or 3 to have setting around in the shop.

[Larry Gibson]

Classic case that a double charge of fast burning powder is not always going to be catastrophic. Fortunately in this case it was not.

To prevent such I developed a hard and fast rule; Any case on a case block/tray has powder in it.

I do not put cases in a block/tray and then put powder in them. The empty, primed and load ready cases are in small containers. One at a time is taken out, a powder charge put in and then set in the block/tray. I never, ever put an empty case in the block/tray for any reason. I also do a visual with a flash light of all the cases in the block/tray before seating bullets or putting a dacron filler in first.

[dangitgriff]

Larry Gibson, that is a good idea and one I will put to use next reloading session.

[dverna]

Gentlemen, I was at the range with my Brother in law yesterday. John is a fairly new handloader and he was shooting a Model 94 Winchester with 7.5 grains Unique and a 165 coated lead bullet. We were shooting steel plates and one of his rounds was much louder than his others. He really struggled getting the lever opened and when his case ejected I grabbed it. The primer was intact but very flat! I told him to put the rifle up until we could determine the cause. I took his rounds home and weighed them. I had 2 that were heavier and I broke them down with my collet puller. I found 15 grains of Unique in them (double charge). Question is them rifle seems fine and when I told him what I found he was curious about the condition of the rifle. Any thing to check as far as the action? Lock seems tight and he called me and said that he fired a few factory loads afterward and it seemed fine.
Any ideas on the pressure of that load? I am assuming that he was very lucky that he did not have a grenade in his face.
I have talked him into 4198 for his cast loads now!

He was lucky...as were the others near him. Some double charges will cause a more severe result.

Hard to believe the guy had three double charges in one batch.

I hope some of these suggestions are heeded and that he will accept your help in developing a safer methodology.

[David LaPell]

What I do is weigh all the components separately, and then when I have the rounds loaded I weigh them. This way I know if my loads are above or below what they're supposed to be, I know for sure. There is no guesswork.

[Kev18]

Kev, it was a 30-30. He said my sister called for him and I guess that was enough of a distraction. Our main concern now is the rifle it was a sweet pre 64. Any way to figure pressures?

Look up loads. They are safe loads, and unsafe data also. You can get an average idea. And for the rifle... I wouldnt worry. I have an 1886 and have blown necks off cases. If the primer was flattened. I wouldnt worry. DO NOT DO IT AGAIN THOUGH!

[Kev18]

Also a simple method. If he is set on doing batch charging... I know above you said he wasn't but im adding to the list here. Take a wood dowel. (dollar store has some) Load one case-Stick the dowel in-Make a line on the dowel with the marker.

Now you have a gauge to check loaded cartridges. People do this on ram rods on muzzle loaders just to make sure... If the line, lines up with the case mouth.... You have a full charge.

[ulav8r]

I use the same method as Larry for rifle loads, pull empty from a container (butter tub, tupperware container, etc.), charge and set in block. For short pistol cases, pull case from container, dip powder-charge case-seat bullet. The short cases are too easy to jostle and spill with my fumble fingers so I put the bullet in right away to keep the powder in.

[cbennett]

Guys, Thanks for all of the advice. John has learned a valuable lesson as well as dodging serious trouble. He tells me that his clean living has paid off!

[Prairie Cowboy]

.

There are two other damages, beside excessive headspace, that a Winchester 94 can receive from an overload:

1) The receiver sidewalls can be stretched lengthwise.

2) The bottom of the barrel near the chamber can bulge, or blow out - due to the thinness there.


I would respectfully suggest having a qualified gunsmith (not some AR parts-changer) thoroughly check out the gun before shooting it again.


.

I was thinking the same thing about stretching, with the 94 not being that strong of an action. While the rifle may shoot just fine and seems unchanged, it's possible that it is just a mite longer.
An assessment to check for excess headspace with a no-go and a field gauge might be in order.
Perhaps the event resulted in little or no change, or perhaps the headspace is now a bit excessive.
If it is excessive, it might be hard to pin on the event, not knowing what it was before, but at least you would know.
There is also the field expedient of seating a fired primer partly into the pocket of a sized and trimmed case and then chambering and carefully closing the action to seat the primer as far in as it will go.
A measurement of the case with an accurate dial caliper before the primer was inserted and after the action was closed on it will give you the difference between the two, and the headspace.

[Prairie Cowboy]

I never really liked the loading block and flashlight method of verifying powder charges. It reveals a double charge in a straight walled case usually I guess, but it seems more difficult for bottle neck cases and small charges.
Also it leaves the charged cases open to contamination from any debris that might fall into them.

As I age I am also more aware of the effects of short term memory loss. Things like checking the time and then realizing a minute or two later that you can't remember it (unless you tell yourself to), or placing something on the kitchen counter without giving it any thought, and then forgetting where you put it a minute or two later. It happens to all ages, but it gets worse as you age.
I have always placed my powder measure close to the press and load from a container of primed cases to the left.
I pick up a case and invert it and tap the mouth on the bench to verify that it is empty and then immediately charge it with the powder measure. I glimpse into the case to verify the charge and it immediately receives a bullet. The case and bullet goes directly into the shell holder of the press where it is seated. It's all one fluid sequence that eliminates the possibility of distraction and memory error. Any interruption or glitch before the bullet is seated and I dump the charge back into the measure reservoir.

[gnostic]

Recently I double charged a 38spl with 7.6 grains of Titegroup, without damage to my 2 1/2" 686. The shell holder on my 550 Dillon cracked vertically causing the full tube of primers to fall on the floor. When I cycled the press without a case, you couldn't see the crack. When the press was cycled with an unsized case in the shell holder, the resistance of resizing the case exposed the crack. I called Dillon and they didn't know what the problem was, it took me awhile to figure it out. It sounds really dumb, but I must have started and stopped, unloading each stage twenty times. In the course of starting, unloading each stage and picking up the primers off the the floor, I just screwed up and double charged a case. The case with the double charge was obviously hotter than my standard 38spl handload and did crack the case horizontally about 3/8" above the rim. But, aside from the broken case, it wasn't a real big deal.

[cbennett]

Prairie, Thanks for that advice. I had looked at this 94 for him earlier and it is one that did not back primers out on normal loads. I will check it when I see him on the 4th.
To shift this thread, I have looked at a few rimmed cartridge's and realized that the rim thickness also can determine headspace. I do not have my manuals here with me but it seems that compared to the old specs todays rims are several thousandths thinner even on new brass, thoughts?

[richhodg66]

Unique is bulky enough that a double charge would be obvious, IF he visually inspected each case after charging with powder.

Yes. I use the load block method quite a bit, but with bottle necked cartridges, it's a lot more difficult. Lately I've been keeping rifle cases turned upside down and turn over only the one I'm charging and then seat a bullet, no doubts whether one has been charged or double charged.

Never doubled charged a case that I can recall, but did manage to load two out of about 50 .45 Colt rounds without powder the other day. Fortunately, I pay attention when I shoot and it was immediately apparent those two weren't like the others so I stopped and dislodged bullets before proceeding. It pays to be careful, both loading and shooting.

[missionary5155]

Here is another reason I like to use a dipper for deep large cases... especially a bottleneck.
Mike in Peru

[dangitgriff]

Hey, Mike in Peru—
What’s shakin’ down there? Heard there were some temblors in that country recently.
You can get some good earthquake forecast info at Suspicious0bservers.org.

[jimb16]

I batch load, charging up to 50 cases at a time. But before I seat any bullets, I visually inspect ALL of the charged cases using a flashlight. If any case looks different from the others, it gets dumped and recharged. It has proven interesting since it has disclosed such things as spiders and other unwanted things in the cases! You never know!

[35 Whelen]

Don't feel bad, I've done it twice.

The first time was a double charge of Unique (12.0 grs.) in a Enfield .303 British with a 203 gr. cast bullet. Although the bolt was difficult to open, no harm, no foul. In fact I sold all my Enfield's except that particular one. I kept it because it was the most accurate of all I owned.

Second time I was loading a small batch of target loads of 5.0 grs. of B'Eye and a 250 cast RN for one of my Uberti .44 Special's. One of the grandkids was Papaw-ing me to death and I failed to visually check the charges. I fired two before the light came on. Again, no harm no foul and I still have and use the revolver.

Now I visually check ALL revolver cases and use a short wooden dowel to check bottle neck cases.

I'm of the uneducated opinion that cast bullets are very forgiving.

35W

[john.k]

I was a bit luckier........my double charges showed up as a dud ,and then a stuck bullet........I pulled the batch and a whole lot were wrong........then I investigated ,powder was feeding erratically from the measure,sometimes sticking in the spout for three loads,before the lot would come down.......but a lot more were 2/3 coming out ,1/3 sticking for the next load or something like....Cured by rapping the spout with a steel rod every load. I junked the measure after that,got a better one.

[762 shooter]

I load up a loading block. Visually inspect with a flashlight. Then dowel check. I can check 50 cases in one minute.

Exposives near face = can't check too much.

762

[trapper9260]

When I load. no matter if it is for test rounds or 50 to 100 cases of one load. I do one step at a time. after I prime the cases. I turn them upside down in what I use for the cases or do like what Larry dose with the cases . When the cases are load with powder they go in the tray and only those that are face up will have powder and any upside down ones will show up easy. The other thing is make sure there is nothing else is going on around you. If there is a phone call let the message pick it up. We all live and learn. If I am not sure for some reason some thing dose happened when I loading I will recheck all the cases .I like the dowel idea for check the powder.

[Savvy Jack]

This is exactly why I use RIFLE POWDERS in my 44-40....no chance of a double charge and cost much less than a destroyed firearm!

[Norske]

Buy your BIL some Trail Boss powder, then consult a Lyman reloading manual for charge weight. He'll notice a double charge easily.

[bob208]

I hand prime cases. then put them in the block neck down then put powder in back in block neck up. when the last one in in the block I take a flash light and check every case then load the bullets. 45 years of loading never a double charge or a squib.

[buckshotshoey]

Another vote for the loading block and flashlight. And yes, I do it for bottleneck cases too. It's simple.... its effective... and its foolproof if you do it every time. Another thing is to limit how many you do at one time. I try to do 20 COMPLETE rounds at a time and take a break.

Also I NEVER choose a powder where it's possible to double charge a case. Both of these things are reloading 101.

Remember the experiments using powder that only filled the case 1/3 of the way? Where having the powder in the front or in the back of the case can cause erratic ignition? Some of you will say it wont make a difference. Ok...you might be right if you are talking plinking ammo. But the USAMU says it does make a difference in accuracy.

So why choose a powder that is possible to double charge? That is also reloading 101. I have never double charged or light loaded a case using the basic methods above. But I also hand weigh my charges. I never got into progressive reloading. I've only been reloading for 30 years so I'm just a newbie compared to some of you!

[Captain*Kirk]

I presently use Unique on my .44-40 loads. After dropping the powder (very meticulous attention, I might add) I give each and every case a thorough visual using a very bright Streamlight LED flashlight. A double charge would stick out like a sore thumb.
It also should be second nature after this event to weigh each loaded round after seating the bullet.

[onelight]

I hand prime cases. then put them in the block neck down then put powder in back in block neck up. when the last one in in the block I take a flash light and check every case then load the bullets. 45 years of loading never a double charge or a squib.
I use this same method , another advantage to this is after all are primed in the block mouth down you can tilt the block so all the cases lean the same and sight down each row double check for high primers.

[OverMax]

10.6 Max for unique 35500 cup. I do believe your brother-in- law did proof test his rifle with 15 gr. Had to develop near 50000 CUP or better.
Good thing someone was on the ball to stop such shooting. Although I would suggest for the young mans use a completely different powder. AA-2230 that's all I use in my 30-30s 32 specials. Tried 30-31 4198 2400 in my rifles and never got the accuracy I expected.

[Walks]

I learned to load on a Lyman "C" Press. With an "open" press you can load from left to right, with a loading block on each side. I would size/decap from right to left, then prime off the press using a Lyman tong tool setting each case into the block UPSIDE down. Then expand each case and drop powder, then put the case into the block on the other side of the press. When all 20 or 50 when expanded and charged, I would check them under a strong light. Then seat and crimp if needed.

These days I do most handgun and some rifle on a progressive. I still prime off the press and and prefer to decap/size separately too.

The little Dandy Powder Measure makes these a lot easier.

[cbennett]

Max, Thanks for the information. John tried 4198 with the Missouri coated bullets and the accuracy was horrible. I gave him a few of my 150 Grain Sierras with 3031 powder and the old 94 shot very well so we eliminated the gun.
Can we get an idea on your starting wait for the AA-2230 it sounds like the direction we need to go as we are about to quit on these coated bullets ?
Thanks

[OverMax]

170 gr jacketed is what I shoot at Yankee white tails._My 2230 charge? _>27.5

[cpaspr]

I have equipment to load .45 ACP, .223 and .30 Carbine rounds on the Dillon 550B. So far. Everything else is still loaded on a single stage press.

For the rifle rounds, I add up the weight of two fully loaded cartridges, then set the beam scale about 5 grains lighter. I'll load a bunch up, but before they get boxed up I weigh them all two at a time. A single powder charge is very near the top of the case, so double-charging isn't possible for either. If two rounds tip the scale, they're good. If they don't, one or both doesn't have enough powder.

But that method doesn't work for the .45ACP so well. Too much case weight variance and comparatively lightweight powder charges. Though I've had the Dillon for many years, I'd had loaded .45ACP ammo for even longer, all done on an RCBS Jr. press. And the bright light over the loading block method has never failed me. Plus I only powder charge about 20-30 at a time before adding the bullet. But, I finally shot up all of that older .45 ACP ammo. Anyway, back to the Dillon. I recently set it up and loaded some .45 ACP wadcutters for my Convertible Blackhawk. I THOUGHT I was visually looking in to each case after the powder charge, but I missed one. And didn't hear the difference when I shot it. Fortunately, a friend standing behind me when I shot it heard the difference and stopped me before I fired another round. Good thing too! The bullet stuck 1/2" up the barrel. No powder at all.

I finished off the few remaining rounds from that last .45 ACP loading session on the Dillon and have since acquired a Hornady Powder Cop die for when I get back to loading pistol ammo on the Dillon. That should be easier than trying to look down into the shell. I may have to seat and crimp in separate steps, but I'd rather that than the alternative.

[cpaspr]

I was looking to see if I had ever asked a particular question here (I hadn't), and in doing so went down the rabbit hole of re-reading some of my old posts. I just finished re-reading this one, and though I know it's old, I wanted to add a little bit more to my last comment.

Using the Dillon, I recently loaded up 150 rounds of .30 Carbine with H110. Using the Powder Cop die, the loads were consistent. Until they weren't. They weren't off by much, but it appeared the loads started getting a bit erratic. So I started pulling each shell after the powder drop and checked each one. The charge was sometimes on, sometimes under, sometimes over. And with H110, a grain under was almost 10% below my target charge, and since the recommendation with that powder is to not decrease more than 3% below max, well, I decided it was safer to pull them all and figure out what was going on.

So, they were all pulled, the powder salvaged, and I loaded them all on the single-stage press, using a Uniflo powder measure, and checking every 10th charge. It never varied over the entire 150 round run.

What I discovered is that H110 is such a fine-grained powder that sometimes the powder in the charge bar cavity was flowing back between the charge bar and the body of the Dillon powder measure. So, even though all of my rounds made on the Dillon passed my "way undercharged" test above, many were still under- or over-charged.

So, at least for me, the Dillon has its place, but using very fine grain powders that can bridge is not one of them.

[Baltimoreed]

I’ve batch loaded powder into cases in the past but for the sake of expediency my primed rifle cases are upside down in a block, I pick up a primed case and charge it I then put it in a Bair single stage press and seat a bullet. Done. I have had a couple pistol doubles with the auto powder dump on my Dillon 550 where the case in the sizer location had an issue, split-failed to deprime etc, and a second case was pit there without advancing the shellplate. Haven’t done that in a long time.

[indian joe]

Any of us using fast burning powders its critical to develop a system in the loading room that flat out does not allow double dosing to happen
I duplex load for a couple of blackpowder cartridges and mine is ....
stand a bunch of primed cases on the bench to my left (I stand at the loading bench - always have)
powder measure is in front of me
each case I pick up is tipped upside down, charged with powder (the smokeless duplex charge) and put on the bench to my right
even still I check them with a flashlight to be sure they all got one dose of the 4227
that done I load the blackpowder and compress with a die in a small turret press

been handloading over 50 years and never loaded a double nor a powderless squib - but I always enjoyed my time at the loading bench -
For full smokeless loads I always chose a powder that filled the case as near as was practical - no way a double would fit in any of my smokeless loads - yeah it cost a little more .....................

[COUSIN DANIEL]

A auto indexing progressive reloading press is the answer. I have had star universal with ma auto index and dillon 650, as long as plate goes forward no chance of double charge.

[Wilderness]

I seat the boolit after charging the case, most of the time. If not I am really careful! And do it less and less. Surprised how many others seat the boolit after charging. It’s definitely the safest way.

I see a strong argument for charging and seating one at a time, but I have also had occasions (distractions etc) when I have questioned "did I really put powder in that case" - and it is too late to check with the bullet already seated, other than by weighing the cartridge or pulling the bullet. I have also had occasions when I have realised the poise on the balance has moved. When did that happen? How many of those loaded cartridges are off weight? Hence my general preference for powdering a group, checking, then seating.

[John Taylor]

While overloads can be a problem, underloads can also be a problem. My brother was trying to make some light loads for a 45-70 trapdoor and the gun came apart. He was using RX7 with a load under the recommended starting loads and a light bullet. It took about 4" out of the middle of the stock, the chamber end of the barrel looked like a banana peal and the top of the action was gone. The breach block was still in place. Luck was with him as he was OK. The gun had a new barrel and had been shot many times with factory ammo. Only case of detonation that I have ever seen personally. He had the barrel pointing down when he loaded it and raised it then shot so all the powder was near the base of the bullet.

[ih772]

While overloads can be a problem, underloads can also be a problem. My brother was trying to make some light loads for a 45-70 trapdoor and the gun came apart. He was using RX7 with a load under the recommended starting loads and a light bullet. It took about 4" out of the middle of the stock, the chamber end of the barrel looked like a banana peal and the top of the action was gone. The breach block was still in place. Luck was with him as he was OK. The gun had a new barrel and had been shot many times with factory ammo. Only case of detonation that I have ever seen personally. He had the barrel pointing down when he loaded it and raised it then shot so all the powder was near the base of the bullet.

He had a barrel obstruction.

[Grayone]

I batch charge cases and shine a strong light it the cases to verifie that each case shows the correct level before seating a boolit. I have reloaded since ~1970 and still have both eyes and all my fingers.

[cpaspr]

I see a strong argument for charging and seating one at a time, but I have also had occasions (distractions etc) when I have questioned "did I really put powder in that case" - and it is too late to check with the bullet already seated, other than by weighing the cartridge or pulling the bullet. I have also had occasions when I have realized the poise on the balance has moved. When did that happen? How many of those loaded cartridges are off weight? Hence my general preference for powdering a group, checking, then seating.

And that right there is why I generally batch load. Usually 25-30 at a time. Except for hunting rounds. For those, I have the powder measure drop slightly light, then trickle granule by granule into the pan, till the powder charge is exact. Then the powder goes into the shell, the bullet gets added and then round gets completed.

[762 shooter]

One needs to use a procedure that works for them.

But I will make a comment. If you can't maintain enough focus to load a 50 round tray, you may have issues loading one at a time.

Not hatin', just saying.

762

[elk hunter]

I use a slightly different method to prevent a no charge or double charge. I check the cases inside and out and then prime. When I put the primed cases in the loading block I place them upside-down, i.e. mouth down with the primer up. I weigh the powder charge, take a case from the block, put the powder in the case and set the case in the loading block with the neck/mouth up. When I finish placing the powder in the cases I check the level of the powder in the cases visually. If I see something that looks like an under or over charge I investigate. So far this has prevented any problems for me.

[john.k]

I ,and many others was caught out by erratic deliveries from a powder measure.....I suppose more correct to say ,caught out by relying on a powder measure to be accurate.

[Baltimoreed]

In case others are doing this in order to get by or extend their supply of lpp be warned. I’ve recently started using small [using both rifle and pistol] primer .45acp brass loaded on a Dillon 550] and have had dead primers stick on my decap pin and then get pulled back into the pocket and reseated by the new primer. Of course when I advance the shell plate I see the new primer in the cup which alerts me to the reseated dead primer. If I back up the plate and lever it again the primer will cooperate and fall out BUT I’ve just double loaded the case that was under the measure. When I have a sticky primer i remove the case, advance the plate and redo the odd case again. Be safe out there.

[Seeker]

And that right there is why I generally batch load. Usually 25-30 at a time. Except for hunting rounds. For those, I have the powder measure drop slightly light, then trickle granule by granule into the pan, till the powder charge is exact. Then the powder goes into the shell, the bullet gets added and then round gets completed.

That's exactly my procedure. All ready to charge cases are primer end up. They get turned over 1 at a time to charge and then it immediately gets a bullet seated.

[rockrat]

I charge cases first, before seating boolits/bullets. All charged cases are in the loading block and I take a flashlight and check each and every case for any discrepancies in the level of powder in the case. Any question, I pull that case out, inspect, and re-charge and re-inspect.

[wallacem]

I cannot see any reason to charge all your cases at one time. There are reasons not to do it. I always charge a case and move it to the press to seat the bullet. Charging is part of the bullet seating for me and makes it impossible to double charge. Think about it and change your process. Wallacem in Ga

[AviatorTroy]

Brass lays on its side. It gets picked up and charged and goes into the loading block. Once the block is full a flashlight is flashed over the cases to make sure all the powder level is at the same height. Been reloading for 54 years and have never double charged a case.
Glad your friend endured his error with no loss of limb or rifle.
That is my exact method as well, and what I taught my son to do.

[Walks]

I place fully prepped case upside down in a loading block. Charge a case and seat a bullet, then place loaded round in another loading block.

[HighUintas]

I was thinking the same thing about stretching, with the 94 not being that strong of an action. While the rifle may shoot just fine and seems unchanged, it's possible that it is just a mite longer.
An assessment to check for excess headspace with a no-go and a field gauge might be in order.
Perhaps the event resulted in little or no change, or perhaps the headspace is now a bit excessive.
If it is excessive, it might be hard to pin on the event, not knowing what it was before, but at least you would know.
There is also the field expedient of seating a fired primer partly into the pocket of a sized and trimmed case and then chambering and carefully closing the action to seat the primer as far in as it will go.
A measurement of the case with an accurate dial caliper before the primer was inserted and after the action was closed on it will give you the difference between the two, and the headspace.

That's a beautiful idea for checking headspace. I will start using that method