First revolver Questions before buying.

[Kev18]

Long story short: I live in Canada and for us to own any type of handgun you need a Restricted or Prohibited licence. BUUUT... Any handgun made before 1898 and doesn't have commercially available ammo for it is considered an antique and doesn't require anything, except for the buyer to be 18+ years old.

I was talking to a seller at a gun show and he had a few of these revolvers for sale.

A colt 1851 navy .36 cal. 2200$ . Cap and ball.

A Smith and Wesson model 3 . 44 Russian. I don't know what the price is. I think I can also reload for this caliber?

Unknown brand 400$ pocket pistol .32 RF. I have a few .32RF for a Steven's single shot I have that I could use.

Im interested in the colt and Smith but the prices are high, even for the S&W im sure.


Anyone own these? Pro's and Con's?

[Kraschenbirn]

Starline has .44 Russian brass (or you can shorten .44 Special) and you can reload using .44 Spl/.44 Mag Dies. Haven't loaded for the .44 Russian but have helped a buddy loading .45 S&W for an original #3 Schofield. .45 S&W is, essentially, a shortened .45 LC so case forming/reloading is the same procedure.

Many of those old break-tops have lock-up issues. Advise that you have it checked professionally before making a heavy investment.

Bill

[sandog]

The S&W Russian would be nice. Starline makes brass for it, maybe Ultramax or Black Hills makes loaded ammo, I'm not 100% sure. I had a couple modern top break S&W's one in .45 Colt and one in .44/40.
They feel a bit funky compared to a Colt SA, but cool revolvers nonetheless. You could actually defend yourself well if you got the S&W #3, just make sure to keep to black powder only for that old steel sixgun.

Here any black powder weapon doesn't have the same classification as regular firearm. So could you possess a newly made black powder revolver, or does it have to fall into that pre 1898 date ?
I'd be willing to put a lot of rounds through a reproduction 1851 Colt, but I'd want to baby an original.
Except for breaking a spring though they are pretty tough, not likely to hurt it firing BP.

The 1851 Navy was (is) one of the best handling revolvers ever.
I had a pair of Cimarron Open Tops, like an 1851 or 1861 but fired modern centerfire ammo.
They both felt good, but the longer Army grip frame on my .45 Schofield one felt better than the short grip on the .38 Special Navy model.

There might be more than one flavor of .32 rimfire. Make sure the rounds you have are the same as what the pocket pistol uses. I think for most of the 20th Century C.I.L. of Canada sold some of those obsolete calibers. Industries Valcartier bough them out in the 70's, and now is part of General Dynamics from what I heard..

[Outpost75]

Do modern reproduction cap & ball revolvers such as the Ruger Old Army require a restricted licence in Canada?

The ROA is the best C&B revolver ever made, being durable, accurate and strong.

Of course there are modern reproductions of the Colt and Remington C&B revolvers too.

[Kev18]

Do modern reproduction cap & ball revolvers such as the Ruger Old Army require a restricted licence in Canada?

The ROA is the best C&B revolver ever made, being durable, accurate and strong.

Of course there are modern reproductions of the Colt and Remington C&B revolvers too.

Yes the repros count.
They need to be made before 1898, and not have any commercial ammo available.

For example, that same guy had a .22 revolver made in 1870's. But that is restricted because .22's are still plentiful.

[Kev18]

The S&W Russian would be nice. Starline makes brass for it, maybe Ultramax or Black Hills makes loaded ammo, I'm not 100% sure. I had a couple modern top break S&W's one in .45 Colt and one in .44/40.
They feel a bit funky compared to a Colt SA, but cool revolvers nonetheless. You could actually defend yourself well if you got the S&W #3, just make sure to keep to black powder only for that old steel sixgun.

Here any black powder weapon doesn't have the same classification as regular firearm. So could you possess a newly made black powder revolver, or does it have to fall into that pre 1898 date ?
I'd be willing to put a lot of rounds through a reproduction 1851 Colt, but I'd want to baby an original.
Except for breaking a spring though they are pretty tough, not likely to hurt it firing BP.

The 1851 Navy was (is) one of the best handling revolvers ever.
I had a pair of Cimarron Open Tops, like an 1851 or 1861 but fired modern centerfire ammo.
They both felt good, but the longer Army grip frame on my .45 Schofield one felt better than the short grip on the .38 Special Navy model.

There might be more than one flavor of .32 rimfire. Make sure the rounds you have are the same as what the pocket pistol uses. I think for most of the 20th Century C.I.L. of Canada sold some of those obsolete calibers. Industries Valcartier bough them out in the 70's, and now is part of General Dynamics from what I heard..

Il keep that in mind. Im into the whole "western" them and the 1851 looks great, but I could reload .44.

[Bazoo]

44 Russian is sparsely available in the US, I suspect you'd be able to purchase a box somewhere in Canada.

44 Russian is from 1870 and is the parent of the 44 special in 1907. Well within your western timeframe.

[Kev18]

44 Russian is sparsely available in the US, I suspect you'd be able to purchase a box somewhere in Canada.

44 Russian is from 1870 and is the parent of the 44 special in 1907. Well within your western timeframe.

I see some boxes available at the shows sometimes. I wonder how much the gun actually is... probably super expensive.

[Bazoo]

In your situation, to own a handgun that you can make ammo for, crazy expensive will be that price paid in sure.

If I'm not mistaken, those of y'all that own them, can't carry or hunt with handguns. Will this change for a handgun like you are interested in?

And, what if right now you're cool with the ammo thing but then you walk into a gun shop and see a box of 44russian on the shelves?

[RED BEAR]

Not sure 44 russian is going to work for you as the ammo is readily available from several different manufacturers. Pretty much anything that the ammo is not readily available. May be a pain to even reload for.

[Bigslug]

Soooooo. . .the problem you run into with actual antiques (vs. reproductions) is that in good, shootable condition, they're super collectible and expensive to the point where (A.) you have to question the wisdom of using them regularly and (B.) have to consider the cost of vintage guns and maintaining them vs. the permit process of acquiring something more modern with factory support where at least the GUN itself is cheaper.

Being an actual antique black powder arm, you're dealing with a system of corrosive propellants that first exposed the guns to their own "cancer causing" agents over 120 years ago, and the cold-wet-warm-cold exposure such guns will have typically received in Canada will have only raised the value of the few guns that DIDN'T get that kind of treatment.

I live in California, and as such am no stranger to similar idiotic firearm restrictions causing extra headaches and expense. Choosing to live in a world where your only daily shooters are 120+ year old black powder antiques in odd chamberings will an experience be rife with headaches and expense all its own, so it really is a matter of pick your poison. You may find that the hoops you need to jump through to shoot smokeless, common ammo through an un-rustable, easily-cleaned stainless gun are less frustrating.

[Kev18]

Soooooo. . .the problem you run into with actual antiques (vs. reproductions) is that in good, shootable condition, they're super collectible and expensive to the point where (A.) you have to question the wisdom of using them regularly and (B.) have to consider the cost of vintage guns and maintaining them vs. the permit process of acquiring something more modern with factory support where at least the GUN itself is cheaper.

Being an actual antique black powder arm, you're dealing with a system of corrosive propellants that first exposed the guns to their own "cancer causing" agents over 120 years ago, and the cold-wet-warm-cold exposure such guns will have typically received in Canada will have only raised the value of the few guns that DIDN'T get that kind of treatment.

I live in California, and as such am no stranger to similar idiotic firearm restrictions causing extra headaches and expense. Choosing to live in a world where your only daily shooters are 120+ year old black powder antiques in odd chamberings will an experience be rife with headaches and expense all its own, so it really is a matter of pick your poison. You may find that the hoops you need to jump through to shoot smokeless, common ammo through an un-rustable, easily-cleaned stainless gun are less frustrating.

I already own multiple rifles that Iv'e shot BP in. Not an issue. Even If I would get a licence I wouldnt be allowed to carry it around or shoot it on my land. Id need to only use it in a range. Which I will not do.

Im not sure what the laws are for shooting and carrying the antiques, il do research. But I just want one to leave at the cottage, and shoot occasionally. It would be less weight to carry around. I usually have a full rifle on my back when I walk around in the woods for protection.

[Kev18]

Not sure 44 russian is going to work for you as the ammo is readily available from several different manufacturers. Pretty much anything that the ammo is not readily available. May be a pain to even reload for.

Its already classified as an antique so It's fine to own. And every rifle I own is an odd ball caliber. It adds fun ( and alot of frustration ) to the reloading process ;)

[Kev18]

If anyone cares... this is the law

http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/antique-historique-eng.htm

[Dan Cash]

I am so glad I don't live in Canada.

[RED BEAR]

Yea i am a big fan of the old and or unusual. And i have to go along with the fun and frustration.

[Kev18]

Yea i am a big fan of the old and or unusual. And i have to go along with the fun and frustration.

I spent years trying to find loads for one of my rifles. I get so mad, I just leave everything there.
10 minutes later im back tinkering again8-)

[RED BEAR]

Boy that sounds familiar.