S&W , post-war, pre-Model 10 M&P question

[PBSmith]

What cast bullets/charge/ammo would you expect to shoot to point of aim in such a revolver? Range 25 yards. Barrel length 6".

Or is this a matter of each specimen being a personality unto itself?

I have little experience with fixed sight handguns. I'd hope to shoot DEWC and heavy (190-200 gr) projectiles, probably not what S&W had in mind when they built those revolvers.

Thanks.

[rintinglen]

The old prescription is 3.5 grains of Bullseye under a 158 grain boolit like the 358-311 RN. The 358-432 WC 160 grain, crimped in the crimping groove, will shoot to the same POA but you may need to tweek the charge a smidge to center it. The 200 grain boolits will shoot high.
In my old Model 10-5, I personally have had good success with a 158 grain RN and 3.9 grains of WW-231 which hits very close to POA and groups tightly.

[Outpost75]

Here are a couple targets with my six-inch M&Ps, 3.5 grains and any bullet that "fits" from 146-160 grains should work fine.

243126

1941 M&P, six rounds each 148 factory wadcutter, 158 LRN and handload 3.5 grains Bullseye with Saeco 146 DEWC

243127

An early postwar with the Saeco DEWC and 3.5 grains of Bullseye

243128

And just for good measure a 1929 Colt OP with factory LRN and wadcutter at 25 yds. Plain to see the lighter wadcutters group low and the 158s are "on the money."

[reddog81]

I believe that any bullet going around 800 to 850 FPS should hit close to POA at that distance. How much the barrel moves from when you pull the trigger until the bullet leaves the barrel it what determines POI for handguns at normal distances. However that can vary quite a bit though depending on your sight picture, how you hold the gun and how much it recoils in your hands. 2 people shooting the same load aiming at the same thing can have completely different POI. A 125 grain bullet doing 850 FPS should have about the same POI as a 158 grain bullet doing 850 FPS at that distance. The difference is with the 125 grain bullet your looking at a light/moderate load vs a full strength load with a 170 grain bullet. And that's all assuming the sights have been modified and you can shoot a discenable "group" at 25 yards. The suggested 3.5 grains of Bullseye with a 158 grain LSWC is as good a suggestion as anything else.

You'll be able to get 190 to 200 grain bullets to work, but they'll probably shoot high. Most modern manuals don't give out load data for those bullets but you can find plenty of info online assuming you can trust the source.

[gwpercle]

Use cast boolits in the 148 to 160 grain weight and adjust your powder charge to fine tune it.
A 158 grain RN was the industry standard for a long time , but a SWC , WC or RNFP can be used .
My fixed sighted 38's , J and K frames , all prefer a Lyman #358432 , 160 grain wadcutter , or the NOE version , 2.9 grains of Bullseye shoots exactly to POA , dead center of bull , 15 shots make a ragged hole 1 1/2 inch in diameter at 25 yards ( from a rest) !
That boolit and load is spooky accurate out of my model 64 S&W 38 special .
Gary

[bedbugbilly]

Mine is a 1952 M & P - 5" - I use 3.5 gr of Bulls Eye under either the 358-311 RN or the Lee TL 358-158 SWC - If I do my job, it will do the trick. Personally, I wouldn't put a heavy boolit through like you're talking about (190 - 200 grain) my M & P or my 4" CM - YMMV - what are you hoping to gain with the heavier boolit?

I don't fine open sights that difficult to use but then I've been shooting SA revolvers for years and shave some pretty primitive sights. It's a matter of "learning" your revolver with the load you have - POA to POI and adjusting your sight picture for it. Along with that, I am a real advocate of practicing at different distances - not all targets -i.e. critters like coons, woodchucks, possums, etc. will stand still while you pace off 25 or 50 yards. Practice at different distances will teach you how to hit at different distances using the same load and where to aim to hit. But if all you are gong to shoot at are given distances - then you'll soon learn your POA to POI for whatever load you ago with.

I'll also add . . I have owned a Python as well as any other revolvers through the last 55 years . . . if I could only have one, it would be my 5" M & P . . . non-adjustable sights and all with the above load. But . . everyone is different and likes different things.

[kir_kenix]

You got excellent advise above...3.5 gr bullseye with a 158 gr boolit will likely put you really darn close. If you play with the charge a bit, I'm sure you can get it dead on. 148 gr wc will likely be an inch or 2 low at 25 yards with 3.2-3.5 bullseye. These are just best guesses based on previous model 10's and a few fix sighted colts.

My father has a 10-6 4" that hits dead on with a 88gr wc over 3.2 gr bullseye...so some outliers exist. It is his favorite dueling tree and 20 yard plate gun.

[kir_kenix]

Double post

[PBSmith]

Gentlemen, thank you for the good information.

I wasn't expecting such favorable reports. Should have grabbed one of these old Smith or Colt revolvers when they were affordable.

[Outpost75]

Gentlemen, thank you for the good information.

I wasn't expecting such favorable reports. Should have grabbed one of these old Smith or Colt revolvers when they were affordable.

In the last few years I've picked up a dozen or so classic 1930s and 1940s revolvers from estate sales.

We owe it to the Greatest Generation who fought for our freedom to lovingly care for their artifacts and to adopt them as our own family heirlooms. It is a shame when an old soldier or retired cop dies and neither the wife or kids have any interest in their cherished guns.

[jimb16]

My Victory model (Later SV serial) likes the 3.5 BE behind a 158 gr. RN. So does my model 10.