Debating a new mold for hunting

[weeple2000]

I am just getting into cast bullets for rifle. I have a couple years experience loading 45 ACP with cast. I have 6 months experience casting 45's. I have probably sent 1k of that I cast, and cast 5k. For rifle I am still getting my feet wet. I have only sent a few dozen of them. So far they were all Lee C309-200-1R. I have another mold as well but I don't think the profile lends well to hunting. It is NOE 310-165-FN-H3.

My rifle is a 30-06.

The first one I bought was the Lee. At the time I thought if I couldn't go fast, I should go big. Now that I am learning a bit more, I am thinking the rounded nose profile won't lend well to hunting. I understand that a flat meplat would create a better wound channel. I am hunting white tails in northern Wisconsin. They aren't very big up there.

More recently I have been debating a ranch dog option. There are a lot of places I could order that design. It seems pretty popular. I borrowed my friends Lee C309-170-F. I wasn't too impressed with the size of the meplat. It might be an optical illusion because the bullet diameter is small to begin with, but the meplat on the 170 doesn't seem very big. Another option I found just tonight was MP .308 Hunting HP GC. That one is only 154 grain when HP.

Am I over thinking this? Should I just use the Lee 200 grain? I am confident in my shot placement. I don't want to wound a deer and let it get away though. I would rather buy a new mold if that's an issue.

The MP and ranch dog options would come in either four or five cavities. So that would be attractive. But with how often I shoot my rifle, I honestly don't think the number of cavities is that important. It just seems so futile to cast with a dual cavity vs those six bangers. My 45's though, it would drive me nuts casting those with a dual cavity. That 170 I borrowed from my friend was actually a single cavity. Probably older than I am. Two cavities seems so much more tolerable than one.

Another option would be hollow pointing my 200's. I don't want to go that route. It is an extra step. By the time I get the equipment, I might as well have bought another mold.

[RugerFan]

I am just getting into cast bullets for rifle. I have a couple years experience loading 45 ACP with cast. I have 6 months experience casting 45's. I have probably sent 1k of that I cast, and cast 5k. For rifle I am still getting my feet wet. I have only sent a few dozen of them. So far they were all Lee C309-200-1R. I have another mold as well but I don't think the profile lends well to hunting. It is NOE 310-165-FN-H3.

My rifle is a 30-06.

The first one I bought was the Lee. At the time I thought if I couldn't go fast, I should go big. Now that I am learning a bit more, I am thinking the rounded nose profile won't lend well to hunting. I understand that a flat meplat would create a better wound channel. I am hunting white tails in northern Wisconsin. They aren't very big up there.

More recently I have been debating a ranch dog option. There are a lot of places I could order that design. It seems pretty popular. I borrowed my friends Lee C309-170-F. I wasn't too impressed with the size of the meplat. It might be an optical illusion because the bullet diameter is small to begin with, but the meplat on the 170 doesn't seem very big. Another option I found just tonight was MP .308 Hunting HP GC. That one is only 154 grain when HP.

Am I over thinking this? Should I just use the Lee 200 grain? I am confident in my shot placement. I don't want to wound a deer and let it get away though. I would rather buy a new mold if that's an issue.

The MP and ranch dog options would come in either four or five cavities. So that would be attractive. But with how often I shoot my rifle, I honestly don't think the number of cavities is that important. It just seems so futile to cast with a dual cavity vs those six bangers. My 45's though, it would drive me nuts casting those with a dual cavity. That 170 I borrowed from my friend was actually a single cavity. Probably older than I am. Two cavities seems so much more tolerable than one.

Another option would be hollow pointing my 200's. I don't want to go that route. It is an extra step. By the time I get the equipment, I might as well have bought another mold.

Northern WI whitetails aren't very big? Compared to where else? If you want to see some small deer, check out some of the southern states.

Anyway, the Lee C309-200-1R should work just fine. I've taken deer with .30 cal round nosed cast bullets and the wound cavitation through the soft lung tissue is significant. The deer usually don't go beyond 15 yards if they go anywhere at all (if your shot placement is true).

[georgerkahn]

I did not read what action your '06 rifle is -- which, to me, is a significant determinant vis the bullet you may wish to cast and shoot in it -- e.g, whether it be a gas gun or a bolt action. In pretty much all cases, I'd be more concerned with the bottom of the bullet than the top, albeit hollow pointing is indeed nice. Re the bottom: I'd probably never ever think of a cast hunting bullet (just MY thoughts -- not to start a new thread re the pros and cons ;) ) which is not adorned with a gas check. Again, re possible actions, a spire point is out if you have a lever. Bottom line? I'd suggest pretty much any 185 to 225 grain gas checked RNFP bullet. Good luck!
geo

[white eagle]

Here is the one I use for my 06
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?376743-Accurate-31-194f,
it's made by Tom @ Accurate
its a very accurate boolit and I wouldn't waste your time with a hp
proper alloy is key but accuracy first

[waksupi]

For a .30 bore, I consider 200-220 gr. as optimum. Get a good meplate, you definitely don't need a hollow point.

[cwlongshot]

Weeple2000

Here is a Group Buy for a excellent design. http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?381301-ACTIVE-N-O-E-TL310-178-RF-(Ranchdog)(308-30-06-30-30-300-BO-Boolit)

While I agree a HP is not "needed" sometimes its a nice option. The way this mold is made you can use a FP, HP or deep HP all in same mold. PLUS GC or No or BOTH!

its just met the required number for the build. So you would not likely have long to wait to get this.

CW

[weeple2000]

Ok. I am on the fence about the ranch dog but I am not about to pass on an HP version. I really appreciate the heads up, this post was very timely.

[beltfed]

First of all, those N. WI. deer are not that small unless you are
"picking on" spikes/forks.
Most of my bucks out of Ashland Cty/Chequamegon have been in the
170s 180s field dressed. One was just 200# field dressed/21" spread 6 point.
All camps in our area go by the "minimum 6 point rule" 241162
First buck 1969-185#241163 the 200# buck.
Favorite North Woods rifles: '86 Win/ 45-70, 385 gr cast FP, 358 Win , 250 gr paper patched cast RN
38-55/ 265 gr FP cast. Yes there are larger bucks elsewhere,

[weeple2000]

We are not that far from there. Outside Saxon. But the most we've gotten were forkers or spikes. We saw a rack on the game camera once but I'm sure he wasn't out during the day.

I think I've gone three years now. Before I went they didn't get anything for quite sometime. It's buck only there. Iron county.

[John McCorkle]

A quillion factors all to consider but alloy and velocity are the drivers for expansion (if that is what you are looking for)

Lots of folks have used Lee 170fn for everything deer to elk. I have seen beautiful expansion with just regular round nose Lee bullets with the right alloy/velocity...I use powder coating but paper patching those alloys will also get you those velocities.

But you did say you have accuracy as a key item and I would agree. All of the factors only matter (weight, profile, expansion, velocity) if you place it where you need. If a different mold helps with that goal go for it!

But are you looking for an alloy that will expand or are you looking for wide flat metplat and nevermind on expansion?

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[weeple2000]

I was going to use bhn 10 regardless of the bullet profile.

That HP though.

[John McCorkle]

You can almost throw it by hand fast enough to get bh10 to expand well...no need for hollow point.

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[Dieselhorses]

Make sure you know what rifle will do with j word bullets first, THEN develop your cast rounds, especially getting COL where barely touches your rifling when chambered. As mentioned earlier by others, I'd go with FN. I once shot a deer with osteoporosis and my RN ricocheted off of him.

[Screwbolts]

IMHO, either of your current molds will do fine on whitetail deer. I have harvested 7 with a Boolit very similar to the NOE, same meplat size. 1950 FPS or so with the NOE and your soft alloy as listed will be deadly if you put it threw the boiler room of any deer.

[fatnhappy]

they aren't wearing kevlar. My go to boolit is the 311290 which is a 210 grain round nose. I used to putz around with hollow pointing it, no more.
If it were me, I'd push your 200 grain lee to around 1900-2000 fps with ACWW.

[quilbilly]

I set my boolits out so that the gas checks are just barely within the bottom of the neck. My "hunting 308 rifle's" magazine won't handle anything larger than a 180 gr. so my 190's on up have to be fired single shot. That may not be a consideration with your rifle. I concluded that the old 311041 from a Lyman mold that drops from my mold at 179 gr. is more than adequate for anything I care to shoot at iron sight ranges even if the 190's to 210's are a bit more accurate.

[popper]

The 30XCB is not designed to be a hunting boolit BUT - if you need long range shots it has a better BC than say a RD or 041 style (boolit drop). 2nd is alloy, what can you shoot at your expected fps (range) with accuracy. 3rd is powder selection - 4895/varget/? to get reasonable fill and fps without boolit damage. I use a 31-165C PC for my 308W and it does good with the right alloy, larger meplat than 30XCB. 31-184C for 30/30 which is a RDish design. There are many versions of the RD style - some are good and some aren't (in my 30/30). IMHO, develop good loads with your 30xcb over the summer and then look for a more hunting style when everything else is 'good'. I prefer beef and bacon so don't really look to expansion. My moulds are Accurate 2x Al and they do very well. If I were to go on a high$$ large animal hunt I would buy good hunting ammo. Yes there is a place down here that is 8k$ a day for a guarantee trophy. 50$ ammo is then very cheap.
edit: seems like 19gr 2400 and BHN in the low 20s for 06 is a good load. Bout 1800 fps. File the nose or a flat seater stem?

[richhodg66]

The Ranchdog worked fine on deer for me as did the Lyman 31141 and NOE clone of it. Generally any heavy for caliber bullet with a flat nose cast of an appropriate alloy is gonna work. The ranchdog bullet I shot a good buck with went through him at an angle, close to three feet of deer and didn't stop, so you really don't "need" anything heavier.

If it were me and I was starting out, I'd get the RCBS 180 grain FP and work with that. I haven't used it on game yet, but see no reason why it shouldn't work as well or better than the things I have used. It's been a good shooter in several rifles for me.

[RU shooter]

IMO just shoot what you have now Lee 200 or 170 and work up a good accurate load . if you don't think the flat nose is wide enough to give you confidence a few quick swipes with a file will make them wider . Just shoot it through both lungs and you'll be fine .

[John McCorkle]

Check out this post ..very last one (currently post #69) is your Lee 200 rn all expanded out...all about alloy and velocity

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcastboolits%2Egunloads% 2Ecom%2Fshowthread%2Ephp%3Ft%3D376824&share_tid=376824&share_fid=9688&share_type=t


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[white eagle]

sorry thought the link to the boolit was there
here it is http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=31-194F-D.png,
your not getting big deer may have to stay south for that
I have shot does that were close to 140 lbs. near the Dells
big bodied bucks are pretty common but we have small deer to
you need to be picky is all they don't get big being dead