Cleaning my Lyman Plains rifle

[stick]

I have a problem with cleaning my Lyman Great Plains rifle. Use very hot soapy water and I still get patches that look like rust. Have used black powder solvent and still get the same results. Run about 25 patches down the barrel to dry and still they come out with rust looking on them.
Can anyone tell me what the problem is and how to correct it ?

[Ozark mike]

Are you using real black or fake stuff

[Good Cheer]

Yo stick.
It could be something as simple as your water chemistry. If the rusting is really a lot maybe could use one of the products on the market to make it go away. There's Ballistol and Bore Shine, surely must be others.

[Good Cheer]

Had the same thing with our well water in southeast Texas.

[bob208]

dry the barrel then soak a patch with wd-40 and wipe the bore with it.call it good go back in 2 days and oil it again. been doing it that way for 25 years with out a problem.

[country gent]

Balistol is a water soluble oil cleaner mix it 10 parts water to 1 part balistol. Will become a milky white. use this and clean. I don't normally get any rust colored patches from my BPCR rifles using this. At the range windex with vinegar or the balistol to wipe. I clean every 12-15 rounds. I have found real Black powder cleans easier and faster than the subs. ANither little thing is use bullet lube SPG emmerts or what your using to preserve the barrel this is a heavier coating and stays in place better. It may also over time season the barrel

[Tom W.]

I've used Ivory soap and as hot water as possible. I did have Black, but went to Pyrodex. I also use gauze instead of old t shirts or something and it does better. I quit using WD-40 some years ago as it turned orange in the bore, looking like rust, but was a female dog to clean out. I started using RemOil to coat the bore with and the problems went away.

I do believe what you are getting is just light surface rust that happens when the barrel is hot and the lubricants , along with the dirt, are removed. A coating of Remoil should eliminate the rust.

[Boogieman]

Are You cleaning the powder chamber in the breach plug?

[sghart3578]

I stopped using any water in my GPR and my Pedersoli flintlock.

I lube my shooting patches with Hoppe's Blackpowder Solvent.

When I am done I clean the patent breech and bore with patches soaked in the same Hoppe's Blackpowder Solvent.

I then dry the bore and breech with clean, dry patches.

Lastly I lube the bore with any gun oil like Hoppe's Gun Oil.

I shot a bunch of blackpowder last year and my bores are clean, shiny and rust free.

[FrontierMuzzleloading]

warm soapy water, dry, shot of alcohol, dry, favorite gun oil.

Im betting the rifling is rough and when hot water is causing flash rust.

[Chill Wills]

warm soapy water, dry, shot of alcohol, dry, favorite gun oil.

Im betting the rifling is rough and when hot water is causing flash rust.

A shot of alcohol would be good.
I use Jim Beam.

[OverMax]

All the years of my cleaning T/c sidelocks I can't remember ever seeing a clean last patch. Always slightly streaking of rust brown was observed. There after as soon as my barrel/s bore was lubed for storage if there was any quick corrosion happening. It was immediately stopped with a good B/p patch lubricant _ Ox-Yoke Wonder Lube.

[arcticap]

I agree that it sounds like flash rust that could be caused by the hot water being in contact with the barrel for too long.
But if there's any previous rusting or pits in the barrel, that can also be quickly spread by hot water.
Saturating the barrel and powder residue with mineral oil, Ballistol or Bore Butter before leaving the range or when you get home and before washing, might help to prevent
some of the flash rust.
That could help to loosen up the crud and protect the bore from the hot water.
But the bore needs to be dried quickly after washing.
Maybe using 91% alcohol can help displace the water.
And the bore does need to be flushed out with clean water to remove the old dirty water if it's not being completely rinsed out before the flash rust starts to form.

I usually coat the bore with Bore Butter, then go back and check it after a day or two, or even sooner and replace with another coat of Bore Butter.
It can help remove and dissolve any residue left in the rifling grooves.

Some folks think that cooler water or room temperature water is better for preventing flash rust than very hot water.

I have never seen flash rust result from using BP solvents.
Some BP solvents may contain water, but some are better than others.
If you need to switch away from water and use a better solvent then do so.
If a waterless solvent is used and rust still appears, then that may suggest previous corrosion in the barrel that hasn't been stopped from advancing.
Once a little bit if rust begins in small pits in the barrel, then I think that it needs to be scrubbed out with a bore brush and then use some heavy treatments of lube that stays in place.
And keep checking for signs of rust, wipe out the old lube and replace with new lube.

[Good Cheer]

A shot of alcohol would be good.
I use Jim Beam.

The bore solvent that created the legends of Kentucky long rifles!
:rolleyes:

[rfd]

to each their own, but i see where too many folks just don't have a clue as to how a traditional muzzleloader, used with real black powder, should be cared for when it comes to cleaning, nor what to expect during that cleaning process. there was no need for soaps and hot water back in the day, and that's no different here in the 21st millennium.

there is absolutely NO need for anything more than plain tepid tap water to clean out black powder residue ... UNLESS the gun has not been maintained properly, which means keeping the residue soft after the last shot taken and before leaving the range/field/whatever and getting the actual cleaning done whence back at the ranch. if the barrel was improperly maintained for cleaning, that's the time when concoctions and more invasive methods of cleaning out the **** will be mandatory - and a ton of elbow grease will be required.

for the extreme most part, all these offshore guns have patent breeches - that is, an ante-chamber of a much smaller diameter. yer bore sized cleaning jag won't get in there to better clean out the bp soot and a proper sized brush that's draped with a patch is required.

240568

[charlie b]

I used to use hot water for cleaning and found the same flash rust problem. Also had the rust color residue left from using WD40. Stopped using both.

For my Lyman I wipe the bore first to get most of the crud out (I shoot Pyrodex). Then I remove the nipple and clean that area with a pipe cleaner. Last step is to run some alcohol down that into the bore.

Then I clean the patent breech chamber. Like suggested above, a .30 or so brush wrapped with a patch soaked in whatever you want to use. I use Ed's Red just cause it works for me and is cheap. I clean the patent breech until I see no more powder residue.

Then I clean the bore. Once done I oil it.

Before firing I take off the nipple and run alcohol through to the patent breech. Then clean bore with same. I only wipe the bore about every 5-10 shots. At the range I use Windex.

[waksupi]

Don't use hot water, just plain old tap water. Hot water causes flash rusting.

[taco650]

When I cleaned my Traditions Kentucky rifle and my homemade Hawken (which has a T/C Hawken barrel) recently, I used warm water with dish soap. I'm shooting real BP. I took the barrels out, put the breech end in a bucket with the soap/water mix, cut up t-shirt patch on my jag and then pumped it until the water came out the muzzle. Couple cycles of that cleaned it out. Oiled the barrel with CLP which caused some rust so scrubbed the bore with my bronze brush, then several patches soaked in air tool oil (its what I had) and no more rust.

I had tried Pyrodex and shooting it was ok but the cleaning left rust. Did some more research online and decided real BP was still the best choice and easiest to deal with for me.

[Buzzard II]

I agree with rfd and waksupi. Use plain tap water. I would then use Ballistol in the barrel, on the barrel and on the wood too. Ballistol also helps to slow down any burning on the stock around the nipple. I only use real black powder. I like it. Good shooting.
Bob

[rfd]

i've gotten to using straight ballistol for cleaning all my guns - long gun black powder and smokeless handguns. 1:6 or so ballistol:water mix for the actual cleaning part and straight up for the lube part.

[oconeedan]

All good posts above.
My way...put a cap on nipple and lower hammer, or stick tooth pick in flash hole. Stand up gun and fill bore with a bottle of water / small squirt of dish soap. Let it soak while cleaning up other range gear.
Dump out water, swab with patches until dry. Use can of WD40 and spray directly down bore, follow with patch to make sure entire bore is coated. Leave the bore wet with WD.
Wipe down gun and stock. OK when WD gets on stock, it'll make it purty!
You will get rusty colored patches, that is ok. My bores are slick and I have shot them a lot! Dan

[rfd]

IMHO ... no dish soap needed, not ever. i save that for the BPCR fired case jug, at best, and even then, sparsely. you really want to use as little chemicals as possible, which includes hoppes and windex and hydrogen peroxide and etc etc etc. if need be, use that stuff to get the gun back to square one, then stick with plain water and a water soluble oil (which in the long run will be better than wd40). water soluble oils such as ballistol are actually good for the wood, wd40 not so much so, because whatever secret ingredients are in "Water Displacing #40" they have not been kind to some of the wood finishes on my guns.

[charlie b]

The original Break Free CLP used to show a rust color residue for me when cleaning. It also continued cleaning for a couple days if there was anything left. Worked really good on tank cannons too :)

[triggerhappy243]

I have a problem with cleaning my Lyman Great Plains rifle. Use very hot soapy water and I still get patches that look like rust. Have used black powder solvent and still get the same results. Run about 25 patches down the barrel to dry and still they come out with rust looking on them.
Can anyone tell me what the problem is and how to correct it ?

stick:, the flash rust is normal with water. I deal with it too. I use literally boiling hot water to flush the barrel out. But I start off with a powder solvent that will assist in neutralizing the corrosive properties. the hot water heats the steel to the point that you need a leather glove to hold it. This............ will aid in getting the balance of moisture to dry out. Then, I wipe the bore with a good oil that will penetrate the pores in the steel.

The flushing part by definition: Remove the nipple. place breechend of barrel in bucket of said hot water. I start with a bronze bore brush to scrub the bore (10 strokes with a dash of dawn dish soap). Then, I use a 2x2 inch flannel patch on my jag and commence to drawing the hot water up into the barrel like a pumpjack on an oil well up and down with force being applied to the down stroke. repeat (30-40 strokes). change the water to clean fresh hot water and repeat. Dry the bore with cotton flannel patches, then anoint the bore (while still hot), with your favorite rust preventative.

This is my method. It works for me. If the water in your area has corrosive properties, try distilled water.

[OverMax]

Back in the day there was a aerosol _water displacing_ gun oil_ sold by T/c called Number 13. Still have a few un-open 5oz spray cans of it. Pretty good stuff for long term storage and too all T/c B/p guns were sprayed with #13 aerosol prior to there shipping years ago. But such #13 spray lube stunk of wintergreen. A smell not at all pleasing to my nose. Even so still a tad better smell than Balistol's ol' outhouse scent.

[hc18flyer]

I use hot water and pump it up the bore, and out the flash channel. I started with the 'bore butter ' type lubes thirty years ago, works for me. Nothing else even goes in the bore. Hot water, couple of lubed patches, and stand the barrel, muzzle down overnight, next to the woodstove. Next day, couple more lubed patches, then a Qtip to the nipple, little lube on the nipple threads, put her together, ready for storage. Right or wrong, it works, hc18flyer

[hc18flyer]

Sorry, pipe cleaner, folded in half for the nipple. Small brass wire thru the flash hole.

[725]

The following works for me. I do this with range guns after every session. Swab out with windex, simple green, or the like. Copious amounts until it flows. Dry patches followed by copious amounts of WD-40, PB Blaster flowed by a dry patch. If it comes clean, I wet patch 'em and put 'em away. Within a week, I do another wet patch and go from there. I shoot these guns for a class given all summer and they are in as good a shape as they were almost 20 years ago.