Fixing the Drip-O-matic

[Petrol & Powder]

I finally had enough and pulled the side plates off my Lee 4-20 so I could fix an annoying problem.

The handle that operates the nozzle slides up and down on two screws that act as guides and limit the travel. The upper screw constantly worked its way out of the side plate and caused the handle to move too far or get hung up. The problem is that screw just has sheet metal type threads that engage an extruded channel inside the side plate. There just isn't much there for the threads to engage. It is a classic example of how Lee found a way to cut costs.

The quick fix was to just use a pair of pliers to compress the sides of that channel so that the threads had a little more purchase.

I think the next time I have that apart I'll fabricate a more permanent solution.

On a positive note, about a year ago I polished the nozzle seat and the tip of the metering rod and that stopped the dripping.

At some point in time I'll replace the 4-20 with a RCBS Pro-melt. For now I'm making the cheap Drip-O-Matic work.

[cwlongshot]

Its not just LEE Pots..

https://oimg.photobucket.com/albums/v465/CWLONGSHOT/Temp%20stuff/sporting%20pics/Bullets/Casting/C04D39FC-8A59-45CC-8BD2-C129635E4BAE_zpss905dkf2.jpeg

BUT< LEE can bring drips to a new level. :)

https://oimg.photobucket.com/albums/v465/CWLONGSHOT/Temp%20stuff/sporting%20pics/Bullets/Casting/ABB5AAD4-56CE-4331-8249-2FBA7CD0EC34_zpsfwwpiap6.jpg

CW

[OS OK]

If you want your Lee 4-20 to work well...you will have to modify it some and use clean ingots and stop putting sawdust in there for flux. Ever now and then you must scrape the interior of the pot liner when it's empty and do a little preventative maintenance.

And...you never turn your back on a problematic pot and walk away from it.


https://i.imgur.com/Poyd9Lb.jpg

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I've found those two screws that act as slides see more than their share of abuse...if they aren't lubed, they can bind. I have oiled them with a tiny amount of Bullplate or Synth two cycle oil. I also lube the adjustment screw, As the alloy level gets low, I find myself adjusting while casting,and it turns much easier when lubed.

[Conditor22]

You need to be gentle with Lee drip-o-matics.

Lifting the vale knob harder will not make the lead come out faster, all it will do is loosen the top shoulder bolt that holds the valve arm assembly on. Another problem I found is that the further the vale knob sticks out from the pot the more strain it puts on the top shoulder bolt. (see double red arrow)
I also found that the closer to the pot you lift the vale knob, the easier it lifts with less strain on the shoulder bolts, also allowing the valve to close easier.:)

https://i.imgur.com/9ayc0Nk.png

I'm planning on making either, a leather or thin plywood disk to fit between the Valve Arm Assembly and the Valve Knob so I don't have to worry about "jamming/placing" my finger as close as I can to the Valve Arm Assembly for a straighter lift.

Try lifting with just the tip of one finger, you'll be less likely to force it.

If the lead isn't coming out as fast as you want, lifting it harder won't help (I know I do this also [smilie=b:)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?380707-Easy-DIY-Bottom-pour-spout-cleaner

[Tom W.]

I have two, a 10 and a 20 pound pot. The smaller pot I used to use for casting pure lead. It is VERY old, and works fine. The bigger pot isn't quite as old, but it's far from new. Two years ago I was ready to throw it into the river, as it started dripping terribly. I drained it, cleaned it well and then took out the valve rod and polished it and the spout with valve lapping compound. That stopped the leak. I won't lie and say that it doesn't drip a little bit, but it surely doesn't pour out like it did.....
For the price paid and the service rendered, I ain't gonna complain about either Lee pot.

[jimkim]

I keep saying someone, with a shop, needs to make a bolt on lever mecanism for the Lee pots, that adds a spring to it. Something like this valve/lever assembly made to bolt to the top of a Lee pot, would fix the drip. I'd also lap the valve, and add a place for a pid sensor. The entire assembly could be attached to a piece of angle iron, and screw to the top of the Lee pot. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190422/9d823ddf65c038452e7b200e36372bf7.jpg

Sent from my VS880 using Tapatalk

[Dieselhorses]

I keep saying someone, with a shop, needs to make a bolt on lever mecanism for the Lee pots, that adds a spring to it. Something like this valve/lever assembly made to bolt to the top of a Lee pot, would fix the drip. I'd also lap the valve, and add a place for a pid sensor. The entire assembly could be attached to a piece of angle iron, and screw to the top of the Lee pot. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190422/9d823ddf65c038452e7b200e36372bf7.jpg

Sent from my VS880 using Tapatalk

I think I’m going to do that mod. Thx!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Petrol & Powder]

I fixed the dripping issue by polishing the valve seat and metering rod. I'm happy with that fix.

Those shoulder bolts (more aptly called sheet metal screws with a portion of unthreaded shank) are about as cheap as Lee could make that part. They screw into an aluminum channel and there's not a lot of metal there for the threads to 'bite".

I'm certain I can improve upon that design.

In the meantime, it's working as it should.

[Conditor22]

You could get a longer shoulder bolt for the Lee and put a washer and spring on it pushing the rod down

[KenH]

I fixed my leaking 4-20 Lee pot by adding a brass weight to the top of valve rod. That little bit of extra (3 oz?) weight presses a bit more on the seat preventing the leak.

[Green Frog]

I’ve got two of the “20 pound” Lees and have had a 10 and a 20# Lyman as well as having used a 20# RCBS a fair amount. Anyone who says they have ANY bottom pour pot that doesn’t drip isn’t using it very much! I just got another 10# Lyman (used) and before I put it or either of my Lees into use they will get a little lapping.. I’m also thinking hard about that brass weight that KenH mentions. I don’t suppose you’d be willing to post a picture of it, would Ken? [smilie=1:

Froggie

[mdi]

And...you never turn your back on a problematic pot and walk away from it.
General Shop Practice 101; never leave a machine unattended (or any powered, electrical equipment). I have been using my Lee Pro 4-20 for maybe 18 years. If the alloy is not clean, the pot will drip. If the lever screws work loose, the pot may drip (but it is a well known phenomenon that constant/repeated heating and cooling will "loosen" screws, but there is high temp. Lock Tite). I added some weight to the valve operating handle via lead washers and my pot leaks very little. But, as my usual shop practice, I keep my equipment well maintained and clean. I occasionally empty my pot, wire brush the ID, and clean the needle valve and seat. No big deal, just proper tool ownership, maintenance...

If you just melt, pour, and turn off your pot, expect less than optimum service, and don't whine about cheap equipment...

[Nodakjohns]

I am glad I found this place ! I have only had 3 casting sessions in my life so far. But my casting is getting fairly advanced. I have not had a problem yet with mine dripping. I have had it freeze up a half a dozen times. But my casting sessions were in 40° weather outside with a wind. But so far I have a lead battery clamp hanging from the handle of my PID controlled 4-20.i learned to heat the nozzle up with a torch and keep a screwdriver handy to turn the top of the arm when the time comes. I also learned to leave my pot full when I turn it off. All ideas I would have had to learn in a lifetime of casting. It has made me have some success an know the why when I didn't. This forum has been invaluable.

[Dave W.]

I'd freeze if trying to cast in 40 degree weather. I tend to have the best luck casting when it is 80 degrees. Because of that I cast in the beginning of summer and in the fall.

[Iron369]

My 20-4 pot drips terribly. Between every single pour it drips. I’ve learned to pour, while holding the mold in one hand I turn the pin a quarter turn, then cut the sprue. If I don’t, the drips will break up and send little fragments of molten lead flying. It’s been like that since I bought it. I even took it apart and bought a new pin. Same thing. I guess some people get all the luck. I’m not one of those people.

[robg]

My 10 lb pot is much less drippy since I cleaned and polished the nozzle etc but I stand my pot in a baking tray to catch any drips and splashes.its only 20 years old .

[Pablo 5959]

I guess I just got lucky. Mine drips but nothing like I see here.
Before I started using range scrap I never had any drips.
I just put a small metal cup under the spout and return the lead back about every 50th pour.
Losing maybe 5 or 10 degrees. Not enough to have to stop casting.

[Froogal]

Fluxing with candle wax every time new lead is added seems to help.

[Mike W1]

My 10 lb pot is much less drippy since I cleaned and polished the nozzle etc but I stand my pot in a baking tray to catch any drips and splashes.its only 20 years old .

I use the 10# pots myself and they'll also drip a bit too. Long ago had a 1/4x20 tpi bolt brazed on so I could put tapped aluminum handles on for a bit of extra weight and not have to grab a screwdriver to give it a twist. For reasons of clearance as I use stacked pots the lower one is shorter. Then I replaced that one with one of cold rolled steel for a bit more weight. Recently I added the lead filled weights to the ears. Seem to help. Also another gentleman suggested bending the tip of the valve rod a bit which was also helpful I believe. I really think the thing that probably was most beneficial may well have been just using beeswax for a flux and clean ingots. Generally speaking a little twist of the rod takes care of things just fine.

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[AllanD]

I recently bought a replacement "pin" and seat from Lee and I'm thinking that having one coated with
stellite (a chromium/cobalt coating normally used on performance engine exhaust valves) then lapping it to
the seat is a permanent solution to the problem.

if I cannot get anyone willing to Grind me a tungsten valve pin.
The hard part is grinding threads on the upper end...

I have some Uranium rod stock but I absolutely refuse to grind it, I'm not into heavy metal poisoning...

I also have some 5/8" Hastelloy rod stock so I could make a new seat out of something nearly indestructible...

[GregLaROCHE]

I am certainly in the club with those who have Lee pots that drip. I’m not sure I understand which pot the Op is talking about. Mine is a 20# pot and the lever goes up and down vertically besides the pot. I see pictures of a different type. Is it newer or older? Or just a different model?

My pot drips often, but if I play with the screw or jiggle it I can get it to stop, most of the time. If I am in the groove and all boolits are good, I just let it go and then put the drips back in the pot with a pair of pliers.

[Petrol & Powder]

I am certainly in the club with those who have Lee pots that drip. I’m not sure I understand which pot the Op is talking about. Mine is a 20# pot and the lever goes up and down vertically besides the pot. I see pictures of a different type. Is it newer or older? Or just a different model?

My pot drips often, but if I play with the screw or jiggle it I can get it to stop, most of the time. If I am in the groove and all boolits are good, I just let it go and then put the drips back in the pot with a pair of pliers.

The pot I'm referring to is the 4-20 and it has the handle that operates vertically on the side of the pot.
I fixed the dripping issue by polishing/lapping the lower tip of the rod and the nozzle. For the most part, that eliminated the dripping.

However, the shoulder bolt that limits the upward travel of the handle continued to work loose. That screw is nothing more than a short sheet metal screw with an unthreaded shank above the threads. The threads sort of engage an aluminum channel on the interior of the side plate and there's just not much material there for the threads to bite into. It's a poor design.

The metering rod that controls the flow of lead through the nozzle could stand to be a bit heavier but as other posters have shown, it's not hard to make it heavier. Lapping the rod and nozzle is also a good fix. As for that crappy little sheet metal screw that limits the upward travel of the rod..........Lee could not have made that part cheaper if they tried; and Lee really knows how to make things cheap.

[ShooterAZ]

I "rebuilt" my 4-20 a few times, I had the same problem with the cheezy screw races working loose and stripping out. It served me well enough I guess. In the end I bought a RCBS Pro-Melt and never looked back. I tinkered with it quite a bit before I tightened it all up and sold it off.

[Golfswithwolves]

Not a fix but a work-around: Since I get better .45 bullets with ladle casting I just dedicate the Lee 4-20 to this process and maybe will plug the valve hole before too long to get the valve parts out of the way of the ladle.

[owejia]

The pot I'm referring to is the 4-20 and it has the handle that operates vertically on the side of the pot.
I fixed the dripping issue by polishing/lapping the lower tip of the rod and the nozzle. For the most part, that eliminated the dripping.

However, the shoulder bolt that limits the upward travel of the handle continued to work loose. That screw is nothing more than a short sheet metal screw with an unthreaded shank above the threads. The threads sort of engage an aluminum channel on the interior of the side plate and there's just not much material there for the threads to bite into. It's a poor design.

The metering rod that controls the flow of lead through the nozzle could stand to be a bit heavier but as other posters have shown, it's not hard to make it heavier. Lapping the rod and nozzle is also a good fix. As for that crappy little sheet metal screw that limits the upward travel of the rod..........Lee could not have made that part cheaper if they tried; and Lee really knows how to make things cheap.

Having the same problem, thinking of putting a hi-temp putty in the screw channel for the threads to have more grip. The bottom screw loosens up about every 50 to 100 uses, really gets aggravating when in a good casting groove and trying to cast a lot of boolits. Just did what you did peened the screw channels to make them catch more metal and hopefully that will hold for a while.

[greenjoytj]

You must lap the valve seat with the value rod and lapping compound.
Also the LEE valve rod is too light, its nearly floating in the melt. I hung a large nut over the flow control just to add weight to force the rod down.
Now it only drips if dirt gets in the valve, but I can clear that easily.

[Three44s]

jimkin,

I like that!

+10!

Three44s

[Ranger 7]

I have two Lee 4/20 pots, purchased in 2009.
They have processed 2,000 pounds of range scrap into 1 & 1/2 pound ingots.
They have, so far, produced about 14,00 bullets ( 380, 9mm, 45, 38).
Two years ago I cleaned both by using Emory cloth to return the in side of the pots to bright metal and scraped out the bottom pour nozzle and reseated the release shaft & nozzle.
I also removed the sides and squeezed the metal the screw enters to tighten up the threads.
No more leaking, both are still in use producing bullets.
Do not see how they are not bargains! Other pots are up to 5 times the price. And from posts, they drip!
I also have a Lyman 45, works great! But it cost me much more (I wanted a PID controlled unit).
To top it off, I wound up building my own PID unit using the parts list posted by one of the members here.
I apologize to him for not remembering his name. He used top of the line parts (Auberns), so did I .
Still working great and the close temp control is great.

[Keith 429421]

Today was a Christmas in June . I got 2 USPS packages 1 from Titan Reloading https://www.titanreloading.com/lee-precision-reloading-equipment/lee-service-parts/mold-and-melter-parts containing a inner Lee pot without a spigot EL3021 and Lee valve rod EL3427 for my 4-20 pot that's been leaking bad. I tried the coupling nut on the top of the rod trick by Backyard Inventor on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAx_wiD7-EA but it did not work. The original valve rod was not ground right I tried to regrind it but it is a rounded radius grind not a simple angle grind of about 45 degrees.. It was not ground as such all the way around as the pic shows if I got it up right here. I cleaned the spout with a pin that's used to close a turkey when its stuffed bent into a L on one end and the inside of the spout on the pot side best I could. Then I slightly lapped the rod and spout with Permatex valve grinding compound and filled it with 3 pounds of alloy from my lee 10 pound Production pot. The result was no leaking . It did offer a single drip when I turned it off and it cooled. I cast a couple dozen 250 grain .45 cowboy bullets and went to Greentop down in Richmond Va and bought a new Ruger Vaquaro .45 Colt to match my Ruger New Blackhawk .45 Colt so I will soon be out on the range and happy I got the Lee working as I was about to order a Magma Master Pot on Monday. It was a difficult choice I tell you The Master Pot Or The Ruger but I would have done well either way still Im glad I got the Lee working right .243264

[Keith 429421]

I ordered the new inner Lee pot without a spigot hole so if I could not get the pot to quit leaking I would turn it into a casting pot and use it to mix flux and clean alloy and would have ordered the Master Pot. and kept the 10 pound production pot for linotype or Lyman #2 for rifle bullets only as I don't cast many of those at a session. Yes that pot leaks too and ill gently lap the valve rod on it too but a twist of the screwdriver slot will stop it form leaking for a several casts then it starts up again. I have to say Titan Reloading was really fast getting that order out to me with regular shipping , the same with Magma with everything Ive got from them . I have no complaints with Lee I have several of the Lee 2 and 6 cavity moulds. Mr Richard Lee was an inventive genius who's equipment helped so many getting into reloading on a budget as it did myself with my 30-30 Lee Loader I bought in 1973 for 9.95 and and entered into this fascinating enjoyable life time hobby. I still have that Lee Loader today.

[AllanD]

I bought a replacement inner pot off of ebay for less than lee wanted for one then I bought the valve pin and valve spigot from Lee, it is my intention to mate them using valve lapping compound (Carborundum paste) and see if that will dare to leak...

I'd love to have someone grind me a tungsten valve rod....

[Keith 429421]

I also filed out the elongated hole on the operating handle "valve assembly" where it goes around the spout for extra clearence. It was a bit tight there and dragging on the side of the spout. Now it freely moves

[Keith 429421]

That's the one I wanted. Mgamas master pot .Next time some cash burns a hole in my pocket Ill get one !

[Keith 429421]

I was fast relying to the Master pot pic, still new here !

[Onebad06vtx]

My pot never dripped in the ten years that I have used it.
Then I ran it dry and cleaned it and guess what, now it drips. UGGGGG

[Conditor22]

Keith 429421, you do know that the replacement parts at Lee are free after you put them ion your cart, you just pay shipping and handling

You can get the:
VALVE ROD EL3427
POT 20LB STANDARD EL3474
20 POT VALVE(SPOUT) EL3451
7/16-20 HEX JAM NUT FE3464

for - Please allow up to 14 business days for delivery. ($13.11) shipping and handling directly from Lee

https://leeprecision.com/parts/bullet-casting/electric-melters/pro-4-20lb-parts/

I've found that there are 2 factors that cause the EL3444 #6 Shoulder Bolt the EL3426 Valve Arm Assembly slides up and down on to come loose
1) we push up to hard
2) the EM1120 Valve Knob sticks out too far from the EL3426 Valve Arm Assembly. I shortened the FE3463 8–32x1 Carriage Bolt that attaches the knob to the arm and lift putting my finger as close to the arm assembly as possible putting less stress on the shoulder bolts

https://i.imgur.com/9ayc0Nk.png

[6bg6ga]

Easy solution for me....I gave the leaking *** away.

[Petrol & Powder]

The rod and the nozzle are easy to lap and that will fix most of the dripping problems. A little extra weight on the rod will fix the remaining drips.
However - that CHEAP sheet metal screw that, I guess.....threads??? into a small aluminum channel in the side plate is JUNK. I'll eventually make some type of bracket and pin that replaces that crappy screw.

I have to agree with Ranger 7 that the Lee 4-20 pot is a good overall bargain but it can be aggravating at times. Typical of most Lee products, they found a way to hit a price point and they had to sacrifice some quality to get there. That little shoulder bolt/sheet metal screw is just one of those little things done to cut production costs that could have been made so much better for just a little bit of money.

[Keith 429421]

Thanks for the info Conditor . I thought I had it , but today it leaked again , not so bad. I had it filled 3/4 up I had "Backyard Inventor" YouTube coupling on it and then removed that and adjusted the rod and it was better but still leaking. Ill change it over to the ladle pot . And use the 10 pound production pot. It also leaks but not that bad and use a thrift store SS small ladle to refill it from the 20 pound 4-20. I have never used a casting ladle I use muliti cavity moulds and I like and will stick with a bottom pour . I wish RCBS and Lyman did not change their melters. I would have bought the Lyman Mag 20 or the RCBS Pro Melt with 20 pound capacity and regular T stat controls . I remember the old 60's -70s Lyman pots that were 45- 50 dollars , then expensive top of the line classic bullet proof melters and looked like todays Master Pot with the valve system and T stat but less capacity. Im not a fan of digital electronic controls unless their well proven on a 300 dollar melter. Which is more money then I want to spend if they don't hold up but Im sure they can be changed to a T stat I also don't like any PIDs in the pot and am not sure how these two are set up. The Master Pots outside the pot is what ive heard. My crystal casting ball tells me a Magma Master Pot is in my very near future

[Stephen Cohen]

My Lee 4 20 gave a few drips in its early days, I removed the valve arm assembly and put the valve rod in my drill and lapped it into the valve with valve grinding past. I have had no leaks in the last 5 years and I have put some 400KG of lead through it. I only put clean lead in the pot and do not flux lead while in the pot, I also do not keep casting past about 1inch of lead in bottom of the pot. I have done two of these 4 20 pots and both work just fine, yes they are cheap but with a little care they work just fine. Regards Stephen

[Keith 429421]

Im going to give it another try lapping it. I did use a drill also but I only slightly lapped it Ill give it a good lapping and see what happens.

[Drew P]

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I’ve done a LOT of mods on my Lee pot!
-Remade the rod out of spring wire, longer and non threaded
-Lapped it to the seat using a drill
-Gutted electronics and installed PID and ssr inside.
-Thermocouple screwed into bottom of pot, acorn nut on it to seal
-Ditched mold rest and replaces with steel tube
-Ditched slide screws and installed aluminum plate
-Massive steel weight on rod
-Lever with push down fulcrum for raising rod

After all these mods, it’s still drips lol. Not as bad, and the huge benefit of being able to twist the rod freely makes the drip stop. So my normal pour ends with a quick twist on the weight to stop any drips.

My mould rest is sloped slightly away from me so that when I’m filling back to front, that over pours will puddle on their sprew rather than flow forward into the next cav.

I have a splash guard on the PID, and while I’m not sure that it’s safely cool, it’s been holding up fine for many sessions so I guess it’s able to handle the heat well enough.

Gosh, I should make a better pot from scratch and sell them lol!

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[Keith 429421]

I worked on the Lee 20-4 pot again today. Removed the valve rod cleaned it up used my turkey stuffing L pin to clean the spout and used a good gob of valve compound to lap the valve and seat with a drill about 30 seconds. Cleaned the spout again with alcohol in the pot getting the valve grinding compound out , drying it well then put the valve rod back in adjusted it and put about 4 pounds of ingots in and the result yes it leaks a drip now and then but only a tolerable bit. I opened and closed the valve rod many times pouring into a RCBS ingot mould and was satisfied. After I turned it off I rotated the valve rod back and forth a little bit and set it down well into the seat . No 4 inch lead icicles after it cooled, so I'll call it a success. I also worked on my 10 lb production pot and lapped it and it was a little better also. So if your having leak problems with a Lee pot , lap the valve rod and pot spout seat with valve grinding compound gently one time if that does not fix it then a bit more cleaning out the lapping compound and make sure the valve linkage handle is not binding on the spout or the screws. Also check to see that the valve rod has the same angle on it all the way around .

[Drew P]

A good way to prevent leaks on pot cool down is to throw a kill shot ingot in (carefully) which will reduce the time to solidify severely.

[Keith 429421]

Welded two 1inch nuts on top of the 20 pound Lee pot after lapping the valve rod and spout the leaks gone I can reach into the hole in the nut to turn the valve rod with a screwdriver to adjust or remove the rod , cast 186 9mm bullets today 1 drop of lead seen on the base, it was indeed a Drip O Matic before
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[Tmaloy]

Having the same problem, thinking of putting a hi-temp putty in the screw channel for the threads to have more grip. The bottom screw loosens up about every 50 to 100 uses, really gets aggravating when in a good casting groove and trying to cast a lot of boolits. Just did what you did peened the screw channels to make them catch more metal and hopefully that will hold for a while.

I am getting 4-20 pot soon so please bear with me when I throw this out there, since I don't have it yet but what if you used a 6-32 or 8-32 threaded rod to use as a one piece support for the valve rod assembly? Instead of using the factory threads on the outer shield run the threaded rod top to bottom. Use 1" threaded spacers on the top and bottom of the threaded rod then attach the linkage to it. Run it through the pot and they would be a one piece connection. Place a washer and appropriate screw on each side to keep the valve arm assembly in place. You could probably place a spring in between the arm assembly and the top of the rod with a washer and screw holding it in place and adding downward pressure. Made a rough draft of what I was thinking.


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