williams sights

[redriverhunter]

I got a marlin 30.30 and put on williams fp 336 Set Receiver Peep Sight with Front Fire Sight. with the front sight that came with the set it shot real high so i got a higher front sight still shootting to high sent back and got the williams .500. with the rear sight raised about 1/4 from the lowest its dead on at 50 yard but at a hundred it shooting 6 inches high. what i dont understand is how can there be 6 inch differnce in 50 yards i think my front sight need to go higher yet. before i drop more money what do you all think.

thanks for any advice

[NickSS]

I have used Williams reciever sights on various Marlin and Winchester rifles for years and have never changed a front sight. They always dial in with the original sight hight. If you have put a new front sight on is it on the ramp that comes with Marlin 336 rifles and if you are adding a half inch high sight to that you have a really high front sight. When I have zeroed a 30-30 at 50 yards it has always shot a bit low at 100 yards. This leads me to believe that you have an issue with your barrel not your sights. I had a windage problem with a Rossi rifle. I would set it right on at 50 yards by drifting the rear sight. When I shot it at 100 yards it would shoot to the right. When I drifted the sight so the bullets were zeroed at 100yards it would shoot to the left at 50. I finally sent the rifle to the factory warentee service center and they put a new barrel on it and the problem was solved. Its possible you have a bent barrel that is causing your problem.

[missionary5155]

+1 with what NICKSS said... I have several rifles in Illinois with recievers sights and never had that kind of problem. Stick a good bright light at the reciever and reflect it into the bore and take a look in there.... Also check the muzzle area... any evidence of damage ?
Did you test fire the rifle before doing the sight swaps?

[jlchucker]

I've never had a Marlin rifle (bought new) that I DIDN'T have to change the front sight on. This includes an 1895S (1982 pre-safety version), a 25-20 1894CL (had to even put a ramp on that one to get enough height with a Williams) and a couple of others. The ones that I have bought used all seemed to be OK. This may have been my luck, or it may be that Marlin just shoves any old front sight into the slot at the time of assembly, and test-fires for function as opposed to accuracy. That having been said, changing a front sight out is no big deal. Lyman, Williams, Marbles, and others all make good ones at various heights. And to be fair to Marlin, they are only guessing that the owner won't install some sort of receiver sight or even a scope. Once matched to the correct height, and then sighted in for the ammo the ultimate user fires, Marlin rifles are, IMO, pretty darned accurate.

[Heavy lead]

RRH,
How does it group. If it groups well, I wouldn't worry about it and just change the sight out. iron sighted longguns and hand guns both generally shoot low for me. Just goes to show different sight settings work for different people. As for any lever guns I've owned Winchester or Marlin, seems like I've always had to put different front sights on them when I put a reciever sight on. I usually like a big fat ivory bead.

[KirkD]

If it is bang on at 50 yards, it certainly should not be shooting 6" high at 100 yards. It's not the rifle, it is the sight. I suspect you left the new, higher front sight on, then put the new rear sight on, resulting in a front-rear sight combination that has a higher angle to the bore. The result will be that if it is zeroed at 50 yards, it will shoot unusually high at 100 yards. You can see this effect if you do a scale drawing on graph paper with normal low sights and then an exaggerated set of really high sights. To clarify, the higher your front-rear sight combination, the larger the angle the trajectory intersects it at 50 yards. At least ...... this is my idea of what is wrong. On the other hand, this idea also seems bogus to me, because scopes are way higher. Do they exhibit the same behavior as well or not? I don't have any scopes on my guns, so I do not know.

[Pepe Ray]

KirkD;
Your explanation is correct re; sight height. And 'yes' scopes exhibit the same problems which are exaggerated with the popular 'see thru' mounts. I hate 'em!!

However, RRH hasn't given enough info to completely analyze his problem. The first thing that comes to mind is 'shooting technique, either freestyle or from the bench.' Asking another competent shooter to confirm the problem may provide some answers. Lever actions (all) can be fussy. Pointing the finger at a problem w/o all the data is iffy at best.
Pepe Ray

[georgewxxx]

The one time I had a problem with Williams FP sight on one of my Marlins it was me not noticing the limiting screw on the top being screwed up too high. Until you bring that down so you can lower the sight it seems like your front sight is lower than it really is. ....Geo

[hyoder]

You've installed a higher front sight and had to raise the rear sight 1/4" to compensate. You probably didn't need the higher front sight.
What load are you shooting?
If reloads, what bullet/boolits and powder combination?
Is the muzzle crown in good shape? No knicks or lopsided crown.
And yes, is the barrel straight?
What size aperature do you have in the rear sight?

[redriverhunter]

thanks for all the replies, wish i could have got back sooner.

the shooting was done from the bench

the load is
150 gn win. power pionts
win mag primer
35.5gn of win 748

i took off the peep sight and put the factory buck horn sights left the front sight on.

at 50 yards dead on, at 100 yards about 2 1/2 lower. I am guessing that its either the peep sight or my shooting
thanks rrh

[Pepe Ray]

RRH'
That's too bad. Your going backwards. The good thing is that you obviously have young eyes and your shots will remain true for a while.
My WAG is this. The receiver sight, when properly applied, is called a "Ghost ring" because you don't see it when shooting. Whether the reason is shooting from a bench or having too many clothes on, if the eyes are too far from the sight you will see the sight and try to position the bead/post in the aperture as you would an open middle sight.
Again, this is a WAG based on my experience. For a peep to work the eye must be close enough that it is forced to look THRU the hole w/o seeing what makes the hole.
Pepe Ray

[fourarmed]

I'll go with Pepe on this. I think it is the way you are looking at the sights at the two different distances. Like maybe aiming with the top of the front bead at 50, but with the center of the bead at 100. In order for the gun truly to be dead on at 50 and 6" high at 100, the sights would have to be MORE than 6" above the line of the bore.