30 Luger from 9x23 Super Comp and 38 Super Auto

[tucumcari_kid]

Working on high(er) pressure 30 Luger for my Glock 17 with Barsto barrel. Even factory ammo can't properly function the slide with a stock spring. Loads are at the hi end of Unique 30 Luger and into 7.62x25 territory to properly cycle the slide. I have a range of 30L cases from the 1940s to modern GFL and Starline. However I am experimenting with using trimmed, resized, and neck reamed Starline 9x23 Super Comp brass or 38 Super Auto brass. I don't know what the standard Starline is rated at so the Super Comp seems a known factor.

Resized Super Comp brass with 5.8 grains of unique and 83 grain cast bullet (This is a modern Glock load, not a Luger or HP load) functions smooth, sharp but manageable recoil and the brass LITERALLY dropped on my feet.

I imagine Starline 30L brass would be sufficient in the 30k PSI range but some of this might approach 40k PSI.

Thoughts?

Super Comp brass is rimless and 38 Super Auto is semi-rimmed. Still working on getting that into line and that might be a showstopper for me since Super Comp is available.

237132
237133

[SOFMatchstaff]

I tried this with the 9x21 brass I had no use for, and ended up with marginal success, the base dia was the issue. they wouldnt chamber in the PO-8 Luger. I guess if you start with new 38 super comp brass it might work better, but the tapered 9mm cases didnt seem to form as well.

[tucumcari_kid]

I tried this with the 9x21 brass I had no use for, and ended up with marginal success, the base dia was the issue. they wouldnt chamber in the PO-8 Luger. I guess if you start with new 38 super comp brass it might work better, but the tapered 9mm cases didnt seem to form as well.
I formed and fired one super comp. My shell holder that I modified to use the Lee 30l dies broke on me so I can't push the shoulder back far enough on the 38SA to see if it is going to work. 9x23 seems to work, but it will be a couple days since I'm waiting for Hornady dies to rescue me. I was concerned about the neck after reaming to 308, but I was able to get the bullet to seat firmly and crimp. We'll see.

[Tackleberry41]

Seems be way easier to just buy some 7.62x25 brass.

[Sig556r]

Seems be way easier to just buy some 7.62x25 brass.

^^^what he said, 38SC or 38S are just as expensive to begin with, making brass conversion to 30L kinda moot, unlike converting 40SW to 357Sig which makes more sense.

[SOFMatchstaff]

Seems be way easier to just buy some 7.62x25 brass.

This is what I did after the salvage operation didnt yield any usable brass.

[tucumcari_kid]

The point isn't brass conversion. I have plenty of brass. The issue is trying to get to high pressure. 40k+ and beyond. Since these need to be loaded hotter just to function, I prefer to use something I don't need to worry about beyond normal pressures. Otherwise, you're absolutely right. You can buy it from starline for a reasonable price. Thanks

[skeettx]

Have you tried making some from 223 brass
I used to make 7.62x25 cases from them
They are thicker, take a bit less powder and can
stand higher pressure

Mike

[Tackleberry41]

All that effort really is overkill. I run 117gr cast w 6.5gr of unique in standard 7.62x25 cases. And run up to 7.3 gr of power pistol, no signs of pressure.

[tucumcari_kid]

All that effort really is overkill. I run 117gr cast w 6.5gr of unique in standard 7.62x25 cases. And run up to 7.3 gr of power pistol, no signs of pressure.

Are you running those in 30 Luger? 5.8gr of unique is about the starting load in the Glock with 86 grain. I ran some 115s with bullseye, seems like 4.5 grains but I wasn't getting reliable cycling. I was going to drop a pound in the spring but I'd rather just get it working "stock" so to speak, since it isn't stock anyways. lol :groner:

[tucumcari_kid]

Have you tried making some from 223 brass
I used to make 7.62x25 cases from them
They are thicker, take a bit less powder and can
stand higher pressure

Mike

No, mostly because running the 9x23 is just a matter of sizing and trimming, and neck reaming, which is pretty straightforward. I can probably skip the reaming with 7.62x25. Starline brass in 7.62 and 30 Luger is probably equally strong. I'm probably just adding work I don't need to, but hey, that's the fun? Right?

[Tackleberry41]

No I am running 7.62x25. I already had a Tokarev I was loading for, bought a barrel for my 1911. No real difference dimensionally between the 2, just the lower pressure for the 30 luger. And that was antique guns, not the cases that was the issue. Lyman does not give any pressure on 30 luger loads. But doubt w cast and unique, going to blow up a glock.

Some data from when I was working up a load for the NOE mold I bought.
I wrote down 5.5gr unique, 104gr cast hollow point, lino w a gas check, sized .309. 1264fps.
Same bullet, w 6.0gr unique 1317-1334fps, avg 1325, ES 16.41
Same bullet, 2 6.5gr unique, 1356-1357fps, avg 1356, ES .76 a pretty good load. No pressure signs, no flinging them to the next county.

Tried AA9, but not alot of velocity. 8.0gr was only 1100fps.
Tried True blue, even worse, all of 594fps, so moved on.

Power pistol was the best, 7.0gr w a 104gr cast, 1462fps. And I went to a solid 117gr, shorter OAL, 7.3gr power pistol, was 1440-1442fps, avg, 1441, ES 1.2. Another good load, and what I used to load several boxes.

I used the NOE as they need to be shorter than factory to run in a 1911mag. I can give a solid crimp on the bullet to prevent set back. Work fine in my Tokarev to.

[tucumcari_kid]

No I am running 7.62x25. I already had a Tokarev I was loading for, bought a barrel for my 1911. No real difference dimensionally between the 2, just the lower pressure for the 30 luger. And that was antique guns, not the cases that was the issue. Lyman does not give any pressure on 30 luger loads. But doubt w cast and unique, going to blow up a glock.

Some data from when I was working up a load for the NOE mold I bought.
I wrote down 5.5gr unique, 104gr cast hollow point, lino w a gas check, sized .309. 1264fps.
Same bullet, w 6.0gr unique 1317-1334fps, avg 1325, ES 16.41
Same bullet, 2 6.5gr unique, 1356-1357fps, avg 1356, ES .76 a pretty good load. No pressure signs, no flinging them to the next county.

Tried AA9, but not alot of velocity. 8.0gr was only 1100fps.
Tried True blue, even worse, all of 594fps, so moved on.

Power pistol was the best, 7.0gr w a 104gr cast, 1462fps. And I went to a solid 117gr, shorter OAL, 7.3gr power pistol, was 1440-1442fps, avg, 1441, ES 1.2. Another good load, and what I used to load several boxes.

I used the NOE as they need to be shorter than factory to run in a 1911mag. I can give a solid crimp on the bullet to prevent set back. Work fine in my Tokarev to.

I'm using the NOE 315-121(?) which is working, even though I have to size them twice to get to 309. I just cast up a bunch of NOE 102 SWC which come out to 96 with hollow points. I think this is going to be a go to, except they are pushing the length.

The 7.62 loads in the 30L are going to be a bit higher pressure, esp with the heavier weights, I believe. Since I can probably push them harder in the Glock, we'll see what that means to the brass. Unique and bullseye worked, but I picked up some AA #5 and #7 which are probably optimal. I have some CSB #1 and #2 powders from Spain and they both have loads listed for 30L so it's a place to start. 800x might be interesting too. I have a Glock 22 and a 23 with the 30L barrel I would like to get to the point of performance and expansion with the G23 so I can carry it. I want to put a few hundred (thousand) rounds through it to make sure it feels reliable. Interesting project....

[tucumcari_kid]

No I am running 7.62x25. I already had a Tokarev I was loading for, bought a barrel for my 1911. No real difference dimensionally between the 2, just the lower pressure for the 30 luger. And that was antique guns, not the cases that was the issue. Lyman does not give any pressure on 30 luger loads. But doubt w cast and unique, going to blow up a glock.

Some data from when I was working up a load for the NOE mold I bought.
I wrote down 5.5gr unique, 104gr cast hollow point, lino w a gas check, sized .309. 1264fps.
Same bullet, w 6.0gr unique 1317-1334fps, avg 1325, ES 16.41
Same bullet, 2 6.5gr unique, 1356-1357fps, avg 1356, ES .76 a pretty good load. No pressure signs, no flinging them to the next county.

Tried AA9, but not alot of velocity. 8.0gr was only 1100fps.
Tried True blue, even worse, all of 594fps, so moved on.

Power pistol was the best, 7.0gr w a 104gr cast, 1462fps. And I went to a solid 117gr, shorter OAL, 7.3gr power pistol, was 1440-1442fps, avg, 1441, ES 1.2. Another good load, and what I used to load several boxes.

I used the NOE as they need to be shorter than factory to run in a 1911mag. I can give a solid crimp on the bullet to prevent set back. Work fine in my Tokarev to.

I wanted to chrono mine last week and I forgot my tripod. The range was sunny at 830am and not a soul in sight. Really made me sad because I wanted to see what the 5.8 of unique gave me. I'll run those 5.8 6.0 and 6.2 and see where they come out, since 5.8 seemed to cycle. I could n't find the brass with the 5.8 and was shocked that it was literally at my feet. I have some 308252 and 313249 that I made up. I can't wait to see what those 76 grain babies will do. Probably won't be able to fit enough powder in the case... Well something will work. :Fire::Fire:

[Tackleberry41]

NOE had 2 bullets, one w a longer nose. I did some measuring, so they would fit in a 1911 mag. Crimped at the groove they are quite a bit shorter than factory ammo. But still not short enough to fit in a 9mm mag like you are doing. I come out at 1.250 OAl. They are 104gr hollow point, 117gr solid. Only other 30 cal pistol mold I have is the Lee RN plain base. Heavy for my 32S&W.

Need some chrony data. I started at the fixed length, went really light on data, worked my way up. Could go hotter but figured 117gr at 1350fps was enough.

[AllanD]

^^^what he said, 38SC or 38S are just as expensive to begin with, making brass conversion to 30L kinda moot, unlike converting 40SW to 357Sig which makes more sense.

40S&W is too short to form 357Sig from it and the case walls at the base too thin.
357Sig is formed from 10mmAuto Brass, and that is kinda wasteful...

[elysianfield]

Years ago I used 9mm Largo cartridges to good effect. Removed bullet and powder, reformed case, and loaded the primed brass with a good starting load for the 30 Luger. Functioned well, and was accurate. Big plus is not needing to chase your brass, as it is Berdan primed...9mm Bayard was also used, as I had a large quantity available to me.

[Ateam]

I form 7.62x25 from .223, and have found that AA#7 is the optimal powder. It would be worth a look since you are essentially in 7.62x25 territory just with a .30luger case.

[Red River Rick]

Have you tried making them from 9mm blanks?

Trimming the crimp off should still leave you a partial "Neck", and enough length.

RRR

[mf79]

I form 7.62 x 25 from 223 because I got it free, and made my own cutter so I only had to get dies and neck trimmer