Any M1 Garand experts in here?

[hornsurgeon]

I’m eyeballing my first Garand at a local shop. Looking for opinions and any info you can provide. Receiver is a Springfield 1.95million serial. Barrel is SA 3-52. Bolt reads D28287-12SA RE5B. Barrel has import mark EXCEL/GARDNER MA. Op rod is marked NM. Stock has been replaced. From what I can tell it’s one that has been lent to Korea then imported back into the country. Originally built in 43, rearsenaled around 52-53, then possibly rebuilt again when imported. Finish is great on it, and the bore looks mint and crisp rifling. Anything I should look for? Anything seem sketchy?

[Ford SD]

IÂ’m eyeballing my first Garand at a local shop. Looking for opinions and any info you can provide. Receiver is a Springfield 1.95million serial. Barrel is SA 3-52. Bolt reads D28287-12SA RE5B. Barrel has import mark EXCEL/GARDNER MA. Op rod is marked NM. Stock has been replaced. From what I can tell itÂ’s one that has been lent to Korea then imported back into the country. Originally built in 43, rearsenaled around 52-53, then possibly rebuilt again when imported. Finish is great on it, and the bore looks mint and crisp rifling. Anything I should look for? Anything seem sketchy?

Sounds Good

minor stuff
Head space ?
Check barrel for wear..Muzzle cleaning rod wear.. rifling .. dinged muzzle
Oprod Bending = wrong ammo .. spring length (you should replace spring anyway)
dirty bolt .. function test. safety test
fit of stock to receiver (will affect accuracy)
is it 308 or 30-06 ?

Problems I have read about, Very rare
if 308 check for the chamber insert know to fall out when shooting
.. dirty firing pin= slam fire (firing pin should be run dry)
Bad bridge = has to do with firing pin
Welded receiver or twisted receiver = when new barrele is installed receiver is twisted = parts gun only

The good thing about M1 Garands is all the parts can be replaced .. Have fun with it

some one with more experience will have more to say:)

[cub45]

look into the CMP and buy a rifle through them, you will get a good gun at a fair price and not a problem mess.

[Sailormilan2]

I have one with a 1.95 Million serial number. Typical middle of the war rifle. It may have a "lead dipped" heal. Meaning the heal was dipped into molten lead after heat treating to anneal the heal and prevent the heal from cracking due to the bolt striking it. Gives a distinctive two tone finish, which I actually like. Mine is not real visible, but can be seen.
One thing to check for. If the gunshop will let you, take the receiver out of the stock and look at the Drawing Number(essentially a part number) on the right hand receiver leg, below the woodline. A Springfield receiver with a serial number in the 1.95 Million range will have a Drawing Number of D28291-30(per the book, and I double checked mine to make sure). If you have any number other than D28291-30, it may have a welded receiver, and I would be very leery of it.
The barrel will have a series of letters and numbers on it that can usually be seen by pulling back the op rod. WW2 barrels are stamped D35448 and then numbers to indicate date of manufacture of the barrel. If it's post war barrel it may be stamped D6535448 or 6535448, plus a date. For example, mine is stamped SA 6535448 3 63. Post war barrel made by Springfield, in March of 1963.

[Rich/WIS]

Price? Current CMP prices are $650 for field grade and $750 for service grade. There are certain qualifications to meet if you purchase from them, check out their site.

[country gent]

Check the muzzle very carefully if you suspect Korean return. A lot of these were carried cleaned a lot and shot little bore looks good thriat is acceptable but they have a lot of rod damage in the muzzle. OP rod spring should measure at least 18" when free and out of rifle. They arnt expensive. If you can find these to borrow a throat gage and muzzle gage would be handy to check the barrel. From what you describe it sounds like a parts rebuilt rifle. Another quick little check is to look at the sights close front should be centered or close to centered. Rear should also be close to centered on its scale. a front of to one side of dovetail and rear opposite side is a sign of a twisted receiver or barrel out of time. Check front hand guard to see if the sheet metal liner is still in it. It was a accurizing thing to remove the liner when built to match grade. Not a big issue but does weaken front hand guard and rifle shouldn't be handled by it if done. ( with the NM op rod this is a possibility). Another quick test is to remove from stock and remove spring and follower. bolt should open and close when barreled actions muzzle is raised and lowered roughly 30* from level. Look for a pad of silicone or epoxy under rear hand guard just in front of receiver ring, again a match mod to keep hand guard from bearing when converted to NM.

[georgerkahn]

The NUMBER ONE thing I look for is a welded receiver!!! Many, many Garands were de-milled by being cut in half, with resultant metal sold by the pound. A few enterprising entrepreneurs got the brilliant ($$$) idea of welding two halves together, adding a parts kit, and making quite the profit. There are many ways to check -- ranging from drawing number examinations, to tell-tale pot holed, to off-grind marks, and even to not so perfect alignment. Some put a drop of lighter fluid where there may be a weld, as this will follow the line if so. (My friend Hughie, just last year bought such a M1 at a local gun show -- beware!) This is something worth your Googling to research!
Other than this, one of the real beauties of the firearm is it is in "groups". Clint McKee (Fulton Armory) and Michael Pucci (Orion7 Arms) not only sell groups, but do repairs on any in need, customize them, and even do entire rifle check-outs and (if needed) repairs. I have had work done by both, and they are "11's" on the ubiquitous 10-scale!
The major pricing on M1s around here is based whether it be a "collector" or a "shooter". The National Match Op Rod is nothing extra special, imho: when arsenal rebuilt, I gather a lot of these were in the parts bins. Your other descrips raise no red flags to me.
I assume your interest is as a "shooter", and would definitely have it checked out by a competent gunsmith before your shooting. They generate mega-psi within inches of your eye/face/brain.... 'nough said.
One last but VERY important note is M1's REQUIRE a very special ammo. Yes, ammunition designed exclusively for the Garand. To wit, it is a gas-operated firearm, and a powder of proper speed coupled with a proper size bullet is a necessity. Using "sporting good store" .30-06 ammunition invited a bent operating rod, or worse....
Best battle implement ever made, so Gen Patton said... I envy you in having one to hopefully purchase, and I do hope it is a "good" one!
geo

[Baltimoreed]

My wife’s uncle, a really swell guy, Tom Wilburn shot high power at Camp Perry [1950s to 1970s?] told me about his first Garand that had a welded recvr and shot very well, and that he got rid of it to buy a NM rifle which didn’t shoot near as well. Don’t know if I’d want a welded up one though. When I built mine I used a modern [late 1970ish] SA recvr and GI parts. Replaced the stock with a Boyds winter laminated stock after my retirement. Great rifle. Shot it in a match last year.

[El Bibliotecario]

I concur with those who advocate a CMP rifle, which will not have a welded receiver, will have been inspected for all the mechanical bugaboos previously mentioned, and will be honestly described as to condition and priced accordingly.

[Adam Helmer]

hornsurgeon,


OK, So WHAT is the PRICE? As Bruce Canfield said in his Garand book, "Most Garands went thru one, or two, rebuilds." Weapons of war get HARD DUTY. What is the $ price? There is a difference between price and value.

Webley

[beltfed]

Long story short for loads for garand NOT really that special. Max bullet weight, 173s(the old special ball bullet)
NO 180s or heavier. Heavy bullet loads like to bend op rods.
Good load published for DCM/CMP loads for their Garands:
47 gr IMR 4895/168 gr match bullet.-165 BTSPs work , too
Used to shoot 125s or 130gr bullets for short range, with same powder charge. Nice. Lighter recoil
beltfed/arnie

[georgerkahn]

hornsurgeon -- Never having heard of Excel Gardner, I rang a knowledgeable M1 guru buddy of mine. He recalls that they were in Massachusetts, and believes they were one of the first firms to import Garands -- from Korea -- in the early 1970s. At the time, M1s could only be sold to/purchased by Police agencies or LEOs with official documentation that they were, indeed, LEOs. In about 1980, the "police only" ban was lifted and Blue Sky Imports bought the remaining Excel Gardner imported firearms. Hence, *IF* my friend is correct, the Garand you're looking at came back into the USA over forty years ago. Re my "quality" query, he did not reply, simply stating they most likely spanned the entire range from pristine down to "parts gun".

[hornsurgeon]

Thanks for the replies and wealth of knowledge. I ended up talking them down from $1300 to $750. It does need the op spring replaced. Otherwise it seems ready to go. It’s all Springfield except for the NM RA op rod. Here’s some pics including numbers.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/msteenis/1FF62CDE-16AD-46A3-AD8B-5E23831192AF_zpsupvi33f9.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/msteenis/media/1FF62CDE-16AD-46A3-AD8B-5E23831192AF_zpsupvi33f9.jpg.html)
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/msteenis/30A52BD4-6AA3-4A5F-9039-9780EA3CE73E_zps0gxuwvus.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/msteenis/media/30A52BD4-6AA3-4A5F-9039-9780EA3CE73E_zps0gxuwvus.jpg.html)
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/msteenis/EED907A4-3DBA-4CAF-A2D5-4CC80D0B1FE8_zpsc1xstpee.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/msteenis/media/EED907A4-3DBA-4CAF-A2D5-4CC80D0B1FE8_zpsc1xstpee.jpg.html)
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/msteenis/7197730C-C7C8-4039-9A6D-E4BDFC89C829_zpsgx69rps1.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/msteenis/media/7197730C-C7C8-4039-9A6D-E4BDFC89C829_zpsgx69rps1.jpg.html)
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/msteenis/0E14FF7F-1B20-4B90-B257-04D361B9B721_zps1vx6nm9w.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/msteenis/media/0E14FF7F-1B20-4B90-B257-04D361B9B721_zps1vx6nm9w.jpg.html)
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/msteenis/05CEDCAD-CDC2-4C3A-8EAB-4B73B7566BD6_zpsd5vsottf.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/msteenis/media/05CEDCAD-CDC2-4C3A-8EAB-4B73B7566BD6_zpsd5vsottf.jpg.html)
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/msteenis/8E14495C-24D7-4ACC-B681-E5C44F21F7D1_zpspsuxjkoj.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/msteenis/media/8E14495C-24D7-4ACC-B681-E5C44F21F7D1_zpspsuxjkoj.jpg.html)
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/msteenis/F19B84F0-C56B-43F9-A990-FB16598F05CF_zpsowntpxzj.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/msteenis/media/F19B84F0-C56B-43F9-A990-FB16598F05CF_zpsowntpxzj.jpg.html)

[Ford SD]

There is something wrong with that ... so send it to me ...:) I can dispose of it;) ;)

Looks very nice

Looks like it was re-parked when it was restocked

from the pictures the only thing wrong with it is.. it is dry .. as in no grease/ lube

do not use anything on firing pin

My expert that I talk to says forget about all the fancy stuff

What would Mr Garand have used ?.... white grease and as a visual aid you can see the grease

other people may have a different opinion

Enjoy it and have fun

[Beeks]

I bought some Lubriplate and a bunch of cheap tin brushes.

Guide for greasing -

http://www.garandgear.com/m1-garand-grease

[Kraschenbirn]

+1 on Lubriplate. Works great on 1911 slides and barrel bushings, too.

[Beeks]

And 1911 slides and barrel bushings too?

BUT I ONLY HAVE 24 OUNCES! :D

[Idz]

My Garand guy who has been through all the CMP armorer courses likes the white lithium grease. It seems to work well and is easy to see where you've applied it. The M1 is a rugged rifle but does like to be well lubed.

[Sailormilan2]

Not a welded receiver. Serial number is about 6000 lower than mine, so it was made within a day or two of mine. -12 bolt is standard midwar bolt. I can't tell from the picture if it has a lead dipped heal.

[hornsurgeon]

Well, went to a gun show tonight and had Don Kemps from the Garand collectors society look it over. He was extremely impressed by it. Said it was worth about double what I paid for it. Barrel has a zero for ME, and around a 1 for TE. Every part is correct except the ihc front sight.

[georgerkahn]

Congratulations!!! Looks like you have a firearm which will be a delight to shoot. I belong to a club with a hi-power league, and quite a collection of M1s. Each and every one has had the op rod spring replaced, and the best-of-the-best are those which were custom made for Anthony Pucci, Jr. at his Long Island, NY business, Orion7 Enterprises. Sadly, Tony had some medical issues, but his son Michael now runs the business. You can get the springs from Michael (631) 205-1299, and/or through many after-market sellers who buy these in bulk from him for resale, on eBay and similar sites. (I have one in my Garand!)
I cannot recommend these highly enough!
BEST!
geo

[starnbar]

One parting note if you buy one from the cmp it will be a solid rifle and it has been inspected by knowledgeable armorers you apy a little more but the old addage is and allways true that you get what you pay for enjoy your purchase its one of the best deals you will ever get on a real rifle.

[samari46]

Blue Sky was one of the other companies that did import the South Korean M1's. Mine also came with a Remington national match op rod. Used to be you could go to a good gun show and always find a couple dealers selling op rods. The last two cost me $50 each. Haven't seen a dealer in parts selling op rods in years. That is why it pays to stick to standard powders, bullet weights. There was an article in the old Precision Shooting magazine on where the bends should be and and how to correct the bent ones. Rebuilding the gas piston usually involves removing the old one then silver soldering in a new one. I read a story about one machinist using the table on a bridgeport mill rebend bent op rods. Frank

[TNsailorman]

The last op rod for the Garand that I saw for sale went for over $200.00 and it was not a new one and was "sold as is". People who want to chance bending their op rod are free to do so as it belongs to them. However, they may end up with a parts rifle. It is not just a matter of high pressure but also mass(weight). The Garand was designed for a specific weight of bullets and the 200 plus weights were not in the design model. Someone may eventually start producing op rods again (hopefully) but until they do, they are getting almost impossible to find. Metal fatigues when bent and although an expert can bend them back properly, they will never be as strong again and tend to go right back where they were before being straightened. Bent barrels tend to do the same. I knew an old gunsmith who had an overhead press to straighten barrels, but he always cautioned customers that they tend to walk groups back to the original point of aim as the barrel heated up from repeated firing. He did a lot of business from people who brought in new rifles with slightly warped barrels. Todays high speed machines can do that to barrels, especially light contour ones. I don't consider myself an expert but there are mighty few "experts" on the Garand left. I am only passing along my 50+ years of shooting a Garand. I trained on one and carried one while in service. They are wonderful rifles when cared for and operated within their designed functions. I am one those old dinosaurs that think that the only combat rifle that comes up to the Garand level is the M14, which is nothing more than a improved Garand. james