Any low pressure smokeless loads for an 1887?

[Kev18]

I bought an 1887 not to long ago. I was wondering if anyone here used smokeless instead of BP. I dont feel like or dont always have time to clean the barrel out right away after use. I would rather smokeless loads but since im not an expert on pressures I dont know which powder and how many grains to use.

[PapaG]

Pb powder produces some 6k psi loads.

[longbow]

A lot of people say to never use smokeless powder in guns designed for black powder yet we have factory .45-70 rounds loaded with smokeless powder, .45 long Colt rounds loaded with smokeless powder and several others.

I have read that you should never use smokeless powder in Damascus shotguns but I have to think that if the gun is certified sound by a gunsmith and smokeless loads are kept to BP pressures that everything would be fine. My opinion only.

With the fluid steel barrels I have to think that BP level pressures will not harm it Again my opinion.

I did a bit of an internet search on this topic and came up with a lot of naysayers but no comments from actual gunsmiths which I thought odd. Not saying that a gunsmith should be saying "If the gun looks good go shoot it!" but some factual safety discussion could be had with some answers of "Yes, it the gun has been inspected by a competent gunsmith and certified safe to shoot then you can reload to "X" pressure (BP equivalent?)." But no such discussions to be found... in my search anyway. Opinions aplenty though.

I did find one site that has some links to low pressure shotshell sources for "vintage" guns:

https://nyfirearms.com/forums/shotguns/81535-black-powder-12-gauge-shells.html

Post #5

There may be more to it than just max. pressure. Burn rate and where peak pressure occurs may have some effect. Again My opinion.

I also found a site where Tom Ceretto lists his recipes for low pressure loads for vintage shotguns if you are interested:

https://www.nssa-nsca.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/ceretto.pdf

I do not know the name and have no idea of his credentials.

I think the gun would be fine to shoot with low pressure loads as long as it is in good shape and agree with comments I found that it should be checked by a gunsmith to ensure it is in safe condition to shoot even with BP loads. If you don't know the history then you don't know if the gun has been shot using modern smokeless loads and if so it may have been over stressed. That would be my concern more than just using low pressure smokeless reloads. The barrel may be fine but internals may be peened, stretched or damaged in some way.

From what I just read the 1887 Winchester was found not to be strong enough for smokeless loads so it was redesigned in 1901 but as 10 ga. only. So yours was designed for BP but has fluid steel barrel.

Hah! Just found another interesting site that you might like:

http://parkerguns.org/forums/archive/index.php?t-14.html

There is a lot of info listed for low pressure loading on that site.

That's all I've got.

Longbow

PS: I am assuming it is an original 1887? If a modern repro then it will be fine.

[Kev18]

It is an original 1887. Made in 1888. I brought it to a gun smith and he said there was no problem shooting smokeless loads. Thing is... I dont really trust my gunsmiths around here. For me, a smith is someone who can make parts, and fix guns. The ones around here get customers with stripped screws that need to be changed... see what im saying?
He said I shouldnt have issues shooting smokeless because the barrel is thick. For me, thats an unprofessional thing to say. Muzzle loaders have 1 inch thick barrels and they would blow up if used with a few grains of smokeless. Its all about the steel. The barrel on mine is atleast twice as thick as any modern shotgun, then again, the steel is weak compared to today.

I will look into the links you posted! thank you.
https://i.imgur.com/P6diYNd.jpg

[gunauthor]

Check out Ballistic Products, they have some good info regarding low pressure loads.

[Kev18]

Check out Ballistic Products, they have some good info regarding low pressure loads.

Will do, thanks.

[smkummer]

The older IMR loading data handouts had a bunch of data with some of it low pressure such as using SR7625 with a 1 oz. load and 800X with a 1 1/8 oz load. I shooting for pressuresin the 5-6k range for my 1883 colt hammerless double.

[Kev18]

Im not sure if my action is stronger or weaker then a Double?