alloy mix equivalents

[Taylor]

Since my office has expired and I can't use my alloy calculator. Can someone help me out? I have researched here and all over google. But can't seem to find an answer.

50/50 mix..pure lead and clip on wheel weights is equivalent to ?? For example...16:1, 20:1 etc.

[Camper64]

Your looking at 10.1 or close to 20:1

Google Docs is another option for using the calculator.

[Rcmaveric]

I use Open Office on my windows computer and Linux has an Office equivalent aswel.

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[Taylor]

I will look into Open Office, does it have an Excel program too?

[oneofsix]

Yes

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[JonB_in_Glencoe]

some are listed here

http://www.lasc.us/CastBulletNotes.htm

[Mitch]

should be about .4%tin and 1.5% antimony.about 10.5bhn. and that depends on the coww you are getting

[MostlyLeverGuns]

I have used Open Office and there is also a LibreOffice, both about the same, but reviews have LibreOffice better supported. I have used LibreOffice on a new laptop, not a lot of difference, both handle all MS file formats. LibreOffice can save files in the 'newest' MS formats for use 'at the office' with MS Office.

[Outpost75]

In richer ternary Pb-Sb-Sn alloys tin forms the intermetallic compound Sb-Sn, which provides better strength and grain refinement than either tin or antimony used alone. If the tin content exceeds the antimony content, so that all the tin is not held in solution, the structure will lose strength in aging through cellular precipitation. Linotype alloy is the ternary eutectic formula for PB-Sb-Sn alloys, having optimum strength and wetting characteristics, and so gives the greatest as-cast diameter.

Linotype-plumber's lead blends are ideal for most bullet casting and enable excellent fillout with good strength and predictable repeatability using simple weight ratios which can be produced at moderate cost. You can estimate the hardness of your blend easily:

LinoPounds(22)+LeadPounds(5) / TotalPounds = EstBHN

A 50-50 linotype-lead blend at 13.5 BHN is slightly softer than commercial hardball or Lyman No.2 alloy. (22)+(5) /2 = 13.5

A 1:2 linotype-lead blend at "about 10.5 BHN" approximates 1:20 in hardness and is well suited for revolver and black powder cartridge "smokeless" applications. (22)+2(5) /3 = 10.6 BHN

A 1:4 linotype-lead blend at 8.5 BHN approximates the hardness of 1:30 alloy and is best for black powder cartridges, in subsonic, smokeless revolver loads, or with plain based rifle bullets below 1300 fps and is satisfactory up to 1700 fps with gas checks in rifles for hollow-point hunting applications. (22)+4(5) /5 = 8.5 BHN

A 1:5 linotype-lead blend at 8 BHN approximates 1:40 alloy and is the frugal shooters best bang for the buck to make your alloy go far as possible in revolver, cowboy loads, black powder cartridge, and subsonic hollow-point hunting applications. (22)+5(5) / 6 = 8 BHN


Common backstop scrap and COWW are of similar hardness so you can use these ratios of Linotype and Wheelweight blends, to estimate hardness. If you know that your source of linotype has been melted and recast several times it will be less than 22 BHN and you should adjust that factor in the formula when estimating your mix:

[Lino-Pounds(22) + WW-pounds(12)] / TotalPounds = BHN

1:10 linotype to wheelweights 1(22) +10(12) = 142/11 = 12.9 BHN
1:5 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 5(12) = 82 /6 = 13.6 BHN
1:4 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 4(12) = 70 / 5 = 14 BHN
1:3 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 3(12) = 58 / 4 = 14.5 BHN
1:2 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 2(12) = 46 / 3 = 15 BHN
1:1 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 1(12) = 34 / 2 = 17 BHN

[Rich/WIS]

Antimony has roughly 3 times the hardening effect as tin. Wheel weight are about 3% antimony so 50/50 is 1.5%, equivalent to about 4.5% tin, not quite 20:1.

[Tripplebeards]

Since my office has expired and I can't use my alloy calculator. Can someone help me out? I have researched here and all over google. But can't seem to find an answer.

50/50 mix..pure lead and clip on wheel weights is equivalent to ?? For example...16:1, 20:1 etc.


So back to op's original question which would make sense to me. I was under the impression when mixing 16:1 was a mix of pure lead and tin(pewter).

I tried a mix of 16lbs of pure lead with a pound of pewter. I was expecting a BH around 11 since that is the receipie posted all over the net but ended up at soft, 7.5.

I see the op is asking if using a 50/50 mix of coww and pure and then using it in 16:1, 20:1, ect. Which makes more sense on how my mix would have climbed to a BH of 11. If this is how it's done it must be a BIG mystery since I asked on several posts what went wrong and had no logical answers...but just to use my alloy.

So was I given the wrong information on how to mix? I was told to use pure lead which obviously didn't work but on the good side it still made a good accurate boolit that shoots sub MOA out of my 77/44 at 1675 fps.

[Tripplebeards]

...so the mystery continues :?

[Mitch]

So back to op's original question which would make sense to me. I was under the impression when mixing 16:1 was a mix of pure lead and tin(pewter).

I tried a mix of 16lbs of pure lead with a pound of pewter. I was expecting a BH around 11 since that is the receipie posted all over the net but ended up at soft, 7.5.

I see the op is asking if using a 50/50 mix of coww and pure and then using it in 16:1, 20:1, ect. Which makes more sense on how my mix would have climbed to a BH of 11. If this is how it's done it must be a BIG mystery since I asked on several posts what went wrong and had no logical answers...but just to use my alloy.

So was I given the wrong information on how to mix? I was told to use pure lead which obviously didn't work but on the good side it still made a good accurate boolit that shoots sub MOA out of my 77/44 at 1675 fps.

Just a thought or 2 here
Are you checking ingots or bullets for hardness? ingots will check much different from bulletsfrom cooling rate.

How long did you wait to check the hardness? again any alloy will check much different right after casting then say in 10 days

Is your pewter close to 100%? If not the hardness will not be what you calculate as pure tin.

[Tripplebeards]

I casted the boolts a year and half ago. They were at 7.5 two days after casting and the same six months later. Has anyone casted 16:1 with PURE TIN here and pure lead with the results of a BH of 11? I put out several posts on this and never received an answer...just questions of how I mixed it and suggestions. There were a few other posters that did what I did mixing 16:1 and received about the exact same BH harness. I tested both ignot and boolit with pure that was a 5 Bh and I never tested my pewter other than an in ignot form and don’t remember the Bh.

[Mitch]

I can say o do use 20 in 1 and 40 in1 mix and both come out reasonable close to what they should be with my LBT tester.The Tin is pure from rotometals and the pure lead I used is from x ray room.I have never tried mixing up any 16 in 1.This is strange you should get at least 9bhn I calulate 10.3.could be a few things not sure what.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

...so the mystery continues :?
Have you investigated your Pewter?
while most all Pewter products made in the West are lead-free, some pewter from other sources may contain some Lead.
>>>Here is one with 62% Lead.
https://www.belmontmetals.com/product/35-tin-pewter-alloy/

If your 16:1 alloy is measuring 7.5 BHN, I highly doubt it is truly 16:1

[Tripplebeards]

I can say o do use 20 in 1 and 40 in1 mix and both come out reasonable close to what they should be with my LBT tester.The Tin is pure from rotometals and the pure lead I used is from x ray room.I have never tried mixing up any 16 in 1.This is strange you should get at least 9bhn I calulate 10.3.could be a few things not sure what.

Someone actually did it. Thanks for the heads up. My pewter must have had a good amount of lead content in it i used at the time is the only thing I could say. I have been buying nothing put marked pewter and tin items now. Mostly dinnerware.

Jonb, yeah...I call it 16:1 but a 16:1 mix of lead and pewter since it’s a third softer than what I thought it would be. I used all of it up and casted about 20 to 30 lbs lbs of hollow points to burn it up on. The bad part is it’s accurate and when I burn up my mystery alloy it’s going to be fun trying to replicate it. Actually I might have some more of the mix ingots put away in the garage.

Pure tin must be a lot harder than pewter. I almost think my old pewter smelt was in the mid 20 ‘s or higher when I checked it?

I’ve learned since then if I want a 10 Bh alloy I just mix 50/50 a COWW and pure and add 2% to the mix and call it a day. I’m sure there isn’t much different in expansion, penatration, and terminal velocity between it and a correct mix of 16:1.

[Mitch]

I have went to testing all the lead I get.One reason is to repeat an alloy the other to save on alloy.Not only these but it saves on propane and time.The old guessing game is over here.I like to make up 350lb batches of alloy.My thought was to allways add a bit of tin to make sure I had enough for good fill out.so just 1% extra tin over what I realy need wold be 3.5 lb or about 50 bucks at new tin prices.Then there is the guess of what I thought I had.Mybe I mix 20lbs of alloy cast a few bullets wait a few weeks to test the harness oops I am way off so I mix more unknow alloy with that.This may go on a while before I get what I want lol.in the mean time I drian the propane tank then drive to get it filled.Now days I collect some lead wait till I get enough of what I have a good idea it is then clean it up.I pour angle iron ingots stack them up in separate batches and send it off for testing.This way I only melt the lead 3 times at the most and I have bullets. I sure save time this way and the old back.More time for shooting and loading.Now I need to work on getting a Dillon lol

[RogerDat]

I will look into Open Office, does it have an Excel program too?
https://www.openoffice.org/download/

In open office Calc is the equivalent of Excel. The alloy calculator does work fine with Calc. For the most part the files are compatible between MS Office and Open Office. Minor formatting stuff won't always be exactly the same in Word but for the most part Open Office is able to do for free what MS Office is charging major bucks for. I can work on documents in Open Office on my home computer and then open them at work with MS Office and continue working.

[RogerDat]

Someone actually did it. Thanks for the heads up. My pewter must have had a good amount of lead content in it i used at the time is the only thing I could say. I have been buying nothing put marked pewter and tin items now. Mostly dinnerware.

Jonb, yeah...I call it 16:1 but a 16:1 mix of lead and pewter since it’s a third softer than what I thought it would be. I used all of it up and casted about 20 to 30 lbs lbs of hollow points to burn it up on. The bad part is it’s accurate and when I burn up my mystery alloy it’s going to be fun trying to replicate it. Actually I might have some more of the mix ingots put away in the garage.

Pure tin must be a lot harder than pewter. I almost think my old pewter smelt was in the mid 20 ‘s or higher when I checked it?

I’ve learned since then if I want a 10 Bh alloy I just mix 50/50 a COWW and pure and add 2% to the mix and call it a day. I’m sure there isn’t much different in expansion, penatration, and terminal velocity between it and a correct mix of 16:1.
I would send in a piece of that alloy or one of the bullets to member BNE to XRF test so you can find out what alloy it is you be shooting. Then you can make more of those accurate bullets. :-)

[dbosman]

I've used Gnumeric for over a decade. There is no longer a full Windows download but the portable version is fine for an alloy calculator.
https://portableapps.com/apps/office/gnumeric_portable

[toallmy]

I thought the mix of alloy such as 16/1 - 20/1 or more with pure / tin was used to modify alloy for a better fill out while maintaining the soft pure characteristics , not as a harder even though it slightly increased the hardness .
Then using 1-2 percent of tin in a alloy such as 50/50 coww / pure balanced the tin with the antimony , to take full advantage of the antimony it needs to be of equal portion with the tin . Such as 2-2-96 or 5-5-90

Is this correct ?

[Funhunting14]

I am new too blogging, please forgive me if i put this in the wrong place. I have 100 pounds of lead I believe it is mostly pure after melting, fluxing and making ingots, it came from lead plumbing joints, a few wheel weights, lead sheets, and battery terminal ends. I was asking Rotometals about mixing 55 pounds of this mix 64%lead, 23% antimony, 12.5% tin to my existing 100 pounds to produce a decent bullet. I don't shoot competition, i'm looking to shoot 158gr bullets in a 38 special, and 200gr bullets from a 44 mag and some 175gr 40 S&W. I could use some direction from whom ever won't mind commenting. If i am good to shoot what i got great, if i should mix only 25 pounds of the above mix that is great too. Thanks so much.

[toallmy]

I am new too blogging, please forgive me if i put this in the wrong place. I have 100 pounds of lead I believe it is mostly pure after melting, fluxing and making ingots, it came from lead plumbing joints, a few wheel weights, lead sheets, and battery terminal ends. I was asking Rotometals about mixing 55 pounds of this mix 64%lead, 23% antimony, 12.5% tin to my existing 100 pounds to produce a decent bullet. I don't shoot competition, i'm looking to shoot 158gr bullets in a 38 special, and 200gr bullets from a 44 mag and some 175gr 40 S&W. I could use some direction from whom ever won't mind commenting. If i am good to shoot what i got great, if i should mix only 25 pounds of the above mix that is great too. Thanks so much.

You should be able to use your alloy as is in low pressure loads like the 38s , light 44 loads , but a few 2-5 percent of antimony would harden your alloy for higher pressure loads 44 mag / 40 s&w . A few percent of tin and antimony not the 20-25 percent that is way to much .
Any questions just ask .

[Funhunting14]

Thank you for the response, i appreciate it immensely. If i were to add 5 pounds of the Rotometal listed above to 25 pounds of my alloy. That would provide 4% antimony and 2.25% tin would that put me in the ballpark for the heavier 44 and 40 our would you go with 5 rotometal and 20 pounds of my alloy to get into those heavier loads.

[toallmy]

Thank you for the response, i appreciate it immensely. If i were to add 5 pounds of the Rotometal listed above to 25 pounds of my alloy. That would provide 4% antimony and 2.25% tin would that put me in the ballpark for the heavier 44 and 40 our would you go with 5 rotometal and 20 pounds of my alloy to get into those heavier loads.

25 pounds - your plumbing joints probably contain extra tin . That should provide you with a hard alloy you could probably use more than 25 pounds a lot more , but ( remember boolit fit is the most important thing in shooting cast boolits ) .
Just a thought but you might want to consider starting with casting for one cartridge at a time to get things worked out .
The 38/357 is a good one to start with . It's very forgiving .

Welcome to cast boolits .