opinions please

[Seeker]

I'm getting ready to buy what might possibly be my last gun, revolvers excluded. Please, if you don't have experience with more than 1....don't reply. I've always wanted a 45-70 levergun. I want brand new. I hunt whitetails, black bear and shoot targets at the range. What should I get?

[Conditor22]

A marlin 45-70 stainless guide gun is at the top of my "shopping list" when the stars align, it will be my next rifle.

[sandog]

If you don't mind a heavier gun, and bigger (receiver), a Browning 1886 or new Winchester 1886, both made at the Miroku plant are excellent. Because of the weight, they are more enjoyable to shoot at the range.
If you are a bigger guy, the 8 1/2 -9 pound weight won't bother you for packing all day during a hunt.

As I got older I appreciated the lightness and compactness of the Marlin 1895. I did the bulk of my hunting in central Idaho and southwest Montana with the 22" round barrel Marlin .45/70's that were reintroduced in 1970.
As I'm a sucker for octagon barrels, slimmer wood and old style dovetail sights, I bought one of the Cowboy 1895's when they came out.
The one I have now is a CBA, which is a Cowboy with a shorter (18") octagon barrel.
It is a joy to pack all day, and the short barrel is easy to carry through the timber.
But at just over 6 pounds, it has some kick with all but lighter loads.
https://i.imgur.com/QZZVN6Oh.jpg
Even a regular Cowboy with 26 inch barrel seems light, as Marlin uses a tapered octagon barrel that gets small at the muzzle. The long version just isn't as easy to get through the woods.
By the way, Marlin has been making .45/70 levers since 1881, 5 years before Winchester came out with one.
https://i.imgur.com/Ry48fx2h.jpg
I recently retired and moved to Arizona, and mainly just bird hunt now, so I continue to shoot my pistol caliber (.44 mag and .45 Colt Marlin 1894's.

There is the Henry, a lot of people like them, but for what they cost, I'd rather have a Marlin or Winchester/Browning.
To me the centerfire Henrys are funky looking and heavy for what they are.
The tube loading is a turn off for some, but it is easier to unload without cycling them all through the action.
I believe the Henry has a rebounding hammer, which I am not a fan of. The rebounding hammer I had in a new Winchester 1892 felt like it was rubber band powered.

The cross bolt safety that Marlin has used since 1984 is the least obtrusive of the lawyer mandated safeties.
You can take off the buttstock and turn in the set screw that rides against it to deactivate it, or do like some of the Cowboy action shooters do and find a tight fitting O-ring to put around the groove with the red paint, to keep it from coming on.
Or you can get a delete kit that replaces the cross bolt with what looks like another action screw, or replace it with a saddle ring.
I find the cross bolt comes in handy at times, and I've never had it switch on accidentally. (Although I checked it often when in Bear country !)

Don't listen to guys that tell you all new Marlins are ****. They turned out some bad ones just after the take over by Freedom Group in 2008. I'd avoid a "Remlin" made from 2008 to 2011. Starting in 2012, they were beginning to turn out decent guns. I bought one then, the CBA, and bought the .44 mag about 2 years ago.
Zero issues. You'll still hear guys telling you to avoid any but old JM Marlins, but you'll also hear more and more guys saying they have a new Remlin and it is fine.

I believe Uberti and Chiappa are making 1886's now as well, but as the cost is about the same, I'd rather have a "Japchester" than a WOPchester.

[MostlyLeverGuns]

A while back Marlin had a rebate , I bought an 1895 Marlin Cowboy. I found it well made and with casual load selection, 1.5 MOA was possible. I expect better when I start to fuss. The Marlin allows easy low scope mounting. I have 71 Winchester and Browning which are similar to the Winchester 1886. I find them heavy, and a mounting a scope is not in their design. I own an 1895 I bought in 1979/80 that has had a hard (and successful) life as an elk rifle and is still my first choice for elk. I find a scope most helpful in ALL rifle hunting, including close timber hunting. I cannot warm to the tube loading of the Henry in center-fires, though I do like the 22 and 17 Henry's I have. I am working on a Marlin 35 Rem for PA hunting, every couple years I get back to eastern PA to visit my sister and hunt there. Unless you just WANT a 45-70, the 35 Rem handles PA game, deer, black bear very well.

[Hickory]

The 45-70 is an excellent caliber, if you can find someone to make you a .465 round ball mold, you can use it on everything from squirrels to grizzly bear with proper boolits.

[MrWolf]

My JM Marlin 45/70 was my first lever gun. Shoots great, feels great, and I will never sell it. I probably have about a dozen levers all told. See if you can try one as you won't be disappointed. I do not think the recoil is tuff with the standard 405 grain loads off the shelf - think I tried it back then with the Grizzly Ammo. Good luck

[WHITETAIL]

Go Cowboy!!!
I have one for several years and never
looked back. I have shot the Gould boolit,
the RCBS boolit and the NOE boolit.
With a little tinkering they all shot well.
My cowboy has never seen a boolit off the
shelf.:cbpour:

[500Linebaughbuck]

well...if you're going to big get the bighorn armory in 500L
http://www.bighornarmory.com/catalog/big-horn-armory-products/model-89a-500-linebaugh-11/

[indian joe]

Chiappa makes a purty nice copy of the Winchester1886 - their carbine version weighs in around 7.5 pound - blued steel and nice wood - and a recreation of the classic big winchester action.

[cwlongshot]

Well writen and informative!


If you don't mind a heavier gun, and bigger (receiver), a Browning 1886 or new Winchester 1886, both made at the Miroku plant are excellent. Because of the weight, they are more enjoyable to shoot at the range.
If you are a bigger guy, the 8 1/2 -9 pound weight won't bother you for packing all day during a hunt.

As I got older I appreciated the lightness and compactness of the Marlin 1895. I did the bulk of my hunting in central Idaho and southwest Montana with the 22" round barrel Marlin .45/70's that were reintroduced in 1970.
As I'm a sucker for octagon barrels, slimmer wood and old style dovetail sights, I bought one of the Cowboy 1895's when they came out.
The one I have now is a CBA, which is a Cowboy with a shorter (18") octagon barrel.
It is a joy to pack all day, and the short barrel is easy to carry through the timber.
But at just over 6 pounds, it has some kick with all but lighter loads.
https://i.imgur.com/QZZVN6Oh.jpg
Even a regular Cowboy with 26 inch barrel seems light, as Marlin uses a tapered octagon barrel that gets small at the muzzle. The long version just isn't as easy to get through the woods.
By the way, Marlin has been making .45/70 levers since 1881, 5 years before Winchester came out with one.
https://i.imgur.com/Ry48fx2h.jpg
I recently retired and moved to Arizona, and mainly just bird hunt now, so I continue to shoot my pistol caliber (.44 mag and .45 Colt Marlin 1894's.

There is the Henry, a lot of people like them, but for what they cost, I'd rather have a Marlin or Winchester/Browning.
To me the centerfire Henrys are funky looking and heavy for what they are.
The tube loading is a turn off for some, but it is easier to unload without cycling them all through the action.
I believe the Henry has a rebounding hammer, which I am not a fan of. The rebounding hammer I had in a new Winchester 1892 felt like it was rubber band powered.

The cross bolt safety that Marlin has used since 1984 is the least obtrusive of the lawyer mandated safeties.
You can take off the buttstock and turn in the set screw that rides against it to deactivate it, or do like some of the Cowboy action shooters do and find a tight fitting O-ring to put around the groove with the red paint, to keep it from coming on.
Or you can get a delete kit that replaces the cross bolt with what looks like another action screw, or replace it with a saddle ring.
I find the cross bolt comes in handy at times, and I've never had it switch on accidentally. (Although I checked it often when in Bear country !)

Don't listen to guys that tell you all new Marlins are ****. They turned out some bad ones just after the take over by Freedom Group in 2008. I'd avoid a "Remlin" made from 2008 to 2011. Starting in 2012, they were beginning to turn out decent guns. I bought one then, the CBA, and bought the .44 mag about 2 years ago.
Zero issues. You'll still hear guys telling you to avoid any but old JM Marlins, but you'll also hear more and more guys saying they have a new Remlin and it is fine.

I believe Uberti and Chiappa are making 1886's now as well, but as the cost is about the same, I'd rather have a "Japchester" than a WOPchester.

As much as I love my Marlins. And I know that they are getting better... if I was buying brand new I would have to look hard at this model.

Henry is probably worth a look, but will not compair to the quality comeing out if Miroku.

Good luck,

CW

[Wheelgun]

Another vote for the Marlin 1895 Cowboy.

I’ve had 2 1895 Cowboys and 1 1895 Guide Gun. I very much prefer the Cowboy. I like the longer octagon barrel and the straight grip better. The weight felt about the same to me, but I’m sure the Cowboy is heavier. I don’t regret selling the Guide Gun, but very much regret selling the Cowboys.

I’m looking for another now. The above 18” Cowboy looks very nice too.

[2shot]

Newer Browning or Winchester 1886 (Miroku) Extra Light. Why carry extra weight when you don't have to.

2shot

[MOA]

Well where it's a bit wet I like a stainless lever. And I think if you can find a Marlin XLR in 45-70 you have half the battle done. Low mount scope IF you want it scoped, not a light rifle, but not a very heavy one either. It does come with Ballard rifling, and the stocks will grow on you over time, but then I am kinda bias.

https://i.postimg.cc/rw0VVCBN/20180818-175815-AA.jpg (https://postimg.cc/LJSKvf6J)

[osteodoc08]

Do you want stainless or blued? Open sights or optics? Optics do you want traditional scope, mounting for red dot or scout style scope? Do you want a tang mounted peep sight? A receiver peep sight? What’s your longest shot at the range? On game? Do you want a tang safety, button safety or no safety? Do you prefer short or long barrels?

We can steer you to the perfect 45/70 for you with those questions for the most part.

Personally, the last 45/70 I’d give up would be my 1895 guide gun and my 1895 CBA and my Browning 1886. Oh boy, are you sure you can have just one?

[Bigslug]

Speaking strictly from the viewpoint of stark practicality, the Marlins are the easiest I've encountered for teardown and maintenance, and you've got the nice aftermarket options that allow you to ditch the idiot crossbolt safeties, plug in a one-piece firing pin, and install a beefed up ejector. They are also "modern" in that they are drilled for optics. You've got the stainless/laminate options, which are ideal for use in the GOOD hunting conditions of rain and snow.

If you want flat-out COOL, get an 1886. Teardown is a PITA, and as far as I know, they are all carbon steel and will rust on you, but it's John Browning at the height of his brain-power, and Winchester at the height of doing it RIGHT rather than CHEAP. You cannot top them for class.

The straight wrist stocks quit being fun as the intensity of the load increases, so if you plan on cranking a Marlin to near 2000 fps, I'd steer away from the Cowboy models and get one you can properly pull into the shoulder.

[Walks]

In 1987 I a Gunsmith my 1982 Marlin 1895 to cut down the 22" bbl to 18 1/2" & magna port it. Added recoil pad too.
SLAPPED Me in the Face with every shot.

I sent it back to Marlin to have the bbl replaced back to 22" bbl. They sent me a New Rifle WITH SAFETY.

I bought one of the 1895CB when they first came out, a 336CB in .38-55 too.

All my Marlins, except the pre-safety ones have had the safeties "disguised". The saddle ring "disguise" wasn't around before 1998.

Love the 1895CB & 336CB, but the .38-55 is easier on the beat up old man.

Watch out for curved buttstocks with heavy recoiling loads.

[Walks]

In 1987 I a Gunsmith my 1982 Marlin 1895 to cut down the 22" bbl to 18 1/2" & magna port it. Added recoil pad too.
SLAPPED Me in the Face with every shot.

I sent it back to Marlin to have the bbl replaced back to 22" bbl. They sent me a New Rifle WITH SAFETY.

I bought one of the 1895CB when they first came out, a 336CB in .38-55 too.

All my Marlins, except the pre-safety ones have had the safeties "disguised". The saddle ring "disguise" wasn't around before 1998.

Love the 1895CB & 336CB, but the .38-55 is easier on the beat up old man.

Watch out for curved buttstocks with heavy recoiling loads.

[jonp]

Not sure what you are asking. Caliber advice or which 45-70? If you plan on shooting heavy loads and from what you said it's intended purpose was probably not then any stock would do but if your like everyone else you just have to try something stronger. In that case I'd recommend a shotgun type stock. Marlin Cowboy or Henry.

[EDG]

The best lever gun is the 1886.
The best Marlin caliber is the .35 Rem.
I guess you could say I like .45-70s a lot since I have a lot of them. My favorites hands down are the 1885 Browning single shots. You can scope them, use a receiver sight, install a tang sight or just use the factory iron sights. Unlike the tube magazine repeaters you can use the long heavy 500 grn bullets for long range shooting.

[indian joe]

The best lever gun is the 1886.
The best Marlin caliber is the .35 Rem.
I guess you could say I like .45-70s a lot since I have a lot of them. My favorites hands down are the 1885 Browning single shots. You can scope them, use a receiver sight, install a tang sight or just use the factory iron sights. Unlike the tube magazine repeaters you can use the long heavy 500 grn bullets for long range shooting.

Have you tried single loading the long heavy boolits in that magazine gun for long range? I have had some nice results in a Uberti 1876.

[BigAl52]

Henry all Weather 45-70. Good looking gun IMHO and as good as anything coming out of Japan. Henry customer service second to no one and a lifetime warranty. What more could you ask for. The new Marlins are no where near what the JM Marlins were. I own both. Henry is where I would look.

[osteodoc08]

Be forewarned that the all weather Henry’s are NOT stainless. Good guns, but I wouldn’t put them ahead of my marlins. My Henry big boy 41 has such a rough finish I can literally file my nails on it like an emery board. The receiver scope mount screws are also a little on the light duty side and will strip before you get to 25 inch pounds..........that’s been my experience anyhow.

[sandog]

You mean a rough finish like this ?:
https://i.imgur.com/LkfobyBh.jpg
I saw that on the Henry website about a month ago. It appears their muzzles are finished with 80 grit sandpaper and they don't crown the barrel. I looked yesterday and couldn't find the picture, maybe they finally figured out it wasn't the best picture they could have come up with ?

Big Al, I would have to disagree with you. I also own new Marlins and older JM Marlins.
The new ones, a 2014 CBA .45/70, and a 2017 .44 Magnum, are just as accurate, smooth, good trigger, and tight metal to wood fit as my JM's.
The only differences are the new ones have that stupid bar code stamp on the receiver, and the new ones have a better polish and deeper bluing than my JM's.
A 1988 Cowboy Limited in .45 I bought a couple months ago, was barely fired, if at all, and had a rougher action than my new ones.
Maybe I just got lucky, and maybe you just got bad ones ?

If you think a Henry is a good looking gun, and as good as anything coming out of Japan (Miroku) well, we have a considerable difference of opinion.

[Texas by God]

That one leaning up against the grinding wheel gets my vote.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[BigAl52]

Thats ok Sandog. I have nothing against the Japan built Winchesters. But if one goes bad try for repair. If one of the new Marlins goes bad try for repair. Been there done that. I have a Remington built Marlin that should have never left the factory. Wouldnt even cycle 357. I had to send it to a gunsmith to get it to where it would run 357. Seems to me I also remember one of the members here sending his 45-70 in to Remington several time for the same reason and ending up with money back because they could not fix his issue. I might also add Sandog those Miroku guns are quite a bit more money than most of the other guns.

Osteodoc08......... Yes I know that the Henry All Weathers are not stainless. Al

[Gunlaker]

If you ever want to use a scope then I'd recommend an older Marlin. I'd heard about the newer ones getting better so I had a look at an 1894 Cowboy the other day. The wood was fit so poorly I could actually see daylight through the gap where the buttstock met the receiver.

The ( used ) Browning 1886 saddle ring carbines are very nice, but the sights aren't the greatest.

Chris.

[tdoor4570]

I have 2 45-70's 1895G 18 1/2 bbl 1895 22" bbl but my fav for dark timber hunting and general shooting Is the 444P in 444 marlin hard hitting and very accurate, right at 1" at 100 with my 265 gr load, and 1.5 at 100 with my 240gr cast.

[osteodoc08]

You mean a rough finish like this ?:
https://i.imgur.com/LkfobyBh.jpg
I saw that on the Henry website about a month ago. It appears their muzzles are finished with 80 grit sandpaper and they don't crown the barrel. I looked yesterday and couldn't find the picture, maybe they finally figured out it wasn't the best picture they could have come up with ?

Big Al, I would have to disagree with you. I also own new Marlins and older JM Marlins.
The new ones, a 2014 CBA .45/70, and a 2017 .44 Magnum, are just as accurate, smooth, good trigger, and tight metal to wood fit as my JM's.
The only differences are the new ones have that stupid bar code stamp on the receiver, and the new ones have a better polish and deeper bluing than my JM's.
A 1988 Cowboy Limited in .45 I bought a couple months ago, was barely fired, if at all, and had a rougher action than my new ones.
Maybe I just got lucky, and maybe you just got bad ones ?

If you think a Henry is a good looking gun, and as good as anything coming out of Japan (Miroku) well, we have a considerable difference of opinion.

234575

Hopefully that’ll show up as far as the roughness/unpolished barrel with the flash.

[murf205]

I own a 1895 CB and the safety doesn't bother me at all. In fact, you might find that it is a feature you would like to use when unloading the rifle just for safety's sake. Very true that you can scope the Marlin if you so desire but if you had rather not clutter the clean lines the Skinner (peep) sight works like a charm and looks good to boot.
I have a friend with a Browning BLR in 450 Marlin that is a very accurate rifle and comfortable to shoot as well. It has the smoothest action on a new rifle I ever shot. The 450 is basically just a 45/70 with a belt. Decisions , decisions.

[Petander]

SBL is my third Marlin 1895, I have a history of tens if thousands rounds through them,lots of heavy loads +2000 fps.

With less comb,SBL tames the recoil better than my previous ones - they had recoil pads,too.

There's nothing "worse than the old ones",none that I've noticed. If there was,I wouldn't have the SBL anymore.

I agree with this article.

http://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/longgun_reviews_st_model1895sbl_200903/100133

[sandog]

Big Al, I will agree with you on Marlin's Customer Service dept. There are instances where when the guns get back to the customer, the issue they were sent it for is still there. They say it's fixed but they didn't even do anything to the rifle.

I don't think anyone would have to worry about having a Miroku gun repaired, I've never heard of one having an issue.
Miroku doesn't ship out guns with problems, period. Other manufacturers could only wish they could do so well.

Feeding issues, crooked sights, etc. are real issues that the manufacturer should fix.
Minor things like a sharp loading gate, I'll take care of myself.
I don't think any gun is perfect as it comes from the factory, I usually change sights or grips to my liking, or do a trigger job.
Sometimes a firearm is really nice in every way, but just has a heavier trigger pull to satisfy the lawyers.

Yes, the Miroku's cost more. But a early '70's Colt New Frontier .22 revolver will cost you more than a Heritage .22.
A 670 horsepower BMW M5 is going to cost you more than a Ford Fiesta.
If you want more quality, you have to pay more money.

[sharps4590]

I've had both the Marlin's and the Winchester '86, the originals, not the repop's. I'd take either one again with a preference for the Winchester simply because I like it better. If I was back in that market I'd be looking at the reproductions most likely.....maybe....I dunno....I have a hard time not having the real McCoy so I could just as well end up with an original '86....if I didn't already have one in 40-82.

[georgerkahn]

I have had the Winchester, Uberti Winchester 1866 clone, and, the Marlin Guide Gun. The Marlin remains in the very front in my wee safe. It's ease of cleaning with readily-removed lever for receiver to muzzle bore cleaning; it's angle-ejection which permits a scope mount straight above barrel; its relatively light weight; and, perhaps best of all being its repeatable accuracy all give it "my vote".
geo

[725]

Have experience with Henry & Marlin. Other than that production period when the company got sold every other weekend, the marlins are good. I like the Henry's, too. They seem heavy, but when shooting the .45-70, that's a good thing. Henry has the best company support I've seen, and parts are more available. I would never get (or even get near) a magna-ported version. Those things will cripple your hearing -- forever.

[georgerkahn]

I ever so agree with 725 re loudness!!! My Marlin, a 1895CB Classic .45-70 Government, S/n 95,207,xxx (Octagon Barrel rifle); is of recent manufacture, having been made in 2005, and is just heavy enough to counter recoil. The Winnie .45-70 I had sported a rather short barrel with porting -- and, even with ear plugs under muffs, my ears would ring. So loud it was I noticed an uncontrollable (for me) "flinch" during firing -- a primary reason for my moving to the Marlin.
geo

[dverna]

Even if you are not planning to put a scope on now, as you get older and eyes fade, it may be something you will want to add. Consider that in your deliberations.

If you have not shot a .45/70 with near full power handloads loads, try one before you decide. Like others have stated, the .35 Rem or .38/55 will do everything you want for hunting purposes and be easier on recoil. PA bears can get big so I understand why you may lean to the .45/70.

[NSB]

Sandog's evaluation is about as perfect a response as you'll ever get. I own/owned a number of 45-70's, and it's probably either my favorite or second favorite cartridge. I own a Miroku/Win 1886 and it's about as nice a gun as I've ever owned, and I've owned a lot of guns. The newer Marlins are pretty nice when I look at and shoot those owned by my friends. If you're not hung up on a lever gun (nothing wrong with it if you are) take a look at the Miroku/Win 1885 single shot. My most accurate 45-70 to date is my 1885. It will do an honest 1moa at 100 yards for five shots. My 1886 will do an honest sub 1.7moa for five shots at 100 yards. I'm talking on a regular basis, not a one time thing. FWIW, the 45-70 is absolutely least fussy cartridge to load for I've ever owned. It likes a lot of different powders, but prefers bullets 400g and up for best accuracy. Loaded to Trapdoor levels it's pretty easy to shoot and it still shoots through deer from end to end with ease. I'm still waiting to recover my first bullet out of quite a few deer I've shot with these guns. Maybe next year....

[robg]

Bought a marlin sbl. Last year great gun and all the tweaks you need.

[Seeker]

Thanks for all the replies, I've been watching this. 45-70 is the caliber I want. I have a Henry in .45 Colt and it's my favorite shooter. I cast my own and want a 45-70 real bad. Looks as though it's Henry or Marlin, still not sure yet.

[smkummer]

I really like my 1895 sporter (22” barrel, pistol grip and 2/3 magazine). I mainly shoot trapdoor velocity loads (350gr,/1300 FPS). My 1951 336 35 Remington SC ( same configuration with pistol grip, 2/3 tube and 20 or 22” barrel) simply does it all though with less recoil and flatter shooting. A 35 caliber 200 grain bullet puts a good smack on anything it hits as well.

[smkummer]

Thanks for all the replies, I've been watching this. 45-70 is the caliber I want. I have a Henry in .45 Colt and it's my favorite shooter. I cast my own and want a 45-70 real bad. Looks as though it's Henry or Marlin, still not sure yet.

You will hear the term of a light 45-70 when you put a heavy bullet on your 45 colt. Often, 45-70 cast bullet shooters settle on a sweet shooting 300-350 grain bullet of which is attainable with modern 45 colt rifle shooting Ruger loads. Just my .02.

[sandog]

I hunted mainly with the .45/70 for close to 40 years in Montana, and it never let me down.
smkummer, I like the half and 2/3 magazine Marlins, too. And a 200 grain .35 bullet gets the job done.

I used a rusty Glenfield 30/30 as a "project gun" and rebored/rechambered it to .356 Winchester.
Grey Cerakote and a "deluxe" Walnut stock from Marlin completed the project.
I normally don't feel the need for scopes on a lever but this was my "long range" lever, so it had an illuminated 2-7x Mueller. The first load I tried in it (200 grain Hornady FTX @ 2375 fps) shot pretty darn well, 3/4" groups at 100 yards.
https://i.imgur.com/GPSW2BZh.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/nfEZB6Fh.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/tCB3j0nh.jpg

[OverMax]

For awhile I was interested in a 45-70 until I shot one. {A guide model.} To much muzzle jump and recoil for my liking. (cartridges shot were store bought)
After that recent experience I don't think I'll find better lever's than those I already have. 32 specials & 2-Savage 99 300s.
Although there are many who have interest in owning a 45-70 usually after they already own a preferenced deer rifle in a different caliber. I have yet to figure out why that is?_>why not the reverse in buying?
My only suggestion:

Buy one having a longer length barrel surely will enhance your targeting ability. Guide model on the other hand with its short barrel? may or may not inhibit those same shooting skills.

[sandog]

I hunted first with a .45/70. I never had any use for a .30/30 or the like.
I hunted where there were moose, elk and big bears. Bison too were around, although I never drew a tag for one.
The .45/70 is a bit overkill for deer, I suspect many want one because of it's rich history, it's being known as a classic round, and it is BIG.
They do have recoil with any but the mildest loads, especially out of a lightweight lever carbine.

Since moving to Arizona a few months ago, I am shooting my pistol round levers more, .45 Colt and .44/40.
Much more pleasant, although loaded stout enough they too get your attention when fired out of a 5 to 6 pound carbine.

[BigAl52]

Sandog
You may have never heard of a Miroku going back but its pure speculation to say one has not ever been returned. Even BMWs go back for repair.

[sandog]

Well, it's probably safe to say that a Miroku having to be sent back is far, far, far more rare than a Marlin or a Henry going back to the factory for an issue.
I never said a Miroku has NEVER been returned. I said I've never heard of it.

[NSB]

I currently have three Miroku made guns and I've had several more that I traded off or sold. I've never had one single problem with any of them. Their fit, finish, and overall workmanship is truly outstanding. Typical Japanese quality.....a lot like their cars. I've got to agree with sandog on this one. I only wish they made a larger variety of guns. FWIW, I also own a variety of other manufacturers guns and most have been pretty good. The ones I've sent back the most have been Rugers. I've sent back several handguns, one shotgun, and a couple of rifles. They did fix them to my satisfaction, but it's a pain in the you know what to have to go through all that.

[BigAl52]

234632

Heres a shot of a new Henry CCH in 357 Sandog. Im thinking the CCH on this gun is outstanding. The other side looks just as good. Its a carbine model. I cant for some reason get the other side to load.

[sandog]

That's a nice looking rifle, BigAl.
An unusual tiger stripe case color job, but very vivid colors, and nice wood.