My first posting - tips om .44 molds

[Norseman]

I have been shooting for 6 years now, and finally I'm finding an urge to step up into the wonderful world of .44 mag.

Since I'm very fond of my Ruger GP-100 6" .357, I've ordered a Ruger Redhawk with 7 1/2" barrel and are using the waiting time ( 2 months?) for it to get to Norway, to look for a suitable mold.

Since handgun hunting is banned here, it will be only used for paper.

The rules for the Magnum 2 class in "field shooting" competition here, demands a power factor (speed [f/s] times bullet weight [grains] divided by 1000) of at least 275.

So I would greatly appreciate some suggestions for molds with a design for accuracy. Currently, I'm leaning towards the Lee TL430-240-SWC, but that's only because of it's easiness in use.

Best regards from Norway

[44man]

The Ranch Dog (Made by Lee.) TLC432-265-RF is very accurate but it takes a gas check.
Using Felix lube on it I have shot 3/4" and 1" groups at 100 yd's from my Ruger. I can't do it all the time but it was enough to show me how good the boolit is. However, it spreads some at 200 yd's.
I haven't checked with RD to see if he has something without a gas check, you might go to his site and look.
You won't hunt but what was interesting is we shot a penetration test yesterday in a huge stack of wet phone books and newspaper. The Remington soft point went 11" but the RD went 33" without damage. That is almost as far as the 37" we got with the .475, 420 gr boolit.
Kind of amazing for a 265 gr boolit.

[mike in co]

lbt 280 lfn pb......works well in my srh/7.5. about 1050/1100 fps....you could go slower to make the 265 pf.

ww, water dropped sized 432 from a 434 mold.

mike in co

[Bass Ackward]

Just for paper? Can you provide more information. What velocity level do you want this to work at?

The caliber and gun implies top end, but paper implies another.

And in truth, you probably need to get the gun and find out it's measurements first as some brands of molds won't throw you much over standard diameters if you should need more. I have two and one does, and one doesn't.

[NuJudge]

I have not tried the Ranch Dog .44, but I have tried the 429421, the 429244, and various Lee molds. The 429244 with gas check shoots better than any other I have tried. I'm using 19.8gr of old Hercules 2400 and a Winchester primer right now with the 429244, and NRA 50/50 lube.

CDD

[Norseman]

I will only use the gun for competition. The Norwegian Shooting Association has a program called "Field shooting" with a Magnum 2 class, where the caliber needs to be between .41" and .455" and the minimum bullet weight is 210 grain.

In the Magnum 1 class, the calibre is .357" - .40", minimum bullet weight is 140 grain and the minimum lenght of the case is 25mm. Power factor is to be over 190.
I use my GP-100 in this event.


The Association suggests that the targets are placed at a distance between 10 and 200 meters.

At each "stage" we'll fire five shots at typically 3-5 targets in 10 - 16 seconds.

I do understand that I have to wait until I get my Redhawk to get some measurements, but it's frustrating to have to wait until mid-november to get it. At least I have ordered a spring kit for it today and will wait until I get to shoot it before I order any grips for it.

As to get molds to throw over standard diameters, I read at the Lee website, that you just soak bits of paper in alox lube and stick them between the to mold-halves. The lube prevents the paper from charring. Worked for me.

[Norseman]

NuJudge: I read that someone casted 265 grains bullets with the 429422. If I get the same weight, I need to get a velocity of 1050 f/s to get the required power factor.

Midway Norway sells the Lyman four-cavity mold for about $170 - I wish I was born in the USA ;)

Do you think I can make without gc? I've read that gc is only needed when the velocity exceeds 1.400 f/s. I have only WW-lead (I got about 400 lbs when I bought the used casting equipment), so I might just have to take up gas checking.

[Lloyd Smale]

MY favorite mid weight bullets are----- hands down my favorite is the rcbs 240 swcgc, followed by the 250kt rcbs and the 429421. Middle weight the lbt 280lfngc is a hell of a bullet. Heavyweight probably my favorite is the lbt 300lfngc followed by the lyman 320swcg and the ballistic cast 300lfngc and the ballistic cast 340 swcgc. All of these are good bullets that fly well at long range and seem to be easier to find accurate loads with in all of my 44. Like i said if i had to pick one all time favorite 44 bullet it would be the 240 rcbs and if you keep in mind i usually go for heavier for the caliber bullets then a 240 44. I cant find one flaw in that bullet. It is accurate in every 44 ive tried it in including 44 rifles, it flys well at long range, and has never let me down on the pigs and deer ive shot with it. One more bullet id like to give an honarable mention to is the lyman 250 devestator. Its a bit of a pain to cast but it is a very accurate bullet and ive shot deer with it with good results and it even put down a 1000 lb buffalo. It lost its nose but the base gave complete penetration and killed that animal as cleanly as my 500s have. I just tried my first ranch dog mold. It was a 350 grain 4570 mold and if the 260 grain ranch dog shoots as well as the 350 does its probably a good choise too. Its a mold thats on my must have list as soon as i get some finatial things taken care of.

[Scrounger]

The actual dropped weight of the bullet will vary according to the alloy used, pure lead may drop at 260 grains, wheel weights at 250 grains, and Linotype at 240 grains, all from the same mold. For that reason your Shooting Association will probably consider the bullet weight to be what the mold maker says it is rather than its actual dropped weight. That is just a guess, you might ask them.Most molds drop bullets a little heavier than their listed weight anyway. As long as you keep the velocity under 1400 fps or so, a gas check is not needed. So I'm wondering why you're considering a gas check designed mold? Why not Lyman 429421 or one of the other flatbase bullet designs? Lyman 429421 has a stated weight of 245 grains, so giving it a velocity of 1125 FPS would fulfill your requirement with no gas check. A heavier bullet would require a little less velocity. You should also be aware a machinist can easily grind out the gas check portion of the mold so no gas check is needed and the mold is 10 or 15 grains heavier. On bullet diameter, the need for oversize .44 bullets almost always comes from owners of Marlin rifles; Most Ruger pistols are almost always within SAAMI specs on bore diameter, .430" or .431" at most. I wouldn't worry about that too much. If I were you, I'd try to buy a Lyman 429421, size the bullets .431", and start figuring out a load that would give about 1150 FPS, using Herco or similar speed powder.

[mooman76]

You could also make some wads to put in if needed to act as a gas check.

[Down South]

So far I only have one .44 mould. That is the 429421. The main reason that this my first 44 mould is that it’s a Keith style boolit. I did a lot of research on .44 moulds and figured this one would be a good one to start with. I’ve only had the chance to shoot a few hundred rounds of the 429421 so far but it has already proved itself to me. As soon as I get home in a couple days I will get the money in the mail for Blammer’s group buy of the .44 Wadcutter. I’ll buy a gas check type mould in some configuration later on down the road.

[HeavyMetal]

MY strongest suggestion will be a Lyman 429421. Depending on how much you shoot either a 2 banger or a 4 banger. If your going to see some serious shooting, say 400 rounds a month go with the 4 banger!

We have several group buys going on right now for various 44 caliber boolits but in all honesty you will get the Lyman mold much faster than any of these!

Plus you are never at a loss with a Lyman 429421!

[Norseman]

Thank you very much for the replies!

The first reply suggested that I tried a bullet with a GC, but I would rather have one without. I'll order a Lyman 429421 from USA, as the prices here are rather high.

When we are picked out for PF control, they take five cartridges, pull out one and shoot the other four over a chrony to determine the velocity, so it's very difficult to cheat with the PF. Mind you, they only do this at the National Championships (next held in Larvik 13.-18th of June 2009), but I like to win fair and square.

I'll go and search for Lyman 429421. We don't have any American powders here in Norway, so I mostly use VV N-110 in magnum loads.

[MtGun44]

The RCBS version of the Elmer Keith design is the .44-250-K 421. This same
basic design is also sold as the Lyman 429421. Current production from Lyman
seems to have conciously returned to Keith's original design after many years
of drifting off with rounded grease groove and some examples with VERY small
front bands, a key point to the Keith design.

These two molds are consitently very accurate for me in S&W and Colt .44 cal
handguns (mag and spl) and also in two .44 mag rifles (Browning 1892 and
Win 94).

For moderate power loads, 10 gr of Unique is extremely accurate and will
typically go about 1100 from a 6" revolver. This load has been found to be
accurate by very many shooters with many different guns. Other powders of
similar burning speed seem to have less consistent accuracy. I have also had
very good results with 9.0 gr of Alliant Power Pistol, which develops
about the same velocity as 10.0 Unique. If you can't get these powders,
I would try a powder with similar burning speed to Unique or PPistol, which are
medium pistol speed powders, not the normal very slow pistol powders (Alliant
2400, H110/W296, & IMR4227) which are used for max power loads. That said,
or max power loads I have had best results with Alliant 2400, only good results with
H110/W296

Fitting bullet diam to cylinder throat diameter is extremely important for best
accy.

Good luck. You should work on your fish and game regulators to permit
hunting with .44s - these cast boolits will shoot exit any moose on a broadside
shot and penetrate very deeply on angling shots, too.

Bill

[NuJudge]

My 429244 casts at about 265gr. I try to grip it hard enough to leave finger prints in the Nickle plating. This helps a lot with controlling the thing.

CDD

[Norseman]

MtGun44:
As I only have access to the VihtaVuori powder range, I'll start with N-110 as the Lee Reloading manual lies between Herc 2400 and H-110 in burning rate.

The Norwegian Reloading Manual I use, lists a starting charge of 21 grain (1443 f/s) with a max charge of 22,5 gr (1498 f/s). I'll probably start lower than this, as I aim for a velocity around 1150 f/s. This is for a 240 grain Pb SWC

Be aware that this loading manual follows the old SAAMI standard!

They also list a charge of 10 gr of N-340 (between HS6 and Win 540 on the burning rate chart) that will yield a velocity of 1023 f/s, with a max load of 11 gr, giving 1101.

The powder that seems to fit my velocity range, is the N-105. 16 gr = 1237 f/s and a max of 17 gr gives 1335. All charges are measured in a S&W M29-2 6" barrel, but as I will be using a Ruger Redhawk with 7 1/2" barrel, I must of course start low and chrony my loads. I'm really looking forward to this!

All the above loading data is for the 240 grain Pb SWC

[felix]

N105 is exactly a single base BlueDot. N105 has a smoother top end, which allows a little more flexability. In contrast, BlueDot will generally give more velocity per grain because of the nitroglycerin. Start 240-265 grainers in 44 mag with 14.5 grains N105. ... felix

[andrew375]

I use two bullets, the RCBS 245g. Keith SWC and the LBT 320gr. flat nose. Both are plain base. For pure accuracy and long range performance the LBT is outstanding, 1 moa accuracy and I've shot them up to 600 yards. Best powder is VV N110.

I've shot one of the "field shooting" courses of fire in sweden. Some targets like the charging guard dog and the lorry tyres are surprisingly challenging.

[MtGun44]

Interesting that the N-340 is listed as BETWEEN HS6 and W-540, since
they are exactly the same powder - just packed by different retailers. There
are a number of powders that are marketed by multiple sources, and
it is common to see them listed as having slightly different results in a
list of loads. The difference is lot to lot variation only.

My powder burning rate chart (and NONE of them are perfectly accurate as
they are all pretty much estimated) shows N340 as quite a bit slower than
Unique, but N-331 only a small bit faster than Unique. I don't use the
VV powders, so have no manual, but if there is a load for N-331 that gives
a bit over 1000 fps with a 240 lead boolit, I would try it for sure as it just
might work like Unique, but I have literally found that particular powder
to be amazingly aptly named

Good luck and please report back your results.

Bill