Prism holder ideas for powder scale

[barrabruce]

Just asking how the smarter people have attached their prism on their powder scale to be able to read it.

Bought a new Scale as I was worried my old 30 odd yr old Lyman D7 was needing an upgrade..

This Looks virtually un used.
Even it’s little aggets wiggle around still.
The pan and wire are a bit big and funky but should be no dramas.
230426
Thnx

[Walks]

Never used one. But it's been so long since I used a beam scale on a regular basis that on those occations that I did. I just put on my readers.

[ulav8r]

Mount the scale on a shelf not attached to the bench. Mount it at eye level, whether you are working seated or standing.

[Three44s]

Look at the picture in this link. It is now discontinue it would seem but I think with a bit of ingenuity you can come up with a solution.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/117653/dandy-products-handy-view-beam-scale-prism

Best of luck!

Three44s

[1066]

That's a really nice old scale - It's only the old style pan and hanger that differentiates it from the famed Lyman "M5" and could be "modified" if you feel the need. Have you thought about going high tech and fitting a camera to use with a cheap android tablet of using a smart phone:
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2012/07/monitor-balance-beam-with-magnified-image-on-smartphone/

[robg]

mines mounted on an eye level shelf

[gray wolf]

I don't see (or can't see) the bracket that allows the triangle prism to slide up and down.
It needs to be somewhat inline with the scale pointer, or close to it anyway.

Mine went in the garbage long ago.

[Land Owner]

FOOD FOR THOUGHT

This isn't rocket science and a vernier is not necessary when measuring powder on a balance beam unless you think you can measure one individual flake, or one individual ball, or one individual cylinder of powder. Remember, many reloaders use a VOLUME method to powder charge and do not even measure the charge weight. They shoot real accurate too.

If you can see the balance beam scale, head up and erect, balance beam on the reloading table or nearby shelf, you can use a RELATIVE point on that scale to say to yourself IT IS ENOUGH and hit that mark CONSISTENTLY each and every time. You do not have to read dead level to make consistently accurate rounds...though I do like the table top camera through the computer to the large screen. That's innovative and creative.

[1066]

FOOD FOR THOUGHT

This isn't rocket science and a vernier is not necessary when measuring powder on a balance beam unless you think you can measure one individual flake, or one individual ball, or one individual cylinder of powder. Remember, many reloaders use a VOLUME method to powder charge and do not even measure the charge weight. They shoot real accurate too.

If you can see the balance beam scale, head up and erect, balance beam on the reloading table or nearby shelf, you can use a RELATIVE point on that scale to say to yourself IT IS ENOUGH and hit that mark CONSISTENTLY each and every time. You do not have to read dead level to make consistently accurate rounds...though I do like the table top camera through the computer to the large screen. That's innovative and creative.

True - with a lot of shooting, a tenth of a grain either way is fairly immaterial if you have a properly developed load, it also true that a lot of benchrest shooters are consistently producing tiny group just dropping powder from a measure. It's also true that other factors, such as wind and shooters ability will play a far more important to what happens down range.


However, I don't think you will find many current long range benchrest or F-Class shooters dropping powder from a measure. Over the last couple of years common practice seems to be to spend $600 on a digital scale, accurate to half a kernel of powder then top it off with a $200 digital auto-trickler. Remember, these are the guys who weigh individual primers - however, they do put in some stunning groups at 1,000 yards.


A good beam scale will easily and consistently measure within a tenth of a grain, fitting a camera is easy and it eliminates any parallax error no matters where you view the screen from, it also allows the scales to be placed in the most convenient position to use rather than where you can see it best.


Here's a good beam scale doing it's thing reliably.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xz2SWCjj5e4

[John Boy]

8 Dollar Crystal Prism ... https://www.amazon.com/Amlong-Crystal-Triangular-Teaching-Photography/dp/B00FHEL74C/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1542378076&sr=8-5&keywords=light+prism+crystal

[Land Owner]

1066 - I like that PC setup and wish I had one. His loading table is far too CLEAN though. I stop all motion in my hanging pan when reading the vernier scale. I also think that zeroing the balance beam at say 100 grains and checking the lower weight scales for zero gives a more fine tuned zero scale. Like a tiny angle at the muzzle will equate to a large miss at 100 yds, using no weight and eyeballing the vernier may not give you an exact zero. But using the largest check weight above the regime you are weighing (charge is 51 grains, use 100 grain check weight), and rechecking zero with nothing in the pan should give the best result. If the beam scale does not vary by 0.10 grain or more on the empty pan after setting zero at the charge weight (or above), you are within the accuracy regime of the beam scale. CONSISTENCY is the key. Thoughts?

[1066]

1066 - CONSISTENCY is the key. Thoughts?


Consistency is absolutely the key - It doesn't matter what your scales actually read, as long as you ascertain that it's a safe load and you can repeat it every time. I have reloading "scales" that have no weight markings. You set the desired weight by loading the pan with appropriate check weights and zero the "scale" at that. Every load exactly the same.

http://i.imgur.com/ijt2Y3Bl.png?1 (https://imgur.com/ijt2Y3B)http://i.imgur.com/tjnxzTAl.png?1 (https://imgur.com/tjnxzTA)

[mdi]

Yep, volume vs weight, again. For a newer reloader, I strongly suggest weighing their powder charges. One major reason is every reloading manual I've ever seen list charges in weight, grains and not cc.

Back to the OP's question; This is the first time I've seen a prism on a reloading scale, but it isn't a bad idea. I can't see any mounting brackets in the pic. Getting a good look at the indicator/hash marks has always been a "problem" especially for us older guys. I have a table (2x4 and 3/4" plywood weighted down by two 10 lb ingots) to raise my scale 10". As seen in some of the posts above there are many ways to get a good view of those tiny, itty bitty lines. I elevate the scale and keep the scale well lighted and don my readers... :wink:

BTW, what make is the scale in the pic?

[1066]

Y

BTW, what make is the scale in the pic?

Those are both Pacific.

[gwpercle]

I never knew a prism was required....or a prism holder !
Loading 50 years without this... I get to buy more reloading stuff !
I drive my wife insane with the stuff I need....more stuff, more stuff , more stuff....it's neverending

[mdi]

Those are both Pacific.
Sorry, I meant the scale in the OP's post...

[1066]

Sorry, I meant the scale in the OP's post...

I'm pretty sure that's a Ohaus 505 - dating from the mid '60's

[barrabruce]

Yes it’s a Ohaus 505 scale early model.

A quick look with the magnafine glass on a iPhone looks good.
I don’t know a bout the parallax error being slightly bent up for viewing thou.

The prism holder is on hold till I find something to make it out of.

Thanks for the links and ideas.

I do need something these days as the lines arn’t as sharp even with my trifocals on..
Ha :)

I think i’ll Trust a good balance beam scale over a electric one any day.

I have noticed that it centres quickly but drafts work on that big pan a lot easier than my old one.

[barrabruce]

230495
First proto type.
Learnt heaps.
Next one should be good I hope.
:grin:

[mdi]

I saw pics of a feller using one of those desk mounted, magnifying lamps. Seemed to work for him...
https://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=magnifing+desk+lamp&tag=googhydr-20&index=aps&hvadid=241901189202&hvpos=1t3&hvnetw=g&hvrand=16341118584773414858&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=e&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9033039&hvtargid=kwd-3508123785&ref=pd_sl_vmnm30twp_e

[Mike W1]

This works for me. Box with lead weights and leveling screws with a cheap magnafying glass.

230617

[nvreloader]

This might help you,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCs0Y7HH2zA

I added a needle pointer to my scale and then recalibrated the scale internal pan weights, to read correctly, with test weights etc,
it made a big difference on the accuracy of the scale and SEEING the difference of just where the needle point was referring to,
the OEM factory marks, on the scale/pointer marks, left a lot to be desired.

HTH,

Tia,
Don

[barrabruce]

Did you just use some superglue and a ground down pin for the pointer.
All of the methods have merit that’s for sure.
Keep ‘Em coming if you got them.

[nvreloader]

I found a pin in the betters half's stash of sewing stuff, and cut it off about 1/2 to 3/4" long,
then took the beam off the scale, laid it flat and solid and used a sharp pointed nail flatten to a sharpened diamond shape,
and a small rat tailed file cut/scraped out a trough deep enough for the needle shank to hold good,
cleaned the trough and used Supper glue to hold it in place.

Do not cut the needle trough TOO deep to cause the needle to rub against the scale face reading area.

Archery cement works very well also, placed the beam on the scale, set a known scale weight in the pan,
then took #9 lead shot flattened and cut enough lead to re balance the scale to dead zero,
placed the lean inside the pan base, then check with several other scale weights, to confirm that it was operating correctly.

With the needle point, you can see exactly where the point is, in relation ship to the line thickness etc.
Very easy to get very accurate reading etc.

HTH,

Tia,
Don

[barrabruce]

Thanks
Sounds like a plan.