Destroyer 9mm Largo

[Battis]

I was looking at a Destroyer carbine in 9mm Largo tonight for $425.00. It's in great shape but someone removed the sight and installed a Williams peep sight. I have an Astra 400 and brass, dies and bullets. It looks like a good shooter. Great wood, great bore.
Any opinions or experiences with the Destroyer?

[tim338]

I have one and they are a blast to shoot. The price seems fair IMO.

[Jeff Michel]

Make sure the extractor is present, they have a practice of falling off and your chance of finding one is inline with unicorn horns. They are great garden rifles with cast.

[Battis]

I have it on hold for a week. I'll bring some brass to check the extractor. It looks like a no nonsense, no frills, well made carbine. And, I have all I need to reload for it.

[bob208]

I have one no problems with it. would make a good house gun. I picked up some extra mags. on ebay.

[Battis]

I passed on this rifle due to what I read about the extractors being impossible to find if they break. I did look at the rifle last night - it's back on the selling floor - and the extractor is there, in good shape. Still tempting.

[LAGS]

I had one of these rifles Years ago, and at the time I could not find 9mm Largo ammo.
So I converted it to 9 mm Luger by putting an insert ring , pressed into the front of the chamber .
Then ran a 9x19 chamber reamer in to cut it to the proper depth.
Worked fine, but now I would opt for leaving one in the original caliber

[bouncer50]

I have 3 of them they were Spanish police rifle. When I bought mine years ago they were cheap. They are a blast to shoot and cheap to reload with cast bullet. They would make a great small game rifle. Their action is base on the 93 Mauser. I really love mine

[Earlwb]

I remember wanting to get one years ago. But by the time I tried to order one, they were out of stock and sold out. They were sort of dirt cheap at the time too.

[Battis]

Is this a Plus or a Minus for the gun...
I went back for a 4th look. The rear sight had been removed and replaced with a Williams peep sight. A blued piece of cylindrical metal covered the section on the barrel where the sight had been - it was a nice job, done by someone with skill. Other than that, the rifle was all original and matching. Does that sight job add to or subtract from the gun?

[Texas by God]

Is this a Plus or a Minus for the gun...
I went back for a 4th look. The rear sight had been removed and replaced with a Williams peep sight. A blued piece of cylindrical metal covered the section on the barrel where the sight had been - it was a nice job, done by someone with skill. Other than that, the rifle was all original and matching. Does that sight job add to or subtract from the gun?I'm not sure about the collectability of Destroyer carbines. But I would use that rear sight replacement as a bargaining chip to get the dealer to drop his price a little. The last one I saw around here was in the late 1980s and the man wanted $350 for it. I thought it was overpriced at the time.

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[Gtek]

It for sure will destroy collector value if you fit a GM 45 Auto barrel blank, open up bolt face a little, massage the extractor, cut the stock at front band, match contour radius of front and rear bridge, drill for Weaver steel mounts, weld new bolt handle, make spacer for mag well and modify 1911 mags. Guess I should finish it since I destroyed it!

[Drm50]

I have had several Destroyers. The ammo I had was Berdan primed. I made cases by thinning 38super rims. Some said this was unnessary that they shot 38acp and 38Super factory in them. I was afraid of putting undue wear on extractors. I have shot 38Super in Stars chambered in Largo.
I load cast 125g RN cast/ 4.5gr unique. Shot a lot of Pigeons and a few groundhogs with it. Never
had one that was a tack driver but at 25yrs was minute of pigeon. I don't think I have any parts for
them left. Maybe some extra mags, no extractors. I just saw one a couple months ago in ruff shape
with broken safety. $200 was the tag.

[Jeff Michel]

I get my brass from Starline and Mags are available from Sarco for around 9.00, if you buy ten the price goes down to six and change.

[Thumbcocker]

Could you pull the extractor and have a spare or two made?

[Earlwb]

I would agree, you could make a spare extractor. Anything man made can be remade.

[bob208]

the first batch that came in in the late 60's were modified to shoot .38 super. that next big batch that came in were not. I have one from the second batch.

[Battis]

How can you tell the difference?

[skeettx]

We took one and using a Win 88 barrel in 308 cut it down to fit the Destroyer
and then chambered it for 7.62x25, what FUN!!!

[Texas by God]

We took one and using a Win 88 barrel in 308 cut it down to fit the Destroyer
and then chambered it for 7.62x25, what FUN!!!
Now you're talking!

[bob208]

they are stamped .38 super over the chamber.

[Battis]

There's a two digit number on the bolt handle that doesn't match any numbers in the serial number. Mismatched bolt or do those numbers mean something else?

[blackbahart]

.My first one I bought out of Texas and imported it into Canada as I couldn't find one up here and it was just over 800 with the par dollar about 8 or so years ago and still have it .
Later found 2 more and bought them for 450 for the pair but the extractors were both missing .As stated by others the extractors are unicorn poop to find .Made extractors out of drill rod for them .The extractors are not really interchangeable ,seems the extractors were fitted to each bolt.I later sold these and kept the one I had imported as it shot the best
Dug it out tonite and looked at the bolt and its #41 and it doesn't match any #s in the ser
here is a pic and of the rear sight230936230937

[Battis]

Thanks for that info and the pic of the rear sight. On the rifle I'm still looking at, it looks like someone completely ground the rear sight and its base down and then smoothed and blended it into the roundness of the barrel. Strange. Then they added a Williams peep sight. It all works but even the salesman said that it definitely detracts from the value of the rifle.
The extractor is still there and in good shape. I read a post on another forum where the poster said that he had 8 rifles all without extractors. I also read that you should work the bolt slowly. What makes them so fragile?

[Jeff Michel]

Most of the Destroyers are mis-matched serial numbered. Arsenal rebuild perhaps? My extractor will "pop" off if I'm moving my bolt aggressively. It's not that they are fragile so much as a poorly designed way of holding them on the bolt, which is spring tension from the bolt band.

[Battis]

Is it more of an issue that they get lost rather than broken?

[blackbahart]

no the ones I bought ,Should have clarified they're broken just in front of the ring that holds them to the bolt .They are not hard to make if you have one to work from .Took about 3 0r 4 hours to make 3 and fit 2 .There is only so much the milling machine will do and the rest is needle file work for the locker hole/for the price you mentioned I would not be to hesitant to get it as they are neat lil rifles

[tunnug]

It for sure will destroy collector value if you fit a GM 45 Auto barrel blank, open up bolt face a little, massage the extractor, cut the stock at front band, match contour radius of front and rear bridge, drill for Weaver steel mounts, weld new bolt handle, make spacer for mag well and modify 1911 mags. Guess I should finish it since I destroyed it!

I had one at one time that had been converted to .45 ACP, they did a great job, called it my bloop gun, that was the sound it made when you shot it (I know the grenade launcher was one), I ended up selling it back to the original owner and now his son has it.

[blackbahart]

put a SIA type kit on a lee enfield for my 45ACP /fake can by the way and 14 inch barrel


231009

[Multigunner]

Years ago I looked around for a small bolt action to convert to 7.62X25. Didn't find one locally and lost interest in the idea after running into a great deal on an excellent condition Savage 23B.

It would be nice if one of the companies that specialize in repro rifles, such as the Henry and Winchester lever action and single shot repros were to make a run of Destroyer carbines with the option of barreling these for any of a number of suitable pistol rounds or similar sized cartridges like the 25-20 ,.32-20 or the many small cased .22 center fire cartridges.

The option would be necessary if marketing these in a number of European countries that ban the use of rifles or pistols chambered for any military cartridge.

[Battis]

I went back to the store for a millionth look. I removed the bolt and really checked the bore - it looks great. The bolt has a matching serial number that I never noticed before. The extractor looks good (no cracks that I could see) but I can see why it's a weak point in the rifle. The Williams peep sight is growing on me. I put it on 60 day hold - 20% down holds it. I have never hemmed and hawed over a gun like this before, but I'm glad I'm buying it.
Are there any other rifle's extractors that can be modified or altered to fit?

[blackbahart]

not that I am aware of ,they are not hard to make if you have one in hand to compare to ,.interesting to remove the bolt the first time .

[Battis]

I found this info online about the bolt collar, for what it's worth: "The bolt collar is easy, the CZ light carbine in 7.62x 39 has one that fits near perfect." That would be the CZ 527. Nothing about using an extractor from another gun. Oh well, just hope it doesn't break.

[Drm50]

A Destroyer will function and fire with 38acp or 38Super. So will Star & Astra pistols chambered for
9mm Largo. I wonder if the ones stamped 38Super are modified in any way? The only reason I didn't
use 38super brass without thinning the Rim was I thought it would be hard on extractors. I saw a very nice Destroyer that had full length stock and rebarreled to 7.63 Mauser and converted to single
shot. Maybe 7.63 Mauser is to long for magazine? The guy who had it knew nothing about it except he wanted $600 for it.

[bouncer50]

A Destroyer will function and fire with 38acp or 38Super. So will Star & Astra pistols chambered for
9mm Largo. I wonder if the ones stamped 38Super are modified in any way? The only reason I didn't
use 38super brass without thinning the Rim was I thought it would be hard on extractors. I saw a very nice Destroyer that had full length stock and rebarreled to 7.63 Mauser and converted to single
shot. Maybe 7.63 Mauser is to long for magazine? The guy who had it knew nothing about it except he wanted $600 for it. Yes the 7.63 round is too long to fit in the mag.

[blackbahart]

I think the extractors get broken from disassembly as the 2 rifles I purchased were broken in roughly the same place and just guessing the previous owners may have tried to remove the extractor ?I am guessing that who ever tried to remove the extractors on these did not know what they were doing and over lifted them and being thin in that area they snapped ?
Lots of firearms get damaged with the best intentions of cleaning by people who do not know what they are doing but do mean well ,even seen damage done on more modern firearms by people who were just cleaning their firearm
I really do not think the extractors are a real problem ,just not available to purchase .

[Battis]

The rifle is in great shape. The butt plate is loose, the bore is shiny and clear. Someone took care of this rifle - even the Williams peep sight was done well (the installer cut into the stock on the right side but it was a decent job). I studied the extractor and wondered why the heck they designed it that way, but it does look good, with no cracks. The store warranties the used guns for 30 days. I'm looking forward to shooting that big little carbine.

[Multigunner]

I think the extractors get broken from disassembly as the 2 rifles I purchased were broken in roughly the same place and just guessing the previous owners may have tried to remove the extractor ?I am guessing that who ever tried to remove the extractors on these did not know what they were doing and over lifted them and being thin in that area they snapped ?
Lots of firearms get damaged with the best intentions of cleaning by people who do not know what they are doing but do mean well ,even seen damage done on more modern firearms by people who were just cleaning their firearm
I really do not think the extractors are a real problem ,just not available to purchase .

Old model P-35 pistol extractors may be damaged by single loading and letting the extractor snap over the rim. Could this have been the case with the Destroyer?

[blackbahart]

Never thought of that ,looked at it again and I think you have something there as it doesn't want to go over the case too readily .I didn't force it and I think the single load will stress it especially if you give it a good slam to jump into the extractor grove .

[Battis]

I think I know what you're talking about but I'm not sure. Any chance of a walk-through?

[Gtek]

Could not take it anymore trying to remember and went and dug mine out. Controlled feed bolts have an open area usually flush to bolt face at 6 o'clock allowing cartridge base to slide up face and slide under the extractor. Single feeding requires the extractor to force itself around rim going into battery putting a lot of stress/bend at the thin spot just forward of collar. Probably many a Mauser and 03 have been massaged to allow (get away with) this but at the cost of claw engagement on rim. Push feed usually has a full circumference rim with a spring loaded extractor allowing single feed with no harm. Looking at this bolt and the small rim (mine has been opened up for 45 Auto) and the tenderness of these extractors and being made of unobtainium I will not be single feeding. This design to me appears to be a controlled feed only even having the small rim. The designers probably felt that with extractor at 12 o'clock the rim was needed at 6 for extraction and control of round. With rim being small enough still allowing controlled feed design as cartridge is pushed forward from magazine angling up under extractor and then captured by bolt face for alignment with chamber.

[Battis]

Interesting info.
Bear with me...I don't have the rifle here to examine and I've never fired one before.
Basically, if you load a single round, the extractor has to jump over the rim when you close the bolt. If the bolt picks up a round from the mag, the extractor doesn't have to jump.

[Gtek]

Correct! As round is pushed forward rim slides up behind claw instead of being pushed through it.

[blackbahart]

Gtek got her spot on ,just feed from the mags and one should be good !Tks for explaining

[Battis]

Thanks for the explanation, Gtek. Nice catch, Multigunner.