Shiloh chambers

[ian45662]

So I have a Shiloh on the way through bill Goodman. Just sent him the deposit only a couple days ago. I already have a c sharps highwall that I have been shooting for 5 years or so in silhouette shoots. Almost 3 years ago I started shouting bore diameter paper patch bullets in the rifle and have never really looked back. Well of course the new Shiloh will have a steady diet of bore diameter bullets but it will from time to time get the groove diameter bullet here and there especially at chickens. So i was all set to just go with a standard chamber but then I find out that there is another chamber that is offered that will accept groove diameter bullets. It has a 7 degree lead, that takes the 45 degree case stop out. I am really leaning that way to be honest but I wanted to see if others have been using this chamber in their shilohs?


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[sharpsguy]

Shiloh is known for having tight chambers. It is very likely that fired, unsized cases from your C Sharps will not chamber in your Shiloh without re sizing. Cases from my 1895 Marlin won't even come close to chambering in any of my Shilohs without re sizing, and neither will cases from my Pedersolis or a couple of original Remington rollers that have been fitted with Green Mountain barrels.

Get the standard chamber, and be happy. It will shoot with either paper patched or grease groove bullets. The Shiloh is a fine rifle, and will work fine the way it comes to you. Just don't expect to shoot the same cases out of the Highwall to shoot without re sizing.

[Don McDowell]

Shilohs standard chamber shoots patched quite well , but if Kirk has a reamer with the 7 degree lead built into it that would be another good choice
I too will echo get separate cases for your Shiloh to make life simpler
My Shiloh gets along real good with Hornsby cases


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[rfd]

the shiloh PPB chamber option is the "orville c. loomer" reamer.

[ian45662]

This one will be a little different than the loomer chamber in that it will still accept groove diameter projectiles.


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[rfd]

that does sounds like the orville chambering, it can do PPBs as well as greasers.

[ian45662]

Ohhh I c. I thought his change was just a straight paper chamber. Still kinda tight in the mouth from what I have seen. .478 or something like that?


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[Don McDowell]

The so called looser chamber is nothing more tha a reamer built from the specs from a chamber cast of an original borchardt

[Gunlaker]

I'm pretty confident that there are 3 choices, other than sending them your own reamer. Orville's reamer is a tight neck bore diameter PP reamer that, if I remember correctly, is something like a 12 degree angle from the outside of the case mouth. Standard is a 45 degree case stop with a 0.050" freebore and 2.5 degrees per side leade. The 7 degree one has the same mouth as the standard ( i.e. accepts groove diameter bullets ) but is just a 7 degree angle all of the way.

Don, I though the 7 degree chamber is what was in the Tollofson rifle you bought from Rick? I know he had one in at least one of his rifles.

You can also get Shiloh to chamber your rifle with a custom reamer that you give them. There is an extra charge for it.

Chris.

[ian45662]

That what it is. Standard Shiloh chamber but the cut a 7degree lead just deep enough to cut out the 45 degree angle at the lead. It goes from that into the 2-30 angle. I believe this to be a very similar set up to what’s in my c sharps but the angle is a little steeper than 7 degrees but it goes 1-30 into the rifling or throat as some call it. In my own line of thinking and of how things work I believe this should do very well for what I am wanting.


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[Gunlaker]

I do know some people who think that 7 degrees is optimal for PP bullets. I've seen a fellow shoot a number of sub-moa groups at 300 from the bench with one in .40 cal.

I can't say how well the Shiloh 7 degree leade is, but I can say that the standard Shiloh chamber is pretty close to as good as it gets for greasers. The only Shiloh I shoot PP bullets out of has a Dan Theodore chamber and it works very nicely. It seems that bore diameter PP bullets work quite well in a number of different chamber designs. I suspect it's mostly because most of the bullet is in the bore regardless ( unless you have a lot of freebore of course. ).

Chris.

[Don McDowell]

Chris the heavy gun does indeed have the 7 degree lead cut in it.
I also have 2 44-77’s with it , one had that cut after it had been shot a while the other was with that lead built into the reamer.
There really isn’t any problem shooting the standard 45-70 Shiloh chamber with patched, the one I am shooting here at the nationals is proving that.

[Gunlaker]

Don I've never tried shooting PP in the regular chamber but I've heard it enough times from enough good shooters to believe it :-).

Good luck at the Nationals! I imagine you must be shooting midrange prone now?

Chris.

[Don McDowell]

Chris Thanks.
Yes we shot prone today and tomorrow then Creedmoor Saturday and Sunday
Have weather moving thru and the winds here today sort of make shooting at Byers look like shooting in a building lol

[Gunlaker]

That must be some wind. The first time I was at Byers it felt like a hurricane :-)

Chris.

[Don McDowell]

Today at times it took 15 minutes left to hold paper at 600

[Gunlaker]

That's a pretty stiff wind! Maybe 18-20 mph full value?

I realized I was incorrect about not having shot PP in the standard Shiloh chamber. My .45-110 has the standard chamber and I've shot PP in it.

Chris.

[Don McDowell]

It woul go from ferocious left right, to mild to strong tailwinds quartering from the left to a mild wind from the right and back again.

[ian45662]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181007/7dfa3de835139bb9244e4d199f74f6b5.jpg. Can you guys guess as to what this lead angle might be? I won’t be home for a while or else I would take some measurements and do some calculations.


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[country gent]

It appears to be the same in length and height so possibly a 45* angle there

[JWT]

I spoke to Kirk at Siloh on Friday and he recommended the standard chamber with the 7 degree lead modification and removal of the stop. He told me that this was a good chamber for paper patch but would also shoot grease groove well.

[ian45662]

I’m probably over thinking it but I have been really beating myself up over this one simply thing. There are some people who are shooting extremely well with the 45 degree lead.


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[flatsguide]

That looks like the chamber in my stock .45-70 Browning bpcr. 20-25 degrees ?
Richard

[Gunlaker]

The Browning chamber is quite different than the Shiloh one. The Browning is something like a 12.5 degree taper from the outside of the case mouth all the way into the rifling. The Shiloh is 45 degrees into a .459" diameter freebore that is 0.050" long, and then a 2.5 degree taper into the rifling.

They both shoot quite well though :-)

Chris.

[flatsguide]

My Browning .45-70 BPCR chamber and the latest target of same228578
228579

[ian45662]

They do look similar but I think the lead in mine looks like it’s just a tad bit longer or is that an optical illusion ? I think the 45 degree lead is about .010 long. I am having a reamer made with a 45 degree lead in it for my cpa. It will be .481 in the mouth so that I can shoot groove diameter bullets in it also.


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[BrentD]

flatsguide, looks like you have it working. I can't imagine how that target would look if you upped your powder to the magical 82 grs. ... :)

Just kidding...

[Chill Wills]

Flatsguide - my Browning BPCR 45-70 chamber is long and will take 2,135" brass and should for best accuracy. Now that you have cast your chamber, can you say how long yours is?

[Gunlaker]

My Browning BPCR also had a very long chamber. I used Starline .45-90 trimmed to length.

Chris.

[flatsguide]

Chill my chamber is 2.110 long.it is rare that I get a paper ring.i trim my brass to 2.115. Too bad there is such a discrepancy on chamber length, but not as bad as the off center chambers in the Browning .40-65 ‘s. As a side note when I got my rifle I wanted to get thicker brass in the neck area for pp’ing. So I purchased samples of longer brass cases, miking the wall thickness at the same height as the .45-70 brass the thickness was the same as the .45-70 cases. This was in Starline brass. It may be thicker in other manufacturers brass.
Regards, Richard

[Chill Wills]

Thanks. I am glad you have a good one. I would have thought or hoped they would have used the same spec reamers. Odd that (too) long case mouth chamber in mine and some others. I wonder (guessing here) if in production they use a set of reamers to do each chamber? A rim reamer, a body reamer and throat reamer??? And just went farther than spec.? What I would have guessed was a one piece rougher and a finisher.

Anyway, it looks like you are well on you way to great accuracy. You will be winning every match ;):kidding: