case buldges

[RED BEAR]

bought a new kel tec p32 32acp and just love the little gun. but it really buldges the brass badly. my question is should this brass be reloaded. i know that lee makes a bulge buster die and i know you can't use one on 32 acp . my first thought is throw it away .any thoughts?227126227127

[Outpost75]

None of the ejected cases from any of my .32 ACPs look anything like that.

I would return your pistol to Kel Tec with some fired cases and the end flap from the cartridge box containing the manufacturer's lot number.

If these are reloads, something is seriously WRONG! Does factory ammo do that?

[RED BEAR]

these are reloads . they should be ok i use 2.2 grains red dot with a 77grain rcbs round nose bullet overall length may be a little short at .935 but any longer and the top lube grove would be exposed. i also use so-called once fired brass . now it doesn't do this with ever round just most and all show something the buldges are exactly where the feed ramp stops supporting the case. my other 32 auto (cz50) doesn't do this. i have read this is a common problem with the p32 . it has a long feed ramp and lose chamber for max reliability. i like the gun enough that if i have to throw the brass away so be it. the brass is very cheap $25 per 500 shipped. i will try factory ammo next time out.

[BK7saum]

How short on the OAL? Just seating a little deeper than OAL specified by load data or getting some bullet setback upon chambering can cause pressures to skyrocket. If you are seating deeper than specified by data, then I'd drop the load down as well. Those look way too hot.

[RED BEAR]

the book i use doesn't give a length for the rcbs bullet this is old data from rcbs. other bullets list min. length at .940 so at .935 i am a little short . but with this bullet that was designed for 32acp any longer and i mean at .940 the lube grove starts to show. the rounds show no other signs of pressures but maybe this is my sign? the max overall is .974 to .980.

[Dennis Eugene]

Do what you want, but I would be doing something different. D.

[jdfoxinc]

Where do you get your brass?

[RED BEAR]

i am looking to do something different i am looking to modify a lee 100 grain rn so that it is closer to 80 grains and set it out farther. but as i say this seems to be a common problem with the p32 even with factory ammo. some brands do it and others don't. maybe due to case thickness. i get my brass from brassman https://brassmanbrass.com . and for other brass that you don't see give him a call. he has 32sw long at times $40 per 500 shipped and has 32hr from time to time.

[country gent]

After enlarging the pics Its more apparent the feed ramp is cut / polished farther than the solid head of the case. the bulge is in the shape of the ramp. I would send it back to kel tec with cases and description of problem. also buy a box of factory rounds known to do this and send factory once fired cases. On most firearms reloads void the warranty.

A small case bvuilds pressures much faster and quicker so small changes variances in the load can make a big difference in pressures.

[mattw]

i am looking to do something different i am looking to modify a lee 100 grain rn so that it is closer to 80 grains and set it out farther. but as i say this seems to be a common problem with the p32 even with factory ammo. some brands do it and others don't. maybe due to case thickness. i get my brass from brassman https://brassmanbrass.com . and for other brass that you don't see give him a call. he has 32sw long at times $40 per 500 shipped and has 32hr from time to time.

Did the Lee mod, makes and awesome 81 grain bullet if you leave all of the middle driving band.

My Kel-tec bulges cases, but nothing like that! Those are either way to hot or you have a bad barrel!!! Mine gets much better with import brass as it is a little thicker as they were designed for the CIP chamber. What bullet diameter are you using? My P32 slugs out to need a .311, maybe you are using a warm load and .314's? These have a tiny case volume, loading is pretty critical here. I find that running my 81 grain Lee the best loads are around factory Winchester OAL.

Be careful! The P32 is not a strong gun! I mainly shoot a CZ70, it is a tank. I have never tried Red Dot, do not have any. I really like Titegroup in this round. I have tried 231 and Clays as well.

This thread has a ton of good info: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?49925-The-Lee-32ACP-Project-1

[RED BEAR]

yes that is exactly what i was planning on the lee mold. and yes it buldges exactly along the feed ramp just put one in and it matches exactly where the feed ramp is. the bullets are sized to .311 .i guess i could try only lubing one grove and setting the bullet out farther. old lyman list max for 77grain at 2.3 red dot others list 2.3 max for 71 grain bullets pulled some of the bullets apart and all were 2.15 to 2.2 grains. the new hornady book list 2.3 for 71 grain bullet as max . may not be over but certainly brushing up against it. will back off a bit and try again. plan on contacting kel tec after i try factory ammo. not foolish enough to say i was shooting reloads as that will void most warranties .and i think i will trash these. like i say this is a pocket gun that probly wount see a great deal of range time so if i have to trash them so be it. as small as it is and at only 6 onces you can't hardly tell you have it.

[BK7saum]

Since it doesn't bulge all cases, is it possible the boolit is getting pushed back into the case during feeding. Have you chambered rounds and then verified OAL hasnt changed?

[RED BEAR]

it doesn't bulge on all cases but you can see something on all them. no i haven't checked to see if they are getting pushed back but i will.

[gnostic]

What's the primer look like?

[mattw]

@RED BEAR, the little guy just disappears in a pocket. I carry mine in my back jeans pocket with a sheet of plastic cut to pocket shape from a gallon milk jug. This eliminates all printing!

[RED BEAR]

the primers aren't really all that bad.227144

[mattw]

I have talked with them about case bulges in mine. I am not the original owner and it may cost to get a barrel for mine, they would not let me buy a barrel. Those primers do not look to bad, I go for rounded edges and very little flattening in mine as I do not want to beat it up. I think I am running 1.8 of TG behind the 81 Lee. Maybe it is opening to soon? Weak recoil spring?

[KCSO]

I would guess bad chamber and would do a cast first.

[RED BEAR]

they are known to have lose chambers but how lose i am not sure .

[RED BEAR]

also when i cycle them by hand they do not push the bullet back at all.

[Steelshooter]

It is obvious the case is unsupported at the feed ramp. Send the barrel back to the kel tec to be replaced. If you don't let us know what happens when a case ruptures there, hope you don't get hurt.

[bob208]

I made some cases like that with a 1911 when I got carried away polishing the feed ramp.

[bedbugbilly]

Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook - 3rd Edition shows a 77 gr RN - OAL .975" - min. 1.5 gr - max. 2.3 gr. of RED DOT

I don't reload 32 ACP - BUT - brass like that coming out of my gun would certainly be making me ask "why?" and I wouldn't be shooting it until I found out why.

If you are using your reloads - have you tried a box of commercial loads yet to see if they come out the same way?

You are using .1 grain under the max load - how are you measuring your charges and are you checking to see if they are dropping accurately. I load several different cartridges that are in the 1.9 to 2.5 range of Red Dot and IF I uses a powder measure - Lee Perfect or Lyman 55 - Red Dot doesn't always meter real well - certainly not like Bulls Eye or similar.

Now for the next question . . . di you work up your loads or just pick one? I have no experience with a KelTec, but with all of my semi-autos, I have always started low and worked up until I find where they cycle - then fine tune it. None have ever been .1 grain under ma.

There are a lot of things to check . . . but, but if they are bulging like that . . . something has to "allow" them to bulge - off tolerance chamber, etc. Id try a few commercial loads and if you still get it, send it back to KT with the cartridge box and spent casings. If commercial doesn't do it - then you really need to be looking at your load.

Small pistol + big hand + shrapnel = very bad day.

[RED BEAR]

the case is definitely not supported there you can take it apart and put a shell in the barrel and see it is not supported there. and the fact it is not supported there is obviously what caused the buldges they match up exactly with the barrel. it is my understanding that it was designed this way. i am still going to check with kel tec after i shoot some factory ammo. i have read that a lot of people say this is normal for the gun. my original question was would you reload these or just trash them?

[RED BEAR]

i use a digital scale (gemini) . to measure them and check every 15th or so against a balance beam. it is always right on the money. i always load from 2.15 to 2.2 grains red dot i set the powder measure a little light and trickle up to weight. all the ones i pulled apart that were left over from trip to range were right on money 2.15 to 2.2 . when loading i use nothing less than 2.15 and nothing over 2.2. these loads show no other signs of high pressure and work just fine in my other 32 a cz 50 and a charter arms 32 hr. after checking with kel tec i will let everyone know what they say.

[gnostic]

the primers aren't really all that bad.227144

The pressure looks ok, when you look in the chamber, does it look normal? My PPK's a blowback design and on my warmer loads, the cases seem a little bulged...

[Bzcraig]

I had a P32, reloaded for it and used the same boolit and never had a case look like that after firing, not even close. To answer your question, throw that brass in your recycle bucket, then send the gun back with a case or at least pics.

[Tom Myers]

Using the Precision Cast Bullet Design ~ Advanced (http://www.tmtpages.com/#advanced) software application, I scaled out R.C.B.S.'s image of their 32-77-RN 465 bullet and set it up in the Precision Load Records (http://www.tmtpages.com/New_Prec_Rec/Prec_Rec-Bas.htm) software application to make sure of the dimensions and case volume data then run everything through QuickLoad to see what the pressures would be.



http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/32%20Auto/R.C.B.S._Mold_32-77-RN_465~1000-pi.Bmp

http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/32%20Auto/32_Auto~C_B_C~R.C.B.S._Mold-32-77-RN_465~_OAL-0.935~Red_Dot-2.2gr_Load~%232.Jpeg

It appears that your load is close to the maximum but still in the safe zone.

http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/32%20Auto/Quickload-32-Auto-internal.PNG

http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/32%20Auto/Quickload-32-Auto-Pressure.PNG

Shortening the C.O.A.L. by 1/10" raised the pressure from 19,606 psi to 20,131 psi, Real close to the SAAMI published Maximum of 20,500 psi.

Notice how small the velocity increase was in comparison to the increase in pressure.

http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/32%20Auto/Quickload-32-Auto-internal-MAX.PNG

[RED BEAR]

thanks tom i have nothing like that. i do plan on contacting kel tec after i shoot some factory ammo . have to wait for monday i saved money by joining the range on weekdays. retired so doesn't make any difference to me.

[Tom Myers]

Another duplicate post. Got to figure out what is causing this.