Funeral Flag Presentation Questions

[Thundarstick]

I posted something along the same line in the PIT, but I know many don't enter therein, so.

In my area of the country, and every funeral I've ever attended, the only flag draped coffins and flag presentations I've ever witnessed where for military service or an officer killed in the line of duty. I was taught, and have the understanding, that this is an honor reserved for these servants. Every person I asked this question locally yesterday seems to understand as I.

Is this just a regional thing, as I seem to have a problem with just anyone being able to receive this honor. If it's common for anyone to have a flag presentation service, does it cheapen that honor for service personnel?

Curious about what is customary in your neck o the woods.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Up here in my neck of the woods it is the same as in yours, to the best of my old mans knowledge. I have heard of this honor being given to elder statesmen or other highly thought of people that have done great things for our country. The flag courtesy was part of my Son`s funeral, he was an E-5 Marine that served in `the sand box`.Robert

[Tom W.]

My wife's Uncle recently passed away after a long and happy life. He was in the Navy, and had a flag covered coffin. The flag was folded by two sailors and presented to his daughter.

[richhodg66]

I've never heard of a flag draped coffin for anyone except veterans and police.

[pworley1]

I have never seen it done except for the reasons you stated.

[richhodg66]

Found this;

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/38/1.10

Not sure what codes or protocols cover police officers, seems like most of them are veterans and would be covered by this anyway.

[FISH4BUGS]

My Dad died and is buried in Ft. Leavenworth National Cemetery. He was a WW2 vet and died of service connected disability. I have the flag that was folded by the color guard and was given to his widow, my mother. That was 1964 so things may be different today.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I think that the link provided by richhodg66 says who can received a flag from the Federal Govt. for funeral uses. It is true that the flag is customarily used to drape the coffin of a vet or officer, but I do not believe that there is a prohibition against using for anyone's funeral. Afterall, they make them into clothing, use them to promote advertising, and burn them in protest. The flag belongs to all citizens, and if it was the desire of any citizen to have it displayed at his/her funeral I believe there is no law prohibiting it if privately supplied.

[MT Gianni]

In Montana a local funeral director informs the VFW and local [200 miles away] AFB. The VFW shows up as does a military contingent from the AFB. No charge is ever made. When my Mother passed my Brother was in Afghanistan and his son in Quitar. They both arrived in time for the funeral and we were visited by their commander previous to the funeral. Not a southern custom at all.

[DCP]

Vets,Police, Firefighters and other 1st responders

[osteodoc08]

Military, police and perhaps Firefighter/First Responder. ONLY.

My understanding is the same as yours.

[Hick]

If you are thinking of this being done when you pass-- be sure your family has the right records. I friend of my wife could not get a flag issued by the government for her husband's funeral because she had no records of his service. My wife made me go locate my DD214 and discharge just so she will have proof. Personally, I have no desire to die before her-- but at least she is satisfied.

[Mr_Sheesh]

I'd have to agree on Firefighters and first responders; Firefighting job is more dangerous than Police's job, yet the maniacs move INTO a fire anyways.

[farmerjim]

I'd have to agree on Firefighters and first responders; Firefighting job is more dangerous than Police's job, yet the maniacs move INTO a fire anyways.
Look up the top 10 most dangerous jobs in the US. Police and Firemen are not on it. They do ( the deputy in the Florida school shooting excluded) make a conscious decision to enter situations that are highly life threatening.

[Mr_Sheesh]

I know - Just that firefighting is more dangerous than policing, statistically, and usually more popular with most citizens, most of the time. The local PD had an incident where I was today - Neighbor of mine saw most of it, I was taking her boyfriend home and while she waited, some guy was following another guy (from what she said, she thinks he was armed in some way) - Probably intending to ambush him. A short time later when I got back there, there were at least 4 police vehicles in the parking lot, blocking everything, so I stopped short as they finished arresting one guy and were putting him in a squad car to haul him off; I think I know the guy he was following (had just talked to him earlier there at an event. I'll ask him next week!) I imagine that PD is VERY popular for saving him, probably, in this situation! Or at least for hauling the attacker away. (Not sure if it's a case of mental issues or what, wasn't there.) Not saying anything bad about our local PD in any way - They're good folks, I've talked with quite a few of them. Just that I also see firefighters as good guys! (Coast Guard too, I never have had to be rescued by them, but knowing they're there is a help when in a one-engine boat out on the Pacific!)

OTOH I definitely wouldn't include that deputy in Florida as a good guy, at best he made a very bad decision and IMO if you are guarding kids and that happens, you figure "Gun and sighting eye and trigger finger, don't fail me now!" and go in, carefully somewhat but go stop the bad guy(s)!

[jdb3]

Military, police and perhaps Firefighter/First Responder. ONLY. Not necessarily true. When I, as one of the Ceremonial Honor Guard that buried J. Edger Hoover, his casket was covered with the flag. Jim

[bedbugbilly]

As a former fire-fighter but a non-veteran . . . .

Since 911 and the heroic efforts of the police & fire, as well as civilians . . . the title "hero" seems to be applied to anyone woking in the law enforcement and fire service fields. My comments are not to "take away" from any of their efforts or actions . . . . but I get tired of hearing everyone being called a hero. Yes, there are "heros". But in the long run I think that the average lawman or fireman would not consider themselves "heroes". They do their job - they help people along the way - they serve and protect their communities. That is not to downplay any individual's efforts - man or woman - who perform those duties in any way. I have been shot at, I have been injured while fighting fires and I have seen things that the ordinary person never needs to see but I'm no "hero".

To me . . . and someone stated it . . . the "heroes" are those men and women in the military who paid the supreme price for our freedoms and didn't come home. Time and time again over the years, I have heard many many veterans describe a "hero" in that manner.

To me, those who have served this country in the military are the ones who have earned the right to have Old Glory on their caskets. If a LE officer or fireman (forewoman) gives their life in the line of duty, then they also deserve the right to the flag. Otherwise, for those of us who served in the fire service or LE, unless they are a veteran, I think the privilege of having a flag draped casket should be reserved for veterans. Long time politicians - if not a veteran, I disagree with them receiving that honor. Honestly, in today's world, other than politicians who are veterans, I question if any of them have earned such a right. The President - most certainly - they are Commander In Chief of the Armed Forces.

Just a humble thought on it form an old "smoke eater".

[DCP]

As a former fire-fighter but a non-veteran . . . .

Since 911 and the heroic efforts of the police & fire, as well as civilians . . . the title "hero" seems to be applied to anyone woking in the law enforcement and fire service fields. My comments are not to "take away" from any of their efforts or actions . . . . but I get tired of hearing everyone being called a hero. Yes, there are "heros". But in the long run I think that the average lawman or fireman would not consider themselves "heroes". They do their job - they help people along the way - they serve and protect their communities. That is not to downplay any individual's efforts - man or woman - who perform those duties in any way. I have been shot at, I have been injured while fighting fires and I have seen things that the ordinary person never needs to see but I'm no "hero".

To me . . . and someone stated it . . . the "heroes" are those men and women in the military who paid the supreme price for our freedoms and didn't come home. Time and time again over the years, I have heard many many veterans describe a "hero" in that manner.

To me, those who have served this country in the military are the ones who have earned the right to have Old Glory on their caskets. If a LE officer or fireman (forewoman) gives their life in the line of duty, then they also deserve the right to the flag. Otherwise, for those of us who served in the fire service or LE, unless they are a veteran, I think the privilege of having a flag draped casket should be reserved for veterans. Long time politicians - if not a veteran, I disagree with them receiving that honor. Honestly, in today's world, other than politicians who are veterans, I question if any of them have earned such a right. The President - most certainly - they are Commander In Chief of the Armed Forces.

Just a humble thought on it form an old "smoke eater".

Just because someone was in the Service doesn't make them a Hero! Not everyone was a SEAL, Ranger or Green Beret please don't misunderstand ALL who severed were part of a greater good. I know folks who hated every minute they served (it was just a Job ) Now he is so proud to be a hero gets his free meal. Yes, Police and Fire folks earned their flag. You shouldn't have to die to earn it. If you served honorably you earned your flag

[trapper9260]

All I know for who gets the flag on there coffin are what is stated. I have the one of one of my uncles that was KIA in WW2 it have 48 stars on it. When i was in the Navy wait for my first ship to come in they have me be honer guard and I done some funerals of Vet from what I know of.Yes I also help to fold the flag over the coffin also.We did only 18 shots for the Vet and place the last round that are blanks in the flag after it was folded. The 21 gun shot I was told at the time is for the President .That is what I was taught back in 1979.

[rl69]

My grand father had a gun salute and I was always puzzled becuse I understood that a 21 gun salute was reserved for certain people. Now I wounder how many shots were fired all thouse years ago?
Thank you trapper.

[DCP]

Everything you want to know about 21 gun salute


https://www.thebalancecareers.com/the-21-gun-salute-3354127

[jonp]

Members of Congress and The President get a Flag

[LukeSrm]

I was always impressed with this kind of funerals. How everything is prepared and performed, you can clearly see that his kind of funerals is made for very respected people. I saw once a funeral of an ex Vietnam soldier. It was, in Sad Diego from what I remember. The guys that planned the funeral really did a good job. They even used the Slant headstone maker (https://mattosmonuments.com/slant-headstone-designs/) for the funeral stone. It's actually sad to attend a funeral, but that one really impressed me. Hope you guys are doing ok. Take care.

[country gent]

One thing also I think is that veterans are saluted by veterans and active military are saluted by active military. The last few veterans here honor guard by the VFW was only 3 members and a local high school band member volunteered to play taps for them. The VFW is losing members and the veterans health is getting to the point that most cant do the honor guard duty anymore. Thats how Dads was done. There just weren't enough for the full Honor guard

[Mk42gunner]

I did a few burials at sea for former service members. At that time we only did cremains, if member of the deceased family was on board, they dumped the ashes.

We always did three volleys of seven rifles.

We also did three volleys of seven when we dedicated the park at Annacortes, WA. Although we did have our Gunnery Division officer in charge that time.

At NAWS Pt Mugu, we had a 40mm saluting battery. The normal salutes weren't too bad, other than screwing up Weapons Dept's liberty; but the minute guns of Memorial Day had us setting off car alarms for several minutes.

There is a rather large Navy manual regarding ceremonies and the number of guns required in a salute. I do not remember the particulars, but a gun salute is different from firing three volleys at a funeral.

Robert

[Blanket]

don't know the protocol but my father a WW2 combat vet and 2 Cousins 1 killed in VN, one from Agent Orange from VN flags were presented

[jonp]

My grand father had a gun salute and I was always puzzled becuse I understood that a 21 gun salute was reserved for certain people. Now I wounder how many shots were fired all thouse years ago?
Thank you trapper.

My grandfather who went ashore at Normandy had a flag draped coffin, taps by an actual person and a salute.

I would think it highly improper for the flag of it wasn't a vet or police/firefighter killed in the line of duty

[Winger Ed.]

In our region, you verify the deceased's credintials, and the funeral home provides the govt. issued flag.

The local VFW used to do the folding ceremony and a 21 gun salute at the grave site if you asked, and they could arrange it.
That's pretty much gone away since the WWII and Korean war guys have mostly passed away themselves.

After they so gleefully **** on the Viet Nam era vets, there isn't any younger guys to be VFW members and continue the services.
Now days, 2 active duty members from the deceased's branch of Service fold and present the flag if requested.

[MstrEddy]

One of the toughest duties I performed a few years ago was presenting the Flag to the mother of one of my young troops at her funeral service. My squadron commander had asked me to stand in for him as I speak Spanish and her mother spoke no English.
The base Honor Guard did the Honors, they played taps on the bugle, they had the volley. I was honored to help carry the flag draped coffin from the hearse to the stand. I could barely hold back the tears as all the following was going on. The Honor Guard folded the Flag. Presented it to me as the Presenting Officer and I then marched and gave it to the mother. I had translated the phrase into Spanish so that her mother could understand.

Thursday, I am attending a funeral for one of my former troops, also a retired LE, who passed last weekend.