38 S&W loads?

[Cactus Farmer]

Anyone playing with the old 38 S&W? I've had a Smoot for years,just aquired a Forehand & Wadsworth and an Iver Johnson 'Safety Hammerless'.None are pristeen but tight enought to shoot a little bit. Would you feel undergunned with one loaded with Holy Black and 358250 Lyman? 5 Rounds of rapid fire would make some smoke and fire,it might put the "bad guys" on their heels!:Fire:

[Buckshot]

http://www.fototime.com/8DAF2A1F0B9E0C6/standard.jpg

My Iver Johnson in the rip snorting 38 S&W cartrudge. Actually a very fine shooting and fun revolter.

http://www.fototime.com/B8AC5913DE564B1/standard.jpg

Target shot with the pistol off the bench at 25 yards. Hold onto yourself as here's the load info. It was an 'as cast' pure lead Lyman 35863 @ .363" and TL 150gr WC over 1.6grs of Bullseye in Starline cases.

It left the piece at a mind blowing and blistering 480 fps. Doncha know THAT would sure raise a welt if you got hit? :-) While the peestol is in superb condition and tight as a tick, I'm pretty sure at least a hundred FPS got let out in the rather generous .012" bbl/cyl gap.

However in the couple Victory models I have the 38 S&W can be an entirely different beast. Interesting in that with the Victory models, you can seat out the 200gr RN Lyman 358430 far enough so that the exposed boolit is longer then the cartridge case :bigsmyl2:

Just name me another cartridge where you can do THAT! :-)

http://www.fototime.com/3B773CE97D573A2/standard.jpg

From Left Lyman 358430, Lyman 35863, Lee GB 6 cav 100gr DEWC, Lee GB 6 cav 146gr RNPB, and loaded. Factory Colt New Police, 38 Special case for comparison.

The Lyman 35863 is loaded to the same OA length as a 38 Special target load as shown in the Lyman CB book (1.15" I think) so in the Victory model you can use the 38 Special load data as case capacity is the same, or not enough difference to matter. About 725 fps IIRC.

.................Buckshot

[Bret4207]

Me personally, I wouldn't shoot black in a revolter 'cuz of all the nooks an crannies to clean, but I'm a lazy son and thats just me. My 38S+W is a beyooootyfull S+W Perfected Model. I haven't shot it a lot but it will hold the black on a 4" target at 25 yards with factory stuff if I can see the sights on that day. Reloads with an H+G #50 and 1.7 gr BE did okay , but I think the boolit is a little skinny at .360+. I have a Lyman 360271S that unfortunately casts at the same .360+ so thats been iffy too. I may try a harder alloy to get a larger diameter boolit of maybe Beagle the Lyman after I get some time, that is- retire. FWIW- Lee makes a 9mm Makarov boolit that specs at .366. It's only 90 gr or something like that, but it might be worth a try too.

As for carry, given a mechanically sound gun and a workable load I 'd be okay with it. Of course I'd avoid crack houses, heroin party's, other guys wives and assassinating heads of state, but you do what you want.:mrgreen:

[9.3X62AL]

As for carry, given a mechanically sound gun and a workable load I 'd be okay with it. Of course I'd avoid crack houses, heroin party's, other guys wives and assassinating heads of state, but you do what you want.:mrgreen:

The above recommendation is a good one anyway--black powder or smokeless, 38 S&W or 454 Casull.

[onceabull]

Iver Johnson 38 S&W was enough for a least one head of state..But perhaps those types have grown armor plate like deer & elk.. Onceabull

[Bret4207]

Yeah, and we got Teddy Roosevelt thanks to that IJ. Odd, but true!

[Cactus Farmer]

I cast up a few 150g 30-1 boolits for the BP loads and put 3grns of Unique under some 358477. WOW, I was shocked with the recoil. Even the BP load,although it was less than the semismokeless Unique. I sure want some ballonhead cases,I got 8 grns of 3f and bet I could get 12 in a BH. Killed some nar-do-well rocks. Saving the world from such things is fun![smilie=w:[smilie=w:

[dubber123]

[QUOTE=Buckshot;

Target shot with the pistol off the bench at 25 yards. Hold onto yourself as here's the load info. It was an 'as cast' pure lead Lyman 35863 @ .363" and TL 150gr WC over 1.6grs of Bullseye in Starline cases.

It left the piece at a mind blowing and blistering 480 fps. Doncha know THAT would sure raise a welt if you got hit? :-) While the peestol is in superb condition and tight as a tick, I'm pretty sure at least a hundred FPS got let out in the rather generous .012" bbl/cyl gap.


.................Buckshot[/QUOTE]

I had a VERY ratty IJ in .38 S&W with the huge BP cylinder gap. My loads clocked 460 fps. I ground out a very thin washer, and welded it to the rear of the forcing cone, to tighten up the gap.

After shaping and polishing, it didn't look bad. Anyhoo. the same loads went from 460 fps. to 520. Real power there.[smilie=1: One of my most fun guns though..

[9.3X62AL]

3.0 grains of Unique is a pretty strong load for an old top-break and the 150 grain #358477. I would back that down significantly--my old top-breaks get 2.0 grains of Unique and a 100 grain Makarov RN sized to .363".

[Geraldo]

Would you feel undergunned with one loaded with Holy Black and 358250 Lyman?

My grandfather didn't feel undergunned with a .38S&W, although he had smokeless in his. His Iver Johnson hammerless is probably tight enough to shoot, but I haven't because I'm leary of a cylinder that doesn't lock up til right before the hammer falls.

[GrizzLeeBear]

--my old top-breaks get 2.0 grains of Unique and a 100 grain Makarov RN sized to .363".

Wow, just yesterday I was looking at some of the inexpensive surplus 9X18 pistols and was thinking the Lee 9mm Mak mold sized down might make a good 38 S&W boolit. I've seen an H&R solid frame revolver with a 4" barrel and thought in would make a nice little "trail" gun for small game, etc. The Lee boolit, even though its a round nose, might work well for this as well.

[Buckshot]

...........Most 38 S&W's with fixed sights were set up for a 146gr slug. The lighter Makarov slug, while able to go faster will probably require an adjusted hold to 'hit'.

................Buckshot

[9.3X62AL]

Factual stuff, Buckshot. It does strike low, ESPECIALLY in the S&W Lend-Lease and the Webley-Enfield. Not so much so in the Owl Head, but a little Tennessee elevation is called for. The little contraption won't be seeing Camp Perry, so the sighting arrangement is livable. The 2.0 grain/Unique load might leave quite a welt on a jackrabbit, so one needs to be careful while afield and select only lighter-bodied game animals and varmints as quarry, in the interests of humane take and preventing the need for follow-up shots on enraged jacks.

They can be a handful if cornered, and have issued many a mauling to the coursing Chihuahuas often employed in the chase of these vicious varmints here in the People's Republic.

[jhrosier]

.... It does strike low, ESPECIALLY in the S&W Lend-Lease and the Webley-Enfield. .....

The Webleys used the British version of the 38 S&W, the 38-200, with a 200 gr bullet. It would be expected to shoot low with a lighter bullet.

Jack

[missionary5155]

I had a S&W down here in Peru for a short time.. I gave it to a pastor in a nearby town... But I fired mine a couple times.. then understood real well why Elmer Kieth stated he prefered the .41 Colt as being "the better man stopper". Down here 38 S&W is factory loaded using cut down 38 Special brass.. The lead (soft) boolits are squeezed real bad in the thick wall cut down cases and have no hope of sealing cylinders and they near rattle down the barrels. But some people are "impressed" by the ball of fire erupting around their knuckles.