Bottom pour vs ladle

[RD4570]

I’ve got a Lee pro 4 20 with the bottom pour but always read where it’s better to use a good ladle for more consistent bullets. I’m not too good with the ladle yet but I’ve found that when I use the bottom pour my bullets are really consistent. I could see myself just staying with using the bottom pour. Does anyone else have the same results?

[sharps4590]

Not I. For handgun bullets I'll bottom pour unless I'm going to do some long range work but, for rifle bullets the ladle is always used. I've never been able to bottom pour within 1/2 gr. weight. Once everything is up to temp, within 1/2 grain weight is expected using a dipper/ladle.

[GhostHawk]

Go with what works for you.

I've been ladle pouring for so long I do not think I could ever switch.
If it is not broke, don't fix it.

[Tatume]

Ladle pouring produces better bullets for me. Bottom pouring is faster. Some folks bottom pour and produce excellent bullets, so the difference is probably experience and personal preference.

[RD4570]

I get a lot of wrinkling with my ladle, so I’m sure it’s my technique.

[marlin39a]

I bottom pour everything, except the 535 gr Postell for My Sharps.

[bbogue1]

RD4570 Early in casting I found wrinkling to be caused by allowing a bit of molten lead to slop over to the next cavity. It enters the empty cavity and cools a bit, then, when the cavity is filled with molten lead the cooler lead is trapped in the new bullet. The outline can still be seen because it never remelted and merged into the new bullet. I fixed that issue by tipping the mold slightly so if any overpour reaches the next cavity that cavity has already been filled. Sprews tend to be a bit bigger but no wrinkling. I still get a few underpours and wrinkling, so I recycle them back into the pot to melt and they become happy bullets in the next few moments.

[Dusty Bannister]

While I have a ladle, I have nearly always used the bottom pour feature. I do like the ladle when pouring samples for hardness testing when smelting scrap to make ingots. My quality does not seem to suffer with the bottom pour which is faster and allows a quick change from free fall, to pressure casting as the mold or temperatures require. It is easy to overflow the cavity, so as earlier noted, tilt the mold away from the empty cavity. I do not cast large long bullets so that is not going to be a factor for me. It is what you have become used to doing and are most comfortable with. Good luck and enjoy the hobby. Dusty

[Walter Laich]

bottom pouring for me

I find I can cast very uniform bullets at a much faster rate. I'm not looking to set records but I don't want to spend vast amounts of time casting either

[country gent]

Several things are a part of this, not just bottom pour or ladle. Bottom pour pots can vary as to flow and stream size pressure. Ladles vary greatly also in stream and flow. The lee ladle is little more than a spoon. The Lyman, RCBS, and rowels are much better choices. I have all 3 and use the rcbs most. My lyman and rcbs have the pouts opened up to .210 dia hole size for better flow and a smoother surface. I cast long heavy bullets, most are in the 1.4" length range. 45 calibers are 500-550 grns 40 cals are 400-425 grn 38 cal are 335- 360 grns. I find I getmuch better bullets and more consistant weights with the ladle. as said above 1/2 grn variance isn't uncommon.

One plus to the ladle is the ability to "over fill" the mould. Instead of pouring a sprue you fill the ladle and pour the whole ladle into the sprue hole allowing the excess to run back into the pot. This makes for a very consistanrt sprue puddle for the bullet to draw from when cooling, Keeps the bullet and bullets base hot and molten longer for better fill out, and allows more time for off gassing. Another plus to the ladle is thee rate of fill they have. A good ladle fills the cavity completely while the nose is still molten.

[gnostic]

I pressure pour with a ladle. I've owned several bottom pour pots, and have never been able to make them drop a bullet, that rivaled the quality of ladle poured. I'll try bottom pour again this summer, hopefully I'll have better results.

[bangerjim]

110% bottom pour here. Fast. Accurate. Repeatable. Easy. I have 2 bottom-side ladles and never use them anymore. Tried them several years ago and just did not like the slow plodding rhythm and very low boolit output - compared to 5-6 banger modern molds.

If you are still using old style 1-2 cav molds, a ladle may be OK. But I like to make MANY hundreds of boolits in one session.......FAST....and get it over with. I have more important things to do than slaving over a hot lead pot hand poring 1-2 boolits at a time.

Angle of mold while bottom pouriing it critical. Experiment to find what works best for your technique.

But do what best fits your needs. I know what fits mine!

Banger

[Tom W.]

I have a Rowell ladle somewhere..... I also have two Lee bottom pour pots. Guess which gets used the most.......

[lightman]

I'm a bottom pour guy. I never perfected the ladle method and I get good results with my bottom pour pot. Both methods can produce excellent results. I suggest using which ever method works for you.

[Walks]

I prefer a bottom pour. I learned to cast using a ladle. But I've never been able to ladle cast consistent bullets out of a 3cav or more mould. I ladle cast test bullets out of a 1cav .45 mould to check hardness when blending fresh alloy. But that's it.

However I do pressure cast pure lead for Cap&Ball and Muzzleloaders. A dedicated 10lb electric pot just for pure lead. And a GOOD LYMAN Ladle just for pure lead.

Bottom pour is so fast when using a pair of 4,5,6 Cavity moulds, I don't know how you could produce as many bullets by ladle casting.

[RD4570]

Thanks everyone for the input.

[white eagle]

Been using a ladle since I started
no need for any different

[jmorris]

I prefer to bottom pour but do ladle from time to time.

[vzerone]

Do a test and be honest about it. Choose a rifle bullet mould for this test. Bottom pour some then ladle pour. Make sure you have a consistent correct melt temperature, make sure the mould it's too hot or cold, make sure you have a good cadence in casting (this one will help with that correct mould temperature, watch for a sprue that solidifies in 4 seconds and maybe a little sooner and never one that takes a very long time. When finished weigh your bullets and see which have less weight variance.

[gwpercle]

Try both and do it the way you like. No rule says you can't have a ladle for some and a bottom pour for others.

I started in 1967 with a Lyman 1 cavity mould and Lyman ladle. Graduated to two cavity moulds and the ladle. About 10 years ago I got a bottom pour and tried and tried and tried but could never get it to work for me....I made a lot of boolits but 50% weren't up to my standards .
I went back to the ladle...but this time I got a bigger pot, bigger ladle and some 3 and 4 cavity moulds. After warming up 99% of the boolits that drop are near perfect keepers. I found it more produtive that way . I can pour good boolits with a ladle, pressure casting, I suck rocks with a bottom pour...it's just me. Try em all and do what way works for you, no right or wrong.
Gary

[Hick]

I bottom pour because its easy and I never learned to use a ladle well. I like that with bottom pour I can let a little slag accumulate on the surface and still get nice clean alloy out of the bottom.

[cjensen]

Less than and equal to 400 grain, I bottom pour. Greater than 400 grain, I ladle.

[toallmy]

I bottom pore with a lee 4/20 pot most of the time mostly handgun boolits , but sometimes I feel like dipping a few .

[stubshaft]

I gave up creating lee drip sculptures years ago. Went to ladle pouring and never looked back. I usually open the sprue holes in my molds to allow faster pouring too.

[Lloyd Smale]

I agree. MAYBE and I mean MAYBE a ladle might work better for a beginning caster for larger bullets but I can make them out of any alloy you can throw at me that have weight variations just as good with a bottom pour as I can a ladle. Most variations in bullet weight come from maintaining mold temp and rhythm, not from how the lead is put in the mold. Id no sooner go back to ladel casting as I would single stage loading of pistol ammo.
110% bottom pour here. Fast. Accurate. Repeatable. Easy. I have 2 bottom-side ladles and never use them anymore. Tried them several years ago and just did not like the slow plodding rhythm and very low boolit output - compared to 5-6 banger modern molds.

If you are still using old style 1-2 cav molds, a ladle may be OK. But I like to make MANY hundreds of boolits in one session.......FAST....and get it over with. I have more important things to do than slaving over a hot lead pot hand poring 1-2 boolits at a time.

Angle of mold while bottom pouriing it critical. Experiment to find what works best for your technique.

But do what best fits your needs. I know what fits mine!

Banger

[RED BEAR]

I've always used a ladle not becouse it is nessarly better but never owned a bottom pour pot. might try one at some point.

[Mike W1]

Just had to adapt this little goodie to the thread. Hope it works!

220318

[DBrown]

My results are consistent as well. Usually if there is a variance it is because of something I did. Let the molds get too hot, too cold, dirty etc
I shootCowboy Action so accuracy is not quite as critical as production.

[aws1963]

Done both. Prefer the bottom pour over ladle. But then again I am not pouring precision projectiles either.

[gpidaho]

My bullets turn out much better bottom pouring. Too many rejects using a ladle Gp

[BrassMagnet]

I agree. MAYBE and I mean MAYBE a ladle might work better for a beginning caster for larger bullets but I can make them out of any alloy you can throw at me that have weight variations just as good with a bottom pour as I can a ladle. Most variations in bullet weight come from maintaining mold temp and rhythm, not from how the lead is put in the mold. Id no sooner go back to ladel casting as I would single stage loading of pistol ammo.

When I started casting 550 grain BPCS boolits with a Hoch nose pour mould, I started out with really poor quality boolits. So I went to experimenting with various techniques. I found pressure filling to work best. So I held the sprue in contact with the pour spout and then after I was sure the mould was full I pulled it away to form a generous sprue. I settled on a 5 count to be sure the mould was filled.

I would vote you can cast awesome boolits with a ladle or a bottom pour mould.

Very heavy, very light, or very complex designs will require more experimentation to find the best techniques. Normal weight pistol boolits in the usual designs are usually very forgiving of technique. Boolits with many square lube grooves are generally very demanding.

[one-eyed fat man]

Keep two pots. A small Lee bottom pour filled with wheelweights for blasting bullets. A large Lee furnace with 30:1 for dipping the big black powder cartridge bullets.