301620 (210gr) Mold and 30-30

[thirtythirty]

Hey guys. I have another thread started on all of the ways the aforementioned mold is not working for my Mosin. I really like it, however I don't have any other similar caliber guns other than my 30-30. Initially I immediately rejected the idea of using a 210 gr Boolit in a 30-30 lever gun, however I've been thinking over the last little while. The Mold throws a .302ish Boolit-I could paper patch the base and leave the nose exposed, which would allow it to chamber (my bore is .302 so leaving the nose exposed wouldn't be an issue). I could single load so I don't have to worry about magazine detonations as a result of pointed bullets. My only issue is finding load data for such a heavy bullet. I don't want to hot rod anything, I just think it would be fun to give it a shot. I saw on a previous thread (I'll post it below) in which someone had used a 220 gr bullet with a winchester 94 30-30, so I think this can be done. Anyone else have experience with this? Any loads?

post # 11 http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?56539-1000-yards-shooting

[longbow]

I may have some loads for a 200 gr. boolit in .30-30 in my old Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook. Seems to me Frank Marshall(?) wrote about using a 311284 in .30-30 Savage bolt gun. I'll take a look.

As for the half jacket paper patching, I tried that in my .303 Lee Enfield but for me it was a total failure.

On the Mosin note... I understand they tend to have generous bores. I made a cylindrical mould modeled after that NRA PP boolit design for my .308. It casts at 0.301" so perfect for the .308 and it worked well. Then I got a Lee Enfield in .303 Brit with a 0.314"+ groove diameter. I got some thicker paper and patched up some of the same boolits to .314" groove diameter. Accuracy was terrible. I tried a few different papers but no go. Then I knurled boolits up to 0.304", patched and shot, accuracy was quite respectable. I didn't pursue PP'ing for .30 cal. for long but that seemed to work for me. You might want to try rolling those boolits under a coarse file or get a knurler to try it out. You might also be able to get a reamer (number, letter or maybe metric) and ream the mould out to get bore diameter or a bit larger cast boolits out of it... or just get a larger mould for the Mosin.

There a fellow posting about patching up much undersize boolits and getting good results so you may want to keep trying with different papers too. It may yet be doable with what you have.

Anyway, I try to remember to look for the .30-30 heavy boolit article.

Longbow

[thirtythirty]

I was looking in my manual again, and the heaviest weight I could find was a 190gr bullet. The Accurate manual shows (max loads of 2495) 28.5gr for a 152 gr bullet, 27.5gr for a 173 bullet, and 27.5 gr for a 190 gr bullet. Would it be possible to go down 2 grains from 27.5 (25.5gr) and use that as a MAX load?

[303Guy]

There is a formula for changing bullet weights which is simply multiplying the powder charge by the bullet weight of the known load and dividing by the new bullet weight. It's Ok at moderate pressure loads if the bullet weight difference is not too great. Test it against known loads with different bullet weights.

[725]

IIRC, Sam Fadela, wrote something about heavy for caliber .30-30's. Been too long to remember where I saw that. Might search out some of his writings.

[thirtythirty]

Thanks you guys. I have one more question which I should have started off with. The little info card that came with the mold said that it was a 190gr mold, however I weighed the bullets and they were 210gr. Whats up with that?

[beltfed]

I have been shooting a 32-40 Rem Hep /8 twist barrel on BRG BPCR action for Schuetzen.
Case Capacity is close to the 30-30.
I am shooting the LYman 311299-nom 200 gr and the 311334-nom 190 gr both w/o Gas Check over 15.5-16.5 gr IMR 4227.
shoots very well (for me) in Schuetzen.
I do expect to get around to trying my Lyman 301618 and 301620 PP bullets in it soon as weather cooperates.

beltfed/arnie

[longbow]

Sorry. I had forgotten about this.

I just looked in my Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook 3rd ed. and yes Frank Marshall posted his load for a Savage bolt action .30-30 using the Lyman 311284 (210 grs.) - 30 grs. 4350.

That is his hunting load with estimated velocity of 1750 FPS.

I hope that is of some help.

Longbow

[longbow]

Oh, and he says his cast at 220 grs.! So even heavier than yours.

Lyman uses their #2 alloy for cast diameter and weight standards so different alloys will give different results.

Longbow

[thirtythirty]

Oh, and he says his cast at 220 grs.! So even heavier than yours.

Lyman uses their #2 alloy for cast diameter and weight standards so different alloys will give different results.

Longbow

Thanks Longbow. Was that IMR?

[longbow]

Unfortunately it was only listed as 4350. You'd have to check to see if there are differences in brands but I'd assume IMR.

[303Guy]

I've heard of 4350 being used in the 30-30 with cast. I think it it may have been H4350. Larry Gibson may have the data for it. It may have been Larry that told me. It would be a full case IIRC.

From what I can remember, there are small differences with the AA 4350.

The ADI powder equivalent chart is quite a nice one.
http://www.adi-powders.com.au/handloaders/equivalents.asp

I found this on MarlinOwners.

150 gr bullet - IMR 4350 min. 32.0gr - 1690 fps
max. 36.0gr - 2012 fps - compressed load

170 gr bullet - IMR 4350 min. 30.5gr - 1570 fps
max. 34.5gr - 1915 fps
http://www.marlinowners.com/forum/reloading/36288-imr4350-30-30-load.html

[thirtythirty]

Thanks. What is the deal with an powder equivalency chart? I assume you can't just interchange load data between "equivalent" powders, right?

[303Guy]

No you can't, it's an indication only but some powders are more interchangeable. ADI make some of the Hodgdon and IMR powders.

[OverMax]

I've read some using a 202 gr. RN for 30-30 use but no one using a 220 gr. cast which is a 30-06 preferred {Heavy wight} game bullet.

[thirtythirty]

Ok, sorry, I haven't given this project too much attention lately. Decided to go another round with the Mosin. Its been a losing battle, so I gave it a shot in the 30-30 with 20gr of Accurate 2495. Only made about 10 rounds, but they appeared to work with no noticeable leading. Got about 1400 fps. The bullet is seated really deeply (am just seating so that the rifling engraves a little on the bullet). Deeply meaning the base of the bullet is below the case shoulder. I'm hoping this is ok if I keep the powder charge lower than normal? Anyways, looks promising so far!

[thirtythirty]

Ok, worked up the load a little bit (until the battery in my powder scale died). Got up to 21g of accurate 2495 and just shy of 1500 fps. Seems reasonably accurate. I would like to push things a bit faster if I could though. I used that trick that 303guy suggested (powder grains x bullet weight of known load and divided by new bullet weight to get new powder charge). I have a load in my Accurate manual for a 190 gr bullet of 27.5gr Accurate 2495. When I use the formula I get 24.88 grains for a 210 grain bullet. I'm thinking I should reduce that charge a bit more because the bullet is seated below the case shoulder (thereby increasing pressure). Would 23gr be a reasonable max charge do you guys think?

[webfoot10]

I use 21 grs of AA 2520 under a NOE 314299 sized to .311 gas checked and lubed
with Ben's Liquid Lube. I shoot these loaded single shot as they won't feed from
the magazine of my Savage 340c 30/30. Shoots a nice 1/2 in group at 50 yds.
I use a small pinch of Dacron over the powder. Good deer load out to 150 yds.