Accurate 11FS Powder

[curioushooter]

Accurate 11FS (http://www.accuratepowder.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/load_data_11FS.pdf) seems to have potential in Magnum Handgun cartridge with medium to heavyweight bullets.

It features a flash suppressant, and is designed for 300 Blackout with short barrels (16"), which has geometry analogous to straight-wall and small-bottlenecked handgun cartridges.

Like most modern load data, the 357 Magnum max loads are weak, but I suppose they could be used as starting loads for 357 maximum. It may be a better powder in these applications than Win 296, Lil-Gun, AA1680, etc.

Anybody played around with it yet?

[9.3X62AL]

Like most modern load data, the 357 Magnum max loads are weak......You can thank (or cuss out) SAAMI for that adulteration circa 1990. Gunmakers wanted to install 357 Magnum loads into J-frame S&Ws and 44 Magnum into repro 1873 Winchester leverguns, so the pressures were reduced for all of the Magnum revolver rounds. Some of the old data still appears in older manuals, but be mindful that powder formulae may have changed over time. Make haste slowly in such enterprises.

Stuff like this is why we have Ruger Blackhawks. 1550 FPS from Lyman #358156 is no problem in my Bisley Blackhawk x 7.5". And the brass slips out with gate open and muzzle elevated.

[kgb]

Might be a 32-20 powder, too. CFE BLK is another 300 Blackout that might work in 32-20, but they only have data for 218 Bee.

[sghart3578]

I might have to try this in my 1894C and my Rossi 92.

[Paul105]

Midsouth recently had a promo - Buy 4 lbs of Accurate Powder (Incl Ramshot) and they waived the HazMat fee. I ordered 3 lbs of 11FS and one lb of silhouette which arrived yesterday. I'll get around to testing it in the .44 and .357 Mags and 45 Colt in the next month or so. Have used a bunch of H110 and 2400 over the last decades and have been perfectly satisfied with the results. Thought I'd try the 11FS due to the flash suppression claim. Not particularly bothered by flash or blast, but we hike in and out of bear country in the dark when bow hunting elk, so I thought I'd give it a try.

If anybody is interested, I'll post my results.

Paul

[Messy bear]

Yes I would be interested in results.

[RobS]

I would really like to use this powder in Ruger only 45 colt loads. I have on the other hand 8 lbs of Enforcer/AA4100 and would trade it out for the newer 11FS powder. Looks like a great performer in magnum handgun rounds.

[Green Frog]

I would be curious as to how this powder would work in max level 327 Fed Mag loads (for my Blackhawk.) :Fire: Both AA 7 and 9 have shown pretty good promise and it looks like the 11 FS might move further in the right direction. Has anybody tried it with, say, a 115-125 grain bullet yet? :coffeecom

Froggie

[curioushooter]

Paul, I was inspired by the same promotion, but didn't take the bait, mainly because I don't want to end up with 4 lbs of 11FS I will never use, and they were out of stock of AA1680 which is what I have been looking to buy more of for a year now.

I would be MOST interested in what you find out, particularly in the 357 Mag.

I have a 357 Max Contender that I run with Win296 at loads that would be ill-advised in any revolver. 11FS might be able to give it even more oomph.

[sghart3578]

I am very interested in the results, thank you.

[Three44s]

Might be a number for the 30 Herret (rimmed) as well.

I have not committed to dive into the stream with the Blackout yet but I like how a lot of the bullets and boolits as well as other components seem to line with the old classic.

Also note the reference to 480 Ruger, I have a lot of Lil’l Gun already.

Three44s

[Shuz]

If anybody is interested, I'll post my results.

Paul[/QUOTE]

Me too! Especially in your model 69's!
thanks,
Shuz

[Paul105]

Accurate No. 11FS testing – April 4, 2018, 357 Mag, 44 Mag, 45 Colt Ruger Only.

First, I checked “bulk density” of 11FS vs 110/296 using my RCBS little dandy and rotor #24.

Weighed on my old Ohaus 10/10 scale.

11FS = 22.8 gr (Current ? production)

H110 = 23.7 gr (Last of an older 8 Lb Lot)
W296= 23.8 gr (Fairly recent 4 Lb lot)

Looks like 11FS is a bit bulkier than H110/W296

RCBS Little Dandy Rotor No. 24 (Mine throws about 1 grain more H110 than indicated on the chart), so if using the Little Dandy, verify actual powder charge on a scale.

Data for info purposes only. If you decide to use any of this, cross check with known data sources – it’s easy to make typo errors when posting info. Here’s a link to the Accurate Powder No. 11FS data sheet.

http://www.accuratepowder.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/load_data_11FS.pdf

All Chrono Results:
5 Rounds (except 357 4 rounds – accidently left one on shell plate)
5 Long paces from muzzle
37 Def F ambient air temp (ammo from house to truck to outside for 10 min)



================================================== =============

.357 Magnum 4 ¼” S&W M66-8 (new Combat Mag)

158gr Hornady XTP 1.57”+ OAL)
15.8gr No. 11FS (Rotor #17)
New Starline cases,
Win Small Pistol Magnum Primer.
Actual FPS: 1,132 fps avg, 92 fps ES

(Note: 16.7gr is max at 1.580” OAL for 1,407 fps from 6” using 158gr Speer JHP)

COMPARISON LOAD(S)
15.0gr A2400
158gr Hornady XTP 1.57” OAL
New Starline
CCI Standard Small Pistol
1,293 fps avg 40 deg F, 5 long paces from muzzle

================================================== =============

================================================== =============


.44 Magnum (4 ¼” S&W M69)

All .44 Magnum Loads with Accurate No. 11FS use:
CCI 350 primers
New Starline Cases




240gr Hornady XTP 1.590”+ OAL
21.8gr No.11FS, Rotor #23 (max 22.6 at 1.590” for 1,554fps from 8.275” w/Sierra JHC)
Actual FPS: 1,197 avg, 72 fps ES

COMPARISON LOAD(S)
240gr JHP Federal Factory (No. 44A)
1,217 fps avg, 45 deg F, 5 long paces form muzzle (ES 12 fps)

240gr Horn XTP (1.595” OAL)
24.0gr H110
Fed 155 Mag
New Top Brass
1,323 fps avg, 60 deg F, 5 long paces from muzzle (ES 55 fps)

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260gr WFNGC .432”, 1.626” OAL (Mt Bullet Works)
20.6gr No. 11FS, Rotor #22 (max 21.9 at 1.625” for 1,47ffps from 8.3” w/265gr Hdy)
Actual FPS: 1,113 fps avg, 140 ES (hi was 64 fps higher than nest value)


COMPARISON LOAD(S)
260gr WFNGC (Mt Bullet Works)
23.2gr H110
Fed 155 Mag
New Top Brass
1,224 fps avg, 45 deg F, 5 long paces from muzzle (ES 52 fps)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------





265gr SWCGC 429244, .430”, 1.572” OAL (crimped over front drive band)
17.7gr No. 11FS, Rotor #19
Actual FPS: 1,056 fps avg, 44 fps ES
No Accurate Powder Data for this Load.

COMPARISON LOAD
265gr SWCGC 429244 (Deep Seated, Crimped over front dr band, 1.572” OAL)
17.5gr A2400
CCI Standard Small Pistol
Multi Mixed Brass
1,142 fps avg, 45 deg F, 5 long paces from muzzle (ES 37 fps)

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------






315gr Lee FNGCDC .429”, 1.605 OAL
16.9gr No. 11FS, Rotor #18 (18.1 max at 1.605” for 1,306fps, 8.3” with Las Cst 300 TC)
Actual FPS: 968 fps avg, 80 fps ES


COMPARISON LOAD(S)
315gr Lee FNGCDC (Top crimp grove 1.605” OAL
20.0gr H110
Fed 155 Mag
New Top Brass
1,141 fps avg, 45 deg F, 5 long paces from muzzle (ES 23 fps) 3 rounds only

315gr Lee FNGCDC (Top crimp grove 1.605” OAL
20.0gr H110
CCI 350 Mag
New Starline
1,193 fps avg, 42 deg F, 5 long paces from muzzle (ES 6 fps) 2 rounds only


================================================== =============

================================================== =============


.45 COLT (4 ¼” Freedom Arms Model 97)

315gr Lee FNGCDC, .452”, 1.587” OAL
21.8gr No. 11FS, Rotor #23
Fed 155 M
New Starline
Actual FPS: 1,061 fps avg, 15 fps ES

(Per Accurate Data Sheet -- 22.8gr max at 1.566” OAL for 1,353 fps, 7.5” BBl w/Laser Cast 300gr TC)


COMPARISON LOAD(S)
315gr Lee FNGCDC (Top crimp grove
22.5gr H110
Fed 155 Mag
1x Starline
1,140 fps avg, 65 deg F, 5 long paces from muzzle (ES 38 fps)


================================================== =============

Some final thoughts:

1. ES might tighten up if load(s) increased towards maximum book.

2. Data for the 300gr LC TC from accurate appeared to be on the low side -- chrono seemed to bear this out.

3. I'll do some additional chrono work and accuracy in the near future as weather permits.

4. Will also test degree of "flash suppression"

Paul

[Shuz]

Thanks Paul!

[Messy bear]

Thanks for posting! I agree with your thinking to increase charge weights. It all ways seems to help e.s. when we are dealing with ball powder and less than full load densities. I look forward to hearing more of your testing.

[Paul105]

Update April 5, 2018

Chrono 5 long paces from muzzle
46 Def F ambient (ammo in house, to truck, to range)

357 Mag (4 ¼” M66-8 – new combat mag)
158gr H XTP, 16.9gr No. 11FS (R18), WSPM, New Starline, 1,194 fps avg, 85 fps ES
5 shots
Yesterday 15.8gr No. 11FS (R17), WSPM, New Starline, 1,132 fps avg, 92 fps ES
4shots



.44 Mag (S&W M69 4 1/4")
New Starline Cases
CCI 350
(240gr and 260gr 10 shots ea., 315gr & 325gr 3 shots each)


240gr XTP, 22.8gr No. 11FS (R24) 1,263 fps avg, 52 fps ES
Yesterday 21.8gr No. 11FS (R23) 1,197 fps avg, 72 fps ES

260gr WFNGC, 21.8gr No. 11FS (R23) 1,119 fps avg, 81 fps ES
Yesterday 20.6gr No. 11FS (R22) 1,113 fps avg, 140 fps ES (Note Hi was 64 fps higher than next value)

315gr FNGC, 17.8gr No.11FS(R19) 999 avg fps, 13 fps ES
Yesterday 16.9gr No. 11FS (R18) 968 fps avg, 80 fps ES


325gr WLNGC (different bullet) 1.719” OAL,
17.8gr No.11FS(R19) 1,019 avg fps, 54 fps ES

Thoughts:

Don’t know what’s causing hi ES. 3 Shot strings pretty meaningless with hi ES. The 158gr 357 and 240gr .44 loads were .2 above Accurate’s indicated max.

Will work a bit more with the 260 & 315gr Bullets, but the 240 XTP is at max per Accurate and within my expected fps range.

The 158gr .357 is at indicated max charge – velocity seems very low compared to the referenced A2400 load in previous post.

No indication of excessive pressure in any of above loads. Easy extraction, case and primer appearance normal.

Paul

[Paul105]

April 6 Update


.44 Mag
New Starline Cases
CCI 350

Chrono 5 long paces from muzzle
26 Def F ambient (ammo in house, to truck, left in truck until shot)
5 shots each load


260gr WFNGC, 22.8gr No. 11FS (R24) 1,190 fps avg, 87 fps ES

315gr FNGC, 19.2gr No.11FS (R21) 1,108 avg fps, 49 fps ES

325gr WLNGC 1.719” OAL, 20.6gr No.11FS (R22) 1,119 avg fps, 45 fps ES


Notes:
I measured the 260 WFNGC and compared it to the 275 gr WFNPB Cast Performance bullet used in Accurate’ data – Nose to crimp and meplat were identical. Max for the 275gr Cast Performace is 22.8gr.

The 315gr FNGC is the Lee bullet. Not the same as the 300gr Laser Cast TC used in Accurate data, so I increased powder charge until I got to 1,100 +-. I have no way of knowing how valid this is, but velocity is more realistic at this level.

The 325 WLNGC is made by Beartooth Bullets. Accurate used the 320gr WLNGC made by Cast Performance. Best I can tell, these bullets are very close to twins. Max for CP 320 is 20.2 gr, so my load is .4gr heavier.

Again, no signs of excessive pressure that I could detect – easy extraction (virtually fell out of cyl), normal primer and case appearance, no excessive recoil or noise.

Paul

[Messy bear]

Thanks Paul! I will get some and try some day. Always enjoy testing new components.

[Paul105]

Ran some loads thru my 7 1/2" Ruger Super Redhawk. Gun is topped with Bushnell 3200 Elite 2x-6x. The target was shot at 50 yards rested with scope set on 6x. The load marked 24.2 WW 296 was 24.0gr. Dillon 550 measure was set at 21.0gr A2400 which threw 24.0gr WW295 and 22.9gr 11fs.

FWIW, my M69 preferred the 21.0 A2400 and 24.0gr WW296.

The Ruger target at 50 yds, the M69 Target at 25 yds.

https://photos.imageevent.com/paul105/hobby/large/IMG_0769%20_1_1.JPG

M69

https://photos.imageevent.com/paul105/hobby/large/IMG_07741.JPG

Iron sight results could be shooter error.

Paul

[curioushooter]

Thanks Paul for the great thread. It also heartens me to see that you have no fear running 15 grains of A2400 behind a 158 XTP in a 66-8 K-Frame. I've been holding it at 13 grains in my 60-18 J-Frame, which has the cylinder stop cuts between the chambers. Maybe I am just being paranoid about newer revolvers made after 1995 with the downgrade. I really like that little revolver; don't want to hurt it.

[Paul105]

Managed to capture some photos of muzzle flash (iPhone video edited by advancing frame by frame to isolate muzzle flash pic). :

the first picture is 22.8gr 11FS, 240gr JSP from a 2 3/4" S&W M69 -- friend shooting my gun.

https://photos.imageevent.com/paul105/hobby/large/5%20ea%20A11FS_%202.75%20M69_%20Jeff%20Outside_Mom ent.jpg

second picture - same gun 2 3/4" M69 - 24.0gr H110, 240gr JSP

https://photos.imageevent.com/paul105/hobby/large/5%20ea%20H110_%202.75%20M69_%20Jeff%20Outside_Mome nt.jpg

[TNsailorman]

Wait till sundown and shoot that revolver with the H110 load and watch it light up the whole area. My brother was with me one evening after he returned from Nam and we were shooting a Ruger Blackhawk in .41 magnum with a 6 1/2 barrel just after sundown in the twilight. After I had pulled off a shot he laughed and said: "we had those in Nam, they had wheels on them and were called 155's". H110 really puts out a flash. james