Pedersoli sharps percussion

[Lethemgo]

Wasn't sure where this should go here or muzzleloader but thinking either would work. My buddy has been looking for one of these for years at a good price. So I'm selling some stuff at the gun show this weekend and one walks by. I see a sharps go by and I ask the guy what you got there...a pedersoli 54cal percussion double set triggers longer barrel $600 with the boolit mold. Message my friend and he in a long story picks it up as the guy was driving through his town going home.
Now we need to learn the art of making some cartridges, he's thinking just the ones that snip the end off when chambered. I'm thinking just making them just right so they close up in chamber. Or...really like those brass cases but to expensive at around $6 + shipping. Hoping maybe I can make one of my 50-70 cases work some how but will have to see about that but thinking it may be close.
What do most of you guys use?215779215779

[marlinman93]

I don't own one, but if I did I'd start with doing a chamber cast with Cerrosafe and figure out what donor case might work closely enough. Whatever is used will need the rim turned off, as it takes a rimless case to allow the action to be closed. The chamber cast will give something to measure for diameter and length. At almost $6 each, I'd sure look at all sorts of options before paying that amount.

[Lethemgo]

Yeah that's a tad bit to rich for me. Can always do paper ones that what they used to use. I haven't had much to do with them but pedersoli is supposed to have a stainless steel floating sleeve in there so seems like you could get some pretty good measurements. Or like one guy on YouTube bought one and turned more later...

[varsity07840]

That's some deal at $600.00. I shoot the same rifle. My advice is to forget about brass cartridges. You need a bent piece of wire in the touch hole to extract the case. Paper cartridges are time consuming, and the type with the tail to cut off can be unsafe due to excess powder accumulating in the forestock. Go to www.hahnmachineworks.com and read up on his cardboard tubes for the Sharps. They come in different chamber lengths and are made to use a ringtail bullet. I use a Lee .544 ring tail and it shoots very well. Do A LOT of research on loading and cleaning the Pedersoli. A lot of them have a problem with the breach block binding up due to fouling. Charlie can take care of that problem, too. He did mine.

[Bent Ramrod]

I found a paper cartridge rolling kit from the C. W. Cartridge Company and stashed it away for future use long before I found my Pedersoli Berdan Sharps. It contained an aluminum mandrel, instructions and packets of nitrate-impregnated papers for rolling cartridges.

A sample cartridge tube, rolled on the mandrel, was too small for the Sharps boolits that came out of my Rapine mould so I made a larger one out of a tapered wood dowel. I also shortened the papers so that the completed tube, tied on the back of the boolit and filled with powder, could be crimped short enough to push the cartridge entirely into the chamber. I poke a hole in the crimp with a pencil before closing the block. The days of snipping off tails and wasting expensive black powder are over, for me at least. The cartridges hold 60-65 gr of powder, depending on brand and grain size.

Rolling and gluing the cartridges is kind of tedious, all right, but it gets quicker with practice, and if you are interested in the process, it's interesting Old School shooting stuff. I'd like to tie a constrictor knot over the ring-tail with silk thread impregnated with beeswax, but my fingers aren't nimble enough so I use a glue pen. My rifle has the Conant gas check in the breech block and the stainless sliding chamber in the barrel. I bring a micro eyedropper and a bottle of Ballistol-water to the range and anoint the joints of each after every five shots or so. This keeps the block and lever from getting sticky.

Shooting the rifle is a riot, and always gets a lot of attention from the simi-otto crowd. Cleanup is about twice the time for a cap and ball revolver. I sharpened a knife blade so I can gradually pry the fouled Conant gas check out of the breech block, alternating corners, sides and bottom. That and the cleanout screw for the percussion fire channel are the hardest to remove; after that, the cleanup is pretty straightforward. A few thoroughly wet patches on a shotgun brush will loosen the stainless floating chamber as they clean the barrel, and the part that protrudes can be wiped off, and the space in the barrel ahead can be cleaned by twirling the patch on the cleaning rod. I spray everything down with Ballistol after cleaning and before I put it all back together. Once in a while I take the forend and lock plate off to check whether the fouling has gotten into the inletting. Even after five range trips, it's pretty minimal.

Percussion Sharps rifles aren't for everyone, but they are a lot of fun for those that like them. Anybody heard from Dromia lately? He had just gotten one a year or so back and I was waiting for a range report, but he seems to have gone incommunicado.

[country gent]

I would recommend the "fitted' cartridges rolled from nitrated paper. A rolling board can be made to make rolling the cartridge tubes easier. A 1" X 6" X6" hardwood board. make a straight saw cut down the front edge 1/2"- 3/4" in from edge. A piece of brass aluminum or plastic for a rail 90* to the saw cut on the left edge. Before assembly bevel the edges of the saw cut 45* to form a vee. glue and screw the rail on the edge. finish as desired. A oil type finish is good here.
In use cut the paper to size for the cartridge. lay a piece along the rail and the mandrel on it in the vee and roll. glue can be applied to end when laid on the board or just before its wrapped around. This simple little tool holds the mandrel square and alighns the paper for you. I also put a light line of glue on the first edge when it comes up on the mandrel so it stays in place inside the tube. Use a small round of the nitraded paper for the base. apply glue to end of tube and from the top push a piece in and down to set flat on the board with a mandrel. the right size square will seal the edges and only the corners will fold up to hold.
The advantage of the nitraded paper cartridge is that it is completely consumed on firing, leaving the chamber ready for the next shot. I do poke a hole in the base after its loaded I use a bamboo skewer for this. I set one in a 3/4" wood ball left the skewer 3" long or so. A Awl, pencil, scribe, or other sharp point will work here.
I roll tubes one night and let dry the next night a set the bases in place and load. This woks good for me. These rifles are a lot of fun and when everything is right can be very accurate.

[john.k]

The breech block jamming has had a cure for 170 odd years since the first.....lots of spit.You can shoot all day if your mouth doesnt dry up.

[Wayne Smith]

Country Gent, a 1inch x 6 foot piece of wood?? I don't think so. Might want to change that for posterity.

[Lethemgo]

country gent Could you send me a picture of your rolling jig. I get it but not quite...

[country gent]

Ooops on the ' things I don't always get the shift key pressed down.

I have a hard time posting pics here before the changes with photo bucket.

Mark the board with the edge facing you this is edge A. Edge b is the left end Of the board. for this project these are the 2 needed edges.
Parrallel to edge A lay out a line 1/2"-3/4" in from the edge. This is a saw cut 1/8" wide and 1/2" deep the length of the board with the grain. Bevel the saw cuts edges with a small plane file or sand paper on a sanding block to form a V.
edge B gets a square cut and the brass aluminum or plastic rail along it. This needs to be .060-.090 taller than the board. much taller and its in the way rolling the tube. Glue this on and then add screws to add support.A piece of the hard wood can be used here also beveling the back edge of the rail for clearance and relief.
This makes a vee trough with a rail 90* to it, the rail alighns the paper template the vee alighns the mandrel and tensions the paper for wrapping. Basically the vee groove and rail form a 90* L.

In use lay a paper along the rail with the edge just touching your working radially here. set the mandrel on the paper and punch into the vee . I let the paper over hang the front edge a little making it easier to get stated around the mandrel, I put a light coat of stick glue on this outer edge and roll the mandrel forming the paper cartridge tube I glue the last edge just before it goes under the mandrel. a few rolls of the mandrel makes a very nice tight tube. Another trick is when you make your template for cutting these make it twice as long as needed. When you wrap a tube you making 2 cartridges. a brass tube cut to length and you slide the tube in and cut in half with a razor blade or exacto knife making 2 tubes. I use a similar board for wrapping paper patched bullets. I cut the patches in bulk and wrap while watching TV in the evening when needed. Tubes could be made in a batch with the ends inserted and glued in place and stored in a box for use later.

Using nitraded paper the cartridge is consumed on firing. regular paper you may have to remove remnants from the chamber after firing.

[Ragnarok]

I shoot the IAB version of a Sharps paper-cartridge. There is a lot more info and bullets/bullet molds available for the Pedersoli version. If you have a bullet mold you are ahead of the game!

There are all sorts of info floating around the netz about shooting the percussion Sharps...some good and some bogus. I'm certain the Pedersoli .54 will have a smaller bore than my IAB does....the big bore was killing me for accuracy and 'Christmas tree' bullets designed for a Pedersoli .54 did not shoot well in my Sharps repro. I ended up using a self-cast .56 caliber round ball.

As far as powder goes...forget the BP sub powders like Pyrodex or 777...too many hangfires and misfires. Get some real blackpowder and that issue will go away.

I messed around with non-nitrated paper cartridges and didn't like the left-over paper left in the bore. Not particularly hard to nitrate paper and roll cartridges. The simpler the paper cartridge the better. I abandoned the long tail that the Sharps breech cuts off and just make flush-fit cartridges with a tissue paper base. I could go on and on about fabricating paper cartridges...but the most important info and destructions I've found came from an old 'Blackpowder Handbook' which shows a really simple cartridge just for a Sharps percussion rifle.

The breech fouling issue caused me some problems...no matter how well the breech-plate was lubed the breech would get tight after about 12 or 15 shots. Some recommend the Hahn modifications that mill the plate and use an o"ring...some recommend a mod that makes a chamber sleeve that seals the breech....I found a few references that recommend filling the breech block cavity with grease. I filled my breech block cavity with some high wax 'Emmert's lube' and this keeps my IAB carbine shooting about indefinitely! You would think the breech block full of Emmert's lube would blast-out all the lube first shot or two...but no...even after twenty or thirty shots the block cavity will have lube in it.

Musket caps?? The CCI caps somewhere gained a bad reputation as too weak(reenactor caps)...I had part of a can of old CCI six-wing caps which were supposed to be good...somewhere down the line CCI changed to a four wing musket cap and must have made them somewhat feeble. Whatever...the CCI four wing caps I bought new last year work fine. Like I mentioned forget the blackpowder substitutes and use real blackpowder will cure hang-fire issues. However you do need to clean-out the fire channel through the breech when you clean(like everytime you shoot)...

The percussion Sharps is a fun shooter. I've learned much just getting able to make my IAB carbine shoot well.

[john.k]

I have owned a IAB for as long as they were on the market.Mine has fired many thousands of rounds ,not only black,but smokeless too.....yeah,a bit naughty...........I found that using berdan primers as caps cured all issues related to ignition.They are twice as powerful as musket caps.....my breech piece develops a ring groove from gas cutting,and Ive lapped it several times.Its getting a bit thin ,and has several cracks.To get accuracy,I breech seat bullets,and just use a powder cartridge.Will try the grease fill next shoot.