My winter Rolling Block Projet

[OlDeuce]

[smilie=s:.......This last weekend locating Stuff ! and Monday stepping over the line to pay for it all WoW ....
I found a bought a 1876 Swedish Rolling Block, she was a 8mm which has to go!! So today a Green Mountain
308 cal Octagon barrel was ordered. Last week I ordered a custom Dave Manson 308 Tapered 30-30 case !
I've done alot of mind searching and I'm now really excited about all the parts and stuff coming!!!

This is my Tapered 30WCF For what itis for a quick glance is a 32-40 but it isn't
https://s20.postimg.org/sg51hn8v1/IMG_1655.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/e9pamexzt/)
https://s20.postimg.org/6gymufcl9/IMG_1678.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/wciddmeex/)

To get my ream it's a 6 to 8 week wait But thats Ok......

Ol Deuce

[marlinman93]

What you just got is the equivalent of the .32-40 Remington Hepburn cartridge! The Rem. version of the .32-40 was a .30 caliber, and I never understood why they didn't refer to it as a .30-40 Straight?

[Nueces]

I once had a Hepburn in 32-40 and made cases from the 30-40 Krag, using a special order RCBS case forming set. It was a sporting model, with a sweet Lyman tang sight. I did the right thing at the time I sold it, but I wish now that I had toughed it out and kept it. Straight tapered, I think either the 30-30 or the 30-34 offers ideal capacity for cast bullets over smokeless powder.

[OlDeuce]

What you just got is the equivalent of the .32-40 Remington Hepburn cartridge! The Rem. version of the .32-40 was a .30 caliber, and I never understood why they didn't refer to it as a .30-40 Straight?

That's really good to know......the ol'Roller will be right at home !!!! I had no idea that was how it was!! 30 cal AKA 32-40 .....WoW So should this be
called a "32-40'' Remington or as in this day call it a 30 Taper ????

Ol Deuce

[OlDeuce]

This is my start It should be at my door this Friday!!!
https://s20.postimg.org/o4vvnp2nh/Capture_C1874rolling_Block.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/y26wgra95/)

Ol Deuce

[corbinace]

Very cool.

[Reverend Al]

By the way, they shoot great just as they are in 8x58R Danish Krag ... I bought 2 of them about 15 years ago when they first came into Canada as surplus.

https://i.imgur.com/g7AWjXM.jpg

[sharps4590]

Recently acquired one just like Al's. It will stay 8 X 58RD. After a week of cleaning the bore and another week or working up a load it shoots at least as good as Al's.

[Boz330]

By the way, they shoot great just as they are in 8x58R Danish Krag ... I bought 2 of them about 15 years ago when they first came into Canada as surplus.

https://i.imgur.com/g7AWjXM.jpg

I got one 12 or so years ago and it actually shot pretty good in the 8MM chambering, but I converted it to 40-65. I wish I had a good use for the barrel and parts left over.

Bo

[GhostHawk]

Nice old Roller!

I like the straight taper case too.

I am not sure what it is, but I always like seeing rimmed cases in single shot rifles.
Just seems to fit for some reason.

Enjoy!

[OlDeuce]

In the past my 32-40s have performed well ! they aren't a power house but !!! when I was looking at my collection of stuff ,this box of New 30-30 brass
stuck out like a sore thumb!!! The answer came ! 30 taper and it should work as good if not better ! Can't wait till all the stuff gets here !!!!

Ol Deuce

[marlinman93]

That's really good to know......the ol'Roller will be right at home !!!! I had no idea that was how it was!! 30 cal AKA 32-40 .....WoW So should this be
called a "32-40'' Remington or as in this day call it a 30 Taper ????

Ol Deuce

Only difference with your version is the rim diameter. Since you're using the .38-55 rim size, and the original used the slightly larger .30-40, .303 British rim diameter. Your choice what to call it, but .30-40 Rem. would work for me.
Was this at Joe Salter's?

[OlDeuce]

Only difference with your version is the rim diameter. Since you're using the .38-55 rim size, and the original used the slightly larger .30-40, .303 British rim diameter. Your choice what to call it, but .30-40 Rem. would work for me.
Was this at Joe Salter's?

This came from Simpson LTD. overwhelmed with pricing !! Ol Deuce

[Texas by God]

Nonmenclature aside- it'll be cool! You should have called it the 30-25 Ol Deuce.

[OlDeuce]

Nonmenclature aside- it'll be cool! You should have called it the 30-25 Ol Deuce.

Hahaha I've bamboozled over the caliber LoL Let me get is shooting and than well put it up to the group !!! I sure hope this sucker
don't let me down !!!!! But I think she is going to do me well !!!!!!!!

Ol Deuce

[sharps4590]

It is a cool looking case and I can't imagine it won't be accurate.

I'm still rather surprised I bought that ol' Swede roller from Simpson's other than the price was...appealing and being an antique it was shipped direct to me. I always have and still do think they're butt ugly but it has been fun and it always receives some favorable comments. I suppose, for me, their beauty is in their simplicity and there's no questioning the quality of the Swedes.

[nekshot]

Yup, some folk go to the movies for entertainment but I go to Simpsons web site! Congrats on that nice roller and that case is awesome with retro beauty oozing all over it. Isn't it great helping the economy go!

[Gewehr-Guy]

OlDeuce, good luck with your project,the Fed Ex truck of happiness is bringing my 8mm roller today, and a 12.7x44R to cheapen the freight. My Simpson's addiction is very BAD!

[Boz330]

It is a cool looking case and I can't imagine it won't be accurate.

I'm still rather surprised I bought that ol' Swede roller from Simpson's other than the price was...appealing and being an antique it was shipped direct to me. I always have and still do think they're butt ugly but it has been fun and it always receives some favorable comments. I suppose, for me, their beauty is in their simplicity and there's no questioning the quality of the Swedes.

My thoughts as well but I got an excellent price on this one and it has grown on me after re-barreling and new wood.

Bob

[Reverend Al]

PS: I really like the looks of your .30 wildcat ... I'm interested to see how it shoots for you!

[Boz330]

OlDeuce, good luck with your project,the Fed Ex truck of happiness is bringing my 8mm roller today, and a 12.7x44R to cheapen the freight. My Simpson's addiction is very BAD!

Somehow I never heard of this dealer, but those rollers sold out pretty quick at those prices. I'd like to have one of the 12X44s in centerfire.

Bob

[MOA]

OlDeuce you dog!
Ya just had ta show off that roller huh. I JUST WANT TO SAY THANKS. I MEAN IT.
I NOW HAVE A ROLLER SHIPPING OUT TOMORROW. I can't believe they had one that had not been sold.
:bigsmyl2:

[MOA]

Just from the site if the images are accurate.

https://s19.postimg.org/p77xxc5zn/2018-02-22_17_27_48-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-12-24_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://s19.postimg.org/b0s7242ub/2018-02-22_17_28_53-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-12-37_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://s19.postimg.org/wzylpbreb/2018-02-22_17_29_55-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-12-53_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://s19.postimg.org/ao0svy003/2018-02-22_17_30_32-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-13-03_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://s19.postimg.org/vxof6rlfn/2018-02-22_17_31_51-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-13-12_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

Have not yet decided what I shall do with this grand roller, I will ruminate a while......so many options. When I decide I will post the decision, and of course some images. Either way, it will be a cast boolit shooter.:bigsmyl2:

[OlDeuce]

OlDeuce you dog!
Ya just had ta show off that roller huh. I JUST WANT TO SAY THANKS. I MEAN IT.
I NOW HAVE A ROLLER SHIPPING OUT TOMORROW. I can't believe they had one that had not been sold.
:bigsmyl2:

MOA..[smilie=s:...Tehehe ....Isn't that cool[smilie=l: I was over the moon when I saw the prices :veryconfu I couldn't believe what I was reading!!
Before this ......LOL I was on Gunbrokers and was shopping the rolling blocks !! and those guys !!!! wow they were flipping rolling blocks !!:-o

I was really Pleased with Dave the salesperson that helped me !!!! Really Nice!! Ol' Happy Dog Deuce[smilie=s:[smilie=s:

[Dusty Ed]

Howdy Fellers
I have a Swede 12.17X44 but It looks as tho some one run a 50-70 reamer into it , so I cut down a 50-90 to fit the chamber , got a 400 gr. 500 S&W bullet mold an sized & lubed it to .503, the barrel slugged at .501 ,loaded 62grs. of 2f Goex powder ,I then fired it an it worked so I cut down about 50 cartridges an loaded them an went to the range ,I fired 7 Shots after the fifth shot the group open up , so i let cool down shot 5 2" let it cool again fired 5 more 2" group so after that I only shot 5 Shots at a time , when winter came along I stripped the stock an refinished an put a Beechs front sight an veneer tang sight on it. It is a AXTELL TANG SIGHT
Now it is for sale214855

[marlinman93]

Somehow I never heard of this dealer, but those rollers sold out pretty quick at those prices. I'd like to have one of the 12X44s in centerfire.

Bob

They aren't sold out. They have more, and get more almost every month. I looked this morning at "new arrivals" there, and there were many still available. Only issue I have is I'm not fond of the set screws used to hold the pins in, and the large bat wing spur on the breech blocks. They are great actions, but those items make them less desirable appearance wise for a rework to sporter configuration.

[sharps4590]

I check Simpson's fairly regularly and would like one in 12.7 X 44R but doggone it, someone must be sitting at their computer watching Simpson's waiting for a shipment to be posted. Every time I see a 12.7 on their site that is good it's already sold. As an aside they have been good folks to deal with.

[RustyReel]

I check Simpson's fairly regularly and would like one in 12.7 X 44R but doggone it, someone must be sitting at their computer watching Simpson's waiting for a shipment to be posted. Every time I see a 12.7 on their site that is good it's already sold. As an aside they have been good folks to deal with.

Yep, if it is something you think you might like you better be quick on the phone. Really nice ones or unique ones are gone pretty much as soon as they are posted. They had a 28ga roller last week. It was a Husky model missing the firing pin. I spent a little time banging around the net to see if I could buy a firing pin or if the Rem brand would fit. Couldn't really find anything so said what the heck, for $195 I'll buy it anyway. Of course in the few minutes it took me to decide that, it as GONE.

[EMC45]

Just from the site if the images are accurate.

https://s19.postimg.org/p77xxc5zn/2018-02-22_17_27_48-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-12-24_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://s19.postimg.org/b0s7242ub/2018-02-22_17_28_53-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-12-37_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://s19.postimg.org/wzylpbreb/2018-02-22_17_29_55-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-12-53_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://s19.postimg.org/ao0svy003/2018-02-22_17_30_32-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-13-03_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

https://s19.postimg.org/vxof6rlfn/2018-02-22_17_31_51-Screenshot_2018-02-22-17-13-12_-_Windows_Pic.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

Have not yet decided what I shall do with this grand roller, I will ruminate a while......so many options. When I decide I will post the decision, and of course some images. Either way, it will be a cast boolit shooter.:bigsmyl2:

Excellent outward condition. This looks like a 50 year old rifle. The metal looks great.

[OlDeuce]

OlDeuce you dog!
Ya just had ta show off that roller huh. I JUST WANT TO SAY THANKS. I MEAN IT.
I NOW HAVE A ROLLER SHIPPING OUT TOMORROW. I can't believe they had one that had not been sold.
:bigsmyl2:

Well MOA....... Did you get yours????? Had conformation today that mine should be delivered tomorrow !!!!:guntootsmiley::guntootsmiley:

Ol Deuce [smilie=s:

[500Linebaughbuck]

[smilie=s:.......This last weekend locating Stuff ! and Monday stepping over the line to pay for it all WoW ....
I found a bought a 1876 Swedish Rolling Block, she was a 8mm which has to go!! So today a Green Mountain
308 cal Octagon barrel was ordered. Last week I ordered a custom Dave Manson 308 Tapered 30-30 case !
I've done alot of mind searching and I'm now really excited about all the parts and stuff coming!!!

This is my Tapered 30WCF For what itis for a quick glance is a 32-40 but it isn't
https://s20.postimg.org/sg51hn8v1/IMG_1655.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/e9pamexzt/)
https://s20.postimg.org/6gymufcl9/IMG_1678.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/wciddmeex/)

To get my ream it's a 6 to 8 week wait But thats Ok......

Ol Deuce


thats a neat case!!! someday(i wish:bigsmyl2:) i would like to take a 30-40 krag case necked up and tapered to .410"(41 rem mag). my boolits will be 270-320gr fn gc and they will be going 1400-1500fps. i would like it to be a high wall(i wish again:bigsmyl2:). but i haven't the time or funds to do it.

[MOA]

Well MOA....... Did you get yours????? Had conformation today that mine should be delivered tomorrow !!!!:guntootsmiley::guntootsmiley:

Ol Deuce [smilie=s:

Not yet but soon.:bigsmyl2:

[sharps4590]

EMC, for a second there I thought that was my rifle!!!! Then I made out the first number as a "1".

Rusty, your experience echo's mine. I went to check their site a few minutes ago and at the moment it won't come up on my 'puter. Probably something there right now I want that will be gone.

[Guy La Pourque]

Wait. WHAT?!?! You guys are running 8 X 58RD and 12x44's??? How??? Where do you get the brass...???

Just to make sure I am understanding you fellas correctly - are we talking about rifles like these?

https://www.tradeexcanada.com/produits/66

Any instruction is sincerely appreciated. (Yes I'd much rather shoot .30-30 tapered like Ol' Deuce!!! But pikers like me have to shoot what's available for the most part!)

[Reverend Al]

Again, fairly large numbers of these rolling blocks came into Canada as surplus years ago, and they are still being brought in and are available through a large Canadian surplus distributor called "Tradex". They still have lots of these rolling blocks in 8x58R's and 12.7x44R's available for sale, so for any of my Canadian brothers who haven't bought one yet you can go have a look at their website and tempt yourself! (They also have lots of Husqvarna M96 bolt action sporters left in 9.3x57mm too.)

https://www.tradeexcanada.com/produits/66

[Reverend Al]

Wait. WHAT?!?! You guys are running 8 X 58RD and 12x44's??? How??? Where do you get the brass...???

Just to make sure I am understanding you fellas correctly - are we talking about rifles like these?

https://www.tradeexcanada.com/produits/66

Any instruction is sincerely appreciated. (Yes I'd much rather shoot .30-30 tapered like Ol' Deuce!!! But pikers like me have to shoot what's available for the most part!)

Just sent you a PM ...

[RustyReel]

Just to make sure I am understanding you fellas correctly - are we talking about rifles like these?

https://www.tradeexcanada.com/produits/66



Yep, that's what I'm shootin anyway. Lots of info on this site and others about the 8x58Rd and the 12.7X44R. Others have way more experience than I do and you should do a search for those threads.

Although I guess it can be found, ammo is not readily available and reloading dies are expensive. For my 8mm I use PPU 8x56R brass and neck size and seat boolits with 8mm lebel dies. For the 12.7 I use starline 50/70 brass, very lightly modified to fit my chamber and use Lee 515 (sized .510) boolits and 50/70 reloading dies. Not endorsing either method, just what I use, YMMV.

[Reverend Al]

Most of the 12.7x44R's will chamber .50-70 Govt brass (and a lot of them up here in Canada had a .50-70 Govt reamer run into the chamber to ensure that that brass will fit). Although 8x58R brass is available it is expensive. It can be reformed from 8x56R Hungarian or .45-70 although they come up a bit short on length after formed. They work just fine as "shooter" brass. I went one step further and bought a Kal Max Case Stretcher from Red River Rick so that I can lengthen .45-70 cases to .45-90 length for reforming to full length .40-82 WCF and 8x58R Danish Krag.

[Guy La Pourque]

Sorry for the continuing dumb questions, fellas - but would that .30-30 wildcat in the OP be stoked with black powder...? I can see that gun being remarkably cheap and fun to shoot once it's put together...

[OlDeuce]

Mine showed up this morning at 9:00 sharp !!! I'm a happy camper!!!!! this Rolling block shows no wear on the moving parts. the hammer face is Perfect!
all the screw heads are perfect, and No Pitting on the frame ........She is going to be a Great Project!! The Bull Barrel will be in my hands on Wednesday !
WoW I still have a month to wait before the Chamber Ream is finished!!! I'm Pumped!!! Oh ,,,,,,,The fun part to come .....Ready for this ......My 1867 Roller
is going to be a Take down!:bigsmyl2:!!! Hmmm........
https://s20.postimg.org/thf98rd6l/IMG_1847.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/fnqwjpkl5/)

Happy Ol Deuce[smilie=s:

[Guy La Pourque]

So Deuce - that was an old military beater that you are going to re-chamber...? Are you going to totally refurb it with new wood too...?

[sharps4590]

Nice score deuce!! The exterior of mine isn't that nice but the internals are as you described yours.

[500Linebaughbuck]

very nice!!!!!!

[Gewehr-Guy]

OlDeuce, so how was your chamber plugged, with some weld or did they pound in a rod or some other devious method to keep these evil assult weapons off the streets?

[MOA]

Well, I'm already playing with what my chambering might be. I'm leaning to begin with a cartridge that has low pressures, projectiles of cast lead which I may already have a mold for, and one that brass is readily available for. I'm thinking of 40-65 Winchester. I'll send the action, trigger, trigger guard and associated parts to Turnbull for case harding, will be checking barrel companies that have had some experience with these actions, although I will speak with Turnbull about this conversion while they have the parts there. Might be easiest and quickest to have them involved if possible. I will work on the stock to see what I can do with it, nice to be hanging out at a cabinet shop three days a week. Might even do a nice presentation box for this project. Anyways will get started as soon as it arrives. Always brightens my day when this kind of project presents itself.:bigsmyl2:

[OlDeuce]

So Deuce - that was an old military beater that you are going to re-chamber...? Are you going to totally refurb it with new wood too...?

Guy..........As it's looking this go-around just going to do the Chamber, New Bull Barrel, and play with the wood !! I need a cheek rest ,and the stock needs to be a bit shorter for my comfort !! Don't want to go crazy with money just yet !!! The wood ,I want it Good Looking when it's finished !! Ol Deuce

[OlDeuce]

Nice score deuce!! The exterior of mine isn't that nice but the internals are as you described yours.

It's crazy for a 150 year old gun......I'm impressed to say the least......I will be shopping them again for a shooter that's for sure !!! Ol Deuce

[OlDeuce]

very nice!!!!!!

Thanks Now to get her shooting .....LoL

Ol Deuce

[OlDeuce]

OlDeuce, so how was your chamber plugged, with some weld or did they pound in a rod or some other devious method to keep these evil assult weapons off the streets?

Well ....in the beginning LoL I thought it had a pressed in rod in the chamber .....Wrong! They dropped in a chunk of rod and plug welded it in!!! Not an
issue for this project. If it was a knock-out I'd have have her warmed up by know LoL.........They plugged it well for sure ........Ol Deuce[smilie=s::bigsmyl2:

https://s20.postimg.org/9zklst8j1/IMG_1848.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/kz5t4eyy1/)

[OlDeuce]

Well, I'm already playing with what my chambering might be. I'm leaning to begin with a cartridge that has low pressures, projectiles of cast lead which I may already have a mold for, and one that brass is readily available for. I'm thinking of 40-65 Winchester. I'll send the action, trigger, trigger guard and associated parts to Turnbull for case harding, will be checking barrel companies that have had some experience with these actions, although I will speak with Turnbull about this conversion while they have the parts there. Might be easiest and quickest to have them involved if possible. I will work on the stock to see what I can do with it, nice to be hanging out at a cabinet shop three days a week. Might even do a nice presentation box for this project. Anyways will get started as soon as it arrives. Always brightens my day when this kind of project presents itself.:bigsmyl2:

Oh Cool.......I'm going to GS this project and see just how she turns out......I have access to a good Lathe & Mill...I have a little combo but she's not big
enough to work this project! But I think she is going to look well ........Mind is going a 100 LoL Ol Deuce

https://s20.postimg.org/r03i1gyf1/IMG_1849.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/4beb1wh15/)

[MOA]

My thoughts as well but I got an excellent price on this one and it has grown on me after re-barreling and new wood.

Bob

Boz, who did your barrel and wood work? Same place, or separate businesses?

[Gewehr-Guy]

I remember seeing on another forum where someone cut off the damaged portion of the plugged barrel, and recut the threads and set it back into the action. Not a lot of extra steel in the chamber area,but enough to rechamber into an oversize .32-40 or 8mm-40.

[OlDeuce]

I remember seeing on another forum where someone cut off the damaged portion of the plugged barrel, and recut the threads and set it back into the action. Not a lot of extra steel in the chamber area,but enough to rechamber into an oversize .32-40 or 8mm-40.

This is what my plan is and by stepping the new barrel into the old part should leave more the enough material to keep it really strong and secure in that
area!!! I sure hope this all works out ! we see!! this is the fun part!!1 If it doesn't work out I'll send off and have the New Barrel put in!!!

Ol Deuce

[Bigslug]

So. . .you're going to end up with a .32-40 that can shoot any and all of your .308 bullets, probably with a high level of accuracy, with virtually no recoil, at the threshold for "easy to achieve" cast velocities, which should be be able to drop any medium game in N.A.

Nothing to dislike about any of that. Good call!

[OlDeuce]

So. . .you're going to end up with a .32-40 that can shoot any and all of your .308 bullets, probably with a high level of accuracy, with virtually no recoil, at the threshold for "easy to achieve" cast velocities, which should be be able to drop any medium game in N.A.

Nothing to dislike about any of that. Good call!

Yes kinda I'm hoping ........The accuracy is what I really want to build into the shooter ! and keep the price down kinda.........Ol Deuce

[Boz330]

Boz, who did your barrel and wood work? Same place, or separate businesses?

My hunting/shooting buddy did the barrel. It was a takeoff from another rifle he re-barred for me. I did the wood. The inletted blank came from Treebone Carving. The caliber is 40-65.

Bob

[MOA]

Thx Boz, I most likely will do something with this stock, but I am still going to clean it up and re-stain it first. Will end up with a hot oil finish no matter what I do. Don't much care for shiny or high gloss finishes on hunting guns.

[Boz330]

Mine has a sandblast finish and the stock oil was rubbed out to dull it for hunting.

Bob

[MOA]

I've used tung oil on a number of my refinished stocks.

[OlDeuce]

I've got a good question guys! Is it required to have all this hammer pressure on the the Old Rolling Blocks??? Been doing alot of cleaning and now
the trigger pull is very smooth with no creep but the hammer pressure Man!!!!!! I would think the old primers took a big hit to get them to go off.

Ol Deuce
https://s20.postimg.org/wmjd8ncz1/IMG_E1872.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/4mf9od9ih/)
https://s20.postimg.org/uhz07ldx9/IMG_1865.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/uhz07ldx5/)
https://s20.postimg.org/kxfdkpgvh/IMG_1863.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/3wwhc13u1/)

[sharps4590]

I can't answer your question about the hammer pressure but, an observation...that thing screams to be re-case hardened!!! Is that on the list? Leaving the hammer and breech block in the white would be a nice contrast.

[Gewehr-Guy]

I think the reason behind the robust mainspring was to keep the hammer forward in case of a ruptured primer. they must have had some problems, so they also designed that unique gas vent in the breech block. Some of the later commercial Husqvarna r-blocks had "safety hammers", and my Larsens Vaabenforr rolling block also has an odd little safety hammer beside the big hammer.
On my 8mm the b-block is fitted so tightly that I don't think it would fire 100% of the time if I lightened the mainspring very much,but maybe one could after a few thousand rounds.

[marlinman93]

I've been told the heavy hammer pressure was designed to ensure the hammer didn't get caught on anything and cock the firearm. It also ensures a heavy strike regardless of any other issues. It is not necessary to be that heavy for what we use these guns for today.
I use my belt sander to remove width off the mainspring, but make sure I stay away from both ends of the spring. I also keep a can of water handy, and don't wear gloves while working the spring down. If I can't hold it while removing metal, it's getting too hot, so I cool it often. I also try the spring often during removal of metal, to see how it feels. Takes time to reinstall it and test, but it's the only way to know it's correct as I go.
I also remove the trigger return spring and make a new one from .045" piano wire to replace the flat spring. My reworked trigger springs give me about a 2.5 lb. trigger, and feel great with a lightened mainspring. Use a good oil on all the mating surfaces too. I like Kroil, and it alone will reduce felt pull on the trigger when applied.

[OlDeuce]

I can't answer your question about the hammer pressure but, an observation...that thing screams to be re-case hardened!!! Is that on the list? Leaving the hammer and breech block in the white would be a nice contrast.


I think the reason behind the robust mainspring was to keep the hammer forward in case of a ruptured primer. they must have had some problems, so they also designed that unique gas vent in the breech block. Some of the later commercial Husqvarna r-blocks had "safety hammers", and my Larsens Vaabenforr rolling block also has an odd little safety hammer beside the big hammer.
On my 8mm the b-block is fitted so tightly that I don't think it would fire 100% of the time if I lightened the mainspring very much,but maybe one could after a few thousand rounds.


I've been told the heavy hammer pressure was designed to ensure the hammer didn't get caught on anything and cock the firearm. It also ensures a heavy strike regardless of any other issues. It is not necessary to be that heavy for what we use these guns for today.
I use my belt sander to remove width off the mainspring, but make sure I stay away from both ends of the spring. I also keep a can of water handy, and don't wear gloves while working the spring down. If I can't hold it while removing metal, it's getting too hot, so I cool it often. I also try the spring often during removal of metal, to see how it feels. Takes time to reinstall it and test, but it's the only way to know it's correct as I go.
I also remove the trigger return spring and make a new one from .045" piano wire to replace the flat spring. My reworked trigger springs give me about a 2.5 lb. trigger, and feel great with a lightened mainspring. Use a good oil on all the mating surfaces too. I like Kroil, and it alone will reduce felt pull on the trigger when applied.



Thank you all This is Great info..I'm really having a great time working with this Ol'Roller , :bigsmyl2:

Ol Deuce[smilie=s:

[marlinman93]

Rollers are my favorite action for rifle builds, and for multiple reasons! First being so plentiful. Then the low price of good used military actions! Ease of swapping parts, and fitting parts. Only drawbacks are the occasionally eroded firing pin holes in breech blocks, and the occasional worn blocks that need work to align perpendicular to the bore. But there's no other old single shot action that's as reasonable to build a complete rifle on!

[MOA]

I'm getting a little worried guys. My mind is refusing to stop thinking about all the possible cartridges I can build these inexpensive RB to shoot. I'm thinking about getting a small battery if they avail themselves in Simpson's inventory for a 45 colt, 38 spcl, maybe even a 45-70 kurz.:veryconfu. Between the 30 WCF case and the 45-70 case you have a wealth of candidates.:bigsmyl2:

[RustyReel]

I'm getting a little worried guys. My mind is refusing to stop thinking about all the possible cartridges I can build these inexpensive RB to shoot. I'm thinking about getting a small battery if they avail themselves in Simpson's inventory for a 45 colt, 38 spcl, maybe even a 45-70 kurz.:veryconfu. Between the 30 WCF case and the 45-70 case you have a wealth of candidates.:bigsmyl2:

I, for one, am very interested in how "inexpensive" the completed rifle ends up being. As mentioned earlier, I have both an 8 and 12.7MM. When I started putting together the cost of a new barrel, stocks, sights, blueing, etc....."inexpensive" was passed pretty quickly!!

[OlDeuce]

I'm getting a little worried guys. My mind is refusing to stop thinking about all the possible cartridges I can build these inexpensive RB to shoot. I'm thinking about getting a small battery if they avail themselves in Simpson's inventory for a 45 colt, 38 spcl, maybe even a 45-70 kurz.:veryconfu. Between the 30 WCF case and the 45-70 case you have a wealth of candidates.:bigsmyl2:

MOA..............How about something like this
https://s20.postimg.org/dbpuc1p2l/IMG_1602.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/krp3xucrt/)

Ol Deuce ...............LoL

[Wolfer]

You dogs! I had never heard of simpsons. The salesman said he would try to ship mine out tomorrow.

[OlDeuce]

You dogs! I had never heard of simpsons. The salesman said he would try to ship mine out tomorrow.

Great Place.............Did Dave take your call???? We are going to have a "Roller Party" LoL Ol Deuce

[MOA]

MOA..............How about something like this
https://s20.postimg.org/dbpuc1p2l/IMG_1602.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/krp3xucrt/)

Ol Deuce ...............LoL

Yo Man, right on. Now that's what I'm talking.[smilie=w:

[Wolfer]

The salesman didn't say his name. I plan on trying to shoot mine as is. It said the bore was fair. But I suspect it will end up as a 35 Krag.

Graf's has dies but too pricey for me. I'll just make my own. Looks like there are several options to make brass from if I can't find any. I love these old guns but never could afford one. I also love projects. I'm giddy as a schoolgirl!

[WILCO]

Congratulations Wolfer!

[sharps4590]

Wolfer, many clichés and adage's are appropriate here; First step down a slippery slope, the camel's nose is in the tent....etc.....:razz:

[Gewehr-Guy]

Before anyone rebarrels one of the 12.7x 44 rifles, I would urge you to give it a fair shooting trial, because it is a very good cartridge which can be reloaded with 50-70 dies and slightly altered 50-70 cases. I bought one advertised with a "fair" bore , and used it to shoot a CBA 100yd record score, so they will shoot,even if the bore is not pristine. It kind of lobs them in, so I call it my "Swedish mortar"

[Jedman]

I just picked up a No. 1 Remington RB that was converted to a 20 ga. shotgun a long time ago.
The way I could tell is if you remove the forend there is a dovetail cut on the bottomside of the barrel where it was once a rifle and was reindexed 180 degrees and rebored to 20 ga.

The gun functions fine as a shotgun and has a 30" barrel but has no choke so cylinder bore.
I am thinking of rebarreling it to 50-70 as I already have a barrel and have several other 50-70's and handload for it already.

Problem is I have a bunch of other project guns that need finished and I don't know if it would be worth more to leave it as a shotgun compared to a non original rebarreled short rifle ?

Does anyone have a opinion on the way they would go with this idea, Leave it as a shotgun or rebarrel it to a 50-70. The conversion would cost me very little except time .

Jedman

[MOA]

Jedman, if I were in your shoes, I'd leave it on the back burner for now, knowing it is still there for a rainy day and complete some of the other projects.

[500Linebaughbuck]

you don't even have to ask..........50-70gov. i have today's counterpart, 500 linebaugh in a 24" tc encore barrel.

[500Linebaughbuck]

excuse me for asking, what kind of pressure (p.s.i. or c.u.p.) does a rolling block handle?

i am asking if a 40-65 winchester with smokeless loads will work?

[marlinman93]

excuse me for asking, what kind of pressure (p.s.i. or c.u.p.) does a rolling block handle?

i am asking if a 40-65 winchester with smokeless loads will work?

Even the older BP actions will handle .40-65 smokeless loads if you don't get crazy. A smokeless action is even stronger and is rated quite a bit higher. I'd generally keep loads with BP under 30,000 cup, and most of mine are closer to 20,000.

[marlinman93]

I, for one, am very interested in how "inexpensive" the completed rifle ends up being. As mentioned earlier, I have both an 8 and 12.7MM. When I started putting together the cost of a new barrel, stocks, sights, blueing, etc....."inexpensive" was passed pretty quickly!!

It's all relative, but it's less expensive than even buying a new Pedersoli Rolling Block, unless you pay someone to do every step. I found Gunstocks Inc. to be the least expensive source for stock sets at under $100 for pretty decent walnut. He has better for more, but not necessary unless you want prettier.
Barrels are about $280 from Green Mountain, but for $200 you can get a BRC barrel that's a little more accurate. It will cost about $150 to have a barrel fitted to the frame. Rust bluing and color case will usually run me about $225-$250, but some places will charge as high as $500 for rust bluing the barrel and CCH the receiver. Sights are all over the place, depending on what you buy. But I don't count that since I'd buy sights no matter what I purchased.
So for under $300 for a donor gun, and another less than $600 I can have one ready to go, except for sights. And it will be exactly how I want it, vs. whatever I can find at $1300 or more.

[OlDeuce]

Me barrel arrived this afternoon !!! Nice Barrel !! So Tomorrow we will get her in if all goes well !!! I'm Liking this project a lot !!! Still in Budget!
The ream was needed to do this project ,but the expense for the ream isn't wasted !!!!

Ol Deuce

[MOA]

Deuce , what diamensions did you get you barrel shank in? Also does it have any taper at all?

[RCE1]

That looks like fun. I've done 1885 Winchesters, Borchardts, Ballards and Martinis, but never a roller. Those Swedish actions are a nice place to start. I like that cartridge, too.

[OlDeuce]

Deuce , what diamensions did you get you barrel shank in? Also does it have any taper at all?

MOA.... the barrel is a Green Mountain 308 x26'' twist is 1:10 with a 1 1/2'' shank it tapered 1.20 to .95
I'll post a picture !! The Barrel Really looks good it was $200 + ship

Ol Deuce
https://s20.postimg.org/opdr95oml/IMG_E1877.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/rjgwmlqsp/)
https://s20.postimg.org/458xao15p/IMG_1878.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/lij7piwgp/)
https://s20.postimg.org/jdyuotsdp/Capture_1876RB.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[MOA]

Thanks Deuce, I'm still waiting for the truck to show up with mine, and I am looking to get a jump on it as I know you understand. So thought it was easiest to know what size shank is going to fit these actions since I am looking around to see what is in the offering from GM and others. Am also still thinking of playing with a necked down and shortened 45-70 case for a number of wildcats, just need some custom taper dies to resize the cases to a .323 boolit and then have the dies made. Keep the original barrel and just have it reamed to a new chamber using the new dies for the reamer to be made from and create some additional 8mm cartridges within the pressure limits of the block. Ya, so many thinks to keep your mind occupied.:bigsmyl2:

Will be following your work and the technical aspects of the marriage of barrel and action, along with your machining discoveries.

[marlinman93]

Is the shank on the new barrel long enough to keep the tulip at the receiver? Hope it is, as that's a nice touch, and adds some strength too.

[OlDeuce]

Is the shank on the new barrel long enough to keep the tulip at the receiver? Hope it is, as that's a nice touch, and adds some strength too.

The shank is about 3/8'' longer than needed... The set length is a cool 1 1/2'' from the Block!! I'm not going to trim any from the Barrel so it will be just a bit over 27 1/2'' The Tulip look is great for these old Girls!!!! the transition from the action to the Octagon will flow Perfect !! I've got a couple tricks up my sleeve that I'm going to test out ! If it works out you may grinn ! Ol Deuce

[WILCO]

Enjoying your progress Ol Deuce!

[Wolfer]

Wolfer, many clichés and adage's are appropriate here; First step down a slippery slope, the camel's nose is in the tent....etc.....:razz:

I'm afraid I took that first step many years ago but I haven't hit bottom yet. I'm the kinda guy that if you could buy something excellent for $500 or buy parts and pieces for $600 and cobble something together that would be half as good I'll take number 2 every time. It may not be anything anyone else wants but it's mine!

Mine should be here tomorrow. Somehow or another I plan on it going bang this weekend.

[MOA]

Deuce, I came across this today, have not heard of it before but I am doing some digging. It is listed on the image as a 8x58 PS. I really like the look of the cartridge, and want to check out if it is still a cartridge or case that can still be had. Might be a something in the running for a reamer. Click on image, fourth in from the right. This is going to drive me crazy all night trying to find out what cartridge this is, can not find any record of this anywhere yet.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:8x58


\

[Gewehr-Guy]

MOA, that cartridge looks like 8x58R Sauer, so it might be a misprint. I looked it up in Cartridges of the World

[OlDeuce]

Deuce, I came across this today, have not heard of it before but I am doing some digging. It is listed on the image as a 8x58 PS. I really like the look of the cartridge, and want to check out if it is still a cartridge or case that can still be had. Might be a something in the running for a reamer. Click on image, fourth in from the right. This is going to drive me crazy all night trying to find out what cartridge this is, can not find any record of this anywhere yet.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:8x58


\

https://s20.postimg.org/qo46c8a19/qbiAPJU_40-70.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/51p5v7bgp/)
https://s20.postimg.org/pkk20upkd/8x58R_8x48R_Sauer-1.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

The start of a Nice Taper Case for the 8mm or .323 boolet !!!! I can draw it with no problem Ol Deuce

[MOA]

It's a crying shame they quit making 33 WCF. Would be another good fit for this rifle.

[Sheriff]

While I usually don't recommend a particular cartridge you might consider these .30-30 based ones:

http://www.reedercustomguns.net/forum/images/uploaded/201802100052355a7e4253c074e.jpg

Cases are readily available, as are dies. L-R: .221 Falcon, .241 Falcon: .256 Falcon, 7m/m GNR, .30 GNR, .30-30, .355 GNR, .366 Falcon and .400 GNR.

[MOA]

While I usually don't recommend a particular cartridge you might consider these .30-30 based ones:

http://www.reedercustomguns.net/forum/images/uploaded/201802100052355a7e4253c074e.jpg

Cases are readily available, as are dies. L-R: .221 Falcon, .241 Falcon: .256 Falcon, 7m/m GNR, .30 GNR, .30-30, .355 GNR, .366 Falcon and .400 GNR.

Thanks Sheriff, those are worthy calibers. I moved from Phoenix to Flagstaff back in 1975. Started working in GS in 79. I remember when Gary came to town and set up his business, been in his store many times. I most likely would have stopped in and had a few words with him on this project if I was still living in Flag, but I will keep these in mind. Since I hope to take this unit hunting for deer and hogs at medium ranges, and since pressures are to be kept down, I will most likely favor the larger pre-expanded boolits to provide quick kills over velocity shock kills and provide through an through results.

[corbinace]

All,
Are those with the short neck suitable for cast? Surely, the smaller ones would be too fast, one would think.
Just trying to learn.

Messed up the quote function....here is an edit

While I usually don't recommend a particular cartridge you might consider these .30-30 based ones:

http://www.reedercustomguns.net/foru...e4253c074e.jpg

Cases are readily available, as are dies. L-R: .221 Falcon, .241 Falcon: .256 Falcon, 7m/m GNR, .30 GNR, .30-30, .355 GNR, .366 Falcon and .400 GNR.

[marlinman93]

All,
Are those with the short neck suitable for cast? Surely, the smaller ones would be too fast, one would think.
Just trying to learn.

Too fast is based on your load. So if you want them slower, simply work up reduced loads for the purpose. Some calibers are tougher to get reduced loads worked up that perform well. But any cartridge can be loaded to work at lower than factory velocities. Some rifling may not suit a cast bullet well, so that will affect how well they might shoot also.
Short necks have little to do with it. I know guys who set their bullets so far out that they barely seat in the case neck. They still get excellent groups. And then there's breech seaters that seat the bullet into the bore and put a case of powder behind it. They could care less about case neck length.

[corbinace]

Thank you for your insight, Marlinman93. I appreciate your taking the time to teach.

[Wolfer]

Well there wasn't anyone home when the fedex man came so I can't get mine until Monday.
I have lots of questions that I planned on the gun providing the answers.
Are the barrel threads metric?
Could an 8x58RD reamer be used to modify standard 8x57 dies.?
How difficult is it to modify the extractor when you go to a smaller rim size?

[OlDeuce]

Well there wasn't anyone home when the fedex man came so I can't get mine until Monday.
I have lots of questions that I planned on the gun providing the answers.
Are the barrel threads metric?
Could an 8x58RD reamer be used to modify standard 8x57 dies.?
How difficult is it to modify the extractor when you go to a smaller rim size?

Oh No...............LoL You have to wait now Sorry[smilie=s:

OL Deuce

[marlinman93]

Well there wasn't anyone home when the fedex man came so I can't get mine until Monday.
I have lots of questions that I planned on the gun providing the answers.
Are the barrel threads metric?
Could an 8x58RD reamer be used to modify standard 8x57 dies.?
How difficult is it to modify the extractor when you go to a smaller rim size?

I haven't run across one with metric threads yet. The extractor takes some tig welding work to build it up to go to smaller calibers.

[OlDeuce]

I haven't run across one with metric threads yet. The extractor takes some tig welding work to build it up to go to smaller calibers.

marlinman ...question....... do the set triggers work in these old frames that are made by Pedersoli or Uberti????? Ol Deuce

[marlinman93]

marlinman ...question....... do the set triggers work in these old frames that are made by Pedersoli or Uberti????? Ol Deuce

Haven't tried them myself, nor do I know what style Pedersoli uses to be able to guess. Some set triggers use a sear vs. the trigger to hammer connection, and those require an reworked hammer with a fly, plus the sear, plus the trigger group. If that's the case just putting the trigger plate in wouldn't finish the job.
I'm going to a friend's house this week to look at a trigger plate with DST in it. He wants to sell them, so I'll need to figure out what they are, and see if I can find a Pedersoli drawing to determine how theirs work if I buy them.

[OlDeuce]

Haven't tried them myself, nor do I know what style Pedersoli uses to be able to guess. Some set triggers use a sear vs. the trigger to hammer connection, and those require an reworked hammer with a fly, plus the sear, plus the trigger group. If that's the case just putting the trigger plate in wouldn't finish the job.
I'm going to a friend's house this week to look at a trigger plate with DST in it. He wants to sell them, so I'll need to figure out what they are, and see if I can find a Pedersoli drawing to determine how theirs work if I buy them.

Looking at what I have ,my thought was to bore & tap 2 small holes for some set screws. one set screw would put upward pressure on the main spring,and
the other on the hammer spring!!! Just to ease the squeeze:bigsmyl2:

So far my thoughts on the barrel lock is going to be sweet for a total tare down with only a screw driver !!! :razz:

Ol Deuce

[Wolfer]

I haven't run across one with metric threads yet. The extractor takes some tig welding work to build it up to go to smaller calibers.

Thanks Marlin man.
Ive been working on some dies this weekend. I'd like to shoot it as is but before I invest too much money I'll rebarrel. Right now I'm thinking 38-55 or 40-65. But that's down the road a piece. Planning on retiring early next year if possible.

[marlinman93]

Looking at what I have ,my thought was to bore & tap 2 small holes for some set screws. one set screw would put upward pressure on the main spring,and
the other on the hammer spring!!! Just to ease the squeeze:bigsmyl2:

So far my thoughts on the barrel lock is going to be sweet for a total tare down with only a screw driver !!! :razz:

Ol Deuce

Hmmm? The mainspring IS the hammer spring! So not sure why you'd use two screws for the same spring? And upward pressure on the mainspring would only increase hammer pressure and make the trigger pull even heavier.
The piano wire trigger spring swap is the easiest and quickest way to reduce trigger pull from 8-10 lbs. to around 2.5-3 lbs. If the mainspring is extremely heavy, reducing spring width on it will also help reduce trigger pull.

[OlDeuce]

Hmmm? The mainspring IS the hammer spring! So not sure why you'd use two screws for the same spring? And upward pressure on the mainspring would only increase hammer pressure and make the trigger pull even heavier.
The piano wire trigger spring swap is the easiest and quickest way to reduce trigger pull from 8-10 lbs. to around 2.5-3 lbs. If the mainspring is extremely heavy, reducing spring width on it will also help reduce trigger pull.

the main spring goes right to the hammer and right below the mainspring is a flat spring that connects just below the sear of the trigger !!! ???? Maybe
I'm looking upside down.........Hmmm I'll post ya some photos !!!! Krazy thing

[marlinman93]

Single trigger Rolling Blocks don't use a sear. The trigger directly contacts the notch in the hammer. There is a trigger return spring that rests on the trigger.
Here's a good view:
http://firearmshistory.blogspot.com/2010/07/actions-rolling-block-action.html

[OlDeuce]

Single trigger Rolling Blocks don't use a sear. The trigger directly contacts the notch in the hammer. There is a trigger return spring that rests on the trigger.
Here's a good view:
http://firearmshistory.blogspot.com/2010/07/actions-rolling-block-action.html

Got it ...Thanks .........How did the Dbl.set trigger look???? Ol Deuce

[MOA]

Well the FedEx truck has finally arrived.

These puppies are heavier then I had thought, my weighs in at 11.8 pounds.

https://s19.postimg.org/lp8zpn283/20180305_151234.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/djqxrhdz3/)

https://s19.postimg.org/g12oysfw3/20180305_151213.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/vzbeoxa3z/)

https://s19.postimg.org/cu85f58ar/20180305_151156.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/nh1ykkgfz/)

https://s19.postimg.org/srbipcakj/20180305_151142.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/5d3jdesn3/)
Now to see if it is a shooter.:bigsmyl2:

[Wolfer]

Picked mine up today also. It looks much better than I expected it to. I can't wait to make this thing go bang!

[Wolfer]

the main spring goes right to the hammer and right below the mainspring is a flat spring that connects just below the sear of the trigger !!! ???? Maybe
I'm looking upside down.........Hmmm I'll post ya some photos !!!! Krazy thing

I believe the lower spring is what holds the trigger into the hammer when the block is open. You can't pull the trigger unless the block is fully closed.
Midway has a video on YouTube with a cutaway that really shows how they work.

[OlDeuce]

I believe the lower spring is what holds the trigger into the hammer when the block is open. You can't pull the trigger unless the block is fully closed.
Midway has a video on YouTube with a cutaway that really shows how they work.

I'm understanding that .....I guess I didn't say it right on the hammer spring !! Let me try it again... I'm thinking of removing most of the tension and coming back with a adjustment screw to bring the hammer spring back to what I think I need for proper tension with out going beyond the realm of safety Does that
make sense ?????? Ol Deuce

[OlDeuce]

Well the FedEx truck has finally arrived.

These puppies are heavier then I had thought, my weighs in at 11.8 pounds.

https://s19.postimg.org/lp8zpn283/20180305_151234.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/djqxrhdz3/)

https://s19.postimg.org/g12oysfw3/20180305_151213.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/vzbeoxa3z/)

https://s19.postimg.org/cu85f58ar/20180305_151156.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/nh1ykkgfz/)

https://s19.postimg.org/srbipcakj/20180305_151142.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/5d3jdesn3/)
Now to see if it is a shooter.:bigsmyl2:

What a good looking rifle!!!! You ready to warm it up LoL ......... She is Looking Good!! Ol Deuce

[Wolfer]

I'm understanding that .....I guess I didn't say it right on the hammer spring !! Let me try it again... I'm thinking of removing most of the tension and coming back with a adjustment screw to bring the hammer spring back to what I think I need for proper tension with out going beyond the realm of safety Does that
make sense ?????? Ol Deuce

It does now. I'm kinda slow!

[sharps4590]

MOA, I'm surprised to read how heavy they are. Mine doesn't feel that heavy and it's just like yours, 'course I'm used to packing around Sharps, double rifles and the like and they're that heavy so maybe I'm numb or dumb.... Now I'll have to weigh it...lol!

Wolfer, the one I have was a hoot to play with. Got it going and now it's time to have some fun with it. God luck and enjoy!

[Boz330]

For trigger return springs you can't beat these folks; http://www.rollingblockparts.com/swede.html
I put one of their springs in mine and it dropped it down to about 3lbs. Great for hunting.

Bob

[MOA]

For trigger return springs you can't beat these folks; http://www.rollingblockparts.com/swede.html
I put one of their springs in mine and it dropped it down to about 3lbs. Great for hunting.

Bob

Thx a bunch. I'll be checking them out for springs and other stuff you can be sure.

[marlinman93]

I believe the lower spring is what holds the trigger into the hammer when the block is open. You can't pull the trigger unless the block is fully closed.
Midway has a video on YouTube with a cutaway that really shows how they work.

That should be a "lever" not a spring. The lever interacts with the block to prevent firing if the block isn't fully closed. Not a spring.

[marlinman93]

A 1 lb. roll of .045" piano wire costs about $5-$6 and will make hundreds of those trigger return springs. Been working of my roll for maybe 2 decades now, and it was $4 back then.

Here's some on Ebay a bit more, if your local hardware store doesn't carry it.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Piano-Music-Wire-10-coil-of-wire-for-sculpting-and-carving/112499588917?hash=item1a317f7f35:m:m8Ew4UqOfvqoJ-n1UDANFKg

[Boz330]

I'm not that talented and don't work on that many rollers to make buying a roll of piano wire practical. I wish I had that expertise and lots of rollers to try it on. My hat is off to you guys that can do that though.
I would like to find one of the military configuration 12MM to work on and that would be all of the rollers I need. They tend to get more and more expensive all of the time. The one I got was less than $250 which makes for a reasonable BPCR.

Bob

Bob

[marlinman93]

I'm not that talented and don't work on that many rollers to make buying a roll of piano wire practical. I wish I had that expertise and lots of rollers to try it on. My hat is off to you guys that can do that though.


Bob



It's not much of a job Bob. Pretty simple looking spring. Here's a link for the picture and info:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?70494-Replacement-rolling-block-trigger-spring

https://www.assra.com/yabbfiles/Attachments/Rolling_Block_Trigger_Spring_002.JPG

[MOA]

Just out of curiosity, can the Swedish rolling block be matched up with any particular Remington rolling block designation such as 1-1/2 or a #2? If I start looking for a new stock set can stocks made for Remington rolling blocks be used for the Swede roller?

[marlinman93]

Just out of curiosity, can the Swedish rolling block be matched up with any particular Remington rolling block designation such as 1-1/2 or a #2? If I start looking for a new stock set can stocks made for Remington rolling blocks be used for the Swede roller?

The early Rolling Block is the early 1867 style, then it's the same as the Remington #1 military. Stocks rarely show up for a Remington though, so what you'll usually find are takeoff stocks from the Swede or Danish guns.
Gunstocks Inc. sell very inexpensive stock sets for these guns, and have sporting style sets made for military actions with their shorter lower tang, and wider upper and lower tangs. They're semi inletted, and can be ordered with forearm for round or octagon barrel, plus different style buttplates. Under $100 a set. I've used a couple sets and they are great.

[MOA]

Marlinman, I was looking around the web and came across macongunstocks.com and they had both Remington and one set for the swede rolling block. They looked nice and the swede forend was made for a octagon barrel. I didn't see one for a round barrel but I'm sure one could call to see if they have them for a round barrel too. Are there measurements out there that give the tang width on the military and the sporting actions of the Swedish RB's. Might be helpful in knowing what the stocks are going to fit that a business is offering be it the military or sporting actions. A bummer if you get a military one and you have a sporting action which is narrower.

[Michael J. Spangler]

You guys are killing me.
I’ve always wanted a RB. Now I think I need to find a donor for a rebarrel.

Any suggestions on where to shop for an old war horse? I would really like one in 45/70 though any cast friendly cartridge would be great.

[MOA]

You guys are killing me.
I’ve always wanted a RB. Now I think I need to find a donor for a rebarrel.

Any suggestions on where to shop for an old war horse? I would really like one in 45/70 though any cast friendly cartridge would be great.

Keep checking with www.simpsonltd.com

[sharps4590]

Welp, I got out Momma's "State of Missouri, Dept. of Agriculture" certified farmer's market scale and mine weighs 8.01 lbs. Compared to my Shiloh's, double rifles and my Ballard with a deuce and a half axel for a barrel that's about what it feels like. I didn't think mine was 11+ lbs.

[MOA]

Welp, I got out Momma's "State of Missouri, Dept. of Agriculture" certified farmer's market scale and mine weighs 8.01 lbs. Compared to my Shiloh's, double rifles and my Ballard with a deuce and a half axel for a barrel that's about what it feels like. I didn't think mine was 11+ lbs.

I stand corrected Sharps. I went back and re weighed myself holding it, and then without holding it. 8.2 pounds.:bigsmyl2:

I have no idea where the 11plus pounds I came up with before came from, but I sometimes think the little grey cells are getting littler all the time, can't wait til next year to see how they are working, like my Dad use to say...... it's later than you think. Anyhow this is how I'm progressing on getting this new toy on the road to being a shooter for now in the first stages of trials as to whether I get another barrel or keep this one. Midway showed up at the house today, so I have the Hungarian brass. Just got it loaded up with about 11.2 grains of Unique and some cream of wheat an a squirt of titebond wood glue. Will let them set up until Sunday and then I'll load them up in boxes for a fire forming party on Monday afternoon if it is not raining here on the coast. Here are a few images of the work.

https://s19.postimg.org/a29px1tcj/20180309_084329.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/4qutcc79r/)

https://s19.postimg.org/fhs392qyb/20180309_131945.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/pf3424yjz/)

https://s19.postimg.org/q119ph0lf/20180309_160759.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/4rdnemkan/)

https://s19.postimg.org/uzos40jtv/20180309_161328.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/5451kthzz/)

https://s19.postimg.org/6j6m9jqsz/20180309_165717.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/h60feyyy7/)

Starting with 100 rounds should be a good start for now. If I change barrels and caliber????? Well, lets just see how this thing shoots before I start to cross that bridge.

[oldred]

Marlinman, I was looking around the web and came across macongunstocks.com and they had both Remington and one set for the swede rolling block.

I would STRONGLY recommend checking the reviews on that place!! Big discussion a while back on another forum and more than a few posters had some very unflattering things to say about that guy! Real eye opener about some of the things he did, I'm surprised he's even still around.

You don't even have to search for reviews just do a Google search on "Macon Gunstocks" and then check the second link down directly under Macon's listing!

[MOA]

oldred, thanks for that information. I will check it right now. I hate being a babe in the woods re stocks and such, never had to replace a stock in my life, should be a learning experience, but not a nightmare right!

[sharps4590]

Not a problem MOA! Have, unfortunately, done the same thing myself more often than not.....:oops: I didn't doubt you. My rifle looks exactly like the one posted and I just didn't think mine weighed that much. Otherwise, I can guarantee I would never have weighed it. Kinda glad I did now.

Unique was the most accurate powder in mine and I think I was shooting 12 grs. under a 200 gr. bullet. Problem with mine was that load was about 6 inches low at 50 yards when using the flipped up sight. With mine the first shot from a cold, as clean as I can get it barrel, is always out of the rest of the group. Shooting 5 shot groups the last four would go under an inch at 50 yards, benched and bagged, with the total group a bit more than 2 inches when counting the first shot. Obviously if hunting the first one is the one that counts the most. Ain't sure how to remedy that situation. 'Course 2 inches at 50 yards is more than minute of deer.

With the same bullet over I think 20 or 21 grs. of SR-4759 and an open cell foam filler groups aren't quite as good as with Unique. That load does shoot to the sights at 50 yards using the flipped up rear sight. Yesterday I shot it at 100 yards and it was about 6 inches low with approximately a 3 inch group. At 50 yards it hovers around 2 inches. Other than adding a hunting style tang sight to the rifle I'm a bit perplexed as where to go from here.

[marlinman93]

MOA, Any good stock company will tell you if their stocks are for military or sporting Rolling Blocks. I could take some measurements to post, but stock companies don't list measurements to compare them. The Sporting rifle tangs are about 1/8" narrower in the tangs, and the Sporting rifles have a much longer lower tang with an extra screw that gets a wood screw up into the stock from below. Most military rifles also have thicker tangs also, so the inletting for the tangs is both wider and deeper.
As I mentioned, Gunstocks Inc. has very reasonable priced stocks. They also sell higher grade wood if you're looking to build a high end gun. But at under $100 a set, I doubt you'll find anything close. They list stock sets by the type of action you have, and barrel contour. They also build sporter type stocks to fit military actions, so those of us who want to rework a Roller to Sporter style can get the correct stocks if they don't want to narrow the tangs, or thin them.
I bought a set for an original Sporting Rifle that had been poorly restocked. They don't sell stock sets for Sporter inletting, so I had to open up the inletting for the longer lower tang. But they do sell them with narrower inletting, so it wasn't a huge issue, and I didn't need to fill any wood on the tang inletting width.

[Boz330]

I have gotten several stocks from Treebone and the guy is very knowledgeable. He also has forearm mounting screws and steel butt plates. They aren't as cheap as $100 but I have been happy with all that I have gotten.
All of these came from Treebone.

Bob

[MOA]

Not a problem MOA! Have, unfortunately, done the same thing myself more often than not.....:oops: I didn't doubt you. My rifle looks exactly like the one posted and I just didn't think mine weighed that much. Otherwise, I can guarantee I would never have weighed it. Kinda glad I did now.

Unique was the most accurate powder in mine and I think I was shooting 12 grs. under a 200 gr. bullet. Problem with mine was that load was about 6 inches low at 50 yards when using the flipped up sight. With mine the first shot from a cold, as clean as I can get it barrel, is always out of the rest of the group. Shooting 5 shot groups the last four would go under an inch at 50 yards, benched and bagged, with the total group a bit more than 2 inches when counting the first shot. Obviously if hunting the first one is the one that counts the most. Ain't sure how to remedy that situation. 'Course 2 inches at 50 yards is more than minute of deer.

With the same bullet over I think 20 or 21 grs. of SR-4759 and an open cell foam filler groups aren't quite as good as with Unique. That load does shoot to the sights at 50 yards using the flipped up rear sight. Yesterday I shot it at 100 yards and it was about 6 inches low with approximately a 3 inch group. At 50 yards it hovers around 2 inches. Other than adding a hunting style tang sight to the rifle I'm a bit perplexed as where to go from here.

Would it do any good to get a different front sight, something that would give you the ability to change the height of it?

[MOA]

Thx marlinman. I will call and talk to these folks. I'm sure they will be helpful. I'll be sure to look my rifle over good to see which action mine has.

[MOA]

Boz, those are sweet looking stocks. Will keep them on my list too.

[Wayne Smith]

Treebone does good work, and he will cut your wood if you have a blank and send it to him.

Be aware he cuts about 10% large. You have to trim it down.

[MOA]

Thx Wayne, nice to have options on wood AND costs.

[Reverend Al]

FAR better to be oversized and have a chance to work it down to fit than have it undersized and not fit at all! (I've run into that before with semi-inletted stocks ...)


Treebone does good work, and he will cut your wood if you have a blank and send it to him.

Be aware he cuts about 10% large. You have to trim it down.

[MOA]

I couldn't agree with you more Reverend Al!!! Wood filler just wood (pun) knot (another pun) work. That would be get-out-the BONDO time I'm afraid.

[marlinman93]

Would it do any good to get a different front sight, something that would give you the ability to change the height of it?
Not aware of a front sight that has the ability to change height???? But a good front and rear sight are an asset on any gun.

George at Treebone specializes in Rolling Block stocks, as he's a huge fan of the guns. His work on rolling Block stocks are wonderful, but I wont buy a Ballard stock from him again. I should have listened when he told me, "I hate doing Ballard stocks. That through bolt is a pain."
My stock set he made had so little wood I had to redrill and open up the through bolt passage, to shift it enough to one side to get just enough wood above metal to simply sand it. Then of course the shift work required me to bed the stock so it would stay shifted over after it was done.

[GunnyJohn]

where did you find that?

[MOA]

All the glue has dried and now getting them boxed up for the fire-forming party tomorrow.:bigsmyl2:

https://s19.postimg.org/65ezec8yr/20180310_110745.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/q0110go67/)

https://s19.postimg.org/4evycljn7/20180310_114550.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/uzyh85m0f/)

[sharps4590]

MOA, a shorter front sight was my first thought and I've done that on several of my old German firearms but, I believe the existing sight is already about as short as it can be. At least it appears that way on mine.

[MOA]

I guess I'd start looking at what you could do about the rear sight. Or, you may have to change them both out for a set that is known to work together properly.

[marlinman93]

where did you find that?


What are you talking about?

[MOA]

What are you talking about?

Maybe he is posting to the wrong thread?????

[WILCO]

Keep checking with www.simpsonltd.com

Love that outfit!

[sharps4590]

A taller rear sight would no doubt work but geez....with the rear leaf flipped up it's already pretty tall. I wouldn't like it much taller, it would look goofy as the dickens to my eye and, I'm not building a long range rifle out of it. I think I'm going to be satisfied with it the way it is. Any hunting I'm likely to do with it shots will hardly be more than 50 yards where we hunt and the taller rear sight is dead on at that distance. If I have a compelling urge to shoot very far I have other rifles that work fine.

[MOA]

216356
First SS pin tumble after first fire-forming session. One more firing to go and then some real boolit trials. Cast about 200 Lee 234 grain Karabiner's yesterday. Now to prime, powder, neck size and put a #00 buckshot in the case mouth for tomorrows ssession. Action on this 1867 Gustav rolling block is solid, positive and no creep in the trigger at all. Can't wait to send some rounds down the tube.
How are you coming along on your RB OlDeuce.

[MOA]

R.I.P. OlDeuce. I'm sure your working on another project somewhere, and no doubt a better place. You will be missed.:sad:

[Boz330]

R.I.P. OlDeuce. I'm sure your working on another project somewhere, and no doubt a better place. You will be missed.:sad:

??????????????????????

Bob

[500Linebaughbuck]

R.I.P. OlDeuce. I'm sure your working on another project somewhere, and no doubt a better place. You will be missed.:sad:

what happened?

[marlinman93]

R.I.P. OlDeuce. I'm sure your working on another project somewhere, and no doubt a better place. You will be missed.:sad:

Yes, what happened? His profile shows he (or someone with his account) was looking at threads just yesterday?

[500Linebaughbuck]

04-01-2018, 06:10 PM
MOA MOA is offline
Boolit Master
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Feb 2012
Location
Mobile, Alabama, formally from Arizona Territory.
Posts
401
OlDeuce
Randy passed away two weeks ago after a short stay at the hospital from a lung infection.




i was told this

[MOA]

I would say most likely it was his wife.

[broken arrow]

I am truly sorry to hear this.
May he rest in piece.

[ratsass]

Hi everyone. I'm relatively new to this site but have been following it for some time. At this point in time I'm just introducing myself. I will be trying to complete Randy's ( Ol Deuce ) projects. He was my friend, and will be greatly missed. I will be finishing his projects as far as my capabilities allow, so I may be picking everybody's brain, once in a while. We discussed at length, the direction the project would follow, so hopefully I can complete it.

[MOA]

Welcome aboard ratsass, many of us will be following your progress reports on Randy's projects with much interest.

[corbinace]

We can only hope for someone to share in our passions enough to carry them through to fruition, when we no longer can.

[MOA]

We can only hope for someone to share in our passions enough to carry them through to fruition, when we no longer can.

:bigsmyl2:

[Wolfer]

We can only hope for someone to share in our passions enough to carry them through to fruition, when we no longer can.

Ain't that the truth. Welcome aboard Ratsass.

[MOA]

And that's the last we heard from Ratsass in 9 months. Wonder how he's doing on Randy' s project?

[500Linebaughbuck]

yes it would, MOA.

[marlinman93]

Hope his good intentions didn't fall by the wayside once he discovered what it costs if you can't do the work yourself?

[MOA]

Well I sent a email off to Dave Manson yesterday re Randy's possible reamer and any other information that he may have on the tapered 30-30 case that Randy was going to use as his wildcat cartridge. I will also reach out to Ratsass to see where he is at with the project and what his future plan is for the project. Will keep you all updated as I get more information.

[MOA]

The last activity Ratsass had on this site was Nov 25 of last year. I've just sent him a email to see if he will let me know how he is coming along with Randy's project.

[MOA]

I just got email from Randy's wife. The gentleman that was going to finish Randy's project had some health issues not long after Randy died. So, the project was sold to the gunsmith that was fitting Randy's barrel to the action l think last August, so I guess we will never know how the project has ended, other than it ended unfinished by Randy.:-(

[marlinman93]

Guess it's not all bad if the gunsmith bought it. Just no ending to the story for us.

[Wolfer]

This was the thread that got me started down this particular rabbit hole. I reread it from time to time and feel a loss every time. I didn’t know Randy but I know he was excited about this project and it saddens me that he didn’t get to finish it. I realize also the same thing will probably happen to many of us that can’t stay out of rabbit holes.

[MOA]

Maybe.....I'm waiting to hear back from Dave Manson reamers about the reamer Randy said he had ordered for this project. I took some screenshots of Randys drawing on his tapered 30-30 case, which I sent to Dave. Hopefully I'll hear back something positive this coming week. I know which barrel Randy ordered from Green Mountain, so I have that covered. Looked at Snowy this morning and nice gallery of case hardening. We'll just have to see where this goes.:p I am leaning toward a lyman peep sight on this go-round I think.

[MOA]

This was the thread that got me started down this particular rabbit hole. I reread it from time to time and feel a loss every time. I didn’t know Randy but I know he was excited about this project and it saddens me that he didn’t get to finish it. I realize also the same thing will probably happen to many of us that can’t stay out of rabbit holes.

Yes, I too got sent down this rabbit hole by Randy also, who know maybe someday if I catchup with him we'll have a few words about all this roller fun. I still plan on doing a roller in a slim octagon about 16 inches chambered in 45 Colt. Lord, just give me a little more time is all I need.:guntootsmiley:

[MOA]

All these are Randy's fault.[smilie=s::awesome:


233898

And I still have one more coming.

[Wolfer]

I have 3 also. An 8 mm a 12. 7 and my soon to be 40-65. I’m always on the lookout for more. How many is too many or is that an infinite number?

I want a 67/89 in 38-55 and another in 45 colt.
I called and killed a coyote this year with the 8mm and killed a deer with the 50. While hunting I noticed I was carrying a rifle made in 1875 and a pistol type that was designed in 1873. I guess I’m just not a modern man.

[MOA]

I have 3 also. An 8 mm a 12. 7 and my soon to be 40-65. I’m always on the lookout for more. How many is too many or is that an infinite number?

I want a 67/89 in 38-55 and another in 45 colt.
I called and killed a coyote this year with the 8mm and killed a deer with the 50. While hunting I noticed I was carrying a rifle made in 1875 and a pistol type that was designed in 1873. I guess I’m just not a modern man.

Ho,ho,ho. Be ever so glad your not a modern man.........you just might get your skirts all messed up when off hunting in the woods.:kidding::kidding::kidding::kidding:

[marlinman93]

I've been a big Rolling Block fan for decades! They just have such a huge place in firearms history, and are still the least expensive source for a single shot rifle build. I've got several I've built up, plus some I purchased that were already built up. Some were cheaper to buy finished than some good actions I've purchased. Some rifles I bought complete to make into projects with their actions have ended up being left alone since they were too nice to alter.
This one was an original Rolling Block Sporting action I got in a trade with a friend, and ended up being a full round .40-65 barreled rifle.

https://i.imgur.com/IxjPU8Wl.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/4OJ3CYil.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/EidVLkDl.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/qU7nnqHl.jpg

This is one I bought to steal the action off, but turned out to be a historically significant gun, so I repaired the wood and metal issues and saved it. It was a mess of broken wood, extra holes, poorly done dovetails, and ugly. But it had a nicely lined .22LR bore, and shot fantastic.

https://i.imgur.com/A6V6ccMl.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/p46ZIGql.jpg

This one is an original that needed nothing. A .44-77SBN with 34" extra heavy barrel, and set trigger.

https://i.imgur.com/aISsY7ll.jpg

This one is a Whitney-Laidley 1st Model with the Laidley system breech block. It had been D&T for Stevens 1.5" tang sight spacing, so a friend built me a new tang sight base for a staff I had here.

https://i.imgur.com/2EiZmx8l.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/LYtTkGdl.jpg

This one is a dainty little #4 with 3 barrels fitted to it. .22 Short, .22 LR, and .25 Stevens RF.

https://i.imgur.com/AWh60zVl.jpg

[marlinman93]

This one is another .22 LR with match chamber.

https://i.imgur.com/WPmqgH8l.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/8L88qBwl.jpg

This one is .44 Long CF.

https://i.imgur.com/mosBtV2l.jpg

Husqvarna Type 33 in 9.5x52R

https://i.imgur.com/9kWdBWQl.jpg

A #2 in .32-20.

https://i.imgur.com/ovB1OvMl.jpg

A Danish Carl Gustav in 11.7 the Danish equivalent of our .45-70, and uses .45-70 cases to make the cartridge.

https://i.imgur.com/TIb1m3Il.jpg

Another Sporting Rifle in .40-50SS with half octagon barrel.

https://i.imgur.com/R9kC286l.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/SMBpXLyl.jpg

An early 3 digit Sporting Rifle in .44 Long CF.

https://i.imgur.com/tcKkbZKl.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/jUo986Ml.jpg

[marlinman93]

And lastly my #4 Roller engraved by my friend RObert Evans.

https://i.imgur.com/GbSblsjl.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Ltr9hjcl.jpg

[ajjohns]

Holy! That's a beautiful spread of Rollers!

[500Linebaughbuck]

:D:D:D:D:D:D

that one there brings a tear to my eye!!!!!

[MOA]

marlinman93,
What a super nice collection. I just love images of these great rollers. How long have you been collecting them, and do you have to travel many miles to find these treasures? Or do you find them online? I really like the #4 three barrel set and a barrel for 25 stevens to boot....what a hoot. I'm such a piker, but one has to start somewhere huh.

[marlinman93]

I've found many of these right here at home; well over half. The three barrel set belonged to a friend who got older and wanted to find a good home. The other engraved #4 belonged to my friend Bob Evans, a guild engraver, and a gun he did very early as an engraver. When he asked if I was interested, I couldn't get my money out fast enough! I only told him I wanted him to sign it first, as he never had.
Others have come from places like the Big Reno Show, and Denver's CGCA show. Interesting to me was finding that .22 #1 Rolling Block that I mentioned as historically significant to me. I found it in Reno, Nv. and the seller was from just 15 miles away from my home here in Oregon. Driving 600 miles to a show and buying from a local guy was humorous to me. The gun was owned originally by a prominent Oregon Territory pioneer. He and his family had a huge part in settling in Oregon Territory, and making it what it became later as a state. EC Hackett is the owner's name, and he was one of the first deputy sheriff's here. He also was mayor of Oregon City, and county recorder until his death in the 1930's. His home is on the National Historic Landmark registry, and the End of the Oregon Trail marker sits in his front yard. Neither the seller or I had any knowledge of the gun's history at the time I bought it. I discovered EC Hackett's name under the forearm when I began taking it apart to salvage the action. Once I figured out who he was, I quickly changed gears and knew the gun had to be saved from restoration. That gun will be donated to the Oregon City Museum someday, but for now I'll enjoy it.
I've collected Rolling Blocks since I was in high school over 50 years ago. Longer than my interest in Marlin Ballard rifles even! Early on it as military versions, as they were plentiful and cheap. Later I discovered the Sporting Rifles, and sold my military models as I fell in love with the look of the Sporting Rifle.
I'm still actively searching for Sporters, but don't find them unaltered too often. The early round top Sporter above was a recent find last year. Looked for one of these for decades, but considering only about 1500 or so exist, they are even tougher to find, and rarely good enough to shoot as the one I found in Denver is.

[Wolfer]

Wow!!!