Light load for noise reduction, Your Suggestion

[bbogue1]

My wife had an eardrum replaced and has very sensitive ear canals. She wears electronic ear muffs. Her 22 pistol noise does not bother her. She shoots a 1 7/8"barrel 38 Special, S&W Lady Smith, which does bother her ears. She's tried factory FMJ 124 grain, She's tried 160 grain cast over 3.6 grains of 231, all too loud. I have two molds I'd like to try for her. Using CCI primers my first choice is a 105 (drops 108) grain swc Lyman recommends 5.1 grains as a starting load. My second is a 125 grain mold that drops at 128 grain. For the 108 grain bullet I'm thinking of loading up a test series of 2.6 grains W231, followed by 2.8 grains followed by 3.0 grains to check the noise and accuracy. Our range is a 15 yard to 35 yard range. I have heard several cases where people have shot reduced loads of 3.0 successfully but not 2.6 or 2.8 What is your opinion?

[Outpost75]

Get her a longer barrel or shoot 148-grain HBWC soft-swaged target wadcutters.

Winchester data:

148 GR. HDY LHBWC

Winchester 231 .358" 1.160" 3.5 grs 14,200 CUP

[jcren]

Starting my noise shy wife out, I ran as low as 2.8 of unique. Some powders have a lower, mellower tone to the report, so try other powders. At that low of a charge, I had some squib loads with standard Winchester primers, but Winchester magnum or cci primers worked just fine.

[dougader]

2.1 grains W231 with 125 - 158 grain swc fired from S&W 64, 2" barrel. Low noise, recoils like a 22 LR. Make sure of soft dirt or similar back drop as these slow moving slugs will bounce right back at you otherwise.

[bbogue1]

Outpost75 I see the value of a longer barrel but for us that is not an option. I am very interested in the thought of a heavier bullet and a low charge. The heavier bullet came a s a surprise since it is the opposite of my thinking. I am far from being knowledgeable in this area, therefore, I was thinking a lighter charge and a lighter projectile. Can you elaborate on the use of a heavier bullet?

dougader Thanks, I thought it could be done You, too, suggest a heavier bullet than the 105 I thought would work. Tell me more. I appreciate the warning, I had not considered that possibility. Don't worry, our target is placed at an angle to reflect ricochets to our right and down. Or we have a few steel targets that blow up normally charged lead bullets and they are never perpendicular to our line of fire.

More thoughts, anyone?

[jcren]

Sorry, forgot to mention I used 125 and 158 grain bullets. The heavier did have slightly more felt recoil and a higher poi due mostly to the longer dwell time in the barrel. That same dwell time gives powder more time to burn and reduces muzzle blast.

[JBinMN]

I made up some reduced loads of 38 spec. using Red Dot under 158gr SWC for the missus in her LCR.357 for her hand & carpal tunnel issues in both her wrists. Ladder tested from 2.2 up to 2.9 sandbagged/benched @ 15 yds. Best performance in her pistol was 2.5gr then 2.9, then 2.2.. Did the same ladder test with 148gr WCs & the best once again was 2.5gr. Made it easy for me to remember, even though I put the others in the log book.

Anyway, we wear hearing protection, either regular "muffs" or those little "squishy" plugs that are either on a head loop or just come in a lil bag that ya "squish" & put in your ears. [Used to use cigarette butts back when I was in the Corps. LOL ;) ] Never thought to compare the noise between higher/"full" load range to the reduced charges as it was more of a recoil thing for her wrists & hands, so can't say for sure, but I would reckon it is a difference in those little snubbies.

G'Luck! with whatever ya decide to do.
:)

[GhostHawk]

Agrees with JBinMN.

Red Dot under 3 grains.

The problem is not recoil so the heavier bullet should not be an issue.
With the heavier bullet it should remain in the barrel a tad longer. Get higher pressure but better more complete burning with less noise.

Load 10 at 2.5 and see how it goes.

For my wife with sensitive ears and arthritis hands I am loading 2 grains of Red Dot under a 90 grain cast bullet in .32sw long. They hardly pop.

Longer barrel would help but I understand if she does not want to trade guns.

Let us know how it goes.

[trapper9260]

JBinMn for your wife hand problems might like to have her looking into getting something like this
https://www.scheels.com/p/harbinger-womens-pro-weight-training-glove/00751-149-E5.html
I found they work great for the help with what she have because I have carpal tunnel issues also.

[MostlyLeverGuns]

For ear protection, the little foam plugs UNDER the ear muffs make a real difference in sound impact to the ears. Even a 3 inch barrel helps with noise.

[JBinMN]

JBinMn for your wife hand problems might like to have her looking into getting something like this
https://www.scheels.com/p/harbinger-womens-pro-weight-training-glove/00751-149-E5.html
I found they work great for the help with what she have because I have carpal tunnel issues also.

Thanks! I will show the link to her this evening & see what she thinks herself.
:)

[Wayne Smith]

British wartime load in the 38 S&W (not Special) was a 200gr bullet at about 700fps. Don't underestimate a big boolit going slow.

[trapper9260]

Thanks! I will show the link to her this evening & see what she thinks herself.
:)

You welcome .I see it works for me.Mainly at this time of the year for full loads in my hand gun and also helps when i prune my fruit trees,it gives me a better grip and holding too.

[Larry Gibson]

For ear protection, the little foam plugs UNDER the ear muffs make a real difference in sound impact to the ears...........

+1....definitely use the foam earplugs with the muffs.

Many years back I loaded the Lee 105 gr SWC cast soft and TL'd over 2.5 gr Bullseye for my wife and young daughters to use in a S&W Chief's Special with 1 7/8" barrel. Minimal recoil and minimal noise but still loud enough that ear protection was needed.

[arlon]

My wife has crazy good hearing and found the noise to be a problem too. She got a set of the custom ear protectors that are made to fit HER ear canal. They cast them on the spot at a lot of gun shows. They are a little more fiddly than using muffs but they just flat stop the noise issue for her. Something to think about. I also find the recoil from her Lady Smith is noticeably less as the bullet weight goes up. So much so it makes me want to try some 200gr 38 S&W loads in her special cases. The lighter bullets just seem to have a sharper recoil and higher pitched report. More of a crack than bang with the light bullets. I think the slow heavy bullet might have more of a push than snap to the recoil.

[Soundguy]

+1 on the soft lead wadcutters, and possibly something like a 75% freespac under projectile case fill of trailboss.

[bobthenailer]

You can also use 158 or even better a 180 gr SWC seated backwards (nose first) and seated almost flush with the top of the case and add a light taper crimp for the 38 special . using 1.5 to 2.0 grs of BE or tight group powder, make sure the bullet makes it out of the barrel and adj powder charge up or down for the specific handgun preferences , could be shot without earplugs as the noise level is low.

[dverna]

My mousephart load is 2.5 gr of Clays under a 125-130 gr bullet. It is also surprisingly accurate....yielding 1” groups at 30 yards. I use it handguns as well but not with a barrel as short as yours. Beware it is easy to double charge a load with that little volume. I load on a 1050 with Powder Check.

[375RUGER]

Custom fit earplugs are worth every penny. I use to use foam under muffs, doubling up is nowhere near as quiet as custom fit plugs. I got mine from a local guy in NM, who makes the rounds at the SASS, gunshows and other events.
this is just a link, i don't know if it's the product I use or not.
http://www.instamold.com/consumer-products/custom-molded-ear-plugs/

[country gent]

The addition of foam under the muffs is good also try standard muffs with a higher rating for her, most electronics muffs arnt rated as high in reduction as the none standards are. The draw back to the plugs and standard muffs are talking on the range is almost imposible.

The old bullsey load of 2.6-2.7 grns bullseye and a 148 grn hollow based wadcutter is very soft shooting and very low report also is very accurate in most handguns. Faster burning powders and mid to light bullets tend to do better for what your wanting the lower gas volumne and faster burn helps .

[dougader]

dougader Thanks, I thought it could be done You, too, suggest a heavier bullet than the 105 I thought would work. Tell me more. I appreciate the warning, I had not considered that possibility. Don't worry, our target is placed at an angle to reflect ricochets to our right and down. Or we have a few steel targets that blow up normally charged lead bullets and they are never perpendicular to our line of fire.

More thoughts, anyone?

I first read of this in, I think, an early 1990's issue of Shooting Times magazine. Their load was with a 148 grain swaged HBWC and 2.1 grains WW231. The author said it was more fun than a barrel of monkeys, or some such... I had a few of the HBWC's around so I loaded some up, and it was a nice paper puncher at 10-15 yards and indeed fun.

When I ran out of the HBWC's I turned to what I had on hand, some 158 grain SWC's cast by a local shop. They worked just as well and we never had a stuck bullet, even in my 6" GP100. IF we load in 357 cases, we up the charge to 2.5 grains of WW231.

When taking new shooters to the range, we often started them off with these "puff" loads and the 38 Special just to get them used to a DA revolver, and then moved them up to match style target loads, then 38 Special ball and, finally 38+P and 357 magnum.

My warning about the back stop comes from an incident where we didn't notice that someone had dumped an old tire at the back of the bay at our local range.... our target stand blocked it's view and, after a few shots, my then girlfriend stopped shooting and said she got hit by a ricochet. Sure enough, she had a fat lip and there was the bullet on the ground by her feet. I imagine any hard or elastic surface could cause a problem, so be careful. These are gallery type loads and will bounce back and, as our experience shows, the loads drop like a rock within 35 yards (the length of the bay we were using that day).

I also used the Lee 9mm TL bullet, a 124-125 grain slug they refer to as a SWC but is a rather pointy number. Tumble lubed, we used them in 38 Spl with the same 2.1 grains W231 but the Alox lube is very smokey.

I also bought some light recoil (?? 10-12# ??) springs for my 1st Gen G17 and used the same Lee TL bullet with light loads for teaching new shooters with the semi-auto.... and then worked them up to full loads that way as well.

[bbogue1]

This has been so much more than I expected. Thanks all of you. I will start by loading some 160 gr SWC with 2.2 then up by .2 grams for a series of 4 different loads. I don't have Bullseye but the next powder on the relative burn chart is 700X, I do have that. Makes sense, a low powder load pushing a heavy bullet gives low velocity thus more burn time. I also would like to do the same with a light bullet and compare the noise. I have some 108 grain swc I'll load the same. I am thinking I will like the 160 gr bullet more than the 108. I am looking forward to this test. Thanks, I am going into this with far more confidence now. Comments?

[JBinMN]

Just be very careful not to double load. I think ya already know that, & I am "preaching to the choir" about it, but it can happen if ya get distracted, or even in a hurry.
;)

Very easy with so little powder, a lot of room left in the 38sp. case. 700x, Red Dot, Clays, BE, etc..

I put the boolit/bullet on the case & seat right away, to help prevent adding 2 times, myself. Just to make sure. (I use both single stage & turret)
;)

Otherwise, like I said before, G'Luck!
:)

[rintinglen]

I started my daughter off when she was seven shooting a 3 inch J frame with 358-101 75 grain wadcutters (NOE makes a similar boolit mold). 2.0 grains of Bullseye well crimped made a mild, quiet load. I later went on to use those boolits in multi-ball loads when she graduated to more powerful 38 ammo. The cases were loaded to an OAL of 1.20, and crimped. The boolits in question are in front of the 357 Multi-ball cartridges on the left.
214080214080

[Soundguy]

I started my daughter off when she was seven shooting a 3 inch J frame with 358-101 75 grain wadcutters (NOE makes a similar boolit mold). 2.0 grains of Bullseye well crimped made a mild, quiet load. I later went on to use those boolits in multi-ball loads when she graduated to more powerful 38 ammo. The cases were loaded to an OAL of 1.20, and crimped. The boolits in question are in front of the 357 Multi-ball cartridges on the left.
214080214080

what happened to the one on the left? go into the sizer near sideways and mash smooth on one side?

[rintinglen]

Yeah, they are a little fiddly to mess with, and I didn't want to fool around casting more for the experiment I was running so I used some that would normally have gone back in the pot. There are three of them in that case and at living room distance I do believe they would put a serious hurt on anyone unfortunate to be standing in their path. Off hand, I can't recall the powder charge, but it gave just over 800 fps for a 225 grain payload.

the bullets on the right have one 358-345 (IIRC) 115 grain SWC on top of one of the little button nose wadcutters.
But these are not the light loads you were looking for...

[Soundguy]

Agreed, even deformed, at living room distance, they will be minute of badguy.