44 Blackhawk Hunter

[newton]

I just cannot seem to see any way around it. I tried to cure the craving for big bore hunting gun with a CVA single shot, but it just did not work out for me. I had originally looked at the Blackhawk hunter but did not have the funds to buy it. So after my try with the rifle, I decided to just wait for the funds to come in for the Ruger. I think I will be set to go sometime in the middle of next week.

I've been doing a lot of looking, seeing what kind of experience people have had with theirs, but nothing is too recent really. So I wanted to get a feel for what others think of their hunter models. Still like them, or wish you would have gone for something else?

I'll be getting a Burris 2x20 to top it with. I have the Lee 240 SWC, the Lee 310, and the Lyman 429640 HP(but may also have a pin that will allow me to cast flat points - that's another story). I am hoping the 429640 will be the ticket.

I'll be buying a newer model(I assume they will not have any of the older stock), which in my research should mean that the throats should be pretty uniform. I am somewhat concerned I might have to deal with the dreaded barrel thread constriction. I had to deal with that on a 45 colt Blackhawk I got a while back.

Thought I might see how people are liking theirs after having it for a while. I am getting it specifically to hunt with. I want to be able to reach out to the 100-yard mark hense the scope.

[lefty o]

mine is one of the first ones from back in 92-93 time frame, and overall its been a very good revolver.213281

[gunarea]

Hey newton
I hope you mean a Ruger Super Blackhawk. After shooting the Blackhawk in 44 mag(ouch), I passed on that.
My wife has an old model three screw which she only shoots competitively. She liked my old gun so well it was a defensive move on my part to keep mine as mine. Hers was purchased used, many years ago. The old moldel three screw of mine was bought new at our local gunstore in 1968. A model 1911 Colt commander was traded in on the new Super Blackhawk after finding out the hard way, 45acp is inadequate on feral hogs. Here in Florida, my 44 is a bit much on most anything but hogs. For hunting, the hollow point just makes a mess. I have both Lee and Lyman mould in the 310gr, both are double cavity but I use the Lyman slug for competition shooting. Of course there is the famous 429421 of which I have four different moulds which produce four different projectiles. For steel under 100m I have switched to a Lyman 215gr SW just to conserve lead. My old three screw has many state level titles hanging off of its barrel. Just to round out the stable, I bought a new, new model super Blackhawk in stainless steel. It is a nice firearm but I have never quite gotten used to the transfer bar feel in the trigger. As such the new model has never been taken hunting. It has been used in many shooting competitions and preforms with milder target ammo equivalent to the older guns. Never had a malfunction in any of them, all three are still factory original. Here is a real world heads up, when loaded up with the 310gr slug, do not whip it out and take a shot from the hip. Although it will stop an angry sow in her tracks, it will take days just for the swelling to go down in my wrist. Gotta give the Ruger super Blackhawk a thumbs up. If you did in fact mean a Blackhawk, never mind.
Roy

[Four-Sixty]

To the OP, are you considering the Bisley frame?

I could just never master the plow handles frame unless I shot it constantly.

[Thumbcocker]

I have a Bisley one that has become my favorite designated hunting revolver. I plan on putting a belt mountain pin and a reduced trigger return spring in it and leaving it alone. The factory sights are good and it is just plain kick butt accurate. If you look at the photos in my album you can see some results in the form of venison. I would strongly recommend a simply rugged holster with shell loops on the holster and the "Chesty Puller" chest carry rig. Mine put two deer in the freezer and jars this year with 3 shots. I don't use a scope on mine but that may change someday of my eyesight fades.

[TCLouis]

I shot the Lee 310 out of a 9 1/2" SRH and it is the most accurate load I have ever shot out of a revolver at 50 yards.

Less pleasant out of a SBH and I think that affected grouping there.

Ever handle a Bisley grip frame?

I would love A Bisley Hunter,

BUT a SRH is probably the best hunting platform

[Lefty Red]

The SBH Hunter was one of my favorite 44s. I traded a SRH Hunter for it and never looked back. I put a 3MOA Reddot Sight on it and at 100s, Lee 310s Aloxed lubed, I could keep everything in 3" post-it note.

Lefty

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

[DougGuy]

If you want a 100yd Ruger SA revolver, it would be highly advised to have those throats at least looked at and pin gaged to see what they measure. I have done tons of cylinders and virtually none are even. It's how Ruger makes them that is the reason for this. The good part is that most are undersize and so they can be precision honed to an exact size and usually I can get them within .0002" of each other.

[newton]

Thanks for the replies guys. I figured that most people with them are still happy with them.

Just for clarification, it will be the hunter model not just the super blackhawk one. That was one of the hardest things to weed through when doing research into the gun because the super blackhawk is pretty prevalent and the hunter seems to be a sleeper. I kicked around the idea of going with just a regular super blackhawk, but I really want to be able to reach 100 yards(with practice of course) and I know that my eyes wont be that great with iron sights on a pistol. So, I need a scoped gun and the hunter model fits the bill just great I think.

I will be getting the bisley frame. Ever since I saw it I liked it. For some reason it just looks really good, and even more so on the hunter model with a scope. I have not shot one before, but I don't do a lot of shooting with the plow grips either so I do not think it will be too hard to get acustomed to. I have read that its a love/hate thing with that grip, but when you really start to look close 90% of the guys who do not like the bisley grip come from shooting a lot of plow grips and it seems(to me) that the bisley just feels 'weird'.

I'm going to somehow try to adopt a holster to attach to my binocular chest case. I always wear it hunting so I might as well take advantage it. I really like the idea of having two hands free without having a rifle slung over my shoulder. It is going to make it way easier to climp the hills and hollers here in the Ozarks.

Doug, I will for sure be checking the throats - I know your the resident master of them, so if they need work I'll be in touch. I am hoping, really hoping, that I will luck out with a "good day" gun and not a Monday/Friday one. I had to do some work on my 45 blackhawk after I got it years ago along with having to send it back to Ruger one time. At least they have great customer service.

I have heard that the 'newer' manufactured guns with the warning stamped under the barrel have much better consistency with their throats. I think the barrel thread constriction is a luck of the draw thing though, just depending on how much they tightened it. I have wondered if those constrictions could be 'helped' by shooting a few boxes of jacketed rounds through them? I firelapped the one in my 45, but it is a blued gun and I have heard the Ruger stainless guns are much harder.

[DougGuy]

You will either be in the old folks home or broke from buying ammo before you get rid of a choke with j words.

Modern throats are much better but of all the newer ones I get with even throats, they run about 5 or 6 out of 10 will be even and most of those are the medium framed guns so yes they have gotten better.

If you don't have pin gages when you get your new one, use a boolit that fits good and see how even the drag fit is in the throats if there is a tight one or loose one you will feel it if your "gaging" boolit is a snug fit.

[Bigslug]

I was chomping at the bit for that revolver when Ruger introduced in in '93 or so, and bought the first one that landed at the shop. Never did hunt with it - tastes and preferences change, after all - but it's a good shooter. Couldn't tell you what the throats WERE. I firelapped the bore to deal with a bit of frame crush, and the throats are happy with .432" slugs now.

Had a scope on it, don't anymore. Just don't like optics on handguns. The extra weight of the scope rib atop the barrel is nice for mitigating recoil.

Peacemaker grip vs. Bisley. I personally cannot abide the Bisley grip, in much the same way that I cannot abide a flat mainspring housing on a 1911 - both point low for me. That's what you want to be checking over simple aesthetics.

Mine's mostly a safe queen now. My revolver preferences have shifted largely toward double action - GP-100 and Redhawks - and I rarely bother to thumb the hammer back anymore.

[newton]

I picked her up on Saturday. I'm happy. :)

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I have to say that it is a nice gun. It definitely has some fit and finish issues. I'm not going to bock at them, I get it happens with a production type gun. The only thing that may be an issue(I really do not think it will be though) is the barrel does have a slight cant to it. Once I get the scope on it I'll make the descision if its too bad or not.

I had no intention of getting too involved in load development until I get the scope on it. However, I had to shoot it so I loaded up some powder coated and gas checked lee 240 SWC's with Unique. I started with 9 grains, then up to 9.5, and settled at 10. It took a bit to get the sights adjusted because I was not sure if it was me or the gun shooting left. I had to adjust the rear blade significantly right of center to bring the shots to the center of the target. I am not sure if it is a result of the barrel cant or not, but its shooting center of target now.

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That is 9 shots on paper at 25 yards. I know its a 3.5" group, but I am pretty excited about it seeing how I was having a pretty difficult time holding the gun steady anyways. I was shooting off a spike driven into the side of my shop wall with some rope wrapped around it. I have it there so I can load a round then step out the door and shoot it across the chrony. For not being a pistol shooter I thought that the group was decent.

I shot 3 across the chrony and got an average of 1170 fps. I guess that is considered a medium load. Recoil was very mild I would say. I shot a total of 35 this weekend, waiting for the scope now and then more serious load development will take place. I had 5 rounds left that I took to the bench and shot at a railroad tie I have set up at the 100 yard mark. I hit it 4 out of the 5 shots, which again I thought was pretty good seeing how it was difficult to see - I have it painted the same color as the front sight is on the gun.

I did some measureing of the gun cylinder/bore. I started with the throats, they all come in real close to each other(if not exact) at .432". The bore does have a slight constriction. A slug that passes through it measures ~.4286". I started another into the muzzle, then pulled it back out, and got a measurement around .429" and some change. It is very difficult to measure like that. When I run a very tight patch in the bore I cannot feel anything, so it seems to make sense that the constriction is around .001" or under.

I know its enough of one to cause that slight bit of leading that happens just past the forcing cone, but not down the rest of the barrel. I am not sure what I might do about it just yet. I did not clean the barrel at all in those 35 shots, and I am sure I could shoot another 35 based on the ammount of lead I see. I might firelap a few rounds in the future. It did help my other blackhawk I did it too.

The one thing I need to work on is the grip. I am having a hard time deciding on how to hold it. The way that feels most comfortable to me, which makes me feel in control of the gun, puts my trigger finger at a significant angle downward to the trigger. I am going to try and get a cheap/used grips to try some modifications on. I think maybe if I slim them down some it will help.

I know people have a love/hate with the Bisley frame, but I do not think the standard frame would be any more comfortable for me to be honest. The other blackhawk I have is comfortable enough, but its also a lot lighter and smaller. When I grip this gun like I would the weight of it makes me feel like I am not in control. I think it will all come with practice.

Thats pretty much it for first impressions. I am happy with it. A lot happier than I was with the CVA. It cost almost 3 times as much, but I think its worth it in the end. I am going to be really excited when deer season rolls back around.

[lefty o]

thats pretty typical of ruger, they seem to have issues indexing a barrel, and have for a long long time.

[newton]

Got the scope in and on today. I know a lot of people think its a horror to see a scope on a single action, but I honestly think it makes this gun look even better.

I had my mind set on the nickel version of the scope, but I ran across some pictures of stainless guns with black scopes on them and I really liked the contrast. After seeing it on mine now I am fully convinced its the way to go. I really like the scope too. It is clear and super easy to get on a target. It sure is an eye opener though to see just how much you shake/move holding a pistol.

Scope on, but no rounds in the cylinder, the gun weighs in at 4lbs 2.2oz.

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[newton]

On a side note, the grip feels way different today when I picked it up and handling it to get the scope on straight.

I think I had convinced myself that my trigger finger had to be at a 90-degree angle to the face of the trigger, which meant I had to hold it lower than what felt good. Last night I thought about how a person's finger is angled toward the trigger when shooting a rifle, and then it all started to click in my head. You can hold this gun with all fingers on the grip real nice, but your trigger finger is slightly angled down. Not a big deal really. Might be if a person had huge hands though.

I might still do a little custom work on the grips. Some light finger grooves would be really helpful in placing the hand the exact point every time.

[Duke3026]

Nice SBHH! I went with a four power, on two of the three hunters.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

c as far as the canted barrel, where do you look to check, where the barrel rib/frame meet? I got lucky with mine in that area, it seems perectly lined up. I just really, really hope I don't have any barrel constriction! I do not want to mess with fire lapping, in fact it makes me nervous, the thought of shooting boolits covered in abrasive down a brand new barrel gives me the willies!!!

[newton]

c as far as the canted barrel, where do you look to check, where the barrel rib/frame meet? I got lucky with mine in that area, it seems perectly lined up. I just really, really hope I don't have any barrel constriction! I do not want to mess with fire lapping, in fact it makes me nervous, the thought of shooting boolits covered in abrasive down a brand new barrel gives me the willies!!!

Yea, where the top rib of the barrel meets the frame. You can see just one corner of the barrel rib above the frame slightly, and the other corner below. You could also feel it where the ejector housing meets the frame. Its not enough for me to be concerned with. Shoots fine as is and doesn't seem to effect the way the scope works. For the more OCD type people it would drive them nuts I am sure.

From what I am hearing, if there is much of a barrel constriction on these guns there is just not much to do except for Taylor throat reaming. If there is not much of a constriction then it probably just means a little extra cleaning when it comes time. I do have a slight one. I decided to clean the gun last night before I move on with my testing of the heavier boolits. I have fired exactly 50 rounds of the lee 240gr SWC with Unique. I also did fire one round with the 290gr Lyman boolit using W296, in hopes I had enough daylight to record velocity, but light had run out.

In those 51 shots I had leaded the barrel enough to make it a pain to clean, but not enough to say it isnt worth it - if that makes sense. I should have taken some pictures. One problem I know is that I am using a way too hard alloy. I knew this before hand, but just was too lazy to change it thinking I might make it work by using gas checks. I will probably melt the rest of the boolits down and just make the right alloy for when I get real serious about practice. For now I don't mind the cleaning.

I might run a few cylinders of firelapping at some point though, just to see if I can smooth things up a bit. I would not be afraid of it at all. I did it, very cautiously, with a blued blackhawk and everything turned out fine. It sure did slick up the barrel in that one gun - very noticable difference.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

ok, well, like I said I don't even know if it has constriction yet, we'll see. you mentioned taylor throat reaming... could you explain that a bit more? do you mean the throats of the cylinder or the forcing cone in the barrel... I am pretty sure that's what its called?

[newton]

ok, well, like I said I don't even know if it has constriction yet, we'll see. you mentioned taylor throat reaming... could you explain that a bit more? do you mean the throats of the cylinder or the forcing cone in the barrel... I am pretty sure that's what its called?

I am no expert at any of this, just an arm chair internet wanna be gunsmith/shooter. :)

Taylor throat reaming is done to the forcing cone. I've never had it done, just heard its the only way to truly remove a tight constriction - plus I think there are some other benifits? I'm not sure.

[newton]

I got a chance to shot last night. I primarily wanted to just test velocity with the W296 and 290gr LFN(Lyman devastator with solid tip). I should have taken a picture of them, but they look just like the devastator minus a hollow point. :)

I was originally going to test in .5 grain increments, but then just decided to do it in 1-grain increments. I figured that the .5 grain ones would fall somewhere in between the full grain ones(I know, that is pure rocket science there......). I loaded two each of 19, 20, 21. The 19 grain shot around 1190fps. The 20 grain shot around 1250fps. The 21 grain had a pretty big difference between the two, one came in at 1259fps and the other just over 1300fps. I am not sure if it was the round, or the chrony messing up.

Instead of just pushing them out with the ejector, I decided to take the cylinder out to see how they felt coming out.

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The 19gr cases almost just fell out. The 20gr cases were a little tighter, and the 21 cases felt even tighter. I did not have to beat any out, but you could tell the difference significantly. One thing to know is that this was a freshly cleaned cylinder, these were the first 6 rounds fired after I scrubbed it spotless the other night.

I am still not sure what to think about what the pressures might be. While I believe it is 'safe' in my gun, there is no data for this boolit and weight. Only the hollow point version. I know Larry has done testing with his mould and, if I remember right, his boolits were 275gr. So is 15gr more going to significantly increase pressures? He uses 23gr of H110. I would think that 21gr should be quite ok. Larry, if your out there, I'd like to hear your thoughts. :)

I wasn't planning on shooting for 'groups', but I liked how the 19gr load felt and thought a load that produced around 1200fps would be a fine hunting load, so I loaded up 6 rounds with 19.5gr and shot at 50yards. Went down to check and had a NICE(to me) group sitting there. Excited, but once again running out of daylight, went back and loaded 6 more to test at 100 yards. I did adjust the scope for elevation, based on assumed velocity and wanting to be zero at 100 yards.

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What makes me scratch my head is how much more left the POI shifted. It was a little left of the POA at 50yd, but its way left at 100yd. Its around 2" left at 50, and 6" left at 100. I guess the adjustment made to the scope could have also attributed?

I know I was not as steady with those shots at 100yd though, not near like I was at 50yd. The trigger creep is still bad though, and I had really not planned on shooting for groups until I work with the trigger. I just thought the 50yd group showed some promise so I wanted to try longer range.

I'm pretty excited though really. I think that after some work on the trigger, then some time with practice, I will be shooting some really nice groups with this thing.

[Bigslug]

Hitting to the left of the target is what right-handed shooters DO:

1. Your elbow bends to the left - lock it out.

2. Your wrist bends to the left - lock it out.

3. All of the meat, muscle and bone of your grip is on the right side. . .leaving only your thumb on the left to close off the path of least resistance - clamp the thumb inward tightly.

4. Your trigger finger wants to curl to the left - adjust so it's pulling straight back instead.

5. If you're shooting with two hands, your left hand's mission in life is to help in counteracting ALL of the above tendencies - apply it with that intent.

Firelapping is a good thing in my experience. I did not know about pin gauges when I did my SBH, but they have come in MASSIVELY handy on subsequent revolvers. For the bore, as I recall, you'll probably need ones in the .416", .417", .418", .419" spread. Find one that slip fits the muzzle and see if it stops before passing through the back of the barrel. I keep a flexible plastic Glock cleaning rod handy to push it back forward if it sticks. From there you can go to smaller gauges to see just how much constriction you have. Firelap until the first gauge passes through. For the cylinder, you can use the .430", .431", .432", .433" gauges to determine if any of your chamber throats are tighter. You can mark the tight ones and shoot your initial firelappers through those, switching to using all six if the throats even out before the frame crush does.

Ruger triggers: I.M.E., at least with the DA ones, the answer is a lot of oil on mating surfaces and a lot of repeatedly cycling the action. Once any factory grit and machining burrs are flushed out or burnished down, there's rarely anything to complain about.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

wow, good info, I found that I was pulling shots to the left, you explained that well, newton, I did break down and do the "poor mans trigger job" since it is reversible, and it did help a lot. you don't feel that creep, and its just about the right pull for me, pretty light. I am gonna work on the above techniques, oh, I don't know if I told you, but I settled on 20.5grs of 296 for a good load, still packs plenty of punch, but the slightly less recoil seems to help with my shooting. good luck!

[newton]

Well all that does make sense. Thanks a bunch. It really helps clarify things.

[newton]

wow, good info, I found that I was pulling shots to the left, you explained that well, newton, I did break down and do the "poor mans trigger job" since it is reversible, and it did help a lot. you don't feel that creep, and its just about the right pull for me, pretty light. I am gonna work on the above techniques, oh, I don't know if I told you, but I settled on 20.5grs of 296 for a good load, still packs plenty of punch, but the slightly less recoil seems to help with my shooting. good luck!

Yea, I am thinking a lower charge is a good thing. I found out how to actually do some tweaking on the trigger spring versus just dropping a leg. I guess you could call it the almost poor mans trigger job. Lol I plan on going through my action the next few days and plan to document it all to share.

[Thumbcocker]

Nice group. Should put plenty of venison in the freezer with that load.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

newton, could you explain what you did, that sounds better than just having it in there next to the mainspring, although I haven't seen any way for it to hang up...

[Oklahoma Rebel]

also, what lube do you use for your keith and lyman molds?

[newton]

newton, could you explain what you did, that sounds better than just having it in there next to the mainspring, although I haven't seen any way for it to hang up...

I haven’t done it just yet. I found out how to on Friday, so I plan on making it apart of what I’m doing with slicking up the trigger. It involves just bending the spring in a few places. Does require the removal of it from the grip frame though, so it’s not as quick as just dropping a leg. I figured since I have my gun apart it would be a good time to do it. I disassembled everything this morning, but had other things to do till now. Fixing to go work on it though.


also, what lube do you use for your keith and lyman molds?

I have only been powder coating my boolits. Just using the old harbor freight red for now. I’ll eventually get some of smokes fancy colors(maybe even clear) to try though. Or do you mean what lube on the Mould itself?

[Budzilla 19]

New model super Blackhawk stainless gun, barrel set back to .003” gap, choke removed, trigger job, muzzle brake, cylinder throats all the same, Lee 310grn slugs powder coated in Smoke’s clear, a healthy dose of Hercules 2400, it shoots wonderfully!!!! Had one like this gun 20+ years ago, sold it, been looking ever since for another one, till last year that is!!! Do I like this gun? No, I LOVE this gun! Just my .02. Good luck with yours.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

newton, yeas, I meant boolit lube, let me know how your spring modification goes, and could you take a pic of it after you bend it so I can see? one thing I cannot understand, is why would you go through the trouble of PC'ing only to use clear paint!!!?!?! J/K,lol, but really, might as well make them look cool! I like the baby blue color, the same color that looks great on an old ford or chevy sedan from the 40's-50's!

[newton]

newton, yeas, I meant boolit lube, let me know how your spring modification goes, and could you take a pic of it after you bend it so I can see? one thing I cannot understand, is why would you go through the trouble of PC'ing only to use clear paint!!!?!?! J/K,lol, but really, might as well make them look cool! I like the baby blue color, the same color that looks great on an old ford or chevy sedan from the 40's-50's!

Yea, powder coating is not for everyone. I started loading cast boolits with only using tumble lube. It was about the time powder coating started gaining interest, so I started to experiment. Once I did it, I realized that while it was some work, it wasnt too much more than just tumble lubing - but a LOT less of a mess. I never bought a traditional lube setup so it just made sense to stick with powder coating. I tried pan lubing, but the powder coating is MUCH easier and again - no mess. I only tumble powder coat though.

The only reason to go with clear is because I do love the look of a lead boolit in the case. Something about that grey color that makes me smile. :)

[newton]

As far as the spring modification, here it is. Jury is out on it, but I will say that I probably will tweak it some.

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There is the before and after pics. I cannot remember which site I saw it on first, but there are many different sites that show basically the same thing. I am not sure if it helped or not to tell the truth. I just got my gun back together this morning and only played with it a little. I know one thing for sure - the bend that contacts the trigger makes it a PAIN to put the frame back together. I do not have a trigger scale to measure the pull, so I have no idea what it was before - or now.

I do know that now it is pretty sweet. I got 90% of the creep out, and ALL of the gritty feeling out, by working on the hammer notch and sear. I am going to post a new thread topic that covers what I did. I figure it might be useful for those who have the gumption to try their hand at a trigger job and figured it might be useful as a stand alone topic. I have not seen a thread like it on this forum. I got most of my info from the ruger forum and some other internet wanna be gunsmith blogs.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

cool! I am looking forward to your new thread explaining what you did, some pictures would really help me understand things before I actually go in and open up the gun,( if I do). oh and I understand about the clearcoat, I too love the look of a nicely cast boolit, if you cast well, you might as well show it off!

[newton]

I couldn't wait any longer, so last night I went out in the freezing rain we were having and shot the hunter for the first time after the trigger job. I have to say I am very pleased with the initial results. The trigger feels so much better. After the last cylinder full I felt like I was able to squeeze off a round accurately(as far as shooting a pistol is concerned). I can see that shooting a pistol, even from a bench, will never have the same steady feel of a rifle on bags. But at least I was able to be, in a matter of words, supprised by the shot and not having to keep squeezing till the trigger broke unpredicably like before. To sum it up, the trigger broke the same each and every time.

The weather conditions were less than perfect. I normally do not shoot in the rain because I do not have a covered bench. But, it was not raining too hard, and the wind was still, so it was not too bad. I set up resting the gun on some bags with the frame in front of the trigger guard was the main point of contact. I pulled out some old leather work gloves that did not fit to use as a shield for the bags. After 18 rounds this is what it looked like.

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What I did not realize is by doing this the gun gets absolutely filthy, all over. This will be one good reason to not use the bench for practice because cleaning all the nooks and cranys, especially with the scope on it, takes some time.

The first cylinder full was with the load I had used last time. 19.5gr of W296. I expected to find a pretty good group when I went to look at it because most of the shots felt good from my end. The targets I use are a 4" black dot printed on paper. My goal is to 'hopefully' get to where I can keep all the shots in that black circle - very lofty goal I am begining to think at 100 yards. With a rest I was able to pretty much keep the cross hairs in the circle, but with only a 2x scope that is kind of tricky. A rest helps, but it does not take out all the movement.

When I went to look at the target I was pretty stunned. 14" group. What did help was that I could see it was pretty well centered on the dot. With knowing what those kinds of groups mean in regards to rifles, I pretty much knew that it meant my load was not up to snuff. The only thing I could reason was the tempurater was about 20 or so degrees lower, so maybe I needed to bump up the charge some. So I loaded up 6 more with 20gr.

The group shrunk by almost 2/3rds. I did feel like a couple of shots I pulled, so I decided to try 6 more before calling it quits and waiting for some better weather. Plus, as it goes this time of year for me, daylight was fading and the freezing fog was moving in. That last group I only felt like maybe a couple were out, and sure enough I went down to find a nice 4.5" group centered above the dot.

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I am pretty sure that the openess of the group is all me, even though I was using a rest. I've never bench rested pistols before, only resting my arms on a bench, but never tried to shoot for groups past 25 yards doing so, and never with a scope. So this is all new to me. With the results I see, I can deffinitely tell that with practice I will be able to shrink those down. Off hand shooting from field type positions will prove enlightening for sure. I never plan to actually shoot the pistol at a deer in a hunting situation past 50 yards without a rest though. So at least I feel good that the pistol will be accurate enough for that situation if it ever arises.

[newton]

The one issue I am facing at this point is my load development. I'm kinda in an unknown place. The boolit I am using has no data associated with it. I am not sure how far I can go, or should go, safely. I suppose I can stay where I am at and work with it because it does show promise, but like the above target shows, could I do more with the load to squeeze the groups down? Is 4" as good as it gets, or am I the limiting factor in it?

I have only really done development with rifle loads, but that is because I can almost take myself out of the equation with a good rest. The pistol takes so much more of my control than the rifle does. I know what to look for in regards to pressures, except I would say that I have almost never(if ever) found a rifle load that performed best at max. Usually, I am always well below max when accuracy is achieved.

I had a bull in the china closet moment last night also. I am kinda kicking myself today because of it. I bought a Lyman devastator mold last month specifically to try in the CVA rifle I had because I thought I might get better accuracy with it than what I was getting with the other molds I have. When I got rid of it I figured I would go ahead and use it in this pistol. When I received it, I looked it over and found there was a small defect in one of the mold halves. Like a pit in the metal, not caused by cherry that made the mold, but like a void that was in the metal that was uncovered when the mold was cut.

I called Lyman about it, and they sent me a new mold. Very nice of them(except they expected me to ship back the other mold - I suppose - on my own dime). Well, the new mold looked ok, so I started casting with it. It was not until I had used it a bit I started seeing that the mold halves are somewhat offset. It is not horrible, but by my best measurement, it makes a boolit that is around .004" or more out of round. After I size it, the out of round is only around .002", but that still is annoying to me.

So last night I thought I might try to correct the problem myself by hopefully moving the alignment pins. That turned out to fail, and in the process of trying to pry(yes, this is the bull moment) I put a good gouge in one half of the cavity. Pure stupidity. I left it alone after that and have not looked at it yet, but I am pretty sure I dinged it up worse than what the first mold was. I should have stopped, I probably should have never attempted it but rather sent the mold back, but I was frustrated that they sent me another defective mold to replace the first one.

I say all of that to say, when you get a sour taste in your mouth for something it's hard to continue to use it. So I am really thinking of getting another mold. I just do not know what to get. I like how steel molds feel in my hands, and the other(mainly RCBS) steel molds cast exceptionally better boolits than the aluminum Lee molds do. I really wanted something in the 280gr - 300gr range. This mold, with my DIY flat nose pin, made a boolit right at 290gr fully dressed. It obviously shoots well, even with it being out of round.

I like the .300" meplat it has and would like to stick with it. I do have the Lee 310gr mold, so I might try and see how it shoots in my gun. I'm considering getting a custom mold maker to replicate the Lyman Devastator except having a flat nose and not having to use a pin.

I guess what I am getting at is am I over thinking the weight thing? Will the 240gr-250gr boolits be just fine? The gun is primarily going to be a deer gun, hogs second, and elk third. There are so many different opinions out there about what to use it makes my head spin a lot of times.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

hey, that load of 20grs, and of course you, shot pretty darn good! what range was that? you might try 20.5grs, see if it tightens up even more, I doubt you will notice a difference in recoil, I think your boolits are 15-20 grains heavier than mine but will still be within reasonable pressures, and recoil is about like a lightweight 357 mag with the 20.5/296 and 270gr keith. you are doing well, and I cant wait to try to show you a target that's just a little bit better!!lol, that's why I need to know your range!

[dvnv]

Regarding loads with H110/296...IME, enough powder to fit snugly to the base of the seated bullet (maybe with some very mild compression) has proven to be a happy place for H110/296 in a wide variety of calibers and bullet weights. That is what I would work towards if I had no load data. fwiw, dvnv

[newton]

hey, that load of 20grs, and of course you, shot pretty darn good! what range was that? you might try 20.5grs, see if it tightens up even more, I doubt you will notice a difference in recoil, I think your boolits are 15-20 grains heavier than mine but will still be within reasonable pressures, and recoil is about like a lightweight 357 mag with the 20.5/296 and 270gr keith. you are doing well, and I cant wait to try to show you a target that's just a little bit better!!lol, that's why I need to know your range!

Those were 100 yards. Off a rest of course. I sure hope you can show me up, seeing how you have the same gun as me then you can tell me the exact load to use and I won't have to wonder anymore. lol

[newton]

Regarding loads with H110/296...IME, enough powder to fit snugly to the base of the seated bullet (maybe with some very mild compression) has proven to be a happy place for H110/296 in a wide variety of calibers and bullet weights. That is what I would work towards if I had no load data. fwiw, dvnv

I've heard of doing this. I have not measured the distance that there is between boolit base and powder with the 20gr charge, but I do know there is some reasonable space there when I hold a boolit to the outside of the case where it would be crimped.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

yes, but I don't have a scope! unfair advantage, well, that, and my range only goes to 45-50 yards, but I did install a small pin on the front sight ( think very similar to a shotgun bead) which has helped m,e focus on the front sight and target immensely! before, I was taking waaay too much time trying to get the front and back sights lined up "just so". still need some more practice, I haven't shot in the last 3 days because of freezing rain. but I am going to be able to shoot tomorrow and all weekend. i'll let you know, and if they aren't too embarrising, i'll show some target pics... I figure your scoped 100 yards is an even match to my iron sighted 45-50 yards! sound fair? by the way, that llast group, esp. for 100yds, was very good!!!!

[Oklahoma Rebel]

by the way, where are you in Arkansas? I would love to go hog hunting there, and would like to know how much a non- resident hunting license is, and do you know some good hunting areas?

[newton]

yes, but I don't have a scope! unfair advantage, well, that, and my range only goes to 45-50 yards, but I did install a small pin on the front sight ( think very similar to a shotgun bead) which has helped m,e focus on the front sight and target immensely! before, I was taking waaay too much time trying to get the front and back sights lined up "just so". still need some more practice, I haven't shot in the last 3 days because of freezing rain. but I am going to be able to shoot tomorrow and all weekend. i'll let you know, and if they aren't too embarrising, i'll show some target pics... I figure your scoped 100 yards is an even match to my iron sighted 45-50 yards! sound fair? by the way, that llast group, esp. for 100yds, was very good!!!!

I agree I think it would be an even match. :) Until you start getting better groups, then it's unfair. lol

I just studied the target again. There is a neat little program that lets you input the aiming point and then input the bullet holes. Then it tells you how far above POA the group is, along with group size, overall width and length, and average center to center.

Whats interesting is if you take the two groups on the right, cull the two furthest shots, the group size and POI above POA are nearly identical. I find that interesting. The reason I did it was to see how much I needed to adjust my scope, and then I saw the results. Which, maybe cheating or not......but both groups counting only four shots were about 3 1/2". I would be tickled pink to have that kind of group repeated over and over at 100 yards.

I hear you on the rain/freezing rain. I live in NWA, just a couple hours from Tulsa. As far as hogs go, it's a 'no no' to actually "hunt" them here. Dumb as it sounds. They have deemed "hunting" of them to be a hindrance to their eradication. Big joke if you ask me. I'll try to stay off my soap box about that one.

I hunt down in the Ozark National Forest mainly. I do hunt around my house some, but most of my time is spent down there. It's getting more and more populated around here. There are hogs around, and lots down where I hunt, but I rarely ever see any. I don't know what the fine is, but I don't think you want to get caught shooting them. Now, a landowner can hunt/shoot them any time they want - day or night. I think that's a good thing personally. But, because it is so populated around here, land owners don't just let anyone come onto their property to shoot the hogs. If you go further south, then the land owners pretty much make money under the table letting people come and shoot hogs on their place(my theory anyways).

The AGFC lets you kill a hog when its deer/bear/elk firearm season without much question - or so says their website. However, I would have zero problems shooting a hog if I happened across one while hunting anything/anytime. I plan to pack my 44 when I go turkey hunting this spring down there. :)

I've only shot one wild hog so far, and that was 6-7 years ago up in Missouri, just across the state line. They at one time let you come shoot them without a license, but they also have changed the laws and it's now illegal except for some exceptions.

I hope to find a landowner one day that will let me come 'help' out, but I refuse to pay some sort of exorbitant fee for doing so.

[MK111]

I shoot the Ruger SB Hunter Bisley in 44 mag. Since deer hunting became legal in Ohio about 1987. I've taken 23 deer with a handgun and all using a cast lead bullet. 22 deer was with the 44 Mag and 1 with a 45 Colt.
I started with the Ruger Redhawk Hunter in 44 Mag but switched to the Ruger SB Hunter Bisley in SS when it available.
Most were taken with the 240 grain Keith design but several was taken with the Lee 310 gr bullet.
I believe the story has already been told how I and a good friend Dale designed the Lee 310 gr bullet when i went to Alaska and was in brown bear country for 2 weeks. We got the design right the 1st time and the bullet shoots great even out of my Ruger Deer Slayer auto rifle.
When I got back from Alaska there was a call from Lee wanting to change the bullet design to a more normal design, I told them leave my design alone and design their own bullet. They left it alone and it's all history now. Lee went on to do a 45 caliber mold along the same desgn.
I also designed a 357 caliber 185 gr bullet the same as the 44 caliber 310 gr bullet with 2 crimping grooves but health issues came up and I didn't move forward with the production. My friend has borrowed the 1 and only 2 cavity mold made for the 357 caliber 185 gr and has loaded ammo and said it shot great.
He is welcome to comment further if he wishes.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

I think they are worried about people "educating" the pigs, but I think that's baloney! hogs that get shot at don't become afraid of traps! they become afraid of hunters, and hogs that are trapped, unless they escape, are dead meat! now if a trapped hog gets out, I have heard it will never go into one again, and I think that's probably true... I just hope that as our pig population grows, they wont ban hunting them here! right now it is year round, but during certain other seasons, you have to play by those rules, including in deer season, you must have a used or unused deer tag, and of course a hunting license. I did some loading today, and will do some more after dinner, since it has been raining non stop, but I think I can get out and shoot tomorrow, I am eager to get to be confident enough to go hog hunting up at skiatook lake! I will try to post some target pics after I get some shooting in!

[newton]

I got to run a couple of cylinders full through the gun on Sunday. I learned two things.

1. The gun shoots way open with a freshly cleaned barrel and cylinder. I imagine it has more to do with the cylinder than the barrel.

2. The gun does not like twice powder coated boolits. I believe this is because the powder coating is easier to cut through than the lead. The reason I tried is because I opened up my sizing die to match the cylinder throats exactly. I had some boolits already powder coated and sized the smaller dimensions, so I coated them again and ran them through the die again to have them fit the throat exactly. I got this in one of the cylinders - which I had seen before in the rifle I had tested.

215392

It did not happen in all the cylinders. But at the same time, I only shot two cylinders full, and then one more.


So now I am casting up some more boolits, and will size them with the larger die, and do just one coat. I might even try some LLA or something.

I also decided to go ahead and try some jacketed bullets. Some might think its taboo, but I am of the curious type and found some at a great price.

Not sure if its well known or not(I did not know about them till a couple months ago) that a company called Roze Distribution has pretty good prices on bullets. They only make one for the 44 mag. Its a 240gr JSP with a flat nose meplat of .300". I am pretty sure its the largest meplat you can get in the jacketed bullet world.

They sent me some samples back a few months ago and I tried them in the CVA rifle. I had one left that I did not load, and it is a tight fit in the throats, but pushes on through with thumb pressure. I am curious how they will react in the revolver though, since they are .431" and the groove diameter of my gun is .429". I would be more hesitant if they were larger than the throats, but since they pass through them I think that it will be fine.

I bought some and am going to try them. Never know, maybe they will help some with the constriction being that they will be over .002" larger at that point. I would think that some of the metal will have to be worn down/ironed out.

Anyone here shot these bullets in their 44 mag revolvers before?