Flat of bad primers? Anyone had this problem?

[Texantothecore]

I just went through 100 primers and had virtually no ignition of the powder. The primers did power the projectile for 20 yards. I put commercial rounds in the gun and it fired perfectly.
I tried it with CFE pistol as well as Unique. Same result.



I haven't seen this before.

[Skunk1]

Do you have more of them? Brand? Did you just buy them? New? Have you tried firing one alone, no powder or projectile?

My primers have been around for a bit, bought before last election. Have gotten others lately but they may be as old as I am and still fire fine.

[Outpost75]

What are we talking about, rifle, revolver, separate loaded artillery, what???

[Texantothecore]

It is a 45 lc Bond arms gun with a new 3.5 " barrel. Cci lp. Primers new.

[CASTER OF LEAD]

Texantothecore,
I haven't ever heard or seen what you describe. Are you sure it wasnt a partial powder burn? I have fired off .45 ACP rounds that were failed to be charged with powder at all ,and the only thing the boolit did was go about 1/2" past the throat and lodge in the BBL. I have had some bad small rifle primers that never set off powder ,but also never ignited the charge either. When i pulled them down the powder was as fresh as it was when i put it in. I reprimed them (with a different brand primers) and the same powder. they shot fine. I am interested in what others have to say.

[ravelode]

last carton of bad primers I had was an orange/green box Reminton LR. The cups pinhole ruptured around the edges. It cut a rough circle in the bolt face of my M96 Swede before I noticed :oops::cry:.

[Texantothecore]

All primers are exactly set at the same level as the cartridge level. I check them visually as well as by feel. I was shooting smaller charges under 454 round ball. I am going to try it again using primers from a different box and a larger charge and see what happens.

[MyFlatline]

I cannot believe the primers alone sent the projectile 20 yards, I was not there but all my squibs have stuck in the barrel. It seems the primers did their job,,,I would look to the powder, either not enough or bad.. Just my opinion.

[CASTER OF LEAD]

I cannot believe the primers alone sent the projectile 20 yards, I was not there but all my squibs have stuck in the barrel. It seems the primers did their job,,,I would look to the powder, either not enough or bad.. Just my opinion.

+1 for this. JMHO - CASTER

[high standard 40]

I cannot believe the primers alone sent the projectile 20 yards, I was not there but all my squibs have stuck in the barrel. It seems the primers did their job,,,I would look to the powder, either not enough or bad.. Just my opinion.



I agree with this assessment.

[tazman]

I had the same primer problem with Remington primers that ravelode mentioned.
I had an issue with a light load in a 45/70 a number of years ago failing to properly ignite the powder. The powder partially burned but left lots of residue in the case and barrel. A couple of those didn't even get past the throat. I started using cotton balls to hold the powder against the primer and the problem disappeared.
The problem the OP mentioned I have no experience with.

[Plate plinker]

Better work it out and call CCI about the lot if indeed they are bad. Maybe they had a newbie working that day.

[Thin Man]

If I wanted to make a comparison test I would change only one variable at a time. For the question raised by the OP, I would change ONLY the primer, and at the same power level (standard v. magnum primer) as the original load. If two variables are changed, the question comes down to: was it the primer or the powder charge? My thought on the original load was too light of a powder charge. Hope your tests find the culprit. Just my 2 cents worth.

[Texantothecore]

Good advice from all. First run same charge. Second run with larger charge. I'll bet it was the small charge.

[NSB]

If they sent the bullet 20 yds you don't have a primer problem. Put one in an empty case and fire it off....how does it sound? If it's going "bang", you've got a powder burn problem. It's simply not the primer.

[Texantothecore]

The powders were from Academy and Basspro and there was nothing odd when I broke the seal on them.

Test series all 5 shot series
1. Five shots with new primer
2. Five shots with previous unsuccessful loads
3. Five shots with greater amount of powder
4. Five shots with 255 grn bullet and max load

I'll report back on this after test results come in.
You guys have really helped me zero in on what to do next. Thank you bigly.

[M-Tecs]

That is not a primer issue. Some powders don't ignite well with light bullets. Try a heavier crimp on your round ball loads.

[edp2k]

>> I was shooting smaller charges under 454 round ball.
> Try a heavier crimp on your round ball loads.

My bet is on this.

[country gent]

A light or no crimp may aid ignition issue with light charges, along with light neck tensions. A small charge in a large case may be an issue for consistant ignition. A dacron or cotton ball filler may be needed, just enough fibers to hold powder and fill air space fluffed up. Bad primers wouldn't drive bullets that far I wouldn't think. But if you can recover some you hae slugs for barrel dia to work with. Another issue might be light hits not fully igniting the primers correctly. I believe CCIs are one of the harder primer cups.

Primers need to be seated to bottom of the primer pocket with a slight preload to arm the anvil primer cup. Seating to a depth may not accomplish this it may leave room for movement and take away from the hammers force. Look at yu new primers the anvil is slightly above the cup and when seated should be set back so the anvil just loads the primer pellet.

[dubber123]

Big case, no neck tension, short barrel, not super fast burning powder.... I'll bet primers are just fine, charge type and weight is way off.

[Green Frog]

I’m going to go with the poor powder ignition votes. Your round ball started out of the case before sufficient ignition of the powder had occurred. When the pressure dropped, ignition was slowed so quickly a goodly amount of powder remained unburned. That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Remedies would start with a heavy crimp on the ball, or a heavier projectile, or more powder located down near the flash hole. I hesitate to mention any kind of filler or wad as that can bring on its own set of problems, but you may need to go there.

Froggie

[44MAG#1]

Just satisfy my little mind why the round ball?

[Texantothecore]

Will try a harder crimp also.

Why round ball? They work well and are cheaper shooting than 255 grn. 140 grn round ball works rather well, has done so for 500 years or so.

[44MAG#1]

Have they worked well in that gun? Other than cheapness any other reason?
Just curious as other than cheapness I can't see it is all.
I may want to try it.

[Tenbender]

Buy some fresh powder. Make sure the barrel is open. ?? Do it again . Green Frog is more than likely correct.

[toallmy]

I don't know what happened to your load but I have purchased blocks of bad primers I still have most of a thousand CCI mag lg rifle primers that drove me crazy for a while . And I remember my brother selling his first 9mm because of a brick of bad primers , later we discovered the primer to be the problem . Both times they came ordered new , and properly stored . It can and does happen

[Texantothecore]

Have they worked well in that gun? Other than cheapness any other reason?
Just curious as other than cheapness I can't see it is all.
I may want to try it.
I shoot them in most of my guns but mostly with black powder with a ground walnut filler. I get 1750 fps with 70 grains of 3fg in my 45-70 and they are accurate at 300 yards. I had to preserve lead during the last 8 years but also found them to be fun. A lot less trouble to cast than boolits. I do weigh them and reject any that exceed a variance of 1/2 grn. They cast very consistantly at 800 degrees using pure lead. Pleasant plinking. Lee moulds.

[BigBore45]

Big case, no neck tension, short barrel, not super fast burning powder.... I'll bet primers are just fine, charge type and weight is way off.

I second this

[44MAG#1]

I shoot them in most of my guns but mostly with black powder with a ground walnut filler. I get 1750 fps with 70 grains of 3fg in my 45-70 and they are accurate at 300 yards. I had to preserve lead during the last 8 years but also found them to be fun. A lot less trouble to cast than boolits. I do weigh them and reject any that exceed a variance of 1/2 grn. They cast very consistantly at 800 degrees using pure lead. Pleasant plinking. Lee moulds.

I worked with a guy that used balls in his muzzleloader for deer. He said he never had any problem killing deer with them. He swore by them. Of course he was shooting a 50 caliber rifle.

[berksglh]

I second thisI third this.

Ive seen partially unburned powder causing jams when running a slow burning powder with an extreemly light charge with light cast.

As I aproached heavier charge weights, problem went away. But I switched to a faster powder realizing I was far from optimum burn rate for my aplication.

I assume the round ball has less friction, as well as being lighter, both combined it doesnt create enough back pressure to keep a slower powder burning properly.

I say go with a faster powder or larger charge.

Be safe.



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